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Honestly, Chrom, if you want my opinion, I'd say to back off me for a little bit and force others to chime in with their thoughts. You're a strong town read for most of us (myself included), so you doing the pressure for the scum isn't really giving us any new material to work with.
See: Nightcat sheeping
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Can you answer my question about your read on Super?
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On July 17 2013 03:07 hzflank wrote:Show nested quote +On July 17 2013 02:59 Hurricane Sponge wrote:On July 17 2013 02:51 hzflank wrote:On July 17 2013 02:41 Hurricane Sponge wrote:On July 17 2013 02:37 Chromatically wrote:On July 17 2013 02:34 Hurricane Sponge wrote:On July 17 2013 02:31 Onegu wrote:
@hurricane
Defend thyself before I sleep. I'll defend once I see the rest of the scum jump on your wagon. Right now, it's solo pressure and I don't respect it. Once I get some votes on me, I'll refute what I need to, but for now, I'm going to scumhunt. What? This is just mindlessly throwing shit, calling anyone that votes for you scum, You're not giving your opinion because you "don't respect" his case? I've publicly stated that I think the mafia's play was to run with the Onegu FoS which is what saved me from the NK. I'm willing to wait to see who piles on before I refute the case. Is gathering reads in this manner unacceptable? Did Onegu's night post really put you under so much pressure that you were worried of being lynched on day 2? You were not the only person that Onegu attacked during the night, so there was no reason to expect him to tunnel you on day 2. Also, I am not going to let you tell me who I can or cannot vote for on day 2, when you tried to tell me not to move my vote on day 1 while you were controlling 4 other votes. And you scum-slipped. ##Vote: Hurricane Sponge Haha, read his filter and tell me I had no way of knowing Onegu would pressure me. And you're going to learn something very valuable about claiming 'scum-slips' in endgame. But regardless, I'm leaning scum (or over-confident town) on you, and your vote has been acknowledged. As it happened I just read his filter before I posted that (I thought I spotted an inconsistency from Onegu, but I was wrong). It looked like he might pressure you, but not enough to force you to go into turtle mode. It certainly was not strong enough to make me think that scum would act on it in any way.
Really? I count seven posts in which he is openly suspicious of me before the night-flip. That's significantly more pressure than anyone has ever put on me in my TL Mafia career. I thought it was pretty obvious he'd be going after me, and look at that: he actually is.
(I seem to be getting heat for being right a lot. hz thinks I'm scum because I was right about thinking Onegu would pressure me. Onegu thinks I'm scum because I raised a defense for StiM, who he knows is Town)
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@Gotard
Koshi was your scum read, but he flipped town. Do you have a new scum read?
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On July 17 2013 03:10 Chromatically wrote:
Can you answer my question about your read on Super?
Yes, sorry. I think that the relationships are a relatively mathematical way to approach the problem, but honestly I expect my Super read to change drastically based on his Day 2 posts. He's a full-on lurker at this point, and hasn't really done anything I'd consider as pro-town as most of the people (nightcat excluded) active right now have done.
In short: My read on Super is lurky-town, but I expect that to change today (because he promised to post more).
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On July 17 2013 03:12 Hurricane Sponge wrote:
hz thinks I'm scum because I was right about thinking Onegu would pressure me.
That is not true.
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On July 17 2013 03:14 hzflank wrote:Show nested quote +On July 17 2013 03:12 Hurricane Sponge wrote:
hz thinks I'm scum because I was right about thinking Onegu would pressure me.
That is not true.
My apologies then. I interpreted you being suspicious of my preparations for pressure as scummy.
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On July 17 2013 02:57 Hurricane Sponge wrote:Show nested quote +On July 17 2013 02:46 Chromatically wrote:On July 17 2013 02:41 Hurricane Sponge wrote:On July 17 2013 02:37 Chromatically wrote:On July 17 2013 02:34 Hurricane Sponge wrote:On July 17 2013 02:31 Onegu wrote:
@hurricane
Defend thyself before I sleep. I'll defend once I see the rest of the scum jump on your wagon. Right now, it's solo pressure and I don't respect it. Once I get some votes on me, I'll refute what I need to, but for now, I'm going to scumhunt. What? This is just mindlessly throwing shit, calling anyone that votes for you scum, You're not giving your opinion because you "don't respect" his case? I've publicly stated that I think the mafia's play was to run with the Onegu FoS which is what saved me from the NK. I'm willing to wait to see who piles on before I refute the case. Is gathering reads in this manner unacceptable? Why do you think that scum are going to push for your mislynch? Do you think Onegu is scum? No, I think Onegu is town. (He's posting like town, and I had a town read by the end on StiM). I was sure that I was the NK target early Night 1, which is why I was actually happy/sad to see Onegu start pressuring me hard. I figured if the Mafia decided they could back his case with 3 votes, they'd just need to convince just two townies to hop on to secure a mislynch, and they'd be able to get rid of one of the most active pro-town posters in the game. However, the points Onegu was making in Night 1 were weak (and I believe I've addressed all of them already. If I missed one, let me know) so I wasn't sure if they'd go for it. (For a while, I entertained the idea that Onegu was fake pressuring for the sole purpose of saving my life that night, because his arguments were pretty bad and filled with confirmation bias.) Lo and behold, I was not targeted for the NK and immediately hz starts jumping on me for a very flimsy reason after Onegu re-affirms his pressure. Everything looked exactly like I thought it would if the scum were following the plan. Fortunately, this pressure didn't surprise me, and I am well prepared for the next 24 hours.
