|
vivax, what's up with that post about "chrom wtf u doing?" can you like...splain that to me?
|
Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
Yamato has made a total of zero posts since I last evaluated him, and this is his only post in the last 24 hours:
On October 26 2015 12:20 yamato77 wrote:
yeah this obviously didn't happen today
at the very least I'll do a couple filters after work tomorrow but I'm honestly so disinterested in this game
I dunno, it's my fault really, but this wasn't as enjoyable as the last time I played for whatever reason
I think I lost it
If you go back 72 hours isntead of 24, you get these two gems:
On October 25 2015 07:38 yamato77 wrote:
CS has consumed my life
On October 26 2015 04:08 yamato77 wrote:
Alright guys, today I will not play CS and I will play mafia.
I have quite a bit of catching up to do lel.
Yamato typically has a slow D1 start but I see no reason to TR him based on his performance after D1. My willingness to lynch him remains. He's a lurker on par with hopeless1. Let's make it happen.
##unvote
##vote yamato
GB filter dive inc. Last I read of him he was not high on my lynch list based on this:
On October 26 2015 17:45 Blazinghand wrote:here are things that stood out to me as townie from GB's filter during my dive a couple days ago: Show nested quote +On October 23 2015 11:18 GlowingBear wrote:On October 23 2015 05:11 Onegu wrote:
My RNG sheep is...
GlowingBear.
GlowingBear my vote is yours!!! OK! ##Vote: Onegu I don't see scum responding to a free vote this way. This is hilarious and fun and spontaneous and probably not what a scum player would do, because scum has to be more calculating. Here's a snippet of you and I discussing GB (edited for some mistakes): Show nested quote +On October 24 2015 03:19 Blazinghand wrote:On October 23 2015 19:02 Vivax wrote:On October 23 2015 10:38 GlowingBear wrote:On October 23 2015 07:53 Xatalos wrote:On October 23 2015 07:49 Vivax wrote:
Bothers me how first GB goes from "Vivax mafia cause tone" when most people agreed that it's my town tone, and then thinks of another reason to scumread me for and switches over to saying that he's suspicious of my townreads cause he doesn't know how they're formed.
So um yeah, either my tone sucks but then my townreads don't have anything to do with it, and when confronted with other people's opinions (marv was hitting that with a pneumatic hammer) he abandons it and starts looking for another reason to bitch about my alignment, so he asks me some fancy questions "why do you townread these dudes" when it's a question he could ask anyone without having to scumread them first. Maybe you're onto something.... Well, it does kind of feel like a premeditated push. No it doesn't. 1.There is no scum-motivation behind trying to push someone who is being universally townread. If scum wants to push someone, they will push mislynchable townies. They (usually) are never going against a hard target.2.I pushed Vivax because I don't like his tone and his easy town passes. I can find it scummy before further investigating it.I'm re-reading the game atm. 1. Wow look at you with the pants on your head, scum would never wear pants on their head. 2. The point is that you can just stick to your guns in that case instead of complaining about me not explaining my reads which is something that doesn't catch scum most of the time. There are dozens of read lists in this game and not every read is explained properly, it's a bottomless barrel. For example there's you saying marv has changed his playstyle and you're not sure about it and then he's suddenly green in the list post of yours, if I ask you why you'd say "I changed my read cause bsbs", great. If I call you scum for it you will just give a reasonable explanation. Or the irony in saying my reads are too static but being suspicious about me giving out too many of them, and basically being the first to do so. You accuse first and ask questions later, that's what I demonstrated with the post of mine and I have a hard time seeing you as the kind of guy who usually tunnels me for reasons I don't understand (like Koshi/Artanis/marv in earlier days). So Vivax, if I understand what you're getting at here, you were tonereaded by GB as scum. After people came in to defend you, GB then said "Vivax is pushing easy targets, so he's still scum". Why is GB scum and not a tunnelled townie for this? I think you raise a good point with the marv flip-flop (though again, marv is easy to read this game, so we don't really care about him) but "this guy got tunnelled and changed his reason for scumreading someone" seems like... well, in a vacuum it seems like the kind of thing a townie would do, especially if it's a little unpopular. Scum could easily change reads (as you note GB did on Marv), so why not do that on you? If I've missed context here, fill me in. Also, if I recall accurately you were one of the early supports of the RNG lynch on rayn. However, glancing through your filter, I don't see anything other than cursory interactions with him between voting him and now, and yet he's no longer on your list. You also write: On October 24 2015 01:55 Vivax wrote:On October 24 2015 01:52 Alakaslam wrote:On October 24 2015 01:49 Vivax wrote:
Oh Slam with the seniority argument.
I remember how I used that in my first games, trying to incite a revolution of the masses to overhtrow the vet government.
Then I got hanged, torn and quartered. I'm not saying they shouldn't use it as town. More that they are using it scummily here. If it comforts you I feel ambiguous about rayn too when he goes after you and not GB but I also take into consideration that we all got massive egos. Which wasn't too long ago. Where do you stand on rayn, and why? I'm not saying "hurr durr vote rayn now" but I'd like to see a clear statement from you on your position on raynpelikoneet, who used to be a library is obvscum clealry due to rng which I think addressed my thoughts on the early GB play pretty succinctly. Show nested quote +On October 24 2015 03:26 Blazinghand wrote:On October 23 2015 19:28 marvellosity wrote:
the funny thing is, one thing that makes me unsure about GB being mafia - both rayn and I stated pretty early that Vivax was town and I think it was kinda obvious we were serious about it. So I guess GB-mafia in that instance somehow decides to go against both me and rayn and push a very weak meta case? it's practically suicidal. maybe he's just town and believes it... dno right now I consider this moderate evidence that GB is town. It would be the easiest thing in the world for GB to drop this, right? So him sticking to it means he must really BELIEVE it (however incorrectly?) more than he cares about living. This isn't a dumbtell, it's a determinedtell. For example, the biggest shitfests between 2 people are always "town and town" cause nobody is more determined and stubborn than a tunnelled townie. I think this is fair point that I make here. This is what tunnelled townies look like. Is it possible, here, Vivax, that you're scumreading GB just because he scumread you, and that got you mad or at least biased? It's a really common thing for Town to OMGUS people, (town or scum), that call them scum, especially for clearly irrational reasonsl ike GB expressed. Now, we can say ":GB is irrational, and we expect town to have a certain logic" and that's a fair thing to say! for sure! but at the same time, scum ALSO has a certain logic. They're looking out for #1. They're not gonna do this, not after getting opposition from rayn and marv, right? They'll blow which way the wind is going, and be forgotten about.
