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On March 31 2011 11:56 xbankx wrote: He has been saying Morrow is terrible and worst zerg in the world for ages. Guess what? Morrow made it past round of 32 and also came in second to Ret at Assembly.
Not true. I remember hearing IdrA say (I believe on SOTG, just before Assembly finals?) that he thought Morrow had very strong ZvT and ZvP but lacked understanding of ZvZ, and therefore would lose to Ret. He may or may not be right about the ZvZ part, but I'm pretty sure IdrA and almost anyone who has been following the game lately would agree that Morrow is incredibly good.
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On March 31 2011 16:50 growl wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 11:56 xbankx wrote: He has been saying Morrow is terrible and worst zerg in the world for ages. Guess what? Morrow made it past round of 32 and also came in second to Ret at Assembly. Not true. I remember hearing IdrA say (I believe on SOTG, just before Assembly finals?) that he thought Morrow had very strong ZvT and ZvP but lacked understanding of ZvZ, and therefore would lose to Ret. He may or may not be right about the ZvZ part, but I'm pretty sure IdrA and almost anyone who has been following the game lately would agree that Morrow is incredibly good.
that was incontrol I think Idra always bashes on morrow
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On March 31 2011 11:56 xbankx wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 07:21 MonsieurGrimm wrote:
Meh, say what you want about IdrA, I'm just glad he says what he thinks, there's sure as hell enough fake people everywhere these days. Cruncher should really just get a tougher skin, just because someone said something honest about you doesn't mean beating him = winning every GSL forever or something, calm down about yourself.
Mondragon is a baller. We can say the same about Cruncher. He says what he thinks and he is just being honest. Why should Cruncher get tougher skin when Idra doesn't. Typical Idra fan, somehow justifying Idra's action as honest/speaking his mind and others as BM when they are doing the same thing. Get a hold of reality please. Both are BM if you don't want to get BMed then don't BM in the first place. Cruncher in his interview never said how good he is so Im not sure where you are getting on about how he should calm himself down. All he said is Idra is terrible and you know what? Recent results speak for itself. While other zergs are taking down tournies left and right, Idra is QQing and not doing anything. He has been saying Morrow is terrible and worst zerg in the world for ages. Guess what? Morrow made it past round of 32 and also came in second to Ret at Assembly.
Nope, IdrA thinks MorroW is one of the better foreign zergs. And anyways, all IdrA said is that he thought the match would be a walkover - never said a thing about Cruncher himself except that he thought he could beat Cruncher easily. Apparently that's BM, I don't think so - maybe it's a little cocky but Cruncher really shouldn't get offended by that, he was the underdog and he knew it. Then Cruncher wins and is arrogant and immature as shit in his interview, just because he caused an upset?
Since you like comparing the "BM" of the two players, here's what went down:
IdrA: I think that beating Cruncher will be easy. Later: What Cruncher did in game 1 took no skill. What I did in game 2 did. You're not a very good player.
Cruncher: LAWL I love making IdrA "rage". IdrA is overrated and arrogant and nowhere near being a good player. It's so funny when he "rages" that I sacrifice the time I could spend getting better at the game just to piss him off. I have no respect for him. I love pissing IdrA off. IdrA's fans only like him because of the BM, not because of his play.
Judge for yourself, I suppose.
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Nada: "My Siege Mode upgrade was late so my expeditionary force had to just come back. I was really surprised by the Battlecruisers, and I felt Dario was really that great of a player as I had expected"
What a class act. Love him.
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On April 01 2011 00:56 MonsieurGrimm wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 11:56 xbankx wrote:On March 31 2011 07:21 MonsieurGrimm wrote:
Meh, say what you want about IdrA, I'm just glad he says what he thinks, there's sure as hell enough fake people everywhere these days. Cruncher should really just get a tougher skin, just because someone said something honest about you doesn't mean beating him = winning every GSL forever or something, calm down about yourself.
Mondragon is a baller. We can say the same about Cruncher. He says what he thinks and he is just being honest. Why should Cruncher get tougher skin when Idra doesn't. Typical Idra fan, somehow justifying Idra's action as honest/speaking his mind and others as BM when they are doing the same thing. Get a hold of reality please. Both are BM if you don't want to get BMed then don't BM in the first place. Cruncher in his interview never said how good he is so Im not sure where you are getting on about how he should calm himself down. All he said is Idra is terrible and you know what? Recent results speak for itself. While other zergs are taking down tournies left and right, Idra is QQing and not doing anything. He has been saying Morrow is terrible and worst zerg in the world for ages. Guess what? Morrow made it past round of 32 and also came in second to Ret at Assembly. Nope, IdrA thinks MorroW is one of the better foreign zergs. And anyways, all IdrA said is that he thought the match would be a walkover - never said a thing about Cruncher himself except that he thought he could beat Cruncher easily. Apparently that's BM, I don't think so - maybe it's a little cocky but Cruncher really shouldn't get offended by that, he was the underdog and he knew it. Then Cruncher wins and is arrogant and immature as shit in his interview, just because he caused an upset? Since you like comparing the "BM" of the two players, here's what went down: IdrA: I think that beating Cruncher will be easy. Later: What Cruncher did in game 1 took no skill. What I did in game 2 did. You're not a very good player. Cruncher: LAWL I love making IdrA "rage". IdrA is overrated and arrogant and nowhere near being a good player. It's so funny when he "rages" that I sacrifice the time I could spend getting better at the game just to piss him off. I have no respect for him. I love pissing IdrA off. IdrA's fans only like him because of the BM, not because of his play. Judge for yourself, I suppose.