I didnt vote on you because i didnt think you are a scum , i was just hoping for a explanation but i can actually accept this one in bold, I am still feeling super and gotard , i will go reread their filter
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Really that is just a small part, the big thing is you created a group of people who you made sure was ok with either lynch, and then made sure it stayed where it was. And you said it was needed, but in reality was in no way needed.
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On July 16 2013 02:44 Gotard wrote:Show nested quote +On July 14 2013 04:14 Koshi wrote:
I would sheep. I have no targets that need to get lynched now. As promised Koshi's case: Show nested quote +On July 13 2013 08:19 Koshi wrote:
@Hurricane Sponge
Koshi: I am still learning on how to play the game properly. I am extremely bad at scumhunting. I get very easily annoyed by people saying that I am scum (I am working on this). I love fluff posts. I hate illogical posts but it seems that illogical does not mean you are scum, however, I am not planning on ever making an illogical post and when I do please call me on it.
As you can see, I got a lot of bad qualities that make me look scum all the time. However, I always prove that I am town by trying and hopefully this game I can prove it by actually nailing some scumreads. Yeah he's bad so there is not much point to listen to him just ignore... Show nested quote +On July 15 2013 00:10 Koshi wrote:
Guys, we need to get our shit together if we want a lynch. Don't forget we need at least 7 people on 1 guy. Both look perfect targets, let's try to come to a consensus now so that the more inactive people can follow us if they pop in.
I would say that Sponge and Umasi try to work this out and they give us final target? It seems that Chroma made the kirby case and that hzflank made the super case.
Me, StiM and all others should FOLLOW lead. all others should FOLLOW. Interesting. why would he want others to just follow? It's easy to hide as a scum if people are just following few leaders. And then trying to correct himself but it's still FOCUS ON THEM. Show nested quote +On July 15 2013 00:13 Koshi wrote:
When you follow lead you should also give own reasoning obviously. But at this point we just need to pick one of these 2 targets. Change in his activity level is really interesting as well. He started with "hello i'm bad" lurking type of player and became 2nd Umasi (no offence) and he of course explained it. Show nested quote +On July 15 2013 09:55 Koshi wrote:On July 15 2013 09:49 Chromatically wrote:
Why am I "smarter than that"? Weren't you just calling me "full of shit" a short bit ago? I actually think you are pretty smart. I was just screaming and kicking in the lynch so that I could get a good read on you and other people. Imagine how boring that last lynch would have been without the two of us. But I am currently having serious scum vibes coming from you. I am pretty sure that I am partially the reason why Kirby died. I played my role as lunatic in the start and people stopped listening to me. I tried to be more serious at the end of the lynch with my "Why Kirby is a better save than Super" but it was too late. But anyway, the only reason why I stopped being the lunatic is because I am 100% certain that your defense of Super is unholy. I hope that people will see the same reasoning. Also, with the green flip of kirby I should NEVER be seen as scum. Or I am that retard that wants to go 2 versus 11 with a bit of townkred from the Day 1 scum lynch. Personally I didn't find that defense particularly scummy. So Koshi's reasons: + Show Spoiler +On July 15 2013 09:18 Koshi wrote:Show nested quote +On July 15 2013 09:14 Umasi wrote:
And also, how good of a target is Super to you, Chrom? Chrom is becoming the target and not Super. I hope I have time to make a good case in the next 24hours. Because the defense of Chrom was UNHOLY. Even if Super flips town, the reasoning of Chrom was getting out of control. At this point I feel If super is scum than 100% Chrom is scum. If super is town, 50% Chrom is scum. Reasoning --> That defense, he must have known Super was town, because that defense made 0 sense. I am not talking about kirby here. I am talking 100% Chrom putting his neck out for a guy that was not better than kirby. On July 15 2013 11:22 Koshi wrote:Red lights in my head after this post. + Show Spoiler +On July 15 2013 03:25 Chromatically wrote:Show nested quote +On July 15 2013 03:21 Koshi wrote:
Can we get a Super lynch going? Chromatically could you please consider this? Don't you think that Kirby is better for town if both Kirby and Super are at this point equally scum? Kirby posts much better than Super, if Kirby is scum I feel like it will be easier to catch him later on than Super.
I see that you guys (StiM, Croma) are thinking that I am scum. It's fine by me, we can discuss it later, I am not going to stop posting, I am during Europe times online A LOT, you can keep grilling me. This is blatantly untrue. Super actually posts scumreads with reasoning. Kirby does not. Chrom defending super. MAJOR RED LIGHTS going off in my head. You can see that I started being really active in this lynch right after this post below. + Show Spoiler +On July 15 2013 05:31 Chromatically wrote:I have to rewrite this because my computer crashed, so I'm just going to c/p the parts that hz wrote (without the quotes from Super). Original case is here: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=420227¤tpage=28#549The Super CaseShow nested quote +
Super introduces himself as a player who understands that people cannot always respond to posts quickly and as a player who thinks that applying pressure on other players is a good thing. His later posts do not exhibit these traits at all.