I will update appropriately.
|
On October 27 2015 05:23 ritoky wrote:
vivax, what's up with that post about "chrom wtf u doing?" can you like...splain that to me?
Yes the way he skipped all the drama to only talk about GB constantly and how his opinion on rayn never seemed to change like it did with me and GB still gives me the feeling he has a stick up his ass in a not townie way.
Like, he has actually really low thread interaction and sticks with presenting his opinion from time to time but without being bothered at all that everyone is discussing something entirely different than just who to lynch, which is where you usually try to get on that level of discussion to actually get listened to about what you want.
|
On October 27 2015 05:23 ritoky wrote:
vivax, what's up with that post about "chrom wtf u doing?" can you like...splain that to me?
And besides this question is really odd to ask to me, it's pointless unless you think I was onto something there, which you probably don't. You've been the only one to find this even worth mentioning, why?
|
cuz it struck me as odd. the guy has a scum read he has said he is over 90% confident in, he made probably the best case of the phase to try and compell people to vote on him; and it hasn't gotten traction. he keeps pushing it trying to get his top read killed....i guess what you said isn't odd in the context of "can you get out of your tunnel and talk about other stuff?" but idk, it just stuck out to me cuz i don't see a compelling reason to read GB town, i like chrom's case, GB's defense is "i am town, push to vote" which is crap tier; so calling out someone for really assertively trying to get him lynched doesn't seem.....i dunno it was just a wat? moment
|
|
|
I laugh every time you describe Chromatically's playstyle as "having a stick up his ass" :D I guess I can see where you're coming from (his like laser-focus on specific things), but.. lol
The yamato wagon is feeling better and better. Basically I feel like everyone in it could easily be town.
|
Yes I get he has that scumread but why does his posting feel so much like he doesn't care what happens with it. It's like he's behind a glass wall at the time, holding up a poster occasionally repeating what he wants.
Especially with all that mess going on all he could do was say "rayn is town, GB is scum". Obviously with some reasons attached to them but still he feels disconnected from other people, in a way.
I'll refrain from having a decisive opinion on him yet cause it feels like he's so hard to read, but these are my thoughts.
|
On October 27 2015 05:42 Vivax wrote:
Yes I get he has that scumread but why does his posting feel so much like he doesn't care what happens with it. It's like he's behind a glass wall at the time, holding up a poster occasionally repeating what he wants.
Especially with all that mess going on all he could do was say "rayn is town, GB is scum". Obviously with some reasons attached to them but still he feels disconnected from other people, in a way.
I'll refrain from having a decisive opinion on him yet cause it feels like he's so hard to read, but these are my thoughts.
Hmmm, maybe during night phase I will read chrom's filter and see if this is right. I got the feeling he was invested in it, but maybe that was me ascribing my feelings about the lynch onto chrom.
|
If yamato is scum and GB town, I guess it does make Chromatically look a bit worse... But I still wouldn't say he's a primary lynch candidate really.
|
Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
So GB comes back into the thread about 4 hours ago to find two votes (chrom and ritok) on him. He makes a post (link) assertin his towniness to Chrom who is voting him.
Rayn questions him on his read re: rayn/slam
On October 27 2015 01:05 GlowingBear wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2015 00:55 raynpelikoneet wrote:
You literally had fucking 20 hours to re-evaluate, you called me town ALL THAT IME, then you suddenly think i am a better lynch than Slam who you had no read on.
Go GB, GO! Basically I read what people said and it made sense. Because my townread was basically on how your posts were sounding like you were trying to solve the game, but your flip on me was scummy. Basically, you say it's highly unlikely I'm scum, then for something I've proved NAI said by vivax you say I'm scum following the thread sentiment over the same filter you said I was level headed. Then you said I defended myself like I always defended myself as mafia but YOU KNOW I use those arguments regardless of alignment
He is pushed for reads, then Vivax says:
On October 27 2015 00:56 Vivax wrote:
GB what are your current reads?
And he replies by quoting his own post from earlier:
On October 26 2015 08:15 GlowingBear wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2015 08:03 Xatalos wrote:On October 26 2015 08:00 GlowingBear wrote:On October 26 2015 07:55 Xatalos wrote:
I'd basically like to shoot these people right now if I had a gun....
- GB: completely static scumread on Vivax that's not affected by anything happening in the thread, and I actually noticed that marv disproved his reasoning during D1 (by showing that Vivax had made overly confident reads before) but that didn't affect anything... it just does indeed feel like he picked someone to scumread and continued calling him scum no matter what... + overall low effort and disinterest towards anything happening in the game... some of the nice posts he's made can't really absolve him at this point
- yamato: playing according to his scum meta (inactive, disinterested) - there's one town game where he was inactive as well, but mostly he's been relatively active and a good asset as town, there's nothing like that to be seen here....
