EPTSCBW Coaching: Update 3 - Page 10
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Liquid`Drone
Norway28820 Posts
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
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Foucault
Sweden2826 Posts
It's definately not "wtf" though as it could easily have been interpreted like he was saying that his muta micro is his specialty. | ||
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DanCeWithDevil
United States87 Posts
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Chill
Calgary26003 Posts
On January 08 2010 20:05 MaRiNe23 wrote: I think alot of koreans would stand by me on this but alot of the learning process can be done simply by watching starcraft vods and listening to the korean commentators alone. They give thorough, detailed analysis from the start of the game till the end and gives strategic insight about the map. Offtopic: I think this is a stereotype accidentally perpetuated by Koreans. Every time I am watch Starcraft with a Korean I ask them are the commentators saying anything interesting, and every time they say no. I'm sure there are some great comments in there, but it seems to be in reality closer to 1 in 1000 than 1 in 2 like Koreans on this forum would have you believe. There's this stigma that Korean commentary is just so mindblowing that hearing anything else will cause your brain to implode. | ||
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
On January 12 2010 05:55 DanCeWithDevil wrote: u guys are stupid i obviously understood incontrol that he meant he knows how to teach non muta micro oriented styles lol...inc i want a few hours ill let u know soon Sounds good! My m/w/f and weekends are really open. I can do early times on t/thur but I have class later in the day. | ||
Rekrul
Korea (South)17174 Posts
On January 12 2010 06:15 Chill wrote: Offtopic: I think this is a stereotype accidentally perpetuated by Koreans. Every time I am watch Starcraft with a Korean I ask them are the commentators saying anything interesting, and every time they say no. I'm sure there are some great comments in there, but it seems to be in reality closer to 1 in 1000 than 1 in 2 like Koreans on this forum would have you believe. There's this stigma that Korean commentary is just so mindblowing that hearing anything else will cause your brain to implode. i agree with chill but disagree at the same time: korean commentary is fun and exciting for the general audience...not really for us if it was translated...but as i'm sure you know, its not directly about what they say but how they say it.... they paint an emotional story and to sit there watching it live on ur big screen is quite riveting but chills right, for a real starcraft player who follows iccup tsl and shit...they will not often say anything insightful and they full often times make hilariously false few-seconds-before predictions about games(especially mr. overlord LOL)...but the korean fans don't give a fuck because the announcers are superb at the generalistics of their jobs just as you guys read 'generalistics' as a word from me and understand the meaning, despite it not being a real word, the korean announcers describe intricate strategies in the same way every day | ||
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
On January 12 2010 05:55 DanCeWithDevil wrote: u guys are stupid i obviously understood incontrol that he meant he knows how to teach non muta micro oriented styles lol...inc i want a few hours ill let u know soon Sounds good  Just PM me. | ||
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barthos
United States30 Posts
On January 07 2010 16:44 Salv wrote: I realize InControl is most likely capable of giving really advanced personal advice to a player, but I would think that most players interested in this endeavor would be between the D- to C- ranks. When teaching players at this level [which I have personally done many times], it's difficult to explain advanced concepts about scouting, cues, game sense etc. You need to start basic and then slowly introduce those concepts. What I am saying is, while InControl is perfectly capable of providing the foundation for improving as a player, I think that information can be found readily and easily for free. I would expect a Zerg of C+ or B- quality to be able to improve a D Zerg player very similarly to InControl up until a certain point, which would most likely be C+ or B-. That's fine, and at that point I would say InControl's personal training would be beneficial, but I am skeptical about the amount of players at this level that would pay for training. I would advise that better players don't necessarily have the best advice in this situation. Every teacher knows this--look at the 20million essays written for admission into teacher education programs. The big challenge teachers talk about is learner diversity. Before you express your bewilderment, put your response into perspective. You're the student that learns from replays and VOD's in a community that has been saturated with both for a long time. Others learn better from feedback, on-the-fly pointers, and in-depth personal replay analysis from a superior player. I think I was one of the first people to get help. I was a D-/D Zerg 24 hours per day, now I'm D+/C- during western hours and D+ during Korean hours. An example of how Incontrol helped me where a replay didn't is this: My mutalisks were never doing any damage to terrans. I analyzed my replays and figured my mutalisk micro must be poor. We watched the replay of our ZvT game, and he said my mutas were slow, so we watched the replay, an I was making a mistake in the standard build order. I fixed it, and now it's fat-fingering, shitty reflexes, and tunnel-visioning my control group that makes me a bad/mediocre ZvT player. On an even more valuable and general level, the attention paid to timings during our rep analysis has completely flipped my understanding of early game on its head; I can now compete with players better than me for the first ten minutes (and figure out if they're better based on their timings and responses made during scouting) on a dangerous level by utilizing some timing windows and trying to get an advantage that will let me play a longer game against somebody who would otherwise have killed me with his or her first push. Lastly, I think somebody owes the ghost of Pafnucy a thank you. Or money.  | ||
