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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
On May 28 2012 16:35 kitaman27 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 16:31 Blazinghand wrote:On May 28 2012 16:25 kitaman27 wrote:
lol Hyaach was mentioned in passing hours into the game. Is that really what you guys are going to jump on? :p
He really does need to post though -_-
"mentioned in passing"? you voted him >.> That's like saying that I met a girl when in fact we've been married for 5 years Naw, I didn't actually vote for him. (Not that it matters). Pretty sure I've random voted in about 80% of my games and changed once there is content in the thread. Is this suddenly scummy?
On May 28 2012 00:52 kitaman27 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 27 2012 11:20 GreYMisT wrote:
I would like to give a big thanks to my friend and fellow Grubby mod "astroorion" for helping me send the PMs I think GreYMisT just wanted to brag about being a Grubby mod. CAUGHT YOU! I agree with Wiggle's statement about the pardoner. The only person who we should elect as a the runner-up should be a player who states in the thread that he is unwilling to use the role on anyone but himself. Blazing, you may not be a troll, but you spam like no other. 37 posts in the first few hours of the game? -_- Mayor and pardoner elections are less important without bodyguards. The focus today should be determining the mayor's day one lynch. I may dislike policy lynches, but grush has failed to address any concerns. With a lyncher possibly in play, its extremeley likely that he has decided to run for mayor. I suggest we elect someone who has not declared their candidacy yet. ##Vote Hyaach. You got this.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On May 28 2012 16:35 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:lol wrong thread 
On May 10 2012 01:40 GreYMisT wrote:Spam:
Spam is not tolerated, nor is any off-topic material. Do not discuss Proleague here.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On May 28 2012 16:37 Blazinghand wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On May 28 2012 16:35 kitaman27 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 16:31 Blazinghand wrote:On May 28 2012 16:25 kitaman27 wrote:
lol Hyaach was mentioned in passing hours into the game. Is that really what you guys are going to jump on? :p
He really does need to post though -_-
"mentioned in passing"? you voted him >.> That's like saying that I met a girl when in fact we've been married for 5 years Naw, I didn't actually vote for him. (Not that it matters). Pretty sure I've random voted in about 80% of my games and changed once there is content in the thread. Is this suddenly scummy? On May 28 2012 00:52 kitaman27 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 27 2012 11:20 GreYMisT wrote:
I would like to give a big thanks to my friend and fellow Grubby mod "astroorion" for helping me send the PMs I think GreYMisT just wanted to brag about being a Grubby mod. CAUGHT YOU! I agree with Wiggle's statement about the pardoner. The only person who we should elect as a the runner-up should be a player who states in the thread that he is unwilling to use the role on anyone but himself. Blazing, you may not be a troll, but you spam like no other. 37 posts in the first few hours of the game? -_- Mayor and pardoner elections are less important without bodyguards. The focus today should be determining the mayor's day one lynch. I may dislike policy lynches, but grush has failed to address any concerns. With a lyncher possibly in play, its extremeley likely that he has decided to run for mayor. I suggest we elect someone who has not declared their candidacy yet. ##Vote Hyaach. You got this. ????
As in, a serious vote in the voting thread.
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On May 28 2012 16:25 kitaman27 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 16:04 VisceraEyes wrote:
C) Toad has claimed mason-who-talks-to-non-mod-confirmed-town-outside-the-thread and I don't want mason-who-talks-to-non-mod-confirmed-town-outside-the-thread in office. I want a townie in office, but not Toad...Toad is one of many many townies in the game Kita. But how many players can we be so certain isn't scum? You act as if toad is a completely incompetant who will certainly be tricked into going against his word to pardon a scum player. A town player who is given the opportunity to elect a player who isn't scum jumps on it. They don't discredit their ability and risk electing a mafia pardoner.Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 16:08 Blazinghand wrote:
I find Kitaman to be utterly inscrutable. At the time he voted for Hyaach, Hyaach's sole contribution to the game was an attempt to NOT vote for the mayor. Since then, he has successfully stated that he plans to placeholder-vote, and that... he hasn't caught up in the thread.