- Onegu: gave a high townread for rayn, voted for him over his nullread at deadline when the lynch was still completely undecided.... just this alone I think is impossible for town, he did make an "RNG sheep" vote in a previous game but I just can't accept he would choose to vote for his (supposed) highest townread based on some meta-joke... it just shows that he has zero interest towards solving the game or doing anything... and he has refused to answer several questions from different players that probed into his nonsensical arguments over the game
- rayn: disinterested towards the lynch result of D1 (basically sheeping/OMGUSing away to whatever he could), then just started spamming/lurking and caring even less about scumhunting than before
So yeah, I'm basically content if any of these players ends up getting lynched right now.... It looks like we still have 3 mislynches even, so I doubt we can lose if we start by cleaning up this pile of scummy. marv never disproved anything, marv disagreed with me, which is different. And my read on Vivax progressed as he came back to the thread. It's all in my filter. And no, I'm not mafia. Have you ever considered him to be town after the first minute...? I guess you did offer alternative lynches at times, like rayn. I'd really like to hear your overall reads right now. Yes, I've tried to read him coming from a townie perspective. He could be town? Yes, but I'm fairly certain he isn't. I have you as town for filter length and activity, you seem to care about the game which is the towniest trait one can have right now. I have chromatically as town, still. I find hard to believe any scum would put so much effort into writing a scum case on you and me, reading filters and shit. I think Rayn can be mafia but his rage quit is giving me pause. Nonetheless, his flip on me + slam's read on him all points out to him being mafia. I don't trust his rage on slam very much because, well, he knows how slam plays and slam was actually being productive - but productive against Rayn. I am very suspicious of Onegu. I will always think he is a good lynch. Hopeless has some townie posts but some of them are too similar to Avogadro's mini mafia. I think gumshoe might be town just because he is defending me. I can't see mafia motivation behind defending me. Now that yamato is extremely unproductive I can see him being scum. As I said, yamato is one of the players that we can have better reads on later days. And here we are. I don't know what to do with BH. Some of his posts seems very townie, others seems like fluff. I particularly dislike his "eternal dining" posts. On the other hand, I think the has being thinking about the game critically, so he is probably town. I don't know if I forgot someone.
and calls out rayn for not contributing and being angry. He gets into a long semantic argument with rayn about goodness and badness
he follows up with this:
On October 27 2015 01:53 GlowingBear wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2015 01:44 raynpelikoneet wrote:On October 27 2015 01:39 GlowingBear wrote:On October 27 2015 01:30 raynpelikoneet wrote:On October 27 2015 01:28 GlowingBear wrote:On October 27 2015 01:24 raynpelikoneet wrote:On October 27 2015 01:22 GlowingBear wrote:On October 27 2015 01:18 raynpelikoneet wrote:On October 27 2015 01:18 GlowingBear wrote:
Ok I'm voting Rayn ofc you are. You're trying to prove a point. The point is that the slam playstyle is annoying and useless. But the point you proved is that slam is fun to play with and you're not, regardless if you're trolling or actually playing. Because nowadays when you're actually playing you're beig bad and when you're trolling you can't get a laugh out of anything you post. You just proved to be a cry baby. Grow up. this post is offending me personally because i am 100x better player than ypu are but it's okay. Im offending your attitude. I've told you more than once that I liked playing with you before but you keep doing this "I am a better player than most of you" or this kind of rant which is annoying as hell. I've never said I was better than you. But that's all that matters to you. How you feel when you compare yourself to the others. And when I criticise your attitude you take it personally. Please change your attitude here, then. that's what you implied. I've implied you've been bad, not that I've been good. This is not a competition. Latest games I've been with you, you have been spot on on some people, and dead wrong on others. CopCake, rsoultin, etc. And you blame THEM, but if others were able to read them correctly, well, it's your fault you've got a wrong read, not theirs. Anyway, that's only if you're town here. If you're mafia you've successfully annoyed everyone, so it might be a good play. this is good. Okay why am i scum? I've said why you're scum, I don't trust your flip on me and that's all there is. To be fair, you usually have been very right on me in most games and I find hard to believe you can be wrong just because Vivax pointed out sonething NAI about me. I even think there were better lynched than you, Rayn. I started today wanting to vote Onegu, kept myself on yamato, but your insistence on trolling simply annoyed me as hell to the point I wanted to get rid of you. Especially when I think you could do that as scum to clutter the thread and disorganise town
In which he basically admits he's lynching rayn for irrational reasons. Then he makes a "case" that I don't understand and does not convince me:
On October 27 2015 02:48 GlowingBear wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2015 07:59 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I might be wrong on GlowingBear, what Vivax said makes a lot of sense tbh.
It's like GB goes "i call this thing scummy then i ask about it" when it should be another way around if he didn't know the reasoning of Vivax' reads. If he doesn't care about the answer (=scummy anyways, as he seemed to think so), why even ask? 1) this is shit and you know I can call people mafia and further investigate it. 2) it was in my filter and you could've catch up on this by yourself. Instead you just shift the responsibility to Vivax It is a weak reason to call me mafia especially because it's a HUGE shift from this: Show nested quote +On October 23 2015 07:12 raynpelikoneet wrote:On October 23 2015 07:05 yamato77 wrote:On October 23 2015 07:02 Xatalos wrote:On October 23 2015 06:52 yamato77 wrote:On October 23 2015 06:47 Xatalos wrote:
So instead of what's stupid, what do you think is... scummy/towny? I liked marv's pressure of GB. I had issue with what GB posted myself and it makes me feel better about him. GB, on the other hand, hasn't posted anything outside of what I believe he could post as mafia, so I'm still quite suspicious of him. Hm... I guess I agree. Though doesn't your last sentence make him null instead of suspicious? No, it makes him suspicious. yamato i am pretty sure GlowingBear is town here. Basically he says really scummy shit that makes absolutely no sense as mafia, because he doesn't really know what to do at all (i assume). Here he has some sort of a thought process going on in his head. Basically it's highly unlike he is scum here. Same goes for Hopeless, he tried to do stuff. He is just doing it in his own way that looks scummy to basically everyone.. always. I am really really sure ritoky is mafia. I am also quite sure Slam is scum because of process of elimination. Xatalos is probably just really fucking dumb atm, but at least his explanation to BH thing makes some sense, unlike ritoky's. ritoky basically argues that Blazinghand is town based on illogical arguments, or arguments that are easily proven wrong. Like even if he believes those arguments are true the read is shit and arguing the read is good for those things is something that a townie never does. Last scum is probably Blazinghand or Onegu. I kinda think it's Onegu atm, since Blazinghand seems to be trying to do something and getting something out of his shennies at the start of the game. I don't believe gumshoe is scum, basically his reacation towards me doesn't make any sense as mafia. He is right in that i suually pressure him every game we are in and i know he acts differently when he is scum than when he is town. I just don't see him being scum here. Vivax is basically his own paranoid town self with a portion of good logical thoughts. marv is almost definitely town. you are almost definitely town. Chromatically seems to be the most level headed person in this game. It's like not totally out of question he is scum here but most likely he is just town as his posting suggests.