Here's what actually went down: IdrA directly insulted Cruncher on three separate occasions. Cruncher never insulted IdrA. Inciting rage in an opponent that has emotional problems is not an insult.  is not an insult. "I knew he would rage because he lost" is not an insult.
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On April 01 2011 03:11 artanis2 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On April 01 2011 00:56 MonsieurGrimm wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 11:56 xbankx wrote:On March 31 2011 07:21 MonsieurGrimm wrote:
Meh, say what you want about IdrA, I'm just glad he says what he thinks, there's sure as hell enough fake people everywhere these days. Cruncher should really just get a tougher skin, just because someone said something honest about you doesn't mean beating him = winning every GSL forever or something, calm down about yourself.
Mondragon is a baller. We can say the same about Cruncher. He says what he thinks and he is just being honest. Why should Cruncher get tougher skin when Idra doesn't. Typical Idra fan, somehow justifying Idra's action as honest/speaking his mind and others as BM when they are doing the same thing. Get a hold of reality please. Both are BM if you don't want to get BMed then don't BM in the first place. Cruncher in his interview never said how good he is so Im not sure where you are getting on about how he should calm himself down. All he said is Idra is terrible and you know what? Recent results speak for itself. While other zergs are taking down tournies left and right, Idra is QQing and not doing anything. He has been saying Morrow is terrible and worst zerg in the world for ages. Guess what? Morrow made it past round of 32 and also came in second to Ret at Assembly. Nope, IdrA thinks MorroW is one of the better foreign zergs. And anyways, all IdrA said is that he thought the match would be a walkover - never said a thing about Cruncher himself except that he thought he could beat Cruncher easily. Apparently that's BM, I don't think so - maybe it's a little cocky but Cruncher really shouldn't get offended by that, he was the underdog and he knew it. Then Cruncher wins and is arrogant and immature as shit in his interview, just because he caused an upset? Since you like comparing the "BM" of the two players, here's what went down: IdrA: I think that beating Cruncher will be easy. Later: What Cruncher did in game 1 took no skill. What I did in game 2 did. You're not a very good player. Cruncher: LAWL I love making IdrA "rage". IdrA is overrated and arrogant and nowhere near being a good player. It's so funny when he "rages" that I sacrifice the time I could spend getting better at the game just to piss him off. I have no respect for him. I love pissing IdrA off. IdrA's fans only like him because of the BM, not because of his play. Judge for yourself, I suppose. Here's what actually went down: IdrA directly insulted Cruncher on three separate occasions. Cruncher never insulted IdrA. Inciting rage in an opponent that has emotional problems is not an insult. is not an insult. "I knew he would rage because he lost" is not an insult.
IdrA is overrated and arrogant and nowhere near being a good player.
Seems just as bad as anything IdrA said.
And even if he didn't insult IdrA, he's acting like a child.
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On April 01 2011 03:47 MonsieurGrimm wrote:Show nested quote +On April 01 2011 03:11 artanis2 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On April 01 2011 00:56 MonsieurGrimm wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 11:56 xbankx wrote:On March 31 2011 07:21 MonsieurGrimm wrote:
Meh, say what you want about IdrA, I'm just glad he says what he thinks, there's sure as hell enough fake people everywhere these days. Cruncher should really just get a tougher skin, just because someone said something honest about you doesn't mean beating him = winning every GSL forever or something, calm down about yourself.
Mondragon is a baller. We can say the same about Cruncher. He says what he thinks and he is just being honest. Why should Cruncher get tougher skin when Idra doesn't. Typical Idra fan, somehow justifying Idra's action as honest/speaking his mind and others as BM when they are doing the same thing. Get a hold of reality please. Both are BM if you don't want to get BMed then don't BM in the first place. Cruncher in his interview never said how good he is so Im not sure where you are getting on about how he should calm himself down. All he said is Idra is terrible and you know what? Recent results speak for itself. While other zergs are taking down tournies left and right, Idra is QQing and not doing anything. He has been saying Morrow is terrible and worst zerg in the world for ages. Guess what? Morrow made it past round of 32 and also came in second to Ret at Assembly. Nope, IdrA thinks MorroW is one of the better foreign zergs. And anyways, all IdrA said is that he thought the match would be a walkover - never said a thing about Cruncher himself except that he thought he could beat Cruncher easily. Apparently that's BM, I don't think so - maybe it's a little cocky but Cruncher really shouldn't get offended by that, he was the underdog and he knew it. Then Cruncher wins and is arrogant and immature as shit in his interview, just because he caused an upset? Since you like comparing the "BM" of the two players, here's what went down: IdrA: I think that beating Cruncher will be easy. Later: What Cruncher did in game 1 took no skill. What I did in game 2 did. You're not a very good player. Cruncher: LAWL I love making IdrA "rage". IdrA is overrated and arrogant and nowhere near being a good player. It's so funny when he "rages" that I sacrifice the time I could spend getting better at the game just to piss him off. I have no respect for him. I love pissing IdrA off. IdrA's fans only like him because of the BM, not because of his play. Judge for yourself, I suppose. Here's what actually went down: IdrA directly insulted Cruncher on three separate occasions. Cruncher never insulted IdrA. Inciting rage in an opponent that has emotional problems is not an insult. is not an insult. "I knew he would rage because he lost" is not an insult. Seems just as bad as anything IdrA said. And even if he didn't insult IdrA, he's acting like a child.