I can't possibly imagine any town motivation for pushing Hyaach for mayor. RnGing a mayor candidate, or, as Kita seems to have done, voted Hyaach... to presure him? lol Hyaach was mentioned in passing hours into the game. Is that really what you guys are going to jump on? :p He really does need to post though -_- Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 16:08 Blazinghand wrote:
Also apparently Kita is down with being mayor but hasn't voted himself or presented a candidacy. Now, I've seen some weird, weird play out of Kita in my day. But this really takes the cake. Spamming up the thread with why I'm so great and how I'm going to be active and open doesn't really do much for the game. (I am great by the way) Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 16:08 Blazinghand wrote:
He's mostly afraid of the lyncher, and quite notably NEVER mentions wiggles anywhere in his filter, except to answer a direct question, and once in passing about the Pardoner. Why doesn't he want to interact with one of the main mayoral candidates? Wiggles has made some valid points, but nothing that tells me about his alignment. The length of his posts tells me that he is putting effort into appearing town (I should probably work on that too), but again that doesn't say much about his alignment. When asked about lynch candidates, he only references toad, who clearly isn't going to be lynched tomorrow, so I don't have much to say about him until he comes up with a real target. Can I switch my random vote to Meapak? Dang it VE, you cost me an hour of sleep.
You're free to go anytime my guy. I just have a couple of quick comments. First, the bolded statement. Again, you're subtly brushing against the fact that you think I'm scum. Just come out and say it, you don't have to be scared Kita. I'm not going to go apeshit and cry OMGUS, you just better have a good explanation for why me having a preference as to who gets what elected position makes me automatically scum when we get votes specifically to indicate our preference on the matter as a mechanic in the very game.
Secondly, I'm not even jumping on you about who you put forth as a candidate. BH seemed shocked and MZ found it odd, but I knew where you were going with it. My question is why in the hell are you so fixated with protecting town from the Lyncher? Again, this was in my original case against you and you're failing to recognize it as a functional aspect of my argument. It's a possible role in the game sure, but do you know the full aspects of the role? Is it the Lyncher's target definitely a townie? And here's some food for thought: Toadesstern has very explicitly stated that he will NOT be using the pardoner power if elected. You know who that kinda sounds like? A lyncher. I mean yeah he claimed Mason and everything, but if you're so fixated on protecting us from the lyncher you'd risk putting someone like Toad who has very explicitly stated that he will "never use the power ever"?
Thirdly, sleep well scummy prince.
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
On May 28 2012 16:39 kitaman27 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 16:37 Blazinghand wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On May 28 2012 16:35 kitaman27 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 16:31 Blazinghand wrote:On May 28 2012 16:25 kitaman27 wrote:
lol Hyaach was mentioned in passing hours into the game. Is that really what you guys are going to jump on? :p
He really does need to post though -_-
"mentioned in passing"? you voted him >.> That's like saying that I met a girl when in fact we've been married for 5 years Naw, I didn't actually vote for him. (Not that it matters). Pretty sure I've random voted in about 80% of my games and changed once there is content in the thread. Is this suddenly scummy? On May 28 2012 00:52 kitaman27 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 27 2012 11:20 GreYMisT wrote:
I would like to give a big thanks to my friend and fellow Grubby mod "astroorion" for helping me send the PMs I think GreYMisT just wanted to brag about being a Grubby mod. CAUGHT YOU! I agree with Wiggle's statement about the pardoner. The only person who we should elect as a the runner-up should be a player who states in the thread that he is unwilling to use the role on anyone but himself. Blazing, you may not be a troll, but you spam like no other. 37 posts in the first few hours of the game? -_- Mayor and pardoner elections are less important without bodyguards. The focus today should be determining the mayor's day one lynch. I may dislike policy lynches, but grush has failed to address any concerns. With a lyncher possibly in play, its extremeley likely that he has decided to run for mayor. I suggest we elect someone who has not declared their candidacy yet. ##Vote Hyaach. You got this. ???? As in, a serious vote in the voting thread.
Oh I didn't uh... ok so I didn't know there was one of those. Withdrawn.
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On May 28 2012 16:37 kitaman27 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 01:40 GreYMisT wrote:Spam:
Spam is not tolerated, nor is any off-topic material. Do not discuss Proleague here.
I have the LR thread open and I forgot I had tabbed to this one, sue me.
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MZ this shit is gold are you getting all this?
