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On March 28 2013 16:35 ObviousOne wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2013 16:24 Keirathi wrote:On March 28 2013 16:20 ObviousOne wrote:In the interests of participating in this conversation, I'm filtering prplhz. ISH purports that prplhz' scum meta suggests not reading the thread and making up bullshit cases when people think he is mafia. I'm not seeing that here. I am getting the same general feeling about his play that I had in Nomination before I knew he was town there. I'm not going to pretend I'm any good at meta but it I go by feeling and ISH's description then prp's filter supports a town read. Towards the end of what is there he's even trying to keep things cool in the thread, and presents an interesting tidbit about Sinani. On March 28 2013 05:24 prplhz wrote:
sinani206 is showing some classic illusion of grandeur in his "I know Nisani201 so just sheep me" post. That's how I remember town sinani206 while scum sinani206 doesn't want to do much and just tries to get other player's sympathy. We are talking about prplhz before this post: On March 27 2013 22:04 prplhz wrote:
@Palmar If scum had an anonymous dayvig then why didn't they shoot you dead? Or just about anybody other than Grackaroni since he was causing quite the ruckus. Everything after that is what I expect from town prplhz and why he wasn't a lynch candidate later in the day. Okay, so above that he just asks a bunch of questions for the most part, one comment about Rayn being frustrated. I'll take a look at Nomination. Early D1 nomination [town] features a lot of paragraphs and looks like real interest in the thread (genuine interest). Trying to get Oats/Moc to stop throwing shit on eachother (peacekeeping). Overall he looks committed to hunting scum right off the bat even as he catches up with the thread. That game looks a lot tighter in terms of being town than this game, but it's not out of the question. I wouldn't give him a green stamp just for his early D1 contributions but D1 looks OK to me right now looking back at it as an entire day. It feels similar to me, but his pokes in this game (again, for the early portion of the day) are much more brief and he pokes quite a few people with not a lot of followup except about Acrofales. Is Acro a person of interest for any of you guys, as well?
Ding ding ding. You hit the nail on the head.
Why was Smurf 100% absolutely positively sure that prplhz was town last night, before all the rest of what prplhz posted after the one I quoted?
I don't particularly want to talk about Acro right now. But feel free if you have some thoughts.
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On March 28 2013 16:40 Keirathi wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2013 16:35 ObviousOne wrote:On March 28 2013 16:24 Keirathi wrote:On March 28 2013 16:20 ObviousOne wrote:In the interests of participating in this conversation, I'm filtering prplhz. ISH purports that prplhz' scum meta suggests not reading the thread and making up bullshit cases when people think he is mafia. I'm not seeing that here. I am getting the same general feeling about his play that I had in Nomination before I knew he was town there. I'm not going to pretend I'm any good at meta but it I go by feeling and ISH's description then prp's filter supports a town read. Towards the end of what is there he's even trying to keep things cool in the thread, and presents an interesting tidbit about Sinani. On March 28 2013 05:24 prplhz wrote:
sinani206 is showing some classic illusion of grandeur in his "I know Nisani201 so just sheep me" post. That's how I remember town sinani206 while scum sinani206 doesn't want to do much and just tries to get other player's sympathy. We are talking about prplhz before this post: On March 27 2013 22:04 prplhz wrote:
@Palmar If scum had an anonymous dayvig then why didn't they shoot you dead? Or just about anybody other than Grackaroni since he was causing quite the ruckus. Everything after that is what I expect from town prplhz and why he wasn't a lynch candidate later in the day. Okay, so above that he just asks a bunch of questions for the most part, one comment about Rayn being frustrated. I'll take a look at Nomination. Early D1 nomination [town] features a lot of paragraphs and looks like real interest in the thread (genuine interest). Trying to get Oats/Moc to stop throwing shit on eachother (peacekeeping). Overall he looks committed to hunting scum right off the bat even as he catches up with the thread. That game looks a lot tighter in terms of being town than this game, but it's not out of the question. I wouldn't give him a green stamp just for his early D1 contributions but D1 looks OK to me right now looking back at it as an entire day. It feels similar to me, but his pokes in this game (again, for the early portion of the day) are much more brief and he pokes quite a few people with not a lot of followup except about Acrofales. Is Acro a person of interest for any of you guys, as well? Ding ding ding. You hit the nail on the head. Why was Smurf 100% absolutely positively sure that prplhz was town last night, before all the rest of what prplhz posted after the one I quoted? I don't particularly want to talk about Acro right now. But feel free if you have some thoughts.
