EPTIn-Game Standard Hero Builds Project - Page 244
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ahswtini
Northern Ireland22213 Posts
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BluemoonSC
SoCal8933 Posts
On December 01 2015 10:09 SpiritoftheTunA wrote: yea i have to admit im quite perplexed that torte is thinking of removing warlock mid before slark mid... slark mid was like a thing when slark felt pub op, nobody knew how to deal with him, and you could even win with him from the solo offlane... the game has developed A LOT since then (including like 2 rounds of slark nerfs), and even the pub meta seems mostly aware of this (i only ever see slark told to go mid or wanting to go mid when they random and there's already a better safelane hero) and the reality is slark mid build is for the most part, the same as slark's lane build, perhaps minus one earlygame item plus one bottle... it's really easy to adapt for mid from the lane guide that's why i'd prefer the verbage go from "mid" and "lane" to "core" and "support" for the most part, your cookie cutter builds will be very similar, and any major differences can be covered in a separate tab for "early game - solo mid" and "early game - safe lane farm" | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
But yes, I've been consistently confused by Torte's unwillingness to use "support" as a designation. I suspect it came out of some desire to make these guides relevant to players at a skill level where support role assignment is not a real thing, but that also goes against his ostensible philosophy of having guides show how the hero is played at top level rather than what works for low level pubs. | ||
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Torte de Lini
Germany38463 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Vr7hc8J.png) 1 million unique for  SpectreIf interested in a timeline of 1 million hits and milestones, you can check it here: http://steamcommunity.com/id/0825771 | ||
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
also it seems a number of pros favor treads over phase now, though i personally still favor phase | ||
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Torte de Lini
Germany38463 Posts
I also expect a ton of new guides to be created and a lot of old ones to be deleted; it's such a huge undertaking that I can't see myself being able to fulfill it at a reasonable pace or with an apt ability to really follow-through on it. So maintaining all those new guides for the remaining long-term future is not something I could probably undertake. This came up a few times already in the past and it was simply because originally this was intended for a specific target, but it expanded and my polices evolved to accommodate; but we were already too invested in this system to follow-through. The current system also cheats in a way that I can designate a singular build and pretend it can be good for both styles of play (Safelane/Offlane) when that isn't necessarily true or fully applicable. Short-version: It'd be too overwhelming to plan, establish and revise for me and I wouldn't have the time. Even when I'm taking a break, I still take an hour of my day to get caught up with stats, feedback post across different sites/platforms and double-check a few things (typos, formatting, builds I fear might be outdated). Let me see if I can find an old post of mine stating the reason. I am still missing builds for offlane heroes like Nature's Prophet, Enchantress and Night Stalker. This project could probably be 175 if I tried. | ||
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BluemoonSC
SoCal8933 Posts
On December 02 2015 08:44 SpiritoftheTunA wrote: quelling blade should be in early game if anywhere also it seems a number of pros favor treads over phase now, though i personally still favor phase i prefer phase too, but sometimes you just need the stats | ||
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Torte de Lini
Germany38463 Posts
Lycan (Jungle) Created New Tab: "Utility Items" Added Smoke of Deceit to "Utility Items" Removed Skull Basher  Shadow Shaman (Lane) Added Glimer Cape to Extension Items Moved Urn of Shadows to Situational Items Moved Blink Dagger to Extension Items Removed Mekansm Removed Black King Bar Removed Shiva's Guard Removed Scythe of Vyse Shadow Shaman (Middle) New Skill Build: Q E Q W Q R Q E E E R W W W R (1. Ether Shock 2. Shackles 3. Hex) Added Magic Wand to Core Items Added Urn of Shadows to Situational Items Added Glimmer Cape to Extension Items Added Force Staff to Extension Items Moved Bottle to Situational Items Removed Black King Bar Removed Mekansm Removed Shiva's Guard Removed Scythe of Vyse Skywrath Mage (Lane) Added Glimmer Cape to Situational Items Added Veil of Discord to Extension Items Moved Urn of Shadows to Core Items Moved Eul's Scepter of Divinity to Extension Items Moved Rod of Atos to Extension Items Removed Tranquil Boots Removed Null Talisman Removed Scythe of Vyse Removed Ethereal Blade Skywrath Mage (Middle) Added Power Treads to Core Items Added Glimmer Cape to Situational Items Added Veil of Discord to Extension Items Moved Urn of Shadows to Core Items Moved Eul's Scepter of Divinity to Extension Items Moved Rod of Atos to Extension Items Removed Arcane Boots Removed Scythe of Vyse Removed Ethereal Blade Double-Check: Lycan (Lane) Lycan (Jungle) -- Itemization may be in an incorrect order; outdated with how he is played now. Improve Extension Item choices. Night Stalker -- I don't understand his item build which is geared towards Urn, Drums, Aghs or Vlad's. Consider Hand of Midas? Earth