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On April 10 2013 08:03 Cyro wrote:
Auto voltage does not know exactly how much you need (undersupply = instability, oversupply = wasteful or dangerous) while you can figure it out quite exactly.
If your CPU is stable at 1.272 load 4.5ghz 4-core under p95 or a certain stress test, but you can't even boot with that on manual voltage, you have a problem or are doing something wrong.
You probably have to raise voltage above what it says in bios and/or use LLC to counteract vdroop, as 1.272v in software under load is by default nowhere near 1.272v in bios.
You are using offset voltage to overclock? or something entirely different?
Ive been using the vcore in bios and left everything on else on auto
Edit: So your saying 1,272 in CPU-Z is actualy waaaay higher? Sounds pretty bad :O
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On April 10 2013 07:26 ghindo wrote:
What are the advantages/disadvantages to using a NIC as opposed to onboard networking? As far as I can tell, a NIC can take some negligible load off of the CPU and maybe shave a few milliseconds off the ping, but that doesn't seem super significant . . .
Most people buy a NIC because they want wireless capacity.
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On April 10 2013 06:00 waffling1 wrote:OK, I found out why my computer wouldn't boot. One of the GPU PCIe cables was not compatible. (WHO KNEW PCI CABLES WERE HAD COMPATIBILITY ISSUES! I would have never expected something like this when all of them are PCIe cables...) So it does boot now, after removing the incompatible "red" cable. I'm only running on one power cable. But it has the same symptoms as having none: the FAN is blasted on max, and the GPU is not detected by GPU-Z or by the windows gadget GPU meter. I downloaded the latest drivers and tools and installed them, but still no detection. I downloaded the first two files, (Catalyst software suite, and latest beta driver) not the 3rd (profiles) http://support.amd.com/us/gpudownload/windows/Pages/radeonaiw_vista64.aspx?type=2.4.1&product=2.4.1.3.42;2.4.1.3.44&lang=us&rev=&ostype=Windows 7 - 64-Bit EditionCould this still be a motherboard issue? I'm going to try updating my BIOS from v 18 to v19beta and see if taht does anything. Today is my last day to return the mobo.
This really shoulda been caught earlier 
You have a 400W unit - most sub500W units don't commonly include a 2nd 6/8pin cable the way most 500W+ units do. You need to use the a dual 4pin molex to single 6-pin PCI-e converter for your 2nd 6pin PCI-e power connector. Do you have one on hand? Most GPUs come with at least one of these in the box these days.
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United Kingdom20275 Posts
Ive been using the vcore in bios and left everything on else on auto
Edit: So your saying 1,272 in CPU-Z is actualy waaaay higher? Sounds pretty bad :O
Im saying to get a load result of 1.27v in software, you probably have to use like 1.3v or a bit above in bios if you don't have LLC etc. The voltage you set in bios does not magically work at 100% accuracy at all times, and in software for auto vcore you see the end result (after vdrop, vdroop and other things), not the same number as you would set in the bios.
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On April 10 2013 09:03 Cyro wrote:Show nested quote + Ive been using the vcore in bios and left everything on else on auto
Edit: So your saying 1,272 in CPU-Z is actualy waaaay higher? Sounds pretty bad :O Im saying to get a load result of 1.27v in software, you probably have to use like 1.3v or a bit above in bios if you don't have LLC etc. The voltage you set in bios does not magically work at 100% accuracy at all times, and in software for auto vcore you see the end result (after vdrop, vdroop and other things), not the same number as you would set in the bios.
Hmmm , but even if its a tad more then whats it showing , isnt that still pretty good for an auto?
Looked around a bit and apparently alot of are running like 1,3+ even some like 1,35+ for getting the same 4,5. Of course iam still worried about undersupplying/oversupplying that you mentioned, so i guess manually is still better or?