We can talk about Acro later, preferably with prplhz as part of the conversation if he's going to be picking up that torch again.
Also, it looks like "questioning people's town reads" is going to be the general theme for this game. Before with Marv's town read on me, and this with ISH on prplhz.
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On March 28 2013 16:39 cDgCorazon wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2013 16:36 InsertSmurfHere wrote:
I take my case very seriously
You truly haven't even tried to get me lynched, but you've been calling me scum the whole game for terrible reasons
Yet again, I'm not interested in pursuing this further. It won't go anywhere right now until the rest of town figures out that your mason claim is bullshit. "You've been calling me scum, yet haven't pursued me. But I just want to call you scum and then not pursue you anymore" What?
That's a gross oversimplification of this situation.
The fact that between the two of you, you have one solid scum read (me), and that your strongest claim to being town is being masoned with each other is just ridiculous.
However, what I do know is that town realizing this takes time, and during that point in time, there are other things worth pursuing.
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On March 28 2013 16:43 InsertSmurfHere wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2013 16:39 cDgCorazon wrote:On March 28 2013 16:36 InsertSmurfHere wrote:
I take my case very seriously
You truly haven't even tried to get me lynched, but you've been calling me scum the whole game for terrible reasons
Yet again, I'm not interested in pursuing this further. It won't go anywhere right now until the rest of town figures out that your mason claim is bullshit. "You've been calling me scum, yet haven't pursued me. But I just want to call you scum and then not pursue you anymore" What? That's a gross oversimplification of this situation. The fact that between the two of you, you have one solid scum read (me), and that your strongest claim to being town is being masoned with each other is just ridiculous. However, what I do know is that town realizing this takes time, and during that point in time, there are other things worth pursuing.
I have more than one solid scum read.
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On March 28 2013 16:40 Keirathi wrote:
Why was Smurf 100% absolutely positively sure that prplhz was town last night, before all the rest of what prplhz posted after the one I quoted?
BECAUSE I LOVE BEING RIGHT
basically
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On March 28 2013 16:43 InsertSmurfHere wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2013 16:39 cDgCorazon wrote:On March 28 2013 16:36 InsertSmurfHere wrote:
I take my case very seriously
You truly haven't even tried to get me lynched, but you've been calling me scum the whole game for terrible reasons
Yet again, I'm not interested in pursuing this further. It won't go anywhere right now until the rest of town figures out that your mason claim is bullshit. "You've been calling me scum, yet haven't pursued me. But I just want to call you scum and then not pursue you anymore" What? That's a gross oversimplification of this situation. The fact that between the two of you, you have one solid scum read (me), and that your strongest claim to being town is being masoned with each other is just ridiculous. However, what I do know is that town realizing this takes time, and during that point in time, there are other things worth pursuing.
Alright bro, the whole second part is kind of a lie but whatever floats your boat. I'll see you D2.
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EBWOP:
And for that matter, you aren't even my STRONGEST scum read. In my top 3, though.
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On March 28 2013 16:44 InsertSmurfHere wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2013 16:40 Keirathi wrote:
Why was Smurf 100% absolutely positively sure that prplhz was town last night, before all the rest of what prplhz posted after the one I quoted? BECAUSE I LOVE BEING RIGHT basically
Easy to be right when you're scum, eh?
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On March 28 2013 16:45 Keirathi wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2013 16:44 InsertSmurfHere wrote:On March 28 2013 16:40 Keirathi wrote:
Why was Smurf 100% absolutely positively sure that prplhz was town last night, before all the rest of what prplhz posted after the one I quoted? BECAUSE I LOVE BEING RIGHT basically Easy to be right when you're scum, eh?
Nah, just better than you. ;]
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On March 28 2013 16:46 InsertSmurfHere wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2013 16:45 Keirathi wrote:On March 28 2013 16:44 InsertSmurfHere wrote:On March 28 2013 16:40 Keirathi wrote:
Why was Smurf 100% absolutely positively sure that prplhz was town last night, before all the rest of what prplhz posted after the one I quoted? BECAUSE I LOVE BEING RIGHT basically Easy to be right when you're scum, eh? Nah, just better than you. ;]
Yet so wrong about me and Cora 
<3
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On March 28 2013 16:45 Keirathi wrote:
EBWOP:
And for that matter, you aren't even my STRONGEST scum read. In my top 3, though.