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On May 28 2012 16:40 VisceraEyes wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 16:25 kitaman27 wrote:On May 28 2012 16:04 VisceraEyes wrote:
C) Toad has claimed mason-who-talks-to-non-mod-confirmed-town-outside-the-thread and I don't want mason-who-talks-to-non-mod-confirmed-town-outside-the-thread in office. I want a townie in office, but not Toad...Toad is one of many many townies in the game Kita. But how many players can we be so certain isn't scum? You act as if toad is a completely incompetant who will certainly be tricked into going against his word to pardon a scum player. A town player who is given the opportunity to elect a player who isn't scum jumps on it. They don't discredit their ability and risk electing a mafia pardoner.On May 28 2012 16:08 Blazinghand wrote:
I find Kitaman to be utterly inscrutable. At the time he voted for Hyaach, Hyaach's sole contribution to the game was an attempt to NOT vote for the mayor. Since then, he has successfully stated that he plans to placeholder-vote, and that... he hasn't caught up in the thread.
I can't possibly imagine any town motivation for pushing Hyaach for mayor. RnGing a mayor candidate, or, as Kita seems to have done, voted Hyaach... to presure him? lol Hyaach was mentioned in passing hours into the game. Is that really what you guys are going to jump on? :p He really does need to post though -_- On May 28 2012 16:08 Blazinghand wrote:
Also apparently Kita is down with being mayor but hasn't voted himself or presented a candidacy. Now, I've seen some weird, weird play out of Kita in my day. But this really takes the cake. Spamming up the thread with why I'm so great and how I'm going to be active and open doesn't really do much for the game. (I am great by the way) On May 28 2012 16:08 Blazinghand wrote:
He's mostly afraid of the lyncher, and quite notably NEVER mentions wiggles anywhere in his filter, except to answer a direct question, and once in passing about the Pardoner. Why doesn't he want to interact with one of the main mayoral candidates? Wiggles has made some valid points, but nothing that tells me about his alignment. The length of his posts tells me that he is putting effort into appearing town (I should probably work on that too), but again that doesn't say much about his alignment. When asked about lynch candidates, he only references toad, who clearly isn't going to be lynched tomorrow, so I don't have much to say about him until he comes up with a real target. On May 28 2012 16:10 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:+ Show Spoiler [PL] +STORKUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU GOGOGOOG KHAAAAAAAAAAAAN :D Can I switch my random vote to Meapak? Dang it VE, you cost me an hour of sleep. You're free to go anytime my guy. I just have a couple of quick comments. First, the bolded statement. Again, you're subtly brushing against the fact that you think I'm scum. Just come out and say it, you don't have to be scared Kita. I'm not going to go apeshit and cry OMGUS, you just better have a good explanation for why me having a preference as to who gets what elected position makes me automatically scum when we get votes specifically to indicate our preference on the matter as a mechanic in the very game.
I'm just arguing for what's best for town. Either you are scum or you are wrong. I won't make bold statements and say that you just claimed scum, but you're not seeing what I'm seeing, which I find scummy.
On May 28 2012 16:40 VisceraEyes wrote:
My question is why in the hell are you so fixated with protecting town from the Lyncher? Again, this was in my original case against you and you're failing to recognize it as a functional aspect of my argument. It's a possible role in the game sure, but do you know the full aspects of the role? Is it the Lyncher's target definitely a townie? And here's some food for thought: Toadesstern has very explicitly stated that he will NOT be using the pardoner power if elected. You know who that kinda sounds like? A lyncher. I mean yeah he claimed Mason and everything, but if you're so fixated on protecting us from the lyncher you'd risk putting someone like Toad who has very explicitly stated that he will "never use the power ever"?
I think a lyncher's target is most likely town yes. From a balancing perspective, it seems harsh that a third party player was given the objective to target a mafia player for death.
I'm not sure what you are saying in the second part. I'm interested in protecting the mayor position from the lyncher (and scum) because, well, they lynch their target who is likely town. It's in the lyncher pardoner's best interest to not use the pardoner role, which also happens to be the ideal use for town. Is this not the case?
On May 28 2012 16:40 VisceraEyes wrote:
Thirdly, sleep well scummy prince.
See you in my dreams. 
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The question is:
Why do you care? Why do you give a shit if the Lyncher wins or loses? What is the point of all of this?
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On May 28 2012 16:50 VisceraEyes wrote:
MZ this shit is gold are you getting all this?
I am forcing myself to remain cautious after my abysmal reads from last game but it's hard given the current play we're seeing.
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YOU'RE DIB THE LYNCHER! YOU'RE DIB THE LYNCHER AND YOU HAVE TO SEE ZIM THE IRKEN MENACE LYNCHED DON'T YOU?!