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On April 10 2013 06:00 waffling1 wrote:OK, I found out why my computer wouldn't boot. One of the GPU PCIe cables was not compatible. (WHO KNEW PCI CABLES WERE HAD COMPATIBILITY ISSUES! I would have never expected something like this when all of them are PCIe cables...) So it does boot now, after removing the incompatible "red" cable. I'm only running on one power cable. But it has the same symptoms as having none: the FAN is blasted on max, and the GPU is not detected by GPU-Z or by the windows gadget GPU meter. I downloaded the latest drivers and tools and installed them, but still no detection. I downloaded the first two files, (Catalyst software suite, and latest beta driver) not the 3rd (profiles) http://support.amd.com/us/gpudownload/windows/Pages/radeonaiw_vista64.aspx?type=2.4.1&product=2.4.1.3.42;2.4.1.3.44&lang=us&rev=&ostype=Windows 7 - 64-Bit EditionCould this still be a motherboard issue? I'm going to try updating my BIOS from v 18 to v19beta and see if taht does anything. Today is my last day to return the mobo.
You didn't try plugging in a modular cable the wrong way or something did you?
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United Kingdom20275 Posts
But you're reading 1.272 @4.5ghz
In some cases, auto might be almost as good as manual + testing, but in some it uses too much voltage, and in many it uses way too much. You could have one of these CPU's + Show Spoiler +![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/AkRZxkN.png) Yes i know awful cooling at the time
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Is your GPU a blower, or open fan style? (not sure how to describe this) and do you have any way to measure temps in case? Even with small case i would not expect temps that bad, 85c is fine on GPU but if you can be brought to throttling temps in stress test then you probably have fans up a ton when playing any GPU intensive game - I know i do, but my GPU is like 15-25c cooler than yours and my other one was too (mid-sized atx tower case with 120-140mm front intake and back exhaust, top exhaust im not sure of fan size)
Open fan, if my terminology serves me correctly.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814133326
The thing is the temps on this card were supposed to be really good, that's why I bought it
http://benchmarkreviews.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=586&Itemid=72&limitstart=16
With the case off, it's around the same, might lose maximum 5C?
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United Kingdom20275 Posts
With the case off, it's around the same, might lose maximum 5C?
Did you test it?
Temperatures function in delta's (if the inside of your case is 10c hotter than room temp, everything in the case will be, too) but all of your temps and especially the GPU are very high. I mean your load temps are insane, as if the inside of your case is reaching >40c under GPU stress testing. That site reports 68c load inside case with 20c room temp (+48c) so reaching +79c while fans are running faster is a major concern, you are pulling 31 degrees out of nowhere.
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I have two hard drives from XP. For my new computer I'll be running Windows 7. What's the best way to install the hard drives or transfer them to a new hard drive with as few difficulties as possible? I've heard that some issues can come up and from searching around the information about it is a bit muddled.
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As an add-on to my previous question: where is the cheapest place to get Windows 7? I already have a CD for it, but no CD key. On the Microsoft site it's $130, but elsewhere it seems to be ~$100. I tried asking someone on the Microsoft site, but they were of 0 help to me and couldn't speak English too well.
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On April 10 2013 08:56 mav451 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2013 06:00 waffling1 wrote:OK, I found out why my computer wouldn't boot. One of the GPU PCIe cables was not compatible. (WHO KNEW PCI CABLES WERE HAD COMPATIBILITY ISSUES! I would have never expected something like this when all of them are PCIe cables...) So it does boot now, after removing the incompatible "red" cable. I'm only running on one power cable. But it has the same symptoms as having none: the FAN is blasted on max, and the GPU is not detected by GPU-Z or by the windows gadget GPU meter. I downloaded the latest drivers and tools and installed them, but still no detection. I downloaded the first two files, (Catalyst software suite, and latest beta driver) not the 3rd (profiles) http://support.amd.com/us/gpudownload/windows/Pages/radeonaiw_vista64.aspx?type=2.4.1&product=2.4.1.3.42;2.4.1.3.44&lang=us&rev=&ostype=Windows 7 - 64-Bit EditionCould this still be a motherboard issue? I'm going to try updating my BIOS from v 18 to v19beta and see if taht does anything. Today is my last day to return the mobo. This really shoulda been caught earlier You have a 400W unit - most sub500W units don't commonly include a 2nd 6/8pin cable the way most 500W+ units do. You need to use the a dual 4pin molex to single 6-pin PCI-e converter for your 2nd 6pin PCI-e power connector. Do you have one on hand? Most GPUs come with at least one of these in the box these days.