On October 27 2015 02:49 GlowingBear wrote:
That, rayn, and slam's suspicions on you, makes me think you're mafia.
Period.
and tries to defend his flip-flopping on rayn (on the same evidence set; note that he scumreads rayn for something that rayn did BEFORe he townreaded rayn):
On October 27 2015 03:39 GlowingBear wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2015 03:34 Chromatically wrote:On October 27 2015 02:48 GlowingBear wrote:On October 23 2015 07:59 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I might be wrong on GlowingBear, what Vivax said makes a lot of sense tbh.
It's like GB goes "i call this thing scummy then i ask about it" when it should be another way around if he didn't know the reasoning of Vivax' reads. If he doesn't care about the answer (=scummy anyways, as he seemed to think so), why even ask? 1) this is shit and you know I can call people mafia and further investigate it. 2) it was in my filter and you could've catch up on this by yourself. Instead you just shift the responsibility to Vivax It is a weak reason to call me mafia especially because it's a HUGE shift from this: On October 23 2015 07:12 raynpelikoneet wrote:On October 23 2015 07:05 yamato77 wrote:On October 23 2015 07:02 Xatalos wrote:On October 23 2015 06:52 yamato77 wrote:On October 23 2015 06:47 Xatalos wrote:
So instead of what's stupid, what do you think is... scummy/towny? I liked marv's pressure of GB. I had issue with what GB posted myself and it makes me feel better about him. GB, on the other hand, hasn't posted anything outside of what I believe he could post as mafia, so I'm still quite suspicious of him. Hm... I guess I agree. Though doesn't your last sentence make him null instead of suspicious? No, it makes him suspicious. yamato i am pretty sure GlowingBear is town here. Basically he says really scummy shit that makes absolutely no sense as mafia, because he doesn't really know what to do at all (i assume). Here he has some sort of a thought process going on in his head. Basically it's highly unlike he is scum here. Same goes for Hopeless, he tried to do stuff. He is just doing it in his own way that looks scummy to basically everyone.. always. I am really really sure ritoky is mafia. I am also quite sure Slam is scum because of process of elimination. Xatalos is probably just really fucking dumb atm, but at least his explanation to BH thing makes some sense, unlike ritoky's. ritoky basically argues that Blazinghand is town based on illogical arguments, or arguments that are easily proven wrong. Like even if he believes those arguments are true the read is shit and arguing the read is good for those things is something that a townie never does. Last scum is probably Blazinghand or Onegu. I kinda think it's Onegu atm, since Blazinghand seems to be trying to do something and getting something out of his shennies at the start of the game. I don't believe gumshoe is scum, basically his reacation towards me doesn't make any sense as mafia. He is right in that i suually pressure him every game we are in and i know he acts differently when he is scum than when he is town. I just don't see him being scum here. Vivax is basically his own paranoid town self with a portion of good logical thoughts. marv is almost definitely town. you are almost definitely town. Chromatically seems to be the most level headed person in this game. It's like not totally out of question he is scum here but most likely he is just town as his posting suggests. YEAH WTF and then here he's saying that he thinks rayn is mafia for something that happened before he called rayn town. If he thinks rayn is mafia so much for the switch then why was rayn so town in the list post he made? Because I was afraid I could be OMGUSing. Then other people, especially slam, brought suspicions on him and it made sense to me.
and then bails
Overall I give GB a C- on his execution and effort. I do not like the way GB has handled today, especially since rayn is not a primary lynch target. Let's talk about his yamato read development:
He begins about halfway through the day with this:
On October 26 2015 08:03 GlowingBear wrote:
Let me ask you something, Xatalos.
Will a tunneled townie forget about his scumread one day later?
Because Vivax called Yamato scum for being inactive (in less than 24 hours in the game). When yamato turned against me, Vivax gave him a very weird townread (it felt like a joke, Vivax said it was an actual townread).
Yamato is inactive now. Vivax never talks about him anymore. He only supports my lynch when people talk about it.
I can never see a world where Vivax isn't scum here. Never.
Especially now that yamato's inactivity IS indeed scummy, and he is doing nothing, and NOW he's fitting his scum meta.
This is his first real mention of yamato, phrased as a series of questions and observations to Xat, 2 hours before he votes Yam, but after Gumshoe votes yam. He doesn't reference gumshoe's case and doesn't describe yamato's meta in detail, other than calling yamato (Accurately) inactive. HE also doesn't vote yamato77 yet. However, in his list post he says:
On October 26 2015 08:15 GlowingBear wrote:
I think gumshoe might be town just because he is defending me. I can't see mafia motivation behind defending me.
Now that yamato is extremely unproductive I can see him being scum. As I said, yamato is one of the players that we can have better reads on later days. And here we are.
Which is his main references to yamato and gumshoe in the list case. He quite reasonably points out that giving yamato a pass on D1 is normal, but now it's D2 and we've had nothing from yamato. I like what he's said here but it seems very tentative, like he's testing the waters. This might be fair; he has several votes on him at this moment and is trying to set up a counterwagon.
He reasonably says associative tells between unflipped players are bad:
On October 26 2015 09:51 GlowingBear wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2015 08:23 gumshoe wrote:On October 26 2015 08:15 GlowingBear wrote:On October 26 2015 08:03 Xatalos wrote:On October 26 2015 08:00 GlowingBear wrote:On October 26 2015 07:55 Xatalos wrote:
I'd basically like to shoot these people right now if I had a gun....
