EPTThe effect is nice for him especially after Moon Shard's cost-effectiveness got buffed, but in any game there are already like 7 items Slark wants in only 6 slots.
In-Game Standard Hero Builds Project - Page 245
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
The effect is nice for him especially after Moon Shard's cost-effectiveness got buffed, but in any game there are already like 7 items Slark wants in only 6 slots. | ||
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Buckyman
1364 Posts
On November 02 2015 00:33 BluemoonSC wrote: slark already has 1000 more night vision than most heroes, so i doubt he would want to spend a slot on a moon shard. if anything, with that extra gold you'll be eating it, reserving your slots for stats/survivability-related stuff. I've been doing very well on Slark since then, with a typical buildup of Treads -> Aquila -> Drums -> (2 of Shadow Blade, BKB or Skadi) -> Moon Shard. The Moon Shard's lack of survival help is compensated for by early BKB charges or by a relatively fast Skadi. | ||
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
The item is legitimately fine on the hero since attackspeed is simply very very good on him. It's a different angle after sb (and maybe sny/skadi) for hitting vulnerable heroes. It's not every game but it's very good the games its good. It's not competing with anything for slots because it's your dps item choice after you solve initiation (SB) and potentially hp pool (Sny/Skadi/Both) if you don't need BKB or abyssal to kill things. | ||
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Buckyman
1364 Posts
(E) And get rid of Satanic. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
Though I'd amend your 2nd statement to "it's your dps item choice IF the game does not require MKB". | ||
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
On December 05 2015 05:13 TheYango wrote: I think that's a bigger if than you're respecting but we'll agree that it is situational. Though I'd amend your 2nd statement to "it's your dps item choice IF the game does not require MKB". dont agree, slark rarely needs MKB. Your job is to kill the backline as slark then outnumber and outlast their tankier heroes (the ones who could have evasion). Sure you won't kill a solar crest alch very fast but ur job isn't to hit that alch until his team is dead anyway, at which point he could have 70% evasion and still eventually die. Obviously there ARE mkb games, but thats a much bigger if than the "needing bkb/basher" if | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
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Buckyman
1364 Posts
Reasons to go MKB first: *Windranger (who I need to kill during an ult duration for some other reason) *Snowballing Phantom Assassin (who might 2-shot me unless I can take him down during my ult plus one attack) *Maybe if the enemy team is stacking Solar Crest on top of another evasion source? | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On December 05 2015 05:13 Sn0_Man wrote: Obviously there ARE mkb games, but thats a much bigger if than the "needing bkb/basher" if I don't treat BKB and Basher as "get them if I need them" but rather "don't get them if I don't need them" because I find the games where they're needed come up more often than the ones where they aren't. Games where I feel I need NEITHER BKB nor Basher are very much the exception. | ||
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Buckyman
1364 Posts
On December 05 2015 05:21 TheYango wrote: Even one Solar Crest actually makes MKB and Moon Shard pretty comparable from a damage output perspective. ...and the tie here goes to Moon Shard because I'll sometimes attack players that don't have the Crest buff. | ||
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
i need to look at the sven guide it needs that item too Sven build i've seen recently is treads dom in lane, SnY->Moonshard->crit for dmg, blink/bkb inserted as needed between damage items Skill build a bit flexible but starting q/e 1/2 every game, cleave max first usually (unless mega hard lane) usually with E max next. 2nd point in stun often comes out at level 3 though for laning. Ult whenever possible ofc. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
What you put for cookie-cutter is whatever because it won't express that regardless. I don't see a point in taking Cleave at 2. It doesn't do anything other than fuck up lane equilibrium at rank 1 with no items because it's not strong enough to do meaningful amounts of incidental damage. This changes when you have Treads + higher ranks which is why you can mass-dump 3 points in it at level 5 + Treads, but otherwise it's not really worth skilling at level 2 and 3 over just holding open skill points. | ||
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
also cleave is surprisignly good in lane to harass lol it's range is huge and it's a good percentage even at low levels plus it lets your supports do more pulling although that's very situational it's true. | ||
BluemoonSC
SoCal8933 Posts
On December 05 2015 05:18 Buckyman wrote: Honestly, there are games where I'd get Moon Shard to shred support despite an enemy bfly and go back for MKB later. Evasion can be overcome to some extent by simply attempting more attacks. Reasons to go MKB first: *Windranger (who I need to kill during an ult duration for some other reason) *Snowballing Phantom Assassin (who might 2-shot me unless I can take him down during my ult plus one attack) *Maybe if the enemy team is stacking Solar Crest on top of another evasion source? there is never a reason you should be going mkb first or second item, possibly not even as a third major item because you will likely not be able to survive any engagement to make it worthwhile. you're better off focusing on finding supports on their own and farming or split pushing if they stick to 5 manning. you can't fight into that even if you HAVE a bkb.but all things equal, the majority your dmg vs these heroes comes from pact + pounce dmg, not your right clicks. and any supports with a crest will not have it faster than you can farm more important items before the mkb if you need it. but, sn0_man is pretty on point when he says that the need for an mkb is far less than the need for other items like a bkb or basher. in general, the only time slark should be focussing a core in teamfights (solo is a different story) is after he's slain their supports. you want fights to drag out so you can accumulate essence shifts and at that point when there is no help left, you can focus down the enemy carry with the rest of your team @yango in terms of getting a bkb, i definitely think on slark you can get away with not picking up one more frequently than you think. in fact, i would argue that linkens or manta as a defensive item is probably better right now than bkb because anything that can kill a slark is usually instant (so you wont be able to activate it) and disco pony got nerfed so he is rarely picked. bkb will not help you in the majority of games this patch unless im missing something. TLDR: at any rate, both mkb and bkb are big "if i need them" decisions as a slark player. i would MUCH rather be working on my skadi, basher/abyssal, or bfly (these are listed in no particular order) vs picking up either of these items because they increase my damage throughput AND my ehp (super important). the dps or truestrike doesn't matter until you can live long enough for it to make a difference in a team fight. thats just my 2cents as a recovering slark addict. edit: oh and RE: moonshard - there is almost no reason to, if you have no other survivability needs and you're ahead, to pick up the item for a pure dps increase. its not a priority, but still a good item for a hero that relies on attack speed. if you're 6 slotted you can (still) eat it. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
Minor but not-insignificant benefit is that Dark Pact does no self-damage during active BKB because it's magic damage. | ||
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Logo
United States7542 Posts
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
could be just as fotm as radiance manta but I don't really think so. Solar crest is WAYYYYY too much survivability for it's cost and doubles as a huge damage boost to concoction (crest + acid = -17 armor LMAO). The hero is still probably not that well understood and I wouldn't be in a rush to redo too much on him until post-patch. | ||
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Logo
United States7542 Posts
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tehh4ck3r
Magrathea7086 Posts
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