How can you say calling someone a walkover is not the same as calling them bad? I don't get your logic.
Idra to Cruncher: Walkover, can only win by 4 warpgate->bad player=insult
Cruncher to Idra: overrated player, terrible player when he isn't practicing
as a professional gamer, the worst insult is being called a walkover. I mean if Idra said something like "I think Im better than him, so I can win" Sure that is not insulting their skill level or even if he did it in a mannered way by saying "cruncher's mechanics is not at my level", but calling someone a walkover+win only be cheesing is.
The thing is no matter how much of an idra fan boy you are, I assume your reality still stays intact enough to realize what Idra said pregame is BM. Im not saying what Cruncher said postgame isn't BM because obviously it is. But I just feel Idra deserve every bit of it
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On April 01 2011 04:52 xbankx wrote:Show nested quote +On April 01 2011 03:47 MonsieurGrimm wrote:On April 01 2011 03:11 artanis2 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On April 01 2011 00:56 MonsieurGrimm wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 11:56 xbankx wrote:On March 31 2011 07:21 MonsieurGrimm wrote:
Meh, say what you want about IdrA, I'm just glad he says what he thinks, there's sure as hell enough fake people everywhere these days. Cruncher should really just get a tougher skin, just because someone said something honest about you doesn't mean beating him = winning every GSL forever or something, calm down about yourself.
Mondragon is a baller. We can say the same about Cruncher. He says what he thinks and he is just being honest. Why should Cruncher get tougher skin when Idra doesn't. Typical Idra fan, somehow justifying Idra's action as honest/speaking his mind and others as BM when they are doing the same thing. Get a hold of reality please. Both are BM if you don't want to get BMed then don't BM in the first place. Cruncher in his interview never said how good he is so Im not sure where you are getting on about how he should calm himself down. All he said is Idra is terrible and you know what? Recent results speak for itself. While other zergs are taking down tournies left and right, Idra is QQing and not doing anything. He has been saying Morrow is terrible and worst zerg in the world for ages. Guess what? Morrow made it past round of 32 and also came in second to Ret at Assembly. Nope, IdrA thinks MorroW is one of the better foreign zergs. And anyways, all IdrA said is that he thought the match would be a walkover - never said a thing about Cruncher himself except that he thought he could beat Cruncher easily. Apparently that's BM, I don't think so - maybe it's a little cocky but Cruncher really shouldn't get offended by that, he was the underdog and he knew it. Then Cruncher wins and is arrogant and immature as shit in his interview, just because he caused an upset? Since you like comparing the "BM" of the two players, here's what went down: IdrA: I think that beating Cruncher will be easy. Later: What Cruncher did in game 1 took no skill. What I did in game 2 did. You're not a very good player. Cruncher: LAWL I love making IdrA "rage". IdrA is overrated and arrogant and nowhere near being a good player. It's so funny when he "rages" that I sacrifice the time I could spend getting better at the game just to piss him off. I have no respect for him. I love pissing IdrA off. IdrA's fans only like him because of the BM, not because of his play. Judge for yourself, I suppose. Here's what actually went down: IdrA directly insulted Cruncher on three separate occasions. Cruncher never insulted IdrA. Inciting rage in an opponent that has emotional problems is not an insult. is not an insult. "I knew he would rage because he lost" is not an insult. IdrA is overrated and arrogant and nowhere near being a good player. Seems just as bad as anything IdrA said. And even if he didn't insult IdrA, he's acting like a child. How can you say calling someone a walkover is not the same as calling them bad? I don't get your logic. Idra to Cruncher: Walkover, can only win by 4 warpgate->bad player=insult Cruncher to Idra: overrated player, terrible player when he isn't practicing as a professional gamer, the worst insult is being called a walkover. I mean if Idra said something like "I think Im better than him, so I can win" Sure that is not insulting their skill level or even if he did it in a mannered way by saying "cruncher's mechanics is not at my level", but calling someone a walkover+win only be cheesing is. The thing is no matter how much of an idra fan boy you are, I assume your reality still stays intact enough to realize what Idra said pregame is BM. Im not saying what Cruncher said postgame isn't BM because obviously it is. But I just feel Idra deserve every bit of it
Maybe he said he would be a walkover because Cruncher has no real notable wins in his past and was a relative unknown? I never said calling someone a walkover was not the same as calling them bad, I said they were equivalent - you said that Cruncher never insulted IdrA which is completely false.
In any case, Cruncher did win using Void Rays and he did win with a 6gate Allin, what IdrA said was relatively accurate.
I don't know why you keep calling me an IdrA fanboy either - it's not like I'm saying LAWL cruncher so bad idra rape him protoss op!!!1, I'm just saying that all the hate IdrA's gettting is uncalled for - all he did was tell the truth.
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On April 01 2011 05:20 MonsieurGrimm wrote:Show nested quote +On April 01 2011 04:52 xbankx wrote:On April 01 2011 03:47 MonsieurGrimm wrote:On April 01 2011 03:11 artanis2 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On April 01 2011 00:56 MonsieurGrimm wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 11:56 xbankx wrote:On March 31 2011 07:21 MonsieurGrimm wrote:
Meh, say what you want about IdrA, I'm just glad he says what he thinks, there's sure as hell enough fake people everywhere these days. Cruncher should really just get a tougher skin, just because someone said something honest about you doesn't mean beating him = winning every GSL forever or something, calm down about yourself.