- GB: completely static scumread on Vivax that's not affected by anything happening in the thread, and I actually noticed that marv disproved his reasoning during D1 (by showing that Vivax had made overly confident reads before) but that didn't affect anything... it just does indeed feel like he picked someone to scumread and continued calling him scum no matter what... + overall low effort and disinterest towards anything happening in the game... some of the nice posts he's made can't really absolve him at this point
- yamato: playing according to his scum meta (inactive, disinterested) - there's one town game where he was inactive as well, but mostly he's been relatively active and a good asset as town, there's nothing like that to be seen here....
- Onegu: gave a high townread for rayn, voted for him over his nullread at deadline when the lynch was still completely undecided.... just this alone I think is impossible for town, he did make an "RNG sheep" vote in a previous game but I just can't accept he would choose to vote for his (supposed) highest townread based on some meta-joke... it just shows that he has zero interest towards solving the game or doing anything... and he has refused to answer several questions from different players that probed into his nonsensical arguments over the game
- rayn: disinterested towards the lynch result of D1 (basically sheeping/OMGUSing away to whatever he could), then just started spamming/lurking and caring even less about scumhunting than before
So yeah, I'm basically content if any of these players ends up getting lynched right now.... It looks like we still have 3 mislynches even, so I doubt we can lose if we start by cleaning up this pile of scummy. marv never disproved anything, marv disagreed with me, which is different. And my read on Vivax progressed as he came back to the thread. It's all in my filter. And no, I'm not mafia. Have you ever considered him to be town after the first minute...? I guess you did offer alternative lynches at times, like rayn. I'd really like to hear your overall reads right now. Yes, I've tried to read him coming from a townie perspective. He could be town? Yes, but I'm fairly certain he isn't. I have you as town for filter length and activity, you seem to care about the game which is the towniest trait one can have right now. I have chromatically as town, still. I find hard to believe any scum would put so much effort into writing a scum case on you and me, reading filters and shit. I think Rayn can be mafia but his rage quit is giving me pause. Nonetheless, his flip on me + slam's read on him all points out to him being mafia. I don't trust his rage on slam very much because, well, he knows how slam plays and slam was actually being productive - but productive against Rayn. I am very suspicious of Onegu. I will always think he is a good lynch. Hopeless has some townie posts but some of them are too similar to Avogadro's mini mafia. I think gumshoe might be town just because he is defending me. I can't see mafia motivation behind defending me. Now that yamato is extremely unproductive I can see him being scum. As I said, yamato is one of the players that we can have better reads on later days. And here we are. I don't know what to do with BH. Some of his posts seems very townie, others seems like fluff. I particularly dislike his "eternal dining" posts. On the other hand, I think the has being thinking about the game critically, so he is probably town. I don't know if I forgot someone. Remember how Yamato attacked you for bullshiting against Vivax? Then casually switched over to accusing Vivax once the chance of your lynch evaporated? Theory- wouldn't that make sense, if you were wrong about Vivax and Yamato knew this cause he was scum?(hence why he was so certain you were making shit up as you went along, from his perspective as scum it would look exactly like that to him no matter you were saying about Vivax, cause the bottom line would be that your wrong)he then was fine with switching onto Vivax because wait for it! Hes scum -_- Proposal- Lets lynch Yamato, then we can come back to Vivax, if Yamato is scum, then wouldn't that tell you a bit about Vivax? I wouldn't do that kind of association because they could be bussing. Yamato never really voted Vivax and Vivax forgot about him to focus on me. It wouldn't really tell me much. Let's see how the day will unfold.
and votes Yam right after this without announcing it in the main thread (as far as I can find).
When gumshoe accosts him, he says he's voting Yam:
On October 26 2015 12:33 GlowingBear wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2015 10:39 gumshoe wrote:On October 26 2015 10:21 GlowingBear wrote:On October 26 2015 10:02 Xatalos wrote:
Could you perhaps elaborate why Onegu is better?
Not that I disagree with lynching him.
Maybe I'll get to sleep soon... Basically I can never read onegu, and I can read yamato better the later we get in the game. We will never know Onegu's alignment until endgame. Because that's how he is. And I prefer to have him lynch as soon as possible. If you can read Yam at all you should know how shit his day 1 was. In fact you of all fucking people should know that XD His contributions consisted of getting Marv to go after you, almost resulting in your lynch. Not wanting to lynch Onegue for no reason, vaugley going after Slam early and then parroting Marvs slam case back at him to explain his miday vote. I can understand chrom not wanting to see Yam as scum, cause then he has to give up his case on you -_- but how can YOU still defend Yam? Its unbelievable XD To summarize, from your perspective all Yam has been doing is advocating mislynches, providing shady undexplained reads, lurking and fucking town reading/protecting the likes of hopeless and onegue... Hopeless is a pretty ez townread IMO. I don't really want to lynch Onegu but I admittedly haven't read his probably short filter either. WHY ARE WE NOT KILLING THIS MAN. If he actually is town by some miraculous stretch, lurkers should be coming out of retirement just to throw shade his way. Instead the only person trying to bring down the man with what must be the most fantastic ratio of lurk to malevolent post this game is me XD That right there should be enough to tell the tale -_- cman gb, get in mah pen ![[image loading]](http://s0.geograph.org.uk/geophotos/02/50/90/2509024_4383a58c.jpg) I'm not defending yamato, I'm voting him. Let me ask you a question: if yamato flips green, does it change your read on me?