I get the feeling I am on this list =[
Guess I better work on that. Before you go sleep which of the things I mentioned I wanted to talk about earlier will get us further towards the right track tonight in your opinion?
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On March 28 2013 16:48 ObviousOne wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2013 16:45 Keirathi wrote:
EBWOP:
And for that matter, you aren't even my STRONGEST scum read. In my top 3, though. I get the feeling I am on this list =[ Guess I better work on that. Before you go sleep which of the things I mentioned I wanted to talk about earlier will get us further towards the right track tonight in your opinion?
I assume you mean your questions?
The ones about the shit-fest and sinani still being a candidate tomorrow are irrelevant (well, maybe not totally irrelevant, but extremely hard to nail down) towards finding scum. If you want to do some analysis, I would spend time on the other two, and share some detailed thoughts about them.
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On March 28 2013 08:45 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Palmar why did you agree to the Keirathi lynch pushed by your scumread marv and agreed by your other scumread me?
on the off chance I was wrong.
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On March 28 2013 17:26 Palmar wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2013 08:45 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Palmar why did you agree to the Keirathi lynch pushed by your scumread marv and agreed by your other scumread me? on the off chance I was wrong.
He (we, as in Palmar and I) were already wrong on Grack. It could be a fatal disease for both of us. In re-reading the thread (I'm up to p21) I'm leaning town on Rayn btw. You still leaning town on Rayn, Palmar? That's the last I remember of you mentioning him off the top of my head.
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On March 27 2013 23:28 Oatsmaster wrote:Show nested quote +On March 27 2013 23:21 Palmar wrote:
I can fight my own battles marv.
Oats, you're smarter than this. The shot was a scumshot, any townie would claim it by now. I doubt we have a multi-shot day-vig that also happens to be retarded enough to shoot early day 1.
So assume I'm scum, and explain to me the thought process behind the shot. I could've probably ridden the Grack lynch out the day as scum, and all this does is cast doubt on me as someone got shot based on an early read by me.
So the only logical scenario where I'm scum is that some random townie decided to test my read and proceed to not claim the shot.
Dudes are stupid in mafia, shit happens. If you were a JOAT with a dayvig and you wanted to kill Grack. (I have extra info ^_^)WHY IN THE WHOLE WIDE WORLD WOULD YOU CLAIM?? If you are scum with anonymous dayvig, WHY WOULD YOU SHOOT LYNCHBAIT INSTEAD OF MARV. WHAT THE FUCK PALMAR. WHY IS YOUR DEFENSE HINGING ON THE GRACK SHOT.
You have extra info... Please share.
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United Kingdom36156 Posts
On March 28 2013 07:51 Keirathi wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2013 07:41 marvellosity wrote:On March 28 2013 07:35 Keirathi wrote:On March 28 2013 07:32 marvellosity wrote:On March 28 2013 07:30 Keirathi wrote:On March 28 2013 07:27 marvellosity wrote:
I'm also probably off until tomorrow. Not sure when I'm going to have time to work on the game properly because I have a chess thingy tomorrow evening. There's too many people I'm leaning town on at the moment, which is partly down to the fact that 2 of my 3 orange reads have flipped/claimed. Looking back through your filter, did you really use "Keir is saying ':o; a bunch" as evidence of me being scum? Like, I talk to you on IRC quite often. I always use stupid emoticons. How was that even relevant AT ALL? Would be like me calling you scum for saying 'dear'. (ok I'm still here temporarily) This isn't IRC, and at least I hadn't noticed/remembered you doing so like you have here in other games, and I thought it was odd, so I mentioned it. You know better than to make stupid ass arguments like that. What gives? Like I said, I mentioned it because I found it odd, and it was at most a small detail in my case against you, which didn't revolve around that at all. Anyway I really am off now It's not about "revolving" around it. It's that you included it at all. Hell, for the sake of argument, I went back and ctrl+f'd through my games for ':o'. I had a grand total of 1 instance in scum games (when I was arguing BL on the last day of GSL 3), and like 40'ish instances in my town games. And you, better than anyone, should know that I use emoticons in casual conversation. So, to me, that whole point was 100% an appeal to emotion. It had 0 basis in fact, and was only there to make you case look better. Do you not see why that is scummy as fuck?
Nope, because I didn't have to include it in my case if I were 'fabricating' it, as it doesn't add anything in particular.
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K I have a giant notepad document filled with quotes and I'm not going to paste them here as is so I'll try to distill some information from it.