Spirit (Lane) Earth Spirit (Middle) -- Very likely outdated itemization. Techies -- Double-check  Slark (Middle) -- Add Ring of Aquila? Witch DoctorAdded Arcane Boots to Core Items Removed Power Treads Slark (Middle)Created New Tab: "Luxury Items" Added Ring of Aquila to Core Items Added Monkey King Bar to "Luxury Items" Added Moon Shard to "Luxury Items" Added Linken's Sphere to "Luxury Items" Removed Orchid of Malevolence Removed Satanic Slark (Lane)Created New Tab: "Luxury Items" Added Monkey King Bar to "Luxury Items" Added Moon Shard to "Luxury Items" Added Linken's Sphere to "Luxury Items" Removed Orchid of Malevolence Removed Satanic  Alchemist (Lane)Removed Battlefury Removed Blade Mail Alchemist (Middle)Removed Blade Mail # of Hero Texts Updated: 145 + Show Spoiler + (Lane/Middle)(Lane/Middle)   (Jungle/Lane)   (Lane/Middle) (Jungle/Lane/Middle) (Lane/Middle)         (Jungle/Lane)(Lane/Middle)  (Lane/Middle) (Lane/Middle) (Lane/Middle)    (Lane/Middle)      (Lane/Middle)(Lane/Middle)  (Lane/Middle)  (Jungle/Lane) (Lane/Middle) (Jungle/Lane)  (Jungle/Lane)      (Lane/Middle) (Lane/Middle)  (Lane/Middle)   (Lane/Middle)         (Lane/Middle) (Lane/Middle)(Lane/Middle)  (Lane/Middle) (Lane/Middle)     (Lane/Middle) (Lane/Middle)    (Jungle/Lane)    (Lane/Middle) (Lane/Middle)(Lane/Middle)  LEFT TO DO: n/a All Hero Builds have been completely rewritten! Took from September 28 to November 29 to rewrite over 145 Hero Builds (approx. 29 items and 4 abilities per hero + general hero summary), equaling over 235,000+ words written. [/big] | ||
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Logo
United States7542 Posts
The Rod of Atos also seems like an odd inclusion. | ||
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
mael + aghs is nonbo ideal progression is something like early phase/bottle/stick core aghs blink extension crit mkb bkb situational hex deso | ||
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Logo
United States7542 Posts
I think I remember Torte and/or Yango giving a reasoning like that before. Still maybe it's just too outdated now. I think most people could handle going right for something like aghs + blink. | ||
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
Mael just doesn't synergize wtih anything in an aghs-centric build. | ||
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Torte de Lini
Germany38463 Posts
I was suggested to include Blink to the blink; so we can definitely change it | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
It's not really a nonbo with Agha though. One doesn't make the other worse, and usually the only item you're considering after Mael is Agha anyway. Farming isn't the reason you get Mael, although it helps it a little bit. On December 04 2015 07:42 Sn0_Man wrote: if you go mael its probably worth it to just go blink next since the whole point of mael is to be able to kill them with ult without needing aghs to do it. Well, and to speed ur farm slightly but not that much tbh. Don't really agree. If there exists a hero in the game that you need BOTH Blink and Mael to kill, it's not really worth your investment over just getting Agha and preserving your own tempo. Both items serve the need of killing heroes pre-Agha, it's just Blink lets you threaten heroes that you need mobility more than damage to kill, while Mael serves the opposite case. In either case you leverage your early tempo into getting an Agha. | ||
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Birdie
New Zealand4438 Posts
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Buckyman
1364 Posts
It plays a bit differently in practice, though. The extra mana in the pool lets a good player save their bottle charges, and the bottle charges get used to offset the mana cost of fighting. So it lets the Slark take fights more often, and the extra ~30% physical EHP and ~25% DPS make more fights winnable (assuming level 9 Slark with bottle, str treads and no stored essence). Pre-shadow blade, it's better DPS than a shadow blade would be. Post-shadow blade, it helps the shadow blade play-style function. That just leaves a ~3 minute window where the shadow blade is awkwardly delayed, but Slark can flash-farm during that window and can skirmish just fine without shadow blade as long as a teammate initiates. So that's the argument for Aquila even in a bottle mid build. On a slightly related note, I've modified my Slark(Lane) play to start with Ring of Protection and pick up Stout Shield before boots from the side shop. | ||
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Torte de Lini
Germany38463 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/41SMbLf.png) 1 million unique for Slark (Lane)If interested in a timeline of 1 million hits and milestones, you can check it here: http://steamcommunity.com/id/0825771 | ||
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
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Velzi
Finland659 Posts
On December 05 2015 03:58 Sn0_Man wrote: in 0/100 games will satanic be the item on slark fyi i would say same about orchid nowadays but i might be wrong | ||
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
satanic is just bad. you already have obscene sustain with ult etc and if you absolutely need something more than ult buy a refresher. PS i've seen moonshard slark due to how well attackspeed works plus the night vision works well with his already-boosted night vision to make him a veritable hunter in the night (huehuehue). probably instead of butterfly which just isn't that impressive. | ||
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