After this, though, he makes a very convenient claim about his stance on yamato:
On October 27 2015 01:53 GlowingBear wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2015 01:44 raynpelikoneet wrote:On October 27 2015 01:39 GlowingBear wrote:On October 27 2015 01:30 raynpelikoneet wrote:On October 27 2015 01:28 GlowingBear wrote:On October 27 2015 01:24 raynpelikoneet wrote:On October 27 2015 01:22 GlowingBear wrote:On October 27 2015 01:18 raynpelikoneet wrote:On October 27 2015 01:18 GlowingBear wrote:
Ok I'm voting Rayn ofc you are. You're trying to prove a point. The point is that the slam playstyle is annoying and useless. But the point you proved is that slam is fun to play with and you're not, regardless if you're trolling or actually playing. Because nowadays when you're actually playing you're beig bad and when you're trolling you can't get a laugh out of anything you post. You just proved to be a cry baby. Grow up. this post is offending me personally because i am 100x better player than ypu are but it's okay. Im offending your attitude. I've told you more than once that I liked playing with you before but you keep doing this "I am a better player than most of you" or this kind of rant which is annoying as hell. I've never said I was better than you. But that's all that matters to you. How you feel when you compare yourself to the others. And when I criticise your attitude you take it personally. Please change your attitude here, then. that's what you implied. I've implied you've been bad, not that I've been good. This is not a competition. Latest games I've been with you, you have been spot on on some people, and dead wrong on others. CopCake, rsoultin, etc. And you blame THEM, but if others were able to read them correctly, well, it's your fault you've got a wrong read, not theirs. Anyway, that's only if you're town here. If you're mafia you've successfully annoyed everyone, so it might be a good play. this is good. Okay why am i scum? I've said why you're scum, I don't trust your flip on me and that's all there is. To be fair, you usually have been very right on me in most games and I find hard to believe you can be wrong just because Vivax pointed out sonething NAI about me. I even think there were better lynched than you, Rayn. I started today wanting to vote Onegu, kept myself on yamato, but your insistence on trolling simply annoyed me as hell to the point I wanted to get rid of you. Especially when I think you could do that as scum to clutter the thread and disorganise town
What I saw wasn't a GB who "kept himself on yamato", I saw a GB who tentatively put out some yamato feelers after Gumshoe set up a case, never pushed hard, but eventually was convinced by GS that Yam was the right lynch over 1gu. I don't think there's something inherently wrong with that; he eventually got on board, reasonably enough. But he definitely didn't keep himself on yamato or somehow drive the case. It's not unreasonable for GB to vote for the main counterwagon regardless of his alignment.
Actually, GB jumping onto rayn (who isn't getting lynched today) COULD be a sign of GB being town. If I were scum GB here, unless I was somehow scumbuddies with Yam-- I won't speculate about associative tells between unflipped players-- I'd generally want to vote Yam to keep myself alive. Moving OFF of yam and ONTO rayn and then getting into some kind of shitfest argument with rayn... well, it doesn't make a huge amount of sense for a GB who's trying to look good and get Yam lynched. I guess what I'm getting at here is that, in a world in which GB is scum, I expect him to be a bit more calculating than this.
That being said, at this moment he's fine with his vote on rayn; there's significantly more support for a yam lynch than his lynch. And I recall someone last night saying "everyone scumreads GB, but nobody actually votes him" which could be a sign of scum activity (did you find anyone who did this, btW? please name names), all of which points to a GB who's playing the part of flustered townie.
I guess, looking at this, I still don't think GB is a great lynch today. He's actually trying to play the game, one way or another, and he's definitely putting in more effort than rayn, H1, 1gu, or yam; I don't think we can actually afford to lynch him today when we could be lynching someone who's literally not contributing. Yam clearly prefers to not play this game, and I don't expect him to post anything to clear things up. He's willing to show up each day and vote to not get modkilled (H1 is also in this category; I AM ONE HUNDO PERCENT DOWN FOR SHENANNIES ONTO H1 BTW) and honestly we can't afford to not lynch people who do that. There's no cop or vigi to save us, we have to do this ourselves
sigh
|
On October 27 2015 03:45 Xatalos wrote:
Chromatically: Hm.... I guess, but it's not implausible for town GB to only start thinking about the switch and how it happened a bit later on. I think what rayn did was worse. I mean... he basically gave a full townread for GB, then suddenly started scumreading him for the same posts when the wind shifted.
He explained it pretty well in my opinion:
+ Show Spoiler +On October 23 2015 07:51 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2015 07:49 Vivax wrote:
Bothers me how first GB goes from "Vivax mafia cause tone" when most people agreed that it's my town tone, and then thinks of another reason to scumread me for and switches over to saying that he's suspicious of my townreads cause he doesn't know how they're formed.
So um yeah, either my tone sucks but then my townreads don't have anything to do with it, and when confronted with other people's opinions (marv was hitting that with a pneumatic hammer) he abandons it and starts looking for another reason to bitch about my alignment, so he asks me some fancy questions "why do you townread these dudes" when it's a question he could ask anyone without having to scumread them first. Hmm okay this makes sense. On October 23 2015 07:59 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I might be wrong on GlowingBear, what Vivax said makes a lot of sense tbh.
It's like GB goes "i call this thing scummy then i ask about it" when it should be another way around if he didn't know the reasoning of Vivax' reads. If he doesn't care about the answer (=scummy anyways, as he seemed to think so), why even ask? On October 23 2015 08:02 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2015 08:00 Xatalos wrote:
Hm... rayn, you stopped responding to me because you understood my point about the RNG things, but I'm "dumb" anyway? Why am I "dumb" even if you thought I ultimately had a point? Or did you talk about it with me because you initially put / painted me as scum and then dropped interest when it didn't go anywhere?
Well, I guess you did answer some of it indirectly in your other posts anyway. I was still left hanging especially with how you gave GB/Hopeless such easy town passes (for almost nothing) and why ritoky became scum for... basically disagreeing with you about some RNG statistics? Because i can see how it makes sense in your world, it doesn't change the fact i consider it dumb.  That's not why i read ritoky mafia. And i can read Hopeless very well. Probably better than anyone in this game. I missed some stuff on GB, he looked level headed enough for me to consider him town and he is another person whose posts i pay very little attention to at least early on, unless ofc i think he is mafia.
But he's not up for lynch today really so not super relevant right now.
Compare to GB's justification:
On October 27 2015 03:39 GlowingBear wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2015 03:34 Chromatically wrote:On October 27 2015 02:48 GlowingBear wrote:On October 23 2015 07:59 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I might be wrong on GlowingBear, what Vivax said makes a lot of sense tbh.