Notable mentions of Nisani (chronologically if I copy/pasted correctly)
+ Show Spoiler [Hapa] +On March 26 2013 12:12 Hapahauli wrote:@ NisaniWhere'd ya go? You offered us two pointless comments then dropped out of the thread: Show nested quote +On March 26 2013 09:28 Nisani201 wrote:
I highly doubt that there are people who haven't read their role PMs. Show nested quote +On March 26 2013 09:31 Nisani201 wrote:On March 26 2013 09:29 sinani206 wrote:
What's the point in saying that you haven't read your role though? Because it seems like the standard D1 meta is to fuck around and wait for someone to take it too seriously. What are your thoughts on some of the suspicions in the thread so far? Particularly on Grack and prplhz?
+ Show Spoiler [Acro familiarity with Nisani's p…] +On March 26 2013 12:20 Acrofales wrote:
Nisani is lurking and Dandel is spamming. Amazing. Who woulda thunk that would happen.
+ Show Spoiler [Acro votes] +On March 26 2013 14:08 Acrofales wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2013 13:52 Nisani201 wrote:Acrofales seemed to be making a lot of sense at the beginning of the game and now he's looking really bad. He said this: On March 26 2013 10:54 Acrofales wrote:
However, if you BELIEVE OO is lying about not having read his role PM; you should really be in favour of lynching him. The ONLY reason to LIE about this, is because he's scum. There is no townie reason to lie and say you have not read your role PM. The joking stage of the game is over and he's still trying to drag it on into seriousness. And looking back at his filter, he said a lot of things about how people should be interpreting OO's words without putting in his own opinion. And in general there isn't much real content in his filter. I think he's scum. ##vote acrofales You are terrible. I made a lot of sense in the beginning of the game. My VERY FIRST serious post was my opinion on OO's claim. The rest of my filter has my opinion on DI, prplhz and Marv. Off the top of my head. Probably anything else that has been discussed in the thread too. This game gonna be easy. Lynch the liar! ##vote Nisani201
+ Show Spoiler [Acro] +On March 27 2013 02:38 Acrofales wrote:Some updates. I like Smurf's more recent participation. Pressure on Cora feels good. Still don't like his stance on DI, and it depends on how good a player Smurf is, whether this is something that can be excused, or is an obvious scumtell. I want to know who he is.
Raynpelikoneet does not look particularly scummy to me. There are some posts I don't like: + Show Spoiler [this one] +On March 26 2013 10:15 raynpelikoneet wrote:
S&B: I never said i wasn't serious with my vote. I asked marv why does he assume i am serious. Something he also failed to answer. completely dodges the point. Because of the way he phrased the initial question, he inherently claimed he wasn't actually very serious. A vague answer that feels like it's part of a larger backpedal regarding prplhz. However, having a very serious vote a few hours into D1 is an oxymoron. + Show Spoiler [and this one] +On March 26 2013 10:42 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2013 10:34 Keirathi wrote:On March 26 2013 10:29 raynpelikoneet wrote:
And given that you don't (at least you should not) know prplhz's alignment how exactly is it not beneficial to see how he reacts to the case first? Because it doesn't matter a single bit how he reacts because the case was built on false information. Hell, if I was scum, I would love nothing more than for someone to make a case on me that I could so easily refute just by posting a few quotes from my previous games that wouldn't even be hard to find. The point of making "cases" isn't to convince the person they are scum. They are to convince everyone else that someone is scum. Plus, S&B was asking for opinions about his case. The problem with meta in this prplhz case is that it's the easiest thing in the world to fake. Even the dumbest idiot could probably fake their "town meta" by posting some general advice as their first post. Other than that part, you are right. misrepresents the argument, which was not that prplhz was playing to his town meta, but that meta was useless in this situation, because prplhz does the same as both alignments. However, neither of these are particularly concerning... and while his case on OO was somewhat OMGUS, I think he picked on some good points and OO's case really was just a bad association case based on unflipped players. Mostly, however, I like that he does not seem concerned to speak his mind or share his reads, and I don't get the feeling that he is just throwing suspicion around to see where it sticks. In closing: he's not a scumspect at the moment.