Mondragon is a baller. We can say the same about Cruncher. He says what he thinks and he is just being honest. Why should Cruncher get tougher skin when Idra doesn't. Typical Idra fan, somehow justifying Idra's action as honest/speaking his mind and others as BM when they are doing the same thing. Get a hold of reality please. Both are BM if you don't want to get BMed then don't BM in the first place. Cruncher in his interview never said how good he is so Im not sure where you are getting on about how he should calm himself down. All he said is Idra is terrible and you know what? Recent results speak for itself. While other zergs are taking down tournies left and right, Idra is QQing and not doing anything. He has been saying Morrow is terrible and worst zerg in the world for ages. Guess what? Morrow made it past round of 32 and also came in second to Ret at Assembly. Nope, IdrA thinks MorroW is one of the better foreign zergs. And anyways, all IdrA said is that he thought the match would be a walkover - never said a thing about Cruncher himself except that he thought he could beat Cruncher easily. Apparently that's BM, I don't think so - maybe it's a little cocky but Cruncher really shouldn't get offended by that, he was the underdog and he knew it. Then Cruncher wins and is arrogant and immature as shit in his interview, just because he caused an upset? Since you like comparing the "BM" of the two players, here's what went down: IdrA: I think that beating Cruncher will be easy. Later: What Cruncher did in game 1 took no skill. What I did in game 2 did. You're not a very good player. Cruncher: LAWL I love making IdrA "rage". IdrA is overrated and arrogant and nowhere near being a good player. It's so funny when he "rages" that I sacrifice the time I could spend getting better at the game just to piss him off. I have no respect for him. I love pissing IdrA off. IdrA's fans only like him because of the BM, not because of his play. Judge for yourself, I suppose. Here's what actually went down: IdrA directly insulted Cruncher on three separate occasions. Cruncher never insulted IdrA. Inciting rage in an opponent that has emotional problems is not an insult. is not an insult. "I knew he would rage because he lost" is not an insult. IdrA is overrated and arrogant and nowhere near being a good player. Seems just as bad as anything IdrA said. And even if he didn't insult IdrA, he's acting like a child. How can you say calling someone a walkover is not the same as calling them bad? I don't get your logic. Idra to Cruncher: Walkover, can only win by 4 warpgate->bad player=insult Cruncher to Idra: overrated player, terrible player when he isn't practicing as a professional gamer, the worst insult is being called a walkover. I mean if Idra said something like "I think Im better than him, so I can win" Sure that is not insulting their skill level or even if he did it in a mannered way by saying "cruncher's mechanics is not at my level", but calling someone a walkover+win only be cheesing is. The thing is no matter how much of an idra fan boy you are, I assume your reality still stays intact enough to realize what Idra said pregame is BM. Im not saying what Cruncher said postgame isn't BM because obviously it is. But I just feel Idra deserve every bit of it Maybe he said he would be a walkover because Cruncher has no real notable wins in his past and was a relative unknown? I never said calling someone a walkover was not the same as calling them bad, I said they were equivalent - you said that Cruncher never insulted IdrA which is completely false. In any case, Cruncher did win using Void Rays and he did win with a 6gate Allin, what IdrA said was relatively accurate. I don't know why you keep calling me an IdrA fanboy either - it's not like I'm saying LAWL cruncher so bad idra rape him protoss op!!!1, I'm just saying that all the hate IdrA's gettting is uncalled for - all he did was tell the truth.
I clearly said what cruncher said is BM. My first post is if you say what Idra said is merely "telling the truth", we can technically say the same about what cruncher said.
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On April 01 2011 08:38 xbankx wrote:Show nested quote +On April 01 2011 05:20 MonsieurGrimm wrote:On April 01 2011 04:52 xbankx wrote:On April 01 2011 03:47 MonsieurGrimm wrote:On April 01 2011 03:11 artanis2 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On April 01 2011 00:56 MonsieurGrimm wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 11:56 xbankx wrote:On March 31 2011 07:21 MonsieurGrimm wrote:
Meh, say what you want about IdrA, I'm just glad he says what he thinks, there's sure as hell enough fake people everywhere these days. Cruncher should really just get a tougher skin, just because someone said something honest about you doesn't mean beating him = winning every GSL forever or something, calm down about yourself.