Before even starting to scum-hunt, Super is concerned with self-preservation. He is not even interested in getting good conversation flowing to produce information. Self-preservation comes first.
This isn't scummy. I've already talked about this at length, but everyone's first priority is to stay alive. If there was suspicion on me, my first priority is to remove it.Ask yourself: what would you do if you walked into the thread and there was a case on you? You'd defend yourself. Show nested quote +
One of the first things that Super says comes to his mind is that Cloud has not posted yet. Why is this the next thing that Super thinks of, after self-preservation? He later gives a reason but I cannot understand how he arrived at that train of thought.
? His reason makes sense. He didn't have time to do anything more than skim, so he called out someone he thought was lurking. Not particularly townie, but not at all scummy. Show nested quote +
Next Super says that he has not yet scum-hunted, but so far I was his biggest scum read. That would be fine if his reads were fluid after he actually did some scum-hunting. As we will see later though, his read on me persists until I really hammer home the point that there is no good town motivation for his read on me.
This isn't scummy. Bad reads =/= scum, bad townies make bad reads all of the time. You say there's no town motivation, but there's really no scum motivation. Scum know that they won't get a mislynch on you, so they have no reason to scumread you. Show nested quote +
Also, why is he so worried that posting this early read might push him to being lynched? I think that it is because he already knows that he cannot actually justify his read on me.
I didn't really understand what he was saying in that sentence. Show nested quote +
Next, Super calls me a lurker but says that the other Europeans should be excused for not posting much. I had already made several posts at this point and am a European myself.
This isn't scummy. This is bad reasoning. Bad reasoning often comes from bad town. If anything, this is overzealous scumhunting. Show nested quote +
He says that he wants to see more from me, but does not give any indication of what he wants to see. When I later make posts directed towards him he completely ignores then as though they are invisible. If he had a scum read on me and wanted to see more, why does he not reply to my posts?
This, once again, isn't scummy. If I say that I want a scumread to post more, that does NOT mean that I'm planning on replying to them. All it means is that I want them to post their reads and reasoning more often. I'm probably NOT going to reply to them, most of the time, unless I have something in particular to say. I cannot understand why you think this is bad. Show nested quote +
Next Super says that he still thinks I am scum. His reasons are that I have not posted anything which contributed to finding scum. I may be biased on this point, but I do not see how a town Super could say that I had not been contributing. Note that I stopped playing at around 2 AM my time last night, but Super seems to think that it was scummy of me to stop posting. Why would a town player think that?
Once again, bad logic =/= scum. Show nested quote +
Now, Super is still more concerned with self-preservation that with finding scum. He also gently suggests that we should consider a no lynch. If a town player was under pressure at this point they would push a scum-read as hard as they could, but they would not try for a no lynch. Super switches his primary scum read from me to Xzavier, without ever saying why I suddenly became less scummy or Xzavier became more scummy (as Xzavier has not posted in a long time). This is still self-preservation without pushing a scum target with any significant force.
Why would a scum player say that they were just giving reads in self defense? I'll admit that this is a decent point though. So almost all of hz's case is stuff that isn't scummy. When I look at Super's filter, I see someone who's at least trying to find scum and share their reads freely. This is way more than you can say for Kirby. So I am pushing Chrom now. I find his defense unholy and I want to see how far he wants to bring this defense. So I make a timeline that is not favoring superflous. But hey, this is why everybody has the superflous scumvibe. Look how Chrom counters this timeline. Chrom says I leave out all the reads Super makes on Xzavier and Hz + Show Spoiler +On July 15 2013 06:41 Chromatically wrote:Show nested quote +On July 15 2013 06:32 Koshi wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On July 15 2013 06:07 Koshi wrote:
Superflous timeline
Why the fuck Xzavier? Super his first and second post are about not lynching on the first day and now he starts a vote train. I think because he thinks days take 24hours?