I mentioned and posted pictures about the pins on the cables being different. They were thought to be all ground, but one in fact was a 12V and one a ground.
It's modular and I just need a second cable. a second cable didn't come with the box, but it has the slots for it. 6 slots, 5 harnesses -_-
I can't believe the cables are made differently than from my old PSU. Was there an update in convention? I dont know why they would switch up the pinouts. Using older cables that had different pinouts for 4 pin molex connectors was probably the reason why my fan controller burned out too.
I only have one cable that has 4 pin molex connections, although both are in series. Once I get the Y adapter, can I stick both molex 4 pin connectors into adapter, and connect that 6-pin end to my GPU... or would i need two different cables from the PSU into the Y adapter into the GPU?
Can you just buy a PCIe cable instead?
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^ Yes, you can. I mentioned this earlier... I also said that with the silencer mk3 you'll need a 2nd pci-e cable if your GPU requires 2 pci-e cables.
The silencer mk3 400w is actually the exact same layout as the 500w. literally, the only difference is that the 500w comes with an extra modular pci-e cable thrown in the box. You can ask either OCZ or PCP&P (ocz is the parent company of pc p&p ever since they bought them, pcp&p is basically the 'premium' brand name for ocz now) for an extension.
Just a month or two ago you could order it off their website, but now you have to ask them for it. You can still order it for pcp&p:
http://www.pcpower.com/products/accessories/power_supply/
There's also some other sites that have them, like frozencpu i think ahs them, moddiy. Just make sure the pin outs the same.
You can, as mav suggested, use a 2 molex to pci adaptor. There's tons of adaptors that can do what you are looking for, really. There's a PCI to 2xPci adaptor too.
I don't know what you mean by switching the pin-outs... just that these days most sub-500w PSUs no longer come with a 2nd pci-e cable. It's just a jip, really, it forces a large number of people to buy a 500w+ psu when it's totally unnecessary. It's a win win for PSU companies though - people who need way less in power, buy a much more quality psu so RMAs occur less frequently, and they make more profit because of people buying bigger ticket items. Very few people need more than 350w on their power supplies.
For example, the XFX PRO450w only has a single PCI-E cable, but the (rare) xfx pro 450w V1 has 2.
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The silencer mk3 400w is actually the exact same layout as the 500w. literally, the only difference is that the 500w comes with an extra modular pci-e cable thrown in the box. You can ask either OCZ or PCP&P (ocz is the parent company of pc p&p ever since they bought them, pcp&p is basically the 'premium' brand name for ocz now) for an extension.
extension as in... a free cable?
On April 10 2013 13:43 Belial88 wrote:^ Yes, you can. I mentioned this earlier... I also said that with the silencer mk3 you'll need a 2nd pci-e cable if your GPU requires 2 pci-e cables. ... Just a month or two ago you could order it off their website, but now you have to ask them for it. You can still order it for pcp&p: http://www.pcpower.com/products/accessories/power_supply/There's also some other sites that have them, like frozencpu i think ahs them, moddiy. Just make sure the pin outs the same. You can, as mav suggested, use a 2 molex to pci adaptor. There's tons of adaptors that can do what you are looking for, really. There's a PCI to 2xPci adaptor too. I don't know what you mean by switching the pin-outs... just that these days most sub-500w PSUs no longer come with a 2nd pci-e cable. It's just a jip, really, it forces a large number of people to buy a 500w+ psu when it's totally unnecessary. It's a win win for PSU companies though - people who need way less in power, buy a much more quality psu so RMAs occur less frequently, and they make more profit because of people buying bigger ticket items. Very few people need more than 350w on their power supplies. For example, the XFX PRO450w only has a single PCI-E cable, but the (rare) xfx pro 450w V1 has 2.