Mondragon is a baller. We can say the same about Cruncher. He says what he thinks and he is just being honest. Why should Cruncher get tougher skin when Idra doesn't. Typical Idra fan, somehow justifying Idra's action as honest/speaking his mind and others as BM when they are doing the same thing. Get a hold of reality please. Both are BM if you don't want to get BMed then don't BM in the first place. Cruncher in his interview never said how good he is so Im not sure where you are getting on about how he should calm himself down. All he said is Idra is terrible and you know what? Recent results speak for itself. While other zergs are taking down tournies left and right, Idra is QQing and not doing anything. He has been saying Morrow is terrible and worst zerg in the world for ages. Guess what? Morrow made it past round of 32 and also came in second to Ret at Assembly. Nope, IdrA thinks MorroW is one of the better foreign zergs. And anyways, all IdrA said is that he thought the match would be a walkover - never said a thing about Cruncher himself except that he thought he could beat Cruncher easily. Apparently that's BM, I don't think so - maybe it's a little cocky but Cruncher really shouldn't get offended by that, he was the underdog and he knew it. Then Cruncher wins and is arrogant and immature as shit in his interview, just because he caused an upset? Since you like comparing the "BM" of the two players, here's what went down: IdrA: I think that beating Cruncher will be easy. Later: What Cruncher did in game 1 took no skill. What I did in game 2 did. You're not a very good player. Cruncher: LAWL I love making IdrA "rage". IdrA is overrated and arrogant and nowhere near being a good player. It's so funny when he "rages" that I sacrifice the time I could spend getting better at the game just to piss him off. I have no respect for him. I love pissing IdrA off. IdrA's fans only like him because of the BM, not because of his play. Judge for yourself, I suppose. Here's what actually went down: IdrA directly insulted Cruncher on three separate occasions. Cruncher never insulted IdrA. Inciting rage in an opponent that has emotional problems is not an insult. is not an insult. "I knew he would rage because he lost" is not an insult. IdrA is overrated and arrogant and nowhere near being a good player. Seems just as bad as anything IdrA said. And even if he didn't insult IdrA, he's acting like a child. How can you say calling someone a walkover is not the same as calling them bad? I don't get your logic. Idra to Cruncher: Walkover, can only win by 4 warpgate->bad player=insult Cruncher to Idra: overrated player, terrible player when he isn't practicing as a professional gamer, the worst insult is being called a walkover. I mean if Idra said something like "I think Im better than him, so I can win" Sure that is not insulting their skill level or even if he did it in a mannered way by saying "cruncher's mechanics is not at my level", but calling someone a walkover+win only be cheesing is. The thing is no matter how much of an idra fan boy you are, I assume your reality still stays intact enough to realize what Idra said pregame is BM. Im not saying what Cruncher said postgame isn't BM because obviously it is. But I just feel Idra deserve every bit of it Maybe he said he would be a walkover because Cruncher has no real notable wins in his past and was a relative unknown? I never said calling someone a walkover was not the same as calling them bad, I said they were equivalent - you said that Cruncher never insulted IdrA which is completely false. In any case, Cruncher did win using Void Rays and he did win with a 6gate Allin, what IdrA said was relatively accurate. I don't know why you keep calling me an IdrA fanboy either - it's not like I'm saying LAWL cruncher so bad idra rape him protoss op!!!1, I'm just saying that all the hate IdrA's gettting is uncalled for - all he did was tell the truth. I clearly said what cruncher said is BM. My first post is if you say what Idra said is merely "telling the truth", we can technically say the same about what cruncher said.
Maybe you should dig deep in the quotes and find what you bolded.
EDIT: Shit that was someone else.
In any case, IdrA attacked Cruncher's play while Cruncher attacked IdrA himself. I do see a big difference between the two, but maybe other people don't care.
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On April 01 2011 09:10 MonsieurGrimm wrote:Show nested quote +On April 01 2011 08:38 xbankx wrote:On April 01 2011 05:20 MonsieurGrimm wrote:On April 01 2011 04:52 xbankx wrote:On April 01 2011 03:47 MonsieurGrimm wrote:On April 01 2011 03:11 artanis2 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On April 01 2011 00:56 MonsieurGrimm wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 11:56 xbankx wrote:On March 31 2011 07:21 MonsieurGrimm wrote:
Meh, say what you want about IdrA, I'm just glad he says what he thinks, there's sure as hell enough fake people everywhere these days. Cruncher should really just get a tougher skin, just because someone said something honest about you doesn't mean beating him = winning every GSL forever or something, calm down about yourself.
Mondragon is a baller. We can say the same about Cruncher. He says what he thinks and he is just being honest. Why should Cruncher get tougher skin when Idra doesn't. Typical Idra fan, somehow justifying Idra's action as honest/speaking his mind and others as BM when they are doing the same thing. Get a hold of reality please. Both are BM if you don't want to get BMed then don't BM in the first place. Cruncher in his interview never said how good he is so Im not sure where you are getting on about how he should calm himself down. All he said is Idra is terrible and you know what? Recent results speak for itself. While other zergs are taking down tournies left and right, Idra is QQing and not doing anything. He has been saying Morrow is terrible and worst zerg in the world for ages. Guess what? Morrow made it past round of 32 and also came in second to Ret at Assembly. Nope, IdrA thinks MorroW is one of the better foreign zergs. And anyways, all IdrA said is that he thought the match would be a walkover - never said a thing about Cruncher himself except that he thought he could beat Cruncher easily. Apparently that's BM, I don't think so - maybe it's a little cocky but Cruncher really shouldn't get offended by that, he was the underdog and he knew it. Then Cruncher wins and is arrogant and immature as shit in his interview, just because he caused an upset? Since you like comparing the "BM" of the two players, here's what went down: IdrA: I think that beating Cruncher will be easy. Later: What Cruncher did in game 1 took no skill. What I did in game 2 did. You're not a very