Conclusion: This isn't town play. this is surviving. Surviving because he is blue or scum? I say scum because of that last vote. Comments on this Chrom? Isn't this exactly what Super did? Read his filter after reading this. I think it's misrepresenting Super's play to make it sound worse than it is. Show nested quote +Entrance with post that no lynch is an option. 1h20m laterApologizing for being gone, defending his previous post in 8 lines. Mentions he has no reads, but cloud didn't post anythinh 2h20m laterapalogising for saying cloud was afk. (in 4 lines) Biggest scumread is HZ, because Umasi is town and HZ commented on Umasi. the read was because he thought hz was using bad logic AND because he posted fluff in the early gameMentions NightCat to be town, Xzavier is scum because Xzavier says Super is scum (Remember Umasi was allowed to do so) he didn't call nightcat town, he didn't like xzavier for lurking and then jumping on him11hours later3rd time sucking up to Umasi. mentions Koshi and Gotard are town. apparently explaining a townread == sucking up now4h 30min laterSuper is alarmed that H.Sponge is disagreeing with him. But maybe Sponge is scummy? Super not making a case but he mentions some things. Eventually a couple times apologizing as well. this is bringing suspicions to the thread and is townie1h later Super goes to a concert and votes Xzavier. his top scum readyou also leave out all of the posts where he is explaining his reads on hz and Xzav Now I admit that I don't really know why I was being the caps lock lunatic. But I looked up all the superflous posts that contained "reads" on Xzavier. I suggest you do the same. There are 3(?) total and 2 are quoted in this post. Look at the 5 reasons Chroms shakes out of his head. Read Xzav his log and he didn't do much but he made 1 big post, the post where he putted Superflous on top of his scumlist, but he talked about 3-4 people iirc. This post contained more than Super did, and on a moment Sponge knew this as well. I don't see why he forgot it during the lynch. + Show Spoiler +On July 15 2013 07:01 Chromatically wrote:Show nested quote +On July 15 2013 06:53 Koshi wrote:On July 14 2013 04:45 Superfluous wrote:
Maybe I didn't make it clear enough in my posts, but my reasons for Hzflank and xzavier were not only because of association. I am suspicious of Hzflank because he had posts which didn't contribute or add anything (he defended it by saying it's his style of getting discussion started) and because he posted early on then didn't post much afterwards. Xzavier didn't post at all, then showed up and basically agreed with what had been said. He also said I was his biggest scum read but wasn't ready yet to vote for me. It struck me the wrong WAY, and I interpreted it as he was waiting for a reason to lynch me, not that he wasn't going to at all. Again, my interpretation here, but I already listed these reasons in previous posts just want to make it clearer. On July 14 2013 04:51 Superfluous wrote:
I'm pointing out Sponge as a possibility as he has seemed to be clear from suspicion after jrkirby's early pressure. Xzavier is my biggest scum read atm for the reasons listed. I have a gut feeling and really have not liked the tone in his posts. Look at ALL THE REASONS SUPER GIVES. WOOOOWWWWOWWW You sure suddenly have very strong feelings about Super when he wasn't even a scumread not too long ago. There's no way you honestly believe that those are his only reasons. I control-F'd "Xzavier" in his filter and here's the reasons I found: 1) Xzav lurked before suddenly jumping on him 2) Xzav read him as scum 3) Xzav hasn't contributed 4) Xzav lurked and then sheeped thread sentiment by voting for him 5) Gut read I personally agree with points 3 and 4, that's why I don't like Xzav. I find it hard to believe that you honestly missed all of these posts. I want everybody to read super his log and READ what he says about xzavier. Then tell me why Chrom thinks Super is so special? Anyway, Chrom seems to be unaware that I am targetting him at this point. At this point I start to think that Super must be scum on top of the fact that Chrom is defending him without a good case, Chrom doesn't want to play this game with only 2 scums. Come on. How can Chrom blatantly ignore Kirby his case on Godart but find 5(!) reasons in the 2 quoted posts from superflous. + Show Spoiler +On July 15 2013 07:19 Chromatically wrote:Show nested quote +On July 15 2013 07:06 Koshi wrote:On July 15 2013 07:01 Chromatically wrote:On July 15 2013 06:53 Koshi wrote:On July 14 2013 04:45 Superfluous wrote:
Maybe I didn't make it clear enough in my posts, but my reasons for Hzflank and xzavier were not only because of association. I am suspicious of Hzflank because he had posts which didn't contribute or add anything (he defended it by saying it's his style of getting discussion started) and because he posted early on then didn't post much afterwards. Xzavier didn't post at all, then showed up and basically agreed with what had been said. He also said I was his biggest scum read but wasn't ready yet to vote for me. It struck me the wrong WAY, and I interpreted it as he was waiting for a reason to lynch me, not that he wasn't going to at all. Again, my interpretation here, but I already listed these reasons in previous posts just want to make it clearer. On July 14 2013 04:51 Superfluous wrote:
I'm pointing out Sponge as a possibility as he has seemed to be clear from suspicion after jrkirby's early pressure. Xzavier is my biggest scum read atm for the reasons listed. I have a gut feeling and really have not liked the tone in his posts. Look at ALL THE REASONS SUPER GIVES. WOOOOWWWWOWWW You sure suddenly have very strong feelings about Super when he wasn't even a scumread not too long ago. There's no way you honestly believe that those are his only reasons. I control-F'd "Xzavier" in his filter and here's the reasons I found: 1) Xzav lurked before suddenly jumping on him JEEZ THIS IS SCUMMY2) Xzav read him as scum SO DID UMASI3) Xzav hasn't contributed YES HE DID? READ THE ENTIRE XZAV POST WHERE HE ALSO MENTIONS SUPER 4) Xzav lurked and then sheeped thread sentiment by voting for him SHEEPED WHO? UMASI? 5) Gut read CRAZYYYYYYYYY I personally agree with points 3 and 4, that's why I don't like Xzav. I find it hard to believe that you honestly missed all of these posts. I capslocked my response. I quoted all 3 posts of Super about Xzavier You were able to find 5 points? I am having a feeling that you are all-in on this Kirby vs Super lynch? Chrom, you are going to look very bad when Super turns red. You realise that? Why are you suddenly defending Xzavier? We're discussing Super, not Xzavier. It doesn't even matter if his points are good (even though 3 and 4 are), it just matters that they exist and come from a town POV. Super has 7 posts about Xzav. Here are the two: Show nested quote +On July 14 2013 04:29 Superfluous wrote:Going back through the posts, I'm a little alarmed at Hurricane Sponge's change of tone. In this post he disagrees with my opinion and says it casts suspicion on me, but doesnt state that I'm a huge scumread or anything. Here I interpreted his post as acknowledging that while we disagree, I was still trying to state my opinion and reasons for having that view. He then says some weird things here though. For instance, he says that he agrees with others' view of me who had semi-defended me, and in the same list puts me as the only scum read. I realize his view may have changed, but it strikes me especially considering in the second post I listed he acknowledged the possibility of a bandwagon on me just because of differing opinions. We also have a mutual disagreement on reads as well. I don't see how hzflank and xzavier have contributed substantially more than me. While knowing everyone's scum reads is good, I don't like it when people show up, say their scum reads, then expect other people to act on them. As for Stim I think he's more likely bad town then mafia. Then again everyone else is saying the same thing, so could be mafia excuse for not lynching him. Show nested quote +On July 14 2013 04:45 Superfluous wrote:
Maybe I didn't make it clear enough in my posts, but my reasons for Hzflank and xzavier were not only because of association. I am suspicious of Hzflank because he had posts which didn't contribute or add anything (he defended it by saying it's his style of getting discussion started) and because he posted early on then didn't post much afterwards. Xzavier didn't post at all, then showed up and basically agreed with what had been said. He also said I was his biggest scum read but wasn't ready yet to vote for me. It struck me the wrong WAY, and I interpreted it as he was waiting for a reason to lynch me, not that he wasn't going to at all. Again, my interpretation here, but I already listed these reasons in previous posts just want to make it clearer. On July 15 2013 21:42 Koshi wrote:Show nested quote +On July 15 2013 21:28 Onegu wrote:On July 15 2013 21:14 Koshi wrote:EDITED VERSION OF THE POST ABOVE THISOn July 15 2013 20:09 Onegu wrote:On July 15 2013 16:27 Koshi wrote:On July 15 2013 09:16 Chromatically wrote:
ahhhhhhhhhh
The case on Kirby was better than the one on Super, Kirby only looked town for the last ~10 minutes. I'll stand by that.
One of Super or Koshi is scum. Koshi's hard defense of Kirby with little reasoning looks like it could be scum trying to get town cred from a town flip to me. I'll also look at Nightcat because he didn't care about who was lynched at all. @OneguCan you please comment on this post by Chroma? I don't want you to comment solely on Chroma, but give your own opinion on the different parts of it. 1)One of Super or Koshi is scum a) Multiple times Chroma said Super wasn't scum, kirby flip shouldn't affect this. Your opinion? b) Why is it Super or Koshi? What is the connection between us? 2) Koshi's hard defense of Kirby with little reasoning looks like it could be scum trying to get town cred from a town flip. a) Do you agree that superfluou would have been a better lynch over kirby? Why? I think that kirby could have been more useful and easier to read Day 2. 1. I dont understand this, its like saying kirby or chrome is scum. It doesnt make sense find reasons for them being scum and then use votes as iceing on the cake.2. I will be biased here because I know the flip already so it is hard for me to answer this. I dont think super is scum. You guys hardly ever went off bandwagon. You let hurricane control this, not saying it is 100% your fault as anyone could have spoken up. I feel it is easier for scum to hide in majority lynch as there wont be 3 bandwagons so when all the votes will be on only 2 people scum has good reasons for being on a bandwagon as it is harder to analyse flips because no one will be off a bandwaggon. You got to know that Chroma was defending Super the whole time, I can quote Chroma a couple times where he says Super is NOT scum. Him suddenly typing that either Super or I might be scum because Jirby flipped town is suspicious because it is illogical as hell to go change on Super. You must know that Chroma had been defending Super 6 hours, he read all Super his logs, he thought all super his actions through, and then when kirby flips town Super is suspicious? That doesn't make sense, you don't think like that. Unless you already know that Super is scum and you are creating a distance? Why did Chroma add that it is Super or Koshi?
There is no correlation between me and Super. You can not make this assumption. Why is Chroma saying this? Maybe trying to keep the option "Koshi" open and try to save Super after all?There are more posts like this. Where Chroma made suspicious posts that no townie would do. Like seeing that Superfluous made a case against Xzavier. No Townie here saw that. Nobody saw that case like Chroma saw it. I am not willing to also point that out again. But if you want... The difference between my bad play (tunneling super) and Chroma his bad play(tunneling on kirby) is that Chroma did silly things that no Townie would do. You disagree? I dont know why he did this, and he needs to answer. What I am saying is it is the same thing as saying kirby or chrome is scum, neither statement has any foundation. I will go over chromes filter, but while reading the thread I remember agreeing with alot of his points early in the game and most scum arent leading one of the day 1 bandwagons, which made me slightly town on him. I want to say something real fast also, defending someone even if they flip scum is a scumtell, at least that is what happahuli told me in scum QT NMMXLII. Chrom said a lot of things that you could agree with, he made me look silly sometimes. But that doesn't mean he isn't scum. You have to look at some of the assumptions he made, the ignoring of the defense Kirby made, the ignoring of the case vs Godart that Kirby made. There is a post where Chroma defends Super by saying that survival is a townplay, and that is a town thing to do when somebody makes a case against you that you defend yourself. It was a really good post by Chroma. But why did Chroma ignore the BIG DEFENSE Kirby made on Chroma his post about Kirby. Chroma gave it not enough attention at all, and it was a really good defense. This is suspicious. There are really multiple things like this. Chroma makes good posts but ignores obvious things that someone like Chroma doesn't do on purpose. Seems weird to me that he takes aggressive stance like that after saying "others should FOLLOW lead" he's ignoring his own advice. But is it scummy or not? Problem is that his advice was scummy so playing against it was pro town but at the same time i don't see how his "all caps madness" was beneficial for town. So I see that like his trying to sheep Chromatically after bad lynch day one. Show nested quote +On July 15 2013 07:46 Koshi wrote:On July 15 2013 07:43 Chromatically wrote:
I would consolidate if it is literally the only way to avoid a no lynch. THIS IS BULLSHIT TOWN WE ARE GOING TO GET SO MUCH INFO WHEN WE LYNCH THERE ARE ONLY 3 FUCKING SCUMS. A MISSLYNCH IS NOT BAD. ARE YOU PEOPLE KIDDING ME? WE ALL AGREED THAT LYNCHING WAS GOOD. AND NOW CHROM WANTS TO PROTECT SUPER SO MADLY THAT A NO LYNHC IS OK? WE AGREE THAT THEY BOTH LOOK SCUM. FUCK THIS Getting mad after misreading. Emotional plays like that indicates bad town to me. Unless he wants to fake being mad after I defended Stim. And the most important note : he can't spell my name.
