EPTTLnet Poll - If the ESL tour is discontinued, how much are…
If the ESL tour is discontinued, how much are you willing to spend per year to support SC2 esports? (crowdfunding, stream subscriptions, donations, etc.) :
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TL.net Bot
TL.net140 Posts
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Waxangel
United States33714 Posts
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Blargh
United States2104 Posts
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Lambertus
South Africa995 Posts
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Balnazza
Germany1383 Posts
On January 07 2025 15:51 Blargh wrote: The problem isn't just the fact that we'd have to be paying $50-100 a year just to keep it around. It's that what we'd be paying for is like... the last 25 remaining competitive players... If I was paying $50-100 a year back in prime GSL (2011-2017) days, I wouldn't mind at all. But now it's hard to even justify... Considering how the question is worded...I don't see the problem? If you subscribe to two streamers on Twitch for a year and don't use any boni for it, you are already paying almost a 100 bucks. | ||
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Harris1st
Germany7459 Posts
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Blargh
United States2104 Posts
On January 07 2025 16:40 Balnazza wrote: Considering how the question is worded...I don't see the problem? If you subscribe to two streamers on Twitch for a year and don't use any boni for it, you are already paying almost a 100 bucks. Well I simply wouldn't feel like I'm making a meaningful investment when the scene is weak. I understand if some people love SC2 unconditionally, but my passion for SC2 has unfortunately faded with the number of players. And for what it's worth, I'm plenty used to supporting smaller esports scenes. I have followed Melee for literally 20 years now, and will frequently subscribe/donate to my favorite players, but the Melee scene makes SC2's look like a shriveled up corpse. There's just a lot of energy in that scene (and there always has been), and it doesn't feel like there's much energy in the SC2 scene. | ||
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kAra
Germany1468 Posts
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kajtarp
Hungary492 Posts
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CicadaSC
United States2076 Posts
On January 07 2025 22:45 kajtarp wrote: I would easily spend 50-100 usd/eur yearly providing the likes of Serral, Clem, Reynor, herO, Maru, Rogue, Trap etc. would still playing. No love for maxpax? | ||
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kajtarp
Hungary492 Posts
As far as i am aware he is not attending offline events, so my love for Maxpax is irrelevant. | ||
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Harris1st
Germany7459 Posts
On January 07 2025 23:50 kajtarp wrote: As far as i am aware he is not attending offline events, so my love for Maxpax is irrelevant. While offline events are obviously way cooler than online tournaments, I would be quite happy if we get some bigger online only tournaments at least. Saves the orga money and leaves more for the prices | ||
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Waxangel
United States33714 Posts
On January 07 2025 17:33 Blargh wrote: Well I simply wouldn't feel like I'm making a meaningful investment when the scene is weak. I understand if some people love SC2 unconditionally, but my passion for SC2 has unfortunately faded with the number of players. And for what it's worth, I'm plenty used to supporting smaller esports scenes. I have followed Melee for literally 20 years now, and will frequently subscribe/donate to my favorite players, but the Melee scene makes SC2's look like a shriveled up corpse. There's just a lot of energy in that scene (and there always has been), and it doesn't feel like there's much energy in the SC2 scene. I think you gotta be more specific about what you mean by "energy." If you mean the general # of pay-to-play offline events, then yeah, that's basically THE core of FGC and Melee since forever ago. But I think those could become more popular for SC2 if the scene became more grassroots (people used to pay a lot to play in MLG's when that was still the 'norm' of the scene). Prolly won't match the same level of enthusiasm, since pay-to-play has been out of the culture for so long. Other than that, I think SC2 has had a better home spectator/viewer scene than Melee for most of the last 20 years, which has limited opportunities for top players to all compete at the same event. | ||
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Garnet
Vietnam9056 Posts
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RogerChillingworth
Chad3132 Posts