I'm not really liking what I see in Cora's filter. In particular this post: Show nested quote +On March 26 2013 15:17 cDgCorazon wrote:
Acro you are blowing OO saying that he hasn't read his role pm way out of proportion. It was annoying at first, but now it's looking scummy. came at a time when I was NOT talking about OO at all (except to answer Oats' stupid question). In fact, I only directly talk about OO in two posts, the rest is all using it as a springboard to analyse OTHER players' reactions to it. At the time, I had specifically singled out two reactions as feeling off: Nisani's and Cora's own. Trying to flip it back just reaks of panicked OMGUS. However, given how Cora was a rather easy mislynch in Personality 2, I am hesitant to just outright call him scum for this behaviour. While I don't agree with his read on Rayn, his posts about it are reasonable and he seems forthcoming with his opinion.
My main scumspect is still Nisani. His case was a pack of lies and he has disappeared from the thread again. Lynch him. Here is his case on me: Show nested quote +On March 26 2013 13:52 Nisani201 wrote:Acrofales seemed to be making a lot of sense at the beginning of the game and now he's looking really bad. He said this: On March 26 2013 10:54 Acrofales wrote:
However, if you BELIEVE OO is lying about not having read his role PM; you should really be in favour of lynching him. The ONLY reason to LIE about this, is because he's scum. There is
no townie reason to lie and say you have not read your role PM. The joking stage of the game is over and he's still trying to drag it on into seriousness. And looking back at his filter, he said a lot of things about how people should be interpreting OO's words without putting in his own opinion. And in general there isn't much real content in his filter. I think he's scum. ##vote acrofales My first few posts were where I gave my opinion about OO's claim. How can those be my most sensible posts when he has clearly not even read them properly?! It's because he is scum and needed to contribute, so jumped on something without thinking it through, that's why. ##revote Nisani201 for emphasis.
+ Show Spoiler [Obvious] +On March 27 2013 03:41 ObviousOne wrote:
Acro, I think your case on Nisani has some merit, though it may have roots in his relative inactivity up to this point. Do you have a second scum read? We seem to agree on Rayn looking town
for now so I will ask for your opinion on Oatsmaster.
Is Oats town or scum to you?
+ Show Spoiler [Grackaroni] +On March 27 2013 04:27 Grackaroni wrote:Show nested quote +On March 27 2013 04:24 ObviousOne wrote:
Who else is scum besides me, Grack? Am I the only scum in this game?
I'm happy to be wrong about you if you would just do something more useful than tunnel me all day. You're just staying the course though and it bothers me. lol how many people have given multiple scum reads so far. I find it ridiculous that I'm still some major suspect because I made 3 posts without stances at the start of the game. I think Nisani and Sinani are both people to look into and both could be scum as well. Nisani wrote a case about acro and seemed to ignore all of the other things that Acro has done in the thread and just said he's too focused on you not reading your role pm. Once again I don't like Sinani's original contribution and he hasn't added anything since then.
+ Show Spoiler [Sinani] +On March 27 2013 04:32 sinani206 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 27 2013 04:28 Nisani201 wrote:
Good morning everyone.
The case on Grack is really weak, and if it were made by someone other than Palmar it probably wouldn't be getting nearly as far as it is now.
Just because Smurf made a bad case doesn't mean he's scum. He looks town now and there shouldn't be any suspicion on him.
Acrofales is making a bit more sense but his case on me is just a bunch of OMGUS. Acro, who is your secondary suspect? How can you say such a huge blanket statement. It's day 1, what evidence do you have that Smurf is for sure town?
+ Show Spoiler [Hapa again] +On March 27 2013 06:09 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On March 27 2013 06:06 Nisani201 wrote:
What the hell is wrong with Grack's "attitude" or "intention?" I don't see anything wrong with that.
It's possible that Palmar is scum. I'm more confident on Acrofales scum though. Can you outline the reasons for Acro being scum? All I see is an active townie. He's contributed a ton this game. It seemed like you were backing off Acro last night too... Show nested quote +On March 27 2013 04:28 Nisani201 wrote:
Good morning everyone.
The case on Grack is really weak, and if it were made by someone other than Palmar it probably wouldn't be getting nearly as far as it is now.
Just because Smurf made a bad case doesn't mean he's scum. He looks town now and there shouldn't be any suspicion on him.
Acrofales is making a bit more sense but his case on me is just a bunch of OMGUS. Acro, who is your secondary suspect? ... so I'm not sure how you're so confident in your read.