Quoted above is an example of one of Gotard's reads. It looks like he's making a scumcase, but apparently he thinks he's town. You've made a lot of cases for people being town, but I haven't seen significant scumhunting aside from a vote on Kirby here...
On July 14 2013 08:22 Gotard wrote:
Jrkirby looks like a better lynch than Superfluous right now.
Why not Superfluous? He isn't afraid to share his strong reads. His posts aren't full of useless crap (Hello Rainbows!) even when he isn't 100% right which concerns me. More pro town that jrkirby in general feel.
Why Jrkirby? I don't see him making pro town content. His post claiming that hzflank is mafia was awkward and then he defended himself saying that it was only a joke/pressure combo. Then posing useless lurker list (seems like every newbie game needs one). But as far as his interaction with stim goes I think you are overthinking it.
##vote: jrkirby.
... and the follow-up here:
On July 14 2013 08:22 Gotard wrote:
Jrkirby looks like a better lynch than Superfluous right now.
Why not Superfluous? He isn't afraid to share his strong reads. His posts aren't full of useless crap (Hello Rainbows!) even when he isn't 100% right which concerns me. More pro town that jrkirby in general feel.
Why Jrkirby? I don't see him making pro town content. His post claiming that hzflank is mafia was awkward and then he defended himself saying that it was only a joke/pressure combo. Then posing useless lurker list (seems like every newbie game needs one). But as far as his interaction with stim goes I think you are overthinking it.
##vote: jrkirby.
On July 14 2013 19:12 Gotard wrote:Show nested quote +On July 14 2013 08:36 Hurricane Sponge wrote:
Do you think Superfluous is Town? I would say him being scum is more likely even now than it was before because he can't really defend himself. Yes, he had some pro town post giving his reads in semi-aggressive way but then he writes something like that: Show nested quote +On July 14 2013 05:14 Superfluous wrote:
Admittedly I am giving reads more to get off my back than to help us. My problem is that after seeing stuff like that i usually tend to think: "Isn't it to easy to be true" and I would put mistakes like that into inexperience basket but he admitted himself that he played mafia on some other forums... His way of getting out of trouble doesn't seem pro town whatsoever so i have to say hi's scum if he won't change anything in his posting. Overall I still think jrkirby is a little bit more scummy.
@Gotard
I'd like to hear who your top 2 scum reads are as of right now.
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Onegu, what do you think about Super?
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Town at this point he says something that gave me a town read as it just wasnt a something newbie scum would post. Let me find it again its in my filter, but I will be going over everyones filter again when I wake up.
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On July 15 2013 13:04 Onegu wrote:Show nested quote +On July 14 2013 05:14 Superfluous wrote:
Admittedly I am giving reads more to get off my back than to help us. I'm trying to get reads, but nothing is super strong so I'm not going to jump to lynch someone. I would vote for xzavier right now because he's my strongest read, but thats because we have to vote not because I feel he's 100% scum It really hurts us to lynch town day one, which is the same reason I brought up the idea of no lynching, and the same reason I'm trying to relieve pressure from myself.
That said ##Vote Xzavier Because I'm going to a concert tonight and may be up late/ sleep in so I don't want to forget to vote. Bad town not scum
Plus his interactions with kirby just left me feeling slightly town.
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So it's a pretty weak read though?
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On July 17 2013 03:31 Chromatically wrote:
So it's a pretty weak read though?
Yeah at this point not very strong, and he is lurking at this point. But I still have the feeling you guys were on town/town last night.
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On July 17 2013 03:20 Onegu wrote:
Really that is just a small part, the big thing is you created a group of people who you made sure was ok with either lynch, and then made sure it stayed where it was. And you said it was needed, but in reality was in no way needed.