It's like GB goes "i call this thing scummy then i ask about it" when it should be another way around if he didn't know the reasoning of Vivax' reads. If he doesn't care about the answer (=scummy anyways, as he seemed to think so), why even ask? 1) this is shit and you know I can call people mafia and further investigate it. 2) it was in my filter and you could've catch up on this by yourself. Instead you just shift the responsibility to Vivax It is a weak reason to call me mafia especially because it's a HUGE shift from this: On October 23 2015 07:12 raynpelikoneet wrote:On October 23 2015 07:05 yamato77 wrote:On October 23 2015 07:02 Xatalos wrote:On October 23 2015 06:52 yamato77 wrote:On October 23 2015 06:47 Xatalos wrote:
So instead of what's stupid, what do you think is... scummy/towny? I liked marv's pressure of GB. I had issue with what GB posted myself and it makes me feel better about him. GB, on the other hand, hasn't posted anything outside of what I believe he could post as mafia, so I'm still quite suspicious of him. Hm... I guess I agree. Though doesn't your last sentence make him null instead of suspicious? No, it makes him suspicious. yamato i am pretty sure GlowingBear is town here. Basically he says really scummy shit that makes absolutely no sense as mafia, because he doesn't really know what to do at all (i assume). Here he has some sort of a thought process going on in his head. Basically it's highly unlike he is scum here. Same goes for Hopeless, he tried to do stuff. He is just doing it in his own way that looks scummy to basically everyone.. always. I am really really sure ritoky is mafia. I am also quite sure Slam is scum because of process of elimination. Xatalos is probably just really fucking dumb atm, but at least his explanation to BH thing makes some sense, unlike ritoky's. ritoky basically argues that Blazinghand is town based on illogical arguments, or arguments that are easily proven wrong. Like even if he believes those arguments are true the read is shit and arguing the read is good for those things is something that a townie never does. Last scum is probably Blazinghand or Onegu. I kinda think it's Onegu atm, since Blazinghand seems to be trying to do something and getting something out of his shennies at the start of the game. I don't believe gumshoe is scum, basically his reacation towards me doesn't make any sense as mafia. He is right in that i suually pressure him every game we are in and i know he acts differently when he is scum than when he is town. I just don't see him being scum here. Vivax is basically his own paranoid town self with a portion of good logical thoughts. marv is almost definitely town. you are almost definitely town. Chromatically seems to be the most level headed person in this game. It's like not totally out of question he is scum here but most likely he is just town as his posting suggests. YEAH WTF and then here he's saying that he thinks rayn is mafia for something that happened before he called rayn town. If he thinks rayn is mafia so much for the switch then why was rayn so town in the list post he made? Because I was afraid I could be OMGUSing. Then other people, especially slam, brought suspicions on him and it made sense to me.
His justification is that he could be OMGUSing. Do you ever read someone's posts and say "oh those are scummy, but I'll give you a top townread because I might be OMGUSing"?
|
I have low thread interaction? Okay Vivax. I've discussed with a lot of people what I think of the lynch today.
|
Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
On October 27 2015 05:48 Chromatically wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2015 03:45 Xatalos wrote:
Chromatically: Hm.... I guess, but it's not implausible for town GB to only start thinking about the switch and how it happened a bit later on. I think what rayn did was worse. I mean... he basically gave a full townread for GB, then suddenly started scumreading him for the same posts when the wind shifted. He explained it pretty well in my opinion: + Show Spoiler +On October 23 2015 07:51 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2015 07:49 Vivax wrote:
Bothers me how first GB goes from "Vivax mafia cause tone" when most people agreed that it's my town tone, and then thinks of another reason to scumread me for and switches over to saying that he's suspicious of my townreads cause he doesn't know how they're formed.
So um yeah, either my tone sucks but then my townreads don't have anything to do with it, and when confronted with other people's opinions (marv was hitting that with a pneumatic hammer) he abandons it and starts looking for another reason to bitch about my alignment, so he asks me some fancy questions "why do you townread these dudes" when it's a question he could ask anyone without having to scumread them first. Hmm okay this makes sense. On October 23 2015 07:59 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I might be wrong on GlowingBear, what Vivax said makes a lot of sense tbh.
It's like GB goes "i call this thing scummy then i ask about it" when it should be another way around if he didn't know the reasoning of Vivax' reads. If he doesn't care about the answer (=scummy anyways, as he seemed to think so), why even ask? On October 23 2015 08:02 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2015 08:00 Xatalos wrote:
Hm... rayn, you stopped responding to me because you understood my point about the RNG things, but I'm "dumb" anyway? Why am I "dumb" even if you thought I ultimately had a point? Or did you talk about it with me because you initially put / painted me as scum and then dropped interest when it didn't go anywhere?
Well, I guess you did answer some of it indirectly in your other posts anyway. I was still left hanging especially with how you gave GB/Hopeless such easy town passes (for almost nothing) and why ritoky became scum for... basically disagreeing with you about some RNG statistics? Because i can see how it makes sense in your world, it doesn't change the fact i consider it dumb. That's not why i read ritoky mafia. And i can read Hopeless very well. Probably better than anyone in this game. I missed some stuff on GB, he looked level headed enough for me to consider him town and he is another person whose posts i pay very little attention to at least early on, unless ofc i think he is mafia. But he's not up for lynch today really so not super relevant right now. Compare to GB's justification: Show nested quote +On October 27 2015 03:39 GlowingBear wrote:On October 27 2015 03:34 Chromatically wrote:On October 27 2015 02:48 GlowingBear wrote:On October 23 2015 07:59 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I might be wrong on GlowingBear, what Vivax said makes a lot of sense tbh.