good player. Cruncher: LAWL I love making IdrA "rage". IdrA is overrated and arrogant and nowhere near being a good player. It's so funny when he "rages" that I sacrifice the time I could spend getting better at the game just to piss him off. I have no respect for him. I love pissing IdrA off. IdrA's fans only like him because of the BM, not because of his play. Judge for yourself, I suppose. Here's what actually went down: IdrA directly insulted Cruncher on three separate occasions. Cruncher never insulted IdrA. Inciting rage in an opponent that has emotional problems is not an insult. is not an insult. "I knew he would rage because he lost" is not an insult. IdrA is overrated and arrogant and nowhere near being a good player. Seems just as bad as anything IdrA said. And even if he didn't insult IdrA, he's acting like a child. How can you say calling someone a walkover is not the same as calling them bad? I don't get your logic. Idra to Cruncher: Walkover, can only win by 4 warpgate->bad player=insult Cruncher to Idra: overrated player, terrible player when he isn't practicing as a professional gamer, the worst insult is being called a walkover. I mean if Idra said something like "I think Im better than him, so I can win" Sure that is not insulting their skill level or even if he did it in a mannered way by saying "cruncher's mechanics is not at my level", but calling someone a walkover+win only be cheesing is. The thing is no matter how much of an idra fan boy you are, I assume your reality still stays intact enough to realize what Idra said pregame is BM. Im not saying what Cruncher said postgame isn't BM because obviously it is. But I just feel Idra deserve every bit of it Maybe he said he would be a walkover because Cruncher has no real notable wins in his past and was a relative unknown? I never said calling someone a walkover was not the same as calling them bad, I said they were equivalent - you said that Cruncher never insulted IdrA which is completely false. In any case, Cruncher did win using Void Rays and he did win with a 6gate Allin, what IdrA said was relatively accurate. I don't know why you keep calling me an IdrA fanboy either - it's not like I'm saying LAWL cruncher so bad idra rape him protoss op!!!1, I'm just saying that all the hate IdrA's gettting is uncalled for - all he did was tell the truth. I clearly said what cruncher said is BM. My first post is if you say what Idra said is merely "telling the truth", we can technically say the same about what cruncher said. Maybe you should dig deep in the quotes and find what you bolded. EDIT: Shit that was someone else. In any case, IdrA attacked Cruncher's play while Cruncher attacked IdrA himself. I do see a big difference between the two, but maybe other people don't care.
I don't get you. Cruncher did not even insult that much idra directly(unless I assume you count calling someone arrogant is super super BM but compared to what Idra said to him I don' even think it is that bad). He merely said Idra was a bad/overrated player which is no different than calling someone a walkover. Walkover=bad player. As for the make Idra rage part through cheese, that is just standard bad manner on bnet. Cheesing someone does not mean he is attacking idra even if he has the intend to make Idra rage. I get cheesed. I raged but it doesn't mean he is attacking me personally even if it is his intent to get me to rage.
The only attack of character is probably when he called Idra arrogant and I don't even think it is that bad considering what Idra said to him during game. Arrogant is not a "OMFG how dare he said that" phrase.
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United States685 Posts
Sportsmanship is really revealing in terms of character and if you look at how the players acted during the actual game, then I think Cruncher was much more professional. As far as I know, Cruncher did have the common courtesy to gl/gg, even during game 2, whereas Idra didn't. As someone who loves sports in general, how you conduct yourself during the game is more important to me than anything else. Athletes are pissed off in post-game interviews all the time.
Sure, Cruncher was BM in the post game interview, but Idra was BM several times before that for no apparent reason. All that Cruncher said before the match was that he was prepared and confident. Why did Idra make those SoTG comments anyway? Or call Cruncher a walk-over before the match? At least Cruncher's reaction was understandable, he was disrespected.
And by the way, most of what Cruncher said was fairly reasonable. If Idra is going to call him a walkover and then lose in a Bo3 at a major tournament, then I have no problem with Cruncher saying he's overrated.
Edit: I also don't understand people giving Idra benefit of the doubt because he is the more accomplished player. All that means is Idra has had the better career, not that he somehow deserved to win and therefore he can say whatever he wants. I had never seen a Cruncher game before this either, but he did win a TSL Qualifier and therefore deserved to be there as much as anyone else. We don't even know if Idra would have qualed if he had to.
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On April 01 2011 13:13 Vul wrote:
The truth.
Amen to that. And your first post too? Color me impressed.
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Okay, a lot of you don't understand why Cruncher is getting a lot of hate. You don't beat your opponent and then in your post-game interview trash talk your opponent (basically getting a free-roll on your trash talking / cheap-shoting your opponent) just as you should always gg after game no matter how badly you got raped.
Cruncher was the higher of the two before and during the match (humble pre-game interview, gg's after g2 loss, etc.) but this coming out party post-game interview is basically him stooping down to Idra's level.
I am not a fan of Idra's BM, attitude, unprofessionalism or antics. But let me draw an example from a real sport where BM and trash talking regularly happens.
In playoff NHL hockey, pre-game trash-talking and in game trash-talking basically the norm. Team A during warm up will go over to Team B's side and say shit like 'you're gf is hot', 'lolol, you remember when I smashed your face in the last time we fought?', 'you guys probably only here because you're riding your goalies nuts, trololol' you do it to psyche your opponent out, it's part of the game and I think that is exactly what Idra was trying to accomplish pre-game and during game.
Yes, it's cocky. Yes, it's dirty. But it is a part of the game.
Idra was even trash talking in between games. I don't know the formal rules on that but I guess in SC2 etiquette that is frowned upon. So Idra is definitely going pretty low here.