Read the thread. I actually floated the idea of moving the lynch to someone else before the deadline once we had the votes. That's one of the weaker points of your argument to me. Read the posts before the deadline carefully: You'll see it was Umasi, StiM(yourself) and Xzavier who resisted the lynch:
On July 15 2013 08:31 Hurricane Sponge wrote:
DOUBLE SECRET TRIBUNAL MEETING
Attn: If you are not part of the Incredible Tribunal For Make Great Benefit Lynching Daily, you must stop reading this post now and cover your eyes.
Alright, now that all the legit folks are in here, I think we've gotten some useful information. We've confirmed that we control 4 mobile votes today (this may change in the future). Sponge, Umasi, Rainbows, Nightcat.
In addition, we have two semi-mobile votes in Chromatically (probably) and hzflank (maybe probably), both unconfirmed however. We could go after the scummiest Other. The more I think about Rainbow's 'town-town' claim, the more it seems like a possibility. I'm still leaning Super as scummiest, but we can talk about that after I get thoughts on the following play:
We could totally drop Gotard or Koshi tonight if we wanted.
Koshi is in the 'too scum to be scum' category for me right now. Gonna dive his filter. Gotard is gotard. For right now, I want tribunal thoughts on this play.
The resistance to moving off the established wagons:
On July 15 2013 08:33 Umasi wrote:
WHISPER WHISPER
Gotard, I do not think, is the best lynch
Koshi has said some good stuff, said some absolutely shit stuff, and is absolutely going to be incompetent as we get later in the game. I still think this is not town-town.
On July 15 2013 08:34 Xzavier wrote:Show nested quote +On July 15 2013 08:31 Hurricane Sponge wrote:
DOUBLE SECRET TRIBUNAL MEETING
Attn: If you are not part of the Incredible Tribunal For Make Great Benefit Lynching Daily, you must stop reading this post now and cover your eyes.
Alright, now that all the legit folks are in here, I think we've gotten some useful information. We've confirmed that we control 4 mobile votes today (this may change in the future). Sponge, Umasi, Rainbows, Nightcat.
In addition, we have two semi-mobile votes in Chromatically (probably) and hzflank (maybe probably), both unconfirmed however. We could go after the scummiest Other. The more I think about Rainbow's 'town-town' claim, the more it seems like a possibility. I'm still leaning Super as scummiest, but we can talk about that after I get thoughts on the following play:
We could totally drop Gotard or Koshi tonight if we wanted.
Koshi is in the 'too scum to be scum' category for me right now. Gonna dive his filter. Gotard is gotard. For right now, I want tribunal thoughts on this play. im worried that this is too big, i liked it when it was just you three, but when you add more you are giving an open invitation to sheep with little to no reason and nothing to lose if its a mislynch, because they were simply following orders. i dont think there is a scum in the core 3, but im super worried that scum can easily tag along and ride the wagon for free.
On July 15 2013 08:55 StiMaDDict wrote:
DO NOT SWITCH. TOO MUCH RISKY OF MISCOMMUNICATION. VOTE JKIRBY AND KEEP QUESTIONING KOSHI.
I stole my brother's phone btw.
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Ebwop
Day 1, not last night
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EBWOP: DEM TIMESTAMPS on the quotes. Too sexy. You're welcome.
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On July 17 2013 03:33 Hurricane Sponge wrote:Show nested quote +On July 17 2013 03:20 Onegu wrote:
Really that is just a small part, the big thing is you created a group of people who you made sure was ok with either lynch, and then made sure it stayed where it was. And you said it was needed, but in reality was in no way needed. Read the thread. I actually floated the idea of moving the lynch to someone else before the deadline once we had the votes. That's one of the weaker points of your argument to me. Read the posts before the deadline carefully: You'll see it was Umasi, StiM(yourself) and Xzavier who resisted the lynch: Show nested quote +On July 15 2013 08:31 Hurricane Sponge wrote:
DOUBLE SECRET TRIBUNAL MEETING
Attn: If you are not part of the Incredible Tribunal For Make Great Benefit Lynching Daily, you must stop reading this post now and cover your eyes.
Alright, now that all the legit folks are in here, I think we've gotten some useful information. We've confirmed that we control 4 mobile votes today (this may change in the future). Sponge, Umasi, Rainbows, Nightcat.
In addition, we have two semi-mobile votes in Chromatically (probably) and hzflank (maybe probably), both unconfirmed however. We could go after the scummiest Other. The more I think about Rainbow's 'town-town' claim, the more it seems like a possibility. I'm still leaning Super as scummiest, but we can talk about that after I get thoughts on the following play:
We could totally drop Gotard or Koshi tonight if we wanted.
Koshi is in the 'too scum to be scum' category for me right now. Gonna dive his filter. Gotard is gotard. For right now, I want tribunal thoughts on this play. The resistance to moving off the established wagons: Show nested quote +On July 15 2013 08:33 Umasi wrote:
WHISPER WHISPER
Gotard, I do not think, is the best lynch
Koshi has said some good stuff, said some absolutely shit stuff, and is absolutely going to be incompetent as we get later in the game. I still think this is not town-town. Show nested quote +On July 15 2013 08:34 Xzavier wrote:On July 15 2013 08:31 Hurricane Sponge wrote:
DOUBLE SECRET TRIBUNAL MEETING
Attn: If you are not part of the Incredible Tribunal For Make Great Benefit Lynching Daily, you must stop reading this post now and cover your eyes.