+ Show Spoiler [More hapa] +On March 27 2013 06:58 Hapahauli wrote:@ NisaniWhy do you "want to believe" that Palmar is scum? If you think he's scum, then go after him. Furthermore, I don't understand why you think the Grack case is bad. These are your stated reasons: Show nested quote +The case on Grack is really weak, and if it were made by someone other than Palmar it probably wouldn't be getting nearly as far as it is now. Show nested quote +The initial case on Grack was bad, it was based off of his reactions to certain things, which weren't really scummy. He didn't do anything scummy after that. As I said
earlier, the only reason people are voting for him is because of Palmar. ...and they're pretty inadequate. I especially don't understand the bolded segment. The Grack case is primarily based on precisely that - that his reactions are completely objective, ungenuine, and purposeless in the context of the thread. How are his reactions not scummy? Furthermore, what in his filter to you suggests that he's town?
+ Show Spoiler [Acro] +On March 27 2013 07:10 Acrofales wrote:Show nested quote +On March 27 2013 05:58 ObviousOne wrote:In the interests of having meaningful discussion about today's candidates, I would like to see everyone take a stand on who they think should be up for lynch today so we can talk about
the candidates and not miss out on the opportunity to hear from people who are in opposite time zones or not able to be in the thread at various points during the day. We're coming up on
the halfway point of the day portion and this is the optimal time to switch gears and makes for a good opportunity for any lingering cases yet to be made to get posted in the thread before
votes are stuck in useless places due to not being around.
Original post regarding Grack: + Show Spoiler +On March 26 2013 15:39 ObviousOne wrote:Grack reads like he's ready to become an echo of thread sentiment. By admission this is a return to the game and he may be a bit rusty for that. I liked: Show nested quote +On March 26 2013 11:17 Grackaroni wrote:
For the record Hapa: When I say that I don't like Sinani using the fact that OO didn't read his role PM to say that he is scum.
I mean that Sinani is using scummy logic. (he is misconstruing something that should not be alignment indicative and using it against OO to say that he is scum.)
This is my first game in a long time and I am having some trouble finding where I need to focus. But I am giving reads and I will continue to do so.
Lack of forthcoming reads about people he's asking questions about is kind of weird, him espousing as much is highlighted here: Show nested quote +On March 26 2013 12:56 Grackaroni wrote:On March 26 2013 12:49 strongandbig wrote:On March 26 2013 12:45 Grackaroni wrote:
I don't like the case on Dandel Ion. He seems to troll regardless of alignment so there's nothing in there that points to him being scum this game as opposed to just anti-town.
@ISH Why didn't you bother to look up a town game of Dandel Ion? u scum bro? No..... I know what you dislike. I didn't say anything about what I think of Dandel Ion or ISH in that post. But I wasn't intending to because I haven't drawn any conclusions on them from it. All i am saying is that I dislike the case and for good reason. Calling out sinani for tunneling on my meaningless hello post: null
We can find out a lot more about him when there are some concrete bits mid-day besides his interactions with sinani. Looking at it again, there's a kind of nugget in the middle there with the interaction between him and Palmar. (BTW I've never played with a D1-talkative Palmar before, this is kind of surreal.) He flat out gave Palmar a town read instead of proposing a better lynch target. Okay, that's weird. Scum points and town points, I want to see more. More red than green. Are you picking up what I'm putting down? Dot points outlining why I think Grack is scum: + Show Spoiler +On March 27 2013 03:13 ObviousOne wrote:Show nested quote +On March 27 2013 03:01 Acrofales wrote:On March 27 2013 02:53 marvellosity wrote:
Grackeroni is an infinitely better lynch than either rayn or Obvious. Obvious isn't playing scared at all which was the overarching theme of his play in Hydra Mafia (even with VE for
support).
Acro, I'll check what you said about Nisani when I'm home and have some time later. What makes you say OO is not timid? He has not really done anything that stands out except to not read his role PM, when he had, probably, not read his role pm, which makes that completely non-indicative of alignment. Since then he has shared 2 rather vague and meaningless association cases... and a meandering post about Grack that left me with the feeling that he didn't actually have an opinion either way. Where are the reads? Where is the scumhunting? Where is the townie activity? You just don't have a handle on how I play. Marv understands me better. This is how I do. When I talk about something, it's typically because it's either worth replying to or the person I'm talking about is a scum-read of mine or someone I'm interested in getting a better read on myself. There's no reason to talk about townies except in passing and/or when referring to cases. I thought Kei was scummy yesterday but he's looking better today and I have dropped it. I'm hedging my bets on Grack being scum - responded to Palmar's pressure by giving Palmar a town read instead of an alternate lynch proposition - no substantial positions taken outside of calling Nisani's train of thought scummy - a lot of posts but little of any intent - seems to have known better than discuss my meaningless intro post but continues to talk about it for several posts instead of simply shutting down the conversation as pointless
My vote is currently on Grackaroni. Fine. I nominate Nisani to be shot, hanged, drawn and quartered. After that we can burn him and end it all with a good old-fashioned drowning. I suggest sensibe people get their vote on him stat. Currently looking back into Smurf given the new insights into who he is and whether he could actually do all that crap as town, and then will look into Grackaroni. I was not convinced by the cases and didn't see anything particularly scummy about him, but his continued absense isn't doing him any favours. Deadline is still like 20 hours away, right? So plenty of time.