Even after a hockey playoff series, no matter what transpired, no matter what trash talk was dished out players line up and shake hands - for respect of the opponent and RESPECT OF THE GAME.
Idra should have GGed out after losing the games. I think that's what it's equivalent to in real sport, to put it into perspective. Idra disrespected Cruncher by rage quitting when he lost and didn't gg out. Simple as that.
However, after beating your opponent (no matter how much trash-talking he did to psyche you out), you SHOULD NOT in post-game interview trash-talk, 'try to induce rage' and try to clown your opponent further after he lost. It's the same as not gg-ing out and not giving a hand-shake.
There are sore losers and there are sore winners. I feel like both players were quite disappointing in their attitudes and professionalism. You don't challenge someone, lose, and then don't give any respect to your opponent. At the same time, you don't win and take a chance to cheap-shot and run salt on already open wounds.
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On March 29 2011 16:47 Sky Net wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On March 29 2011 14:25 tangwhat wrote:
IdrA's bm is different because he disrespects people like Silver/CrunCher(random nobodies who only achieve success based on how strong their race was at the time), he disrespects the way those guys play because it's abusive and comparatively easier to do than the way talented people play(read: Tyler). When Morrow beat Idra at the IEM finals, Idra cried abuse. He said that if Morrow played zerg he wouldn't get past gold league. Idra's fans ate it up. They flamed Morrow on the forums and trolled his fanclub thread, saying he would be terrible as zerg or that he was only good because he abused reapers. Morrow is now one of the best zergs in the world and the scorn of Idra's disciples is mostly forgotten. Before Morrow... well you mentioned Tyler. I'm not sure if you were actually giving Tyler as an example of someone who deserves respect, but in the past TSL, in fact, Idra said Tyler was a terrible player and that he would beat him 4-0. Idra lost 1-4. Memories are short and Idra fans now have a new person to insist is bad and just wins due to imba/cheese. Enjoy all the hater attention, Cruncher. You have nothing to prove given all the big names you've beaten lately, anyone who says you're bad or a "random nobody" is too lazy to look at your actual results or is just completely braindead. 2-0 vs Kiwikaki, 3-0 vs Fenix, 4-1 vs PainUser, 4-1 vs Sjow, 4-1 vs LzGamer, 4-0 vs StrifeCro, 2-0 vs oGsInca, 2-0 vs CheckPrime, 2-0 vs MarineKingPrime... CrunCher's disrespect reeks of being a petulant child towards someone who has earned/proved his worth as a player over a long period of time. There's a subtle difference. I'm sorry that IdrA makes you so angry ploy, but some of us don't let our (probably rational) dislikes of people blind us to the flaws of others. I never said IdrA's BM is acceptable in any way, it's also rude and unacceptable but CrunCher really went above and beyond for being a massive douchebag. I don't know about you, but for me there's nothing more satisfying in SC2 than getting bmed for no reason, winning and then rubbing it in. If that's childish then take me to Neverland, Peter Pan. And yeah me Pete are going to bm Captain Hook after we kick his ass and make him rage all night. I don't even dislike Idra that much, but sheesh, some of his fans are just the worst...
After reading Sky Net's awesome post which I spoilered to minimize it (so awesomely long dude), I decided to look up the Tyler thing he was talking about: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=111989¤tpage=All
Here Idra had already beaten Tyler once by 3-1, and then Tyler had come back later in the same tournament (after this interview) to beat Idra 3-2. Notice, though, that Idra was still saying that Tyler is a skilled player, and in this thread ( http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=109625¤tpage=All ) Tyler says that he is Idra's friend. In other words, despite their rivalry there is still respect between them.
Compare that to the walkover comment Idra made about Cruncher. There is a serious lack of respect there. Did Cruncher go over the line? Probably. But it certainly is more understandable when your opponent just gives you no respect. Here is the real issue. In the interview before the TSL game with Tyler, I do not mind Idra as much since, even though he does basically the same thing, it comes off as confidence rather than just BM. In the interview before Cruncher, here are Idra's exact words:
Q: Your first round opponent is a relatively unknown player - Cruncher. What are your thoughts about him?
A: I'm approaching the match as if it were a walkover.
Q: Are you confident you can beat him? Do you expect him to do any risky strategies against you?
A: Yes, he's going to 4 gate all-in both games unless he decides to be clever and make voidrays or DTs.
Not only is this a lack of basic respect, but it also does not represent good game sense. It is overconfident. There is a huge difference between thinking/know you are going to win, and underestimating your opponent. It seems from the interview that he underestimated his opponent. To make this easier, I will give an example of an answer that remains confident and in Idra style, but that seems not as stupid:
Q: What are your thoughts about him?
A: Since I am not too familiar with him it would not be good to underestimate him. That said I will crush him 2-0 no problem.
Do you see the difference? Saying you are going to crush someone is still in Idra's style, but the utter lack of respect of the former and the underestimation in "approaching the match as if it were a walkover" is not only bad form, but just plain stupid in any competition. Anyone who has competed for anything, or even watched a sports movie at all in their lives once will know that underestimating your opponent is the worst thing you can do.
The 4-1 win by Tyler over Idra that Sky Net mentioned by the way, was a special showmatch after Tyler had won TSL 2. Here is the thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=165609¤tpage=All
Comparing it to this thread with Cruncher all I can think of is: The more things change, the more they stay the same.