Alright, now that all the legit folks are in here, I think we've gotten some useful information. We've confirmed that we control 4 mobile votes today (this may change in the future). Sponge, Umasi, Rainbows, Nightcat.
In addition, we have two semi-mobile votes in Chromatically (probably) and hzflank (maybe probably), both unconfirmed however. We could go after the scummiest Other. The more I think about Rainbow's 'town-town' claim, the more it seems like a possibility. I'm still leaning Super as scummiest, but we can talk about that after I get thoughts on the following play:
We could totally drop Gotard or Koshi tonight if we wanted.
Koshi is in the 'too scum to be scum' category for me right now. Gonna dive his filter. Gotard is gotard. For right now, I want tribunal thoughts on this play. im worried that this is too big, i liked it when it was just you three, but when you add more you are giving an open invitation to sheep with little to no reason and nothing to lose if its a mislynch, because they were simply following orders. i dont think there is a scum in the core 3, but im super worried that scum can easily tag along and ride the wagon for free. Show nested quote +On July 15 2013 08:55 StiMaDDict wrote:
DO NOT SWITCH. TOO MUCH RISKY OF MISCOMMUNICATION. VOTE JKIRBY AND KEEP QUESTIONING KOSHI.
I stole my brother's phone btw.
You didnt make a case, and it was so close to the deadline it was to risky to switch like stim said, you should have known that. Second like I point out multiple time you recruit people are ok with the current wagons not some random other person.
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On July 17 2013 03:37 Onegu wrote:Show nested quote +On July 17 2013 03:33 Hurricane Sponge wrote:On July 17 2013 03:20 Onegu wrote:
Really that is just a small part, the big thing is you created a group of people who you made sure was ok with either lynch, and then made sure it stayed where it was. And you said it was needed, but in reality was in no way needed. Read the thread. I actually floated the idea of moving the lynch to someone else before the deadline once we had the votes. That's one of the weaker points of your argument to me. Read the posts before the deadline carefully: You'll see it was Umasi, StiM(yourself) and Xzavier who resisted the lynch: On July 15 2013 08:31 Hurricane Sponge wrote:
DOUBLE SECRET TRIBUNAL MEETING
Attn: If you are not part of the Incredible Tribunal For Make Great Benefit Lynching Daily, you must stop reading this post now and cover your eyes.
Alright, now that all the legit folks are in here, I think we've gotten some useful information. We've confirmed that we control 4 mobile votes today (this may change in the future). Sponge, Umasi, Rainbows, Nightcat.
In addition, we have two semi-mobile votes in Chromatically (probably) and hzflank (maybe probably), both unconfirmed however. We could go after the scummiest Other. The more I think about Rainbow's 'town-town' claim, the more it seems like a possibility. I'm still leaning Super as scummiest, but we can talk about that after I get thoughts on the following play:
We could totally drop Gotard or Koshi tonight if we wanted.
Koshi is in the 'too scum to be scum' category for me right now. Gonna dive his filter. Gotard is gotard. For right now, I want tribunal thoughts on this play. The resistance to moving off the established wagons: On July 15 2013 08:33 Umasi wrote:
WHISPER WHISPER
Gotard, I do not think, is the best lynch
Koshi has said some good stuff, said some absolutely shit stuff, and is absolutely going to be incompetent as we get later in the game. I still think this is not town-town. On July 15 2013 08:34 Xzavier wrote:On July 15 2013 08:31 Hurricane Sponge wrote:
DOUBLE SECRET TRIBUNAL MEETING
Attn: If you are not part of the Incredible Tribunal For Make Great Benefit Lynching Daily, you must stop reading this post now and cover your eyes.
Alright, now that all the legit folks are in here, I think we've gotten some useful information. We've confirmed that we control 4 mobile votes today (this may change in the future). Sponge, Umasi, Rainbows, Nightcat.
In addition, we have two semi-mobile votes in Chromatically (probably) and hzflank (maybe probably), both unconfirmed however. We could go after the scummiest Other. The more I think about Rainbow's 'town-town' claim, the more it seems like a possibility. I'm still leaning Super as scummiest, but we can talk about that after I get thoughts on the following play:
We could totally drop Gotard or Koshi tonight if we wanted.
Koshi is in the 'too scum to be scum' category for me right now. Gonna dive his filter. Gotard is gotard. For right now, I want tribunal thoughts on this play. im worried that this is too big, i liked it when it was just you three, but when you add more you are giving an open invitation to sheep with little to no reason and nothing to lose if its a mislynch, because they were simply following orders. i dont think there is a scum in the core 3, but im super worried that scum can easily tag along and ride the wagon for free. On July 15 2013 08:55 StiMaDDict wrote:
DO NOT SWITCH. TOO MUCH RISKY OF MISCOMMUNICATION. VOTE JKIRBY AND KEEP QUESTIONING KOSHI.
I stole my brother's phone btw. You didnt make a case, and it was so close to the deadline it was to risky to switch like stim said, you should have known that. Second like I point out multiple time you recruit people are ok with the current wagons not some random other person.
The whole point of the Tribunal was to ensure that a lynch happened that day. To that end, a player who will not vote for one of the main wagons is useless for the purposes of ensuring a lynch. I'm starting to think you missed the entire point of the Tribunal.
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EPT