On January 07 2025 17:33 Blargh wrote: Well I simply wouldn't feel like I'm making a meaningful investment when the scene is weak. I understand if some people love SC2 unconditionally, but my passion for SC2 has unfortunately faded with the number of players. And for what it's worth, I'm plenty used to supporting smaller esports scenes. I have followed Melee for literally 20 years now, and will frequently subscribe/donate to my favorite players, but the Melee scene makes SC2's look like a shriveled up corpse. There's just a lot of energy in that scene (and there always has been), and it doesn't feel like there's much energy in the SC2 scene. Yeah, I vibe with this. I've watched SC2 since the beginning and have enjoyed the 15 years. If now is its rightful time to sleep, that isn't such an awful thing. 15 years is a great run and, as others have put it, we are many years removed from the golden age when the scene was roiling. People also sometimes forget that the players might want to move on, too. Would the actors on Game of Thrones really want to do that show for 20 years, even if it's good? As a viewer, it's not always easy to see that. Existing SC2 players, and SC2 talent in general, may want to move on to other RTS, other games, or other things altogether unrelated to gaming at this point. Just speculating but it wouldn't come as a huge surprise. It's cheesy but every beginning comes from another beginning's end, like that song said. I think this discussion would look very different if at least one new RTS really captured the SC2 scene's attention but, from my vantage point at least, none of them have quite yet. I'm not sure if any of them will, or if there will be a bit of a dry period until something really grabs people again. Maybe for a future discussion. | ||
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Captain Peabody
United States3139 Posts
I don't think the scene is dead or anywhere near dead, frankly. I'm still watching. | ||
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shikadisoda
19 Posts
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Pascal1p
24 Posts
For example, I was a big fan of Rotterdam. But I got banned from his channel for objectively bad reasons. Someone in his chat was badmouthing BikeRush from CnC (who was at that time in the chat, enjoying sc2 as well). I said in chat: "a little more respect for one of the big names in another RTS". I got banned right that moment. So I had send an immediate request with asking: why I was banned? And then Rotterdam on his stream said: I am not going to unbann something who calls me disrespectul. Everyone knew I did not refer to Rotterdam, but no one spoke up for me. Plus I was always in chat and behaved nicely and with my behavior had shown I respected him. So it weird to get disqualified on one moment. Anyways this for me speaks volume about sc2, the scene consists of many people who can be quite toxic towards chat and also cannot take any criticism (with irony being this was not even directed at him). | ||
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Balnazza
Germany1383 Posts
On January 08 2025 03:49 Pascal1p wrote: My love for sc2 is gone, there are too little players I am invested in and in my opinion the casters also have ruined it. For example, I was a big fan of Rotterdam. But I got banned from his channel for objectively bad reasons. Someone in his chat was badmouthing BikeRush from CnC (who was at that time in the chat, enjoying sc2 as well). I said in chat: "a little more respect for one of the big names in another RTS". I got banned right that moment. So I had send an immediate request with asking: why I was banned? And then Rotterdam on his stream said: I am not going to unbann something who calls me disrespectul. Everyone knew I did not refer to Rotterdam, but no one spoke up for me. Plus I was always in chat and behaved nicely and with my behavior had shown I respected him. So it weird to get disqualified on one moment. Anyways this for me speaks volume about sc2, the scene consists of many people who can be quite toxic towards chat and also cannot take any criticism (with irony being this was not even directed at him). While I don't want to turn this into an argument about your specific case and I'm always aware that the "nice guys" on streams can be quite different off-camera (no particular experience in SC2, but I've had that revelation a few times back in my own casting career...and probably was somewhat of an arrogant ass myself, hard to judge)...it is equally hard to judge your case, as you might expect, since we all don't know what exactly happened. Just a few pointers: - In a chat with 100-300 viewers depending on the day, it can be hard for the streamer to follow the conversation. Especially if you didn't use the exact words you said, but a bit mor flowery language. - If you got banned "for this" and not just timeouted, you clearly were not a known viewer. Of course you ban people who you don't know and who seem disrespectful right from the get-go. Also explains why no one spoke out for you...why would anyone defend some random (no offense). - It doesn't particularly help your case that you are obviously quite butthurt about this...always sparks the "are you forgetting some parts of the story"-vibes But in a more general sense: I would say it is obvious that the SC2 casters are quite passionate about the game and that is generally enough for me. Rotterdam, Zombiegrub, Pig and co. are probably the last people I would blame for the decay of SC2 | ||
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CicadaSC
United States2076 Posts
On January 07 2025 23:50 kajtarp wrote: As far as i am aware he is not attending offline events, so my love for Maxpax is irrelevant. Would these crowdfunding efforts go towards offline events though? When I read this question/poll I assumed the crowdfunding would be for online tournaments. How would this even work? I feel like in a grassroots scene paying for a venue/production staff/equipment etc would be a horrendous waste of money and better spent in prizepool and thus online so most of the money goes towards the players/casters. | ||
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