+ Show Spoiler +
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On May 28 2012 16:54 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 16:50 VisceraEyes wrote:
MZ this shit is gold are you getting all this? I am forcing myself to remain cautious after my abysmal reads from last game but it's hard given the current play we're seeing.
+ Show Spoiler +
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MZ I want your opinion: obviously in an ideal situation the town comes to a consensus on a lynch and there are no problems. But is it really in town's best interest to never use the pardoner power?
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On May 28 2012 17:12 VisceraEyes wrote:
MZ I want your opinion: obviously in an ideal situation the town comes to a consensus on a lynch and there are no problems. But is it really in town's best interest to never use the pardoner power?
hmmm. Personally if I was pardoner and I felt VERY strongly that the person who was getting lynched was town I would not hesitate to pardon them simply because I still trust my judgement enough to make that call.
Similarly, I wouldn't have a problem if someone pardoned someone who I thought was town. That being said, it is just a lot simpler if the pardoner is never used in. Even if a townie dies, information will be gleaned from the flip and we won't waste a cycle debating the action of the pardoner.
Just as a general announcement, I'm gonna stop posting in this thread because idk if I can think logically right now. Once I finish watching PL I need to allnighter a paper so see ya'll tomorrow.
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Wow, you guys stole all my reads. :p
Basically, I have two people in mind for who I think should be candidates for the lynch tomorrow. They are Sinensis and strongandbig.
The starting point I took for my two reads is that I believe it's very likely that scum would have at least one person run for mayor/pardoner, if not more. So, I decided to focus most of my attention on the people who declared they wanted to be elected. From that pool, both Sinensis and strongandbig stick out to me, here's why:
Sinensis:
Sinensis opens up by saying that he's running under a platform of lynching Grush. As the game has progressed, he's continued to support this position, and that's pretty much all he's done. Even with people telling him that lynching Grush isn't the best choice, and that Grush's play isn't about to destroy the town, he's still touting that we should lynch him.
I find this scummy, because his position provides zero accountability for his actions. Sinensis wouldn't consider himself accountable if he were to lynch grush and he flips town, because the reasons for the lynch aren't part of this game. They're based on events that happened outside the game.
As well, tunneling grush like he is provides him with an outlet to make posts that look like they're contributing, but actually don't do anything useful and provide no new content. Sinensis can continue to tunnel grush without repercussions, and he doesn't even have to provide reasons for grush being scum, since his reasons for wanting to lynch him aren't based on his play in this game. This is evidenced by the complete lack of reasoning for why we should lynch grush besides just repeating the same thing over and over.
Additionally, it doesn't look like sinensis is willing to let up, because when asked if he would lynch someone else, he says "find me a confirmed mafia and I will happily support their lynch instead of grush's". The thing is, we're rarely going to ever find a "confirmed" scum, so sinensis is just setting himself up to continue to tunnel grush. Even in the face of a reasonable scum candidate, sinensis is telling us that he'd still rather kill grush.
This play makes it so that sinensis won't have to contribute at all to the game until grush dies. As well, it makes it so that sinenesis isn't responsible for the outcome of his tunnel. Overall, I find this play to be very scummy.
strongandbig:
I believe strongandbig is scummy because of how he made a decision to run for pardoner, and then just sort of fell out of the running and didn't even try to continue to gain support after being called out.
He comes in and makes a post saying that he wants to be the pardoner. Quickly, BH calls him out on it, and after some back and forth, he drops his candidacy. It seems to me that scum would love to be able to nab the role of pardoner. This is what strongandbig set out to do, but when he was actually called out about running specifically for pardoner and was put under pressure, he was very quick to just drop his candidacy altogether. I think this is a sign of being scum, since it displays that he was very nervous in running. I feel as though a townie in that position wouldn't back off from running so quickly and after so little pressure. Also, his reason for not continuing to run is odd as well. He says it's because there aren't separate elections, but in my eyes, it seems more because he didn't like that he immediately came under scrutiny and was pressured.
Even beyond his candidacy, strongandbig's posting has been very safe, and not very relevant to the game or contributory. He hasn't provided us with many original thoughts, and has been very reserved since he got called out by BH. Again, this looks like he's afraid of being in the spotlight or being put under pressure.