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
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[DUF]MethodMan
Germany1716 Posts
On January 12 2010 07:03 Rekrul wrote: i agree with chill but disagree at the same time: korean commentary is fun and exciting for the general audience...not really for us if it was translated...but as i'm sure you know, its not directly about what they say but how they say it.... they paint an emotional story and to sit there watching it live on ur big screen is quite riveting but chills right, for a real starcraft player who follows iccup tsl and shit...they will not often say anything insightful and they full often times make hilariously false few-seconds-before predictions about games(especially mr. overlord LOL)...but the korean fans don't give a fuck because the announcers are superb at the generalistics of their jobs just as you guys read 'generalistics' as a word from me and understand the meaning, despite it not being a real word, the korean announcers describe intricate strategies in the same way every day who's mr. overlord? | ||
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
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CTStalker
Canada9720 Posts
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=23780 | ||
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iNcontroL
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iNcontroL
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Boonbag
France3318 Posts
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iNcontroL
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Chill
Calgary26003 Posts
On January 12 2010 07:03 Rekrul wrote: i agree with chill but disagree at the same time: korean commentary is fun and exciting for the general audience...not really for us if it was translated...but as i'm sure you know, its not directly about what they say but how they say it.... they paint an emotional story and to sit there watching it live on ur big screen is quite riveting but chills right, for a real starcraft player who follows iccup tsl and shit...they will not often say anything insightful and they full often times make hilariously false few-seconds-before predictions about games(especially mr. overlord LOL)...but the korean fans don't give a fuck because the announcers are superb at the generalistics of their jobs just as you guys read 'generalistics' as a word from me and understand the meaning, despite it not being a real word, the korean announcers describe intricate strategies in the same way every day ok this is exactly what i expected. im sure korean commentary is extremely entertaining; sucks i cant understand. | ||
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Kyo Yuy
United States1286 Posts
The coaching session definitely helped. We played a few games and he helped me solidify my builds and understand a basic foundation of timing. He also helped me figure out PvZ better, which is a match up that originally made no sense to me but now makes a lot more sense. He admitted to me that this was probably the hardest session he ever had. And I figured that it would be as such, as my primary goal was NOT to improve my Starcraft but to actually DESIRE playing Starcraft. Instilling enthusiasm is definitely a difficult goal for any teacher to do, as anyone who has taught classes at an education institution would know. What I didn't actually say during the session, was that by the fourth game I was actually getting bored and wanted to stop playing. It wasn't that I was tired of losing or anything, I just didn't feel like playing. I don't want ANYONE to think this is Incontrol's fault at all. He is actually extremely fun to play with, and I honestly really enjoyed playing my first few games with him. The compliments he gave to me, whether they were genuine or motivational, did make me want to play some more and did give me a mild spark of interest (when he mentioned that he saw I had potential, that definitely made me happy to hear that from an A- level player ). However, as Incontrol stated in his session, learning is something that takes time. He outright stated that I wasn't going to magically get better in one session (which I have IMMENSE admiration for, being humble enough to admit that) but that he was giving me the tools to develop my game and I would then apply those tools when I play with other people. Likewise, developing interest takes time. Especially for me - it took me an entire year to finally start to enjoy dancing and an entire year before I started to play DDR competitively. Incontrol definitely had a difficult student on his hands, but I think what I really enjoyed about him was his passion for his students. He seemed VERY interested in helping me get better and making me enjoy Starcraft more. I think that is far more important in teaching than having the knowledge or having the skills to back it up. A teacher must be passionate about helping his students or they won't learn as well. And I respect Incontrol a lot for being so considerate and helpful to someone who isn't even sure if he wants to play the game. Overall, Incontrol is an EXTREMELY good teacher. He knows what the most important aspects are to focus on, for a player of my level, and he only focuses on those things rather than try to bombard me with every little facet of a game as complicated as Starcraft. Do I suddenly now have a burning desire to play Starcraft constantly and ladder on ICCUP? No. However, I do now have significantly more interest in the game than I used to, and now I am looking forward to participation in the CSL and I want to find a way to enjoy the game. As someone who pays $40 weekly for dance lessons, I can say that Incontrol's lessons are DEFINITELY worth the price. He is very helpful and informative, and he tries his hardest to help his clients with what they specifically want. Most importantly, he understands HOW to teach and how to get people to understand things, which I feel are far more important than his rank or credentials. | ||
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iNcontroL
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