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On April 01 2011 12:42 xbankx wrote:Show nested quote +On April 01 2011 09:10 MonsieurGrimm wrote:On April 01 2011 08:38 xbankx wrote:On April 01 2011 05:20 MonsieurGrimm wrote:On April 01 2011 04:52 xbankx wrote:On April 01 2011 03:47 MonsieurGrimm wrote:On April 01 2011 03:11 artanis2 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On April 01 2011 00:56 MonsieurGrimm wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2011 11:56 xbankx wrote:On March 31 2011 07:21 MonsieurGrimm wrote:
Meh, say what you want about IdrA, I'm just glad he says what he thinks, there's sure as hell enough fake people everywhere these days. Cruncher should really just get a tougher skin, just because someone said something honest about you doesn't mean beating him = winning every GSL forever or something, calm down about yourself.
Mondragon is a baller. We can say the same about Cruncher. He says what he thinks and he is just being honest. Why should Cruncher get tougher skin when Idra doesn't. Typical Idra fan, somehow justifying Idra's action as honest/speaking his mind and others as BM when they are doing the same thing. Get a hold of reality please. Both are BM if you don't want to get BMed then don't BM in the first place. Cruncher in his interview never said how good he is so Im not sure where you are getting on about how he should calm himself down. All he said is Idra is terrible and you know what? Recent results speak for itself. While other zergs are taking down tournies left and right, Idra is QQing and not doing anything. He has been saying Morrow is terrible and worst zerg in the world for ages. Guess what? Morrow made it past round of 32 and also came in second to Ret at Assembly. Nope, IdrA thinks MorroW is one of the better foreign zergs. And anyways, all IdrA said is that he thought the match would be a walkover - never said a thing about Cruncher himself except that he thought he could beat Cruncher easily. Apparently that's BM, I don't think so - maybe it's a little cocky but Cruncher really shouldn't get offended by that, he was the underdog and he knew it. Then Cruncher wins and is arrogant and immature as shit in his interview, just because he caused an upset? Since you like comparing the "BM" of the two players, here's what went down: IdrA: I think that beating Cruncher will be easy. Later: What Cruncher did in game 1 took no skill. What I did in game 2 did. You're not a very good player. Cruncher: LAWL I love making IdrA "rage". IdrA is overrated and arrogant and nowhere near being a good player. It's so funny when he "rages" that I sacrifice the time I could spend getting better at the game just to piss him off. I have no respect for him. I love pissing IdrA off. IdrA's fans only like him because of the BM, not because of his play. Judge for yourself, I suppose. Here's what actually went down: IdrA directly insulted Cruncher on three separate occasions. Cruncher never insulted IdrA. Inciting rage in an opponent that has emotional problems is not an insult. is not an insult. "I knew he would rage because he lost" is not an insult. IdrA is overrated and arrogant and nowhere near being a good player. Seems just as bad as anything IdrA said. And even if he didn't insult IdrA, he's acting like a child. How can you say calling someone a walkover is not the same as calling them bad? I don't get your logic. Idra to Cruncher: Walkover, can only win by 4 warpgate->bad player=insult Cruncher to Idra: overrated player, terrible player when he isn't practicing as a professional gamer, the worst insult is being called a walkover. I mean if Idra said something like "I think Im better than him, so I can win" Sure that is not insulting their skill level or even if he did it in a mannered way by saying "cruncher's mechanics is not at my level", but calling someone a walkover+win only be cheesing is. The thing is no matter how much of an idra fan boy you are, I assume your reality still stays intact enough to realize what Idra said pregame is BM. Im not saying what Cruncher said postgame isn't BM because obviously it is. But I just feel Idra deserve every bit of it Maybe he said he would be a walkover because Cruncher has no real notable wins in his past and was a relative unknown? I never said calling someone a walkover was not the same as calling them bad, I said they were equivalent - you said that Cruncher never insulted IdrA which is completely false. In any case, Cruncher did win using Void Rays and he did win with a 6gate Allin, what IdrA said was relatively accurate. I don't know why you keep calling me an IdrA fanboy either - it's not like I'm saying LAWL cruncher so bad idra rape him protoss op!!!1, I'm just saying that all the hate IdrA's gettting is uncalled for - all he did was tell the truth. I clearly said what cruncher said is BM. My first post is if you say what Idra said is merely "telling the truth", we can technically say the same about what cruncher said. Maybe you should dig deep in the quotes and find what you bolded. EDIT: Shit that was someone else. In any case, IdrA attacked Cruncher's play while Cruncher attacked IdrA himself. I do see a big difference between the two, but maybe other people don't care. I don't get you. Cruncher did not even insult that much idra directly(unless I assume you count calling someone arrogant is super super BM but compared to what Idra said to him I don' even think it is that bad). He merely said Idra was a bad/overrated player which is no different than calling someone a walkover. Walkover=bad player. As for the make Idra rage part through cheese, that is just standard bad manner on bnet. Cheesing someone does not mean he is attacking idra even if he has the intend to make Idra rage. I get cheesed. I raged but it doesn't mean he is attacking me personally even if it is his intent to get me to rage. The only attack of character is probably when he called Idra arrogant and I don't even think it is that bad considering what Idra said to him during game. Arrogant is not a "OMFG how dare he said that" phrase.
Calling someone a walkover = a comment on their skill
Calling someone arrogant = a comment on their personality
The difference in my mind isn't the severity of the insult but instead what you're insulting.
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