As for kitaman, I can agree that he doesn't look like the towniest person among us, but I think that personally, I would rather lynch into either strongandbig or sinensis for Day 1. Let me know what you think. Do you agree with my reasoning? Disagree? Speak your mind, and hopefully we can decide on the best person to kill for Day 1.
Right now, if elected mayor, I'm planning to kill one of those two.
On a sidenote, if you've signed up for the game and haven't posted yet, or only have 1 post, please start actually playing. I'd rather not have the game end because of 9 mod-kills on Day 1. =/
It also makes you incredibly hard to read if you don't have any posts in the thread, since it's impossible to make a read out of nothing.
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On May 28 2012 17:21 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 17:12 VisceraEyes wrote:
MZ I want your opinion: obviously in an ideal situation the town comes to a consensus on a lynch and there are no problems. But is it really in town's best interest to never use the pardoner power? hmmm. Personally if I was pardoner and I felt VERY strongly that the person who was getting lynched was town I would not hesitate to pardon them simply because I still trust my judgement enough to make that call. Similarly, I wouldn't have a problem if someone pardoned someone who I thought was town. That being said, it is just a lot simpler if the pardoner is never used in. Even if a townie dies, information will be gleaned from the flip and we won't waste a cycle debating the action of the pardoner. Just as a general announcement, I'm gonna stop posting in this thread because idk if I can think logically right now. Once I finish watching PL I need to allnighter a paper so see ya'll tomorrow.
Once again we find ourselves in complete agreement.
Now, by my estimation, no...it's not ALWAYS in town's best interest to NEVER use the pardoner power. To be honest though, I don't know yet if it's in THIS town's best interest because I don't know who the pardoner is going to be...and if it's someone I trust with that power, I certainly wouldn't waste time "debating the action of the pardoner" because like you, I trust my own judgement about who to trust with that kind of power. However, like you (I assume), I wouldn't hesitate to call someone I trust with that power out for betraying that trust by using the power for obviously shitty reasoning.
Here's the part that really gets me about Kita's whole Lyncher fixation: it's entirely based on one huge contradiction.
:OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
Allow me to illustrate.
Kita's reasoning for his Lyncher fixation, I believe, is to protect that one "townie target" from the lynch to extend the game exactly 1 cycle. Don't even worry about the fact that the Lyncher has no direct control over the lynch, because that's not the point. The point is to protect that one "townie target" from the lynch to extend the game exactly
1 cycle
Kita's insisting that Toad be voted for Vice Leader of Earth on the platform of "soon I'll be 'confirmed' * Mason and I'll never ever use the power". By his estimation and repeated (ad nauseum?) insistence, it's in town's best interest to never use the pardoner power. But, by definition, the pardoner power extends the game exactly
1 cycle
....see where I'm going with this? His philosophies are completely contradictory!
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
I agree on SnB. I think you put to words what I was having trouble articulating about the way he's reacted to pressure, and his initial push for the pardoner role. I consider him the #1 scummiest player in the game, and he hasn't made any real attempt to contribute since he's ducked out of the race.
I don't think lynching Kita or Sin would be the optimal play, but I understand why both of them are mentioned in your post.
Since I agree with you on Kita and SnB I'll talk for a bit about Sin. I guess the big thing is that I empathize with the "let's lynch Grush" position. However, you make a good point that Sin is setting himself up to be unaccountable for his actions. It's become more clear that Grush is playing better than he has before, and if I was convinced, certainly Sin could be. I think that there's a definite scum motivation to do what he's done today. I also think that there's a possible explanation for his actions from a town perspective: he's understandably pissed about Grush's performance in the previous game, and is blinded to Grush's improvement this game by his anger.
This contrasts with SnB's play, for which I cannot think of a town explanation. Sin could scum trying to secure an easy mislynch and abdicate responsibility, OR he could be an angry townie. SnB, though, I can't see a motivation for his play except that he's scum. For this reason, I consider SnB a superior lynch target.
Whether you choose Sin or SnB you retain my vote.
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Wiggle similarly if you lynch between Sin and SnapB you'll retain my vote. Personally I prefer a Sin lynch for the reasons I've given. I also agree that lynching Kita D1 would be hasty.
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Actually, I want to talk about SnB for a minute if you guys don't mind.
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Right, I'm going to have to read over a lot of stuff. For the time being, I'm still happy to vote for ET, so ##Vote:EchelonTee however, that may change after reading things over.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/hk68C.jpg)