I understand, Belial, I remember it all. I went to that website but 10 bucks plus shipping and tax is a lot.
I understand you take 2 molex into the adapter. My question was which way can you do the 2 molex connection:
situation A:
1 cable with two molex connectors on the SAME cable in series. both plug into the adapter.
situation B:
2 cables with one molex connectors each. Each plug into the adapter.
Situation A has one cable.
Situation B has two lines in parallel (two connectors in the PSU)
Are situations A and B both valid?
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It makes no practical difference. (in general, very rarely a practical difference)
You just want some +12 V and GND lines wired to the card.
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It was by memory, but I tested again just to make sure.
Msi kombustor again, (furry and tessy)
open case side: 61C idle given 10m cooldown from case closed (dropped from 67c)
within less than a minute temps hit 95C again, and I closed the program
Also turning off the dual monitor reduces gpu temp by a lot. On one monitor (1080p, 23" but not relevant), I have 37C and still dropping down from 65. 37 is a very reasonable temperature. 65 is not. The second monitor isn't even HD, 768 width at 16"(irrelevant). All temps with case still open.
I should fiddle with the performance tiers, or something of the sort(?).
EDIT: I ran kombustor with case open, one monitor. I ran furry tessy 1080p preset, and it ended at temp=95C. Still unacceptably high under load, I guess.
EDIT2: Could the idle temp problem lie in the performance profiles?
+ Show Spoiler +
Level 1 - "Default"
GPU Clock 50 MHz
Memory Clock 135 MHz
Shader Clock 101 MHz
Level 2 - "2D Desktop"
GPU Clock 405 MHz
Memory Clock 324 MHz
Shader Clock 810 MHz
Level 3 - "3D Applications"
GPU Clock 405 MHz
Memory Clock 1850 MHz
Shader Clock 810 MHz
Level 4 - "3D Applications"
GPU Clock 765 MHz
Memory Clock 1850 MHz
Shader Clock 1530 MHz
2D desktop is same clock as 3d applications, don't really know the implications of that.
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Hey can anyone tell me if AMD A6-4400M or (edit)A10-4600M, 4 gbram and ATI Radeon HD 7670M (2GB) will be sufficient for dota2 and sc2 on low graphics?
I hope I'm in the right thread for this.
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On April 10 2013 22:00 Kirb wrote:
Hey can anyone tell me if AMD A6-4400M or (edit)A10-4600M, 4 gbram and ATI Radeon HD 7670M (2GB) will be sufficient for dota2 and sc2 on low graphics?
I hope I'm in the right thread for this.
The amd mobile chips have horrible cpu performance, the only reason you would generally use one is if you don't want to pay the extra for a graphics card and you're playing basic games. SC2 will play like shit, dota 2 should be ok. An ivy i3/i5 would be a large improvement.
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The A6: probably not, it's only a single full core. The A10 has two full cores. Sadly, there seems to be a part of SC2 that mostly runs on one core and is limited on every CPU that exists when you get to 200vs200 supply battles. There's nothing you can do to try to work around that. Regarding what SC2 needs from the graphics card, you can work around that by setting it to low and it'll be fine, but there's nothing you can do about the FPS collapsing at late game because of the CPU. The AMD notebook you're looking at could be better for anything else compared to an Intel notebook, but it won't help for SC2.
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Thanks!
So I guess paying a few bucks more for smth like this:
Intel® Core™ i5-3230M 2,6ghz, NVIDIA GeForce 710M 2048MB, 4gb ram would be worth it.
Man laptop hardware is so confusing to me. :D
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EPT