+ Show Spoiler [Sinani] +On March 27 2013 15:54 sinani206 wrote:OK, Nisani is scum. He's been using soft reads all game to make it look like he's contributing, saying people "look" or "feel" some way or another. He uses words like "possible" and "likely", phrases like "not really." Asking others useless questions to fill up his posts. Nisani is not acting as a townie should ask. He is hesitant and incomplete in his "analysis" and has been trying to deter discussion ( here and here). Not to mention voting prplhz with no reasoning and only 2 sentences mentioning him, asking for a vote count before voting. Nisani's play is not townlike. There are no third parties. Therefore he is scum.
So just looking at the list of names there, a few of them come up several times. Let's look at their reasons for mentioning Nisani.
Hapa filter
- Unsatisfied with Nisani's contributions in the early game
- Did not like Nisani's lack of confidence his scum read on Acro
- More about contribution / Nisani's wanting to believe that Palmar is scum
Hapa's interactions with Nisani look town motivated to me. He looks like the first to bring up anything negative towards Nisani.
Acro filter
- Mentions Nisani is lurking (and doesn't mention if it's suspicious)
- Rather blatant OMGUS vote on Nisani
- Accusation that Nisani is feigning contribution, emphasizes vote
- Brings up Nisani again after my call to start the consolidation process
Acro's intentions are rather clear. They also seem to match Sinani's below.
Why Nisani in particular? Was it because Nisani was talking about him being scummy? That's what it looks like to me but I might be wrong, I'm getting tired trying to finish this before I sleep.
Sinani filter
- Attacks Nisani for Nisani's defense of ISH
- Claims Nisani has given nothing but soft-reads and feigned contribution
More attacks for feigning contribution, lines up with Acro's read.
Okay, so Nisani in retrospect was clearly making himself an easy target, and was not quite up to the task of providing us with multiple reads. He was under attack directly or indirectly by several people from nearly the beginning of the game based on his comments regarding the conversation about my Role PM post. I didn't see any point at which anyone was like "well, he looks like a tilted town" or anything like that in my re-read but I may have missed it.
One of the possible reasons I can see this being the case is that he seems to have been brought to attention by Hapa. For the most part I've had a town read on Hapa the whole game and I'm sure I'm not the only one so I can see how it would lend itself to becoming part of "thread sentiment." The further tunneling by Acro kept Nisani on the back foot. Even I had a few words in regarding the situation (agreeing with Acro's case).
Overall, the lynch happened rather easily, but I think everyone shares the blame on that. Nisani's play did not look like strong town play. We didn't question whether or not he seemed capable of coming up with something new under pressure.
The most questionable candidate of the three people who addressed Nisani is Acro because it essentially boils down to OMGUS. Acro insisted multiple times that Nisani was scum. But that could just be Acro being Acro, I don't know him. I'm just looking at thread action here.
Follow up questions that I really hope someone else will take a look at:
- Were these tunnels / solitary reads / the only prudent cases made the the above players or were they actively seeking out more than one target for Day 1?
- What other "targets of opportunity" did these players pass up in favor of Nisani? Was there any motivation to NOT vote for certain players who were exhibiting similar characteristics? (i.e. prplhz)
- Feel free to add your own thoughts...