It's like GB goes "i call this thing scummy then i ask about it" when it should be another way around if he didn't know the reasoning of Vivax' reads. If he doesn't care about the answer (=scummy anyways, as he seemed to think so), why even ask? 1) this is shit and you know I can call people mafia and further investigate it. 2) it was in my filter and you could've catch up on this by yourself. Instead you just shift the responsibility to Vivax It is a weak reason to call me mafia especially because it's a HUGE shift from this: On October 23 2015 07:12 raynpelikoneet wrote:On October 23 2015 07:05 yamato77 wrote:On October 23 2015 07:02 Xatalos wrote:On October 23 2015 06:52 yamato77 wrote:On October 23 2015 06:47 Xatalos wrote:
So instead of what's stupid, what do you think is... scummy/towny? I liked marv's pressure of GB. I had issue with what GB posted myself and it makes me feel better about him. GB, on the other hand, hasn't posted anything outside of what I believe he could post as mafia, so I'm still quite suspicious of him. Hm... I guess I agree. Though doesn't your last sentence make him null instead of suspicious? No, it makes him suspicious. yamato i am pretty sure GlowingBear is town here. Basically he says really scummy shit that makes absolutely no sense as mafia, because he doesn't really know what to do at all (i assume). Here he has some sort of a thought process going on in his head. Basically it's highly unlike he is scum here. Same goes for Hopeless, he tried to do stuff. He is just doing it in his own way that looks scummy to basically everyone.. always. I am really really sure ritoky is mafia. I am also quite sure Slam is scum because of process of elimination. Xatalos is probably just really fucking dumb atm, but at least his explanation to BH thing makes some sense, unlike ritoky's. ritoky basically argues that Blazinghand is town based on illogical arguments, or arguments that are easily proven wrong. Like even if he believes those arguments are true the read is shit and arguing the read is good for those things is something that a townie never does. Last scum is probably Blazinghand or Onegu. I kinda think it's Onegu atm, since Blazinghand seems to be trying to do something and getting something out of his shennies at the start of the game. I don't believe gumshoe is scum, basically his reacation towards me doesn't make any sense as mafia. He is right in that i suually pressure him every game we are in and i know he acts differently when he is scum than when he is town. I just don't see him being scum here. Vivax is basically his own paranoid town self with a portion of good logical thoughts. marv is almost definitely town. you are almost definitely town. Chromatically seems to be the most level headed person in this game. It's like not totally out of question he is scum here but most likely he is just town as his posting suggests. YEAH WTF and then here he's saying that he thinks rayn is mafia for something that happened before he called rayn town. If he thinks rayn is mafia so much for the switch then why was rayn so town in the list post he made? Because I was afraid I could be OMGUSing. Then other people, especially slam, brought suspicions on him and it made sense to me. His justification is that he could be OMGUSing. Do you ever read someone's posts and say "oh those are scummy, but I'll give you a top townread because I might be OMGUSing"?
Admittedly, GB's actions don't make sense. If the Yam wagon I am on is defeated by the GB wagon, I won't shed a tear for GB's death. That doesn't necessarily mean we shoudl be like, having a super hard-on for lynching GB. A single nonsensible read progression does not a scum player make! Can you understand why, though, I see players like Yam as more of a threat to our ability to win, though?
|
Bleh to many pages to read if it is just all going to be rayn being crazy...
|
I agree with a lot of that post, BH. But honestly I would argue that our biggest threat to our ability to win is lynching mafia, not lynching people who don't play the game. Lurkers are really bad for town in this setup, but I think we have to consider if lynching a lurker is our best chance of hitting mafia. I don't think it is right now, but clearly many disagree.
|
Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
Like, literally if we don't lynch Yam for not playing, and he's scum, we just lose. It's not like he's showing up and doing things and people are scumreading him for that. People who are townreading him are all making different version of the following argument:
"It's possible Yam is town, and we have no way of knowing, since he's not playing. Also he was playing video games on steam or something. In any case, I'm not gonna lynch him for inscrutable reasons, and he will remain inscrutable"
Like, rayn for example, if he's really actually mad, I predicted we needed to give him time (and also had a strong towntell from that argument with the host) and lo and behold, he made some attempts to play in the second half of this day. Did he do a good job of it? No, rayn did a shit job of it. And we can critique him for that. We can also critique GB for doing a shit play.
In fact, I 100% promise you there is more shitty things that GB did than shitty things that Yam did. If you filter dive an dlook for weird inconsitencies, GlowingBear will have more than Yamato. You know why? Cause Glowingbear has made more than 3 posts in the last 72 hours.
Here let me show you yam's filter for the past 72 hours:
On October 25 2015 07:38 yamato77 wrote:
CS has consumed my life
On October 26 2015 04:08 yamato77 wrote:
Alright guys, today I will not play CS and I will play mafia.
I have quite a bit of catching up to do lel.
On October 26 2015 12:20 yamato77 wrote:
yeah this obviously didn't happen today
at the very least I'll do a couple filters after work tomorrow but I'm honestly so disinterested in this game
I dunno, it's my fault really, but this wasn't as enjoyable as the last time I played for whatever reason
I think I lost it
OF COURSE GB is going to have more weird flipflops and flaws than yamato; yamato literally hasn't posted. You can't say GB looks worse than yamato and have that be a meaningful statement. You know how I told the host listing Marvellosity as a non-voter was technically correct, but misleading since he's dead? Well, that's also true for listing GB as scummier than Yam. TEchnically, yes, GB is scummier than Yam, but that's becasue Yam literally hasn't posted anything. HE LITERALLY HAS NOT.
So what's the deal? Why are we defending Yam?
|
Getting some medicine I dont feel well. We should lynch hopeless. BH go back. Other people join.
|
On October 27 2015 05:55 Chromatically wrote:
I agree with a lot of that post, BH. But honestly I would argue that our biggest threat to our ability to win is lynching mafia, not lynching people who don't play the game. Lurkers are really bad for town in this setup, but I think we have to consider if lynching a lurker is our best chance of hitting mafia. I don't think it is right now, but clearly many disagree.
A useless lurker, WITH scummy traits, whose playing against his meta : P Not a bad shot at all.
|
The yamato lynch isn't terrible by any stretch of the imagination. I'm just very confident in GB. But it's doubtful it will happen today anyway.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