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On March 28 2013 11:37 Hapahauli wrote:@ RaynYou need to talk to me about your deadline actions a bit. About 1.5 hours before the deadline, you grace us with this rather wonky post: Show nested quote +On March 28 2013 05:24 raynpelikoneet wrote:There is one another thing why i won't change my vote from Nisani. When the Grack shot happened (and later when prplhz started town telling) there were two players who were totally thrown off their game. Palmar and Hapahauli. Palmar came in with a list of five people and was totally clueless what to do. Which would be okay since he had pushed Grack the whole early D1. If only there wasn't this post of his: No idea yet, I think it's the best option we have right now, aside from maybe one or two other openings I will explore later in the cycle. I think we still have more than a day to form our final wagon, so there's no need to rush it. He already had another couple of suspects. Where is the exploring? Right. And look what Hapa is doing... It might be the strangest thing I've read in the thread so far. Like... I think you're suspicious of myself and Palmar? Or are you just calling us "off our game"? It's very clear what your intentions are here. In addition, the whole idea of "oh I don't want to move my vote off of Nisani because two other players are acting strange" makes very little sense to me. I'd sympathise if your rationale was that you disagreed with our town-reads on Nisani, but you only dismiss them in passing and never address the logic.
Yes, i thought at that time you and Palmar were scum and pushing a mislynch to save your scumbuddy Nisani. Here is why. You were on prplhz before sinani. When people let go of prplhz you straight off start yelling sinani is scum and Nisani is not. Before this i don't see you interacting with sinani in any way. At all. A part of your case was that sinani's case on Nisani was bad, yet when he posted the case you took no action to tell the case was bad. Palmar is more funny. He doesn't do shit after Grack was shot, calls the shot "100% scum shot" and throws out a list of five people with no intention to push any lynch in that list. Later on he switches to Keirathi with no intention to stand behind his sinani vote when Keir is pushed by his scumread marv. rofl.
So yes, at that time i thought the lynch was scum driven. Now that Nisani flipped town i'm not sure about you anymore but Palmar is playing ridiculously scummy.
Show nested quote +On March 28 2013 05:35 raynpelikoneet wrote:
If i have to switch to Keir/sinani to ensure a lynch happens i'll switch to Keirathi. He falls into the gray area for me, i don't remember much from him. And i think sinani lynch is pushed by scum. This is where it starts to get scummy. You switch your vote to Kei without so much as a word here. While I understand that you wanted to consolidate, there are two things wrong here: 1) The deadline was not for another 1 hour and 15 minutes - you had plenty of time to push the Nisani lynch (whom you were reasonably confident in being scum), and instead chose a consolidation lynch in Kei. 2) You didn't really need to consolidate on Kei. In fact, the vote-count between Kei and Nisani at this point was quite even. It reads more like you decided to follow the momentum swing against kei for shits and giggles.
I thought the deadline was in 15 minutes as the OP said so. That's why i switched my vote then. Also other players who had switched their vote were on Nisani, so i thought the Nisani lynch is not going to happen anyways. And i found marv's case on Keir reasonable. And again, i thought sinani lynch was pushed by scum.
Show nested quote +On March 28 2013 06:21 raynpelikoneet wrote:
##Unvote
##Vote: Nisani
Keir, can you paraphrase what have you talked about in the mason circle? Just a short version. So then you unvote, but even then the circumstances here are strange. You unvote while asking Kei to corroborate his story about being in the Mason circle (by summarizing discussion). That makes very little objective sense, as generally people confirm their read BEFORE acting on something.
I asked the question in the same post where i unvoted because of two things:
1) Whatever Keirathi answers he won't get lynched either way. I don't think anyone is dumb enough to scumslip there if they bullshitted about being masons.
2) I wanted to see if Keirathi actually: a) answers me in the first place when there is less pressure on him, or b) if he throws out some wishy-washy answer we can analyze later on if there is a reason to believe he/Cora are lying about being masons. The answer he gave doesn't tell us shit now (like any other answer) but might be useful later. And people tend to be less worried about what they say if they are not under pressure.
Satisfied?
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On March 28 2013 17:36 ObviousOne wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2013 17:26 Palmar wrote:On March 28 2013 08:45 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Palmar why did you agree to the Keirathi lynch pushed by your scumread marv and agreed by your other scumread me? on the off chance I was wrong. He (we, as in Palmar and I) were already wrong on Grack. It could be a fatal disease for both of us. In re-reading the thread (I'm up to p21) I'm leaning town on Rayn btw. You still leaning town on Rayn, Palmar? That's the last I remember of you mentioning him off the top of my head.
I'm almost always wrong on my initial day 1 read, which is why I always revise the read before lynchtime.
As for rayn, I don't think he's town. I liked his initial contributions but I feel some of the things he said since have been pretty strange. I will elaborate later. Then again, I don't think he's our number 1 scum lynch for tomorrow. I still haven't decided where I want to take that.
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EPT
