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Simple Questions Simple Answers - Page 261

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Rachnar
Profile Joined October 2010
France1526 Posts
January 08 2013 22:31 GMT
#5201
What kind of freeze. Peripherals, image, everything? How long?
"What if it's a triple DK ?" "Then we cry" "Prepare your handkerchief then ..."
Wala.Revolution
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
7584 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-09 00:14:23
January 08 2013 22:44 GMT
#5202
Screen, typically 2-4 seconds.

Actually, audio too, but my mouse pointer still moves.
Stuck.
Serpico
Profile Joined May 2010
4285 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-09 00:13:42
January 08 2013 23:38 GMT
#5203
Q: Is it possible for the pcie slot to be damaged if you're getting constant "display driver stopped responding and has recovered" messages.


My new build just finished and everything seems fine except for some reason after a couple minutes of starting my pc it gives me that, and constantly freezes. It freezes for 5-6 seconds, unfreezes for MAYBE 1-2 seconds and repeats constantly. I tried 2 different cards (my new 660 and my old 260 core 216 with newest drivers for each) and both gave the exact same problem. Oddly enough my flash stops working after it happens, I just get a black screen where the video should be playing. Before I get the freezing/driver stopped message everything is perfect with flash.

Another interesting note is that I can play games flawlessly for the time my PC doesn't act up, no artificating or odd graphical glitches, temps are great. It's just that everything starts freezing and unfreezing after a while. I also noticed in the system overview in my UEFI my GPU is the only component that is not specifically identified by the UEFI. My cpu/ram is mentioned by manufacturer and specs, but the GPU is just some generic "nvidia gpu controller" or something odd. It does get recognized in windows though after installing drivers (though name doesnt change in the UEFI).

Again temps are fine with my cpu/gpu. My old GPU worked perfectly fine in my old mobo, which is why I'm really worried I might have to RMA the entire mobo....which means a complete redo of the build .
Craton
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States17281 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-09 00:44:28
January 09 2013 00:24 GMT
#5204
It's not necessarily a problem with the pci-e slot itself, but it probably is your motherboard.
twitch.tv/cratonz
Emnjay808
Profile Blog Joined September 2011
United States10665 Posts
January 09 2013 00:37 GMT
#5205
How do I use the windows 7 reinstall disk on my computer when windows doesnt even start in the first place? Repair option doesnt work btw, it always freezes at a low res windows screen whenever I try that.
Skol
wcLLg
Profile Joined December 2011
United States281 Posts
January 09 2013 09:24 GMT
#5206
Is it possible to watch GSL on the GOMPLAYER like old? I have to use an older version of flash because the newer versions (11.3 and 11.5) cause instability and I don't want to update flash just to downgrade it shortly after. Thanks.
11110000011111000
Solaris999
Profile Joined January 2013
United Kingdom194 Posts
January 09 2013 17:53 GMT
#5207
You should have a startup option to boot straight into the dvd, is that working?
Blisse
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Canada3710 Posts
January 10 2013 02:48 GMT
#5208
Maybe not such a simple question, but listening to one of Anandtech's podcasts ( I think 12 ), and they raised the point, why aren't there plug and play CPU cards like the GPU does via PCI? Maybe not necessarily plug and play, but just plug-in CPUs?
There is no one like you in the universe.
Myrmidon
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
United States9452 Posts
January 10 2013 03:37 GMT
#5209
On January 10 2013 11:48 Blisse wrote:
Maybe not such a simple question, but listening to one of Anandtech's podcasts ( I think 12 ), and they raised the point, why aren't there plug and play CPU cards like the GPU does via PCI? Maybe not necessarily plug and play, but just plug-in CPUs?

You might have to give more context, or I might have to listen to their podcast. How about the first?

If you're talking about plugging in the main (only) CPU like that, where would you plug it in? Routing all the data and power lines to the CPU on the motherboard is not a trivial task. You probably can't have the CPU too far away from other components without some complications like more effort / higher costs / maybe it being impossible. I mean, these days the CPU is connected directly to the RAM, the southbridge, even the graphics card. It seems not worth the effort, because you can just swap CPUs rather than cards with CPUs on them.

If you're talking about adding more general-purpose compute power by plugging in a card that contains more CPU cores, Intel's been working on it for a while in their labs. It was called Larrabee, but that was called off. Seems like Knights Ferry / Knights Corner are going to be a reality though, with the latter actually shipping as a product. Anyway, you've got the same challenges as above, plus however you're going to actually make use of these extra cores. Current operating systems aren't built around having resources structured this way. How do you get programs to make use of the cores? You need special programming and/or a lot of behind-the-scenes dirty work to manage all the loading of instructions and data, sending it to the right place, keeping all the data up to date and locking / simultaneous access of data / other concurrency issues. What about cache and RAM for the coprocessor cores on the card?

Again, like for GPGPU, challenges are in getting the execution resources to actually crunch through some useful instructions. Sometimes all the overheads make it not worth the trouble.

Anyway, people have talked about heterogeneous computing for a long time. Actually, there are some dual Windows / Android products that can switch modes, but that's just a x86 processor running Windows tag-teaming with an ARM processor that runs Android. Nvidia Tegra 3 and 4 have a quad-core architecture with a fifth companion low-power core, but I think that requires some support in the OS. Doesn't work on Windows RT now, AFAIK.

I don't know much about computer architecture though, just some ideas.
Xanbatou
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
United States805 Posts
January 10 2013 04:23 GMT
#5210
Is there some software out there that only records the last X minutes of gameplay and then continuously overwrites it while also allowing the user to save the last X minutes of gameplay at any time?
Cyro
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom20326 Posts
January 10 2013 04:51 GMT
#5211
On January 10 2013 13:23 Xanbatou wrote:
Is there some software out there that only records the last X minutes of gameplay and then continuously overwrites it while also allowing the user to save the last X minutes of gameplay at any time?


FRAPS has this feature.
"oh my god my overclock... I got a single WHEA error on the 23rd hour, 9 minutes" -Belial88
Blisse
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Canada3710 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-10 05:36:37
January 10 2013 05:36 GMT
#5212
On January 10 2013 12:37 Myrmidon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 10 2013 11:48 Blisse wrote:
Maybe not such a simple question, but listening to one of Anandtech's podcasts ( I think 12 ), and they raised the point, why aren't there plug and play CPU cards like the GPU does via PCI? Maybe not necessarily plug and play, but just plug-in CPUs?

You might have to give more context, or I might have to listen to their podcast. How about the first?

If you're talking about plugging in the main (only) CPU like that, where would you plug it in? Routing all the data and power lines to the CPU on the motherboard is not a trivial task. You probably can't have the CPU too far away from other components without some complications like more effort / higher costs / maybe it being impossible. I mean, these days the CPU is connected directly to the RAM, the southbridge, even the graphics card. It seems not worth the effort, because you can just swap CPUs rather than cards with CPUs on them.

If you're talking about adding more general-purpose compute power by plugging in a card that contains more CPU cores, Intel's been working on it for a while in their labs. It was called Larrabee, but that was called off. Seems like Knights Ferry / Knights Corner are going to be a reality though, with the latter actually shipping as a product. Anyway, you've got the same challenges as above, plus however you're going to actually make use of these extra cores. Current operating systems aren't built around having resources structured this way. How do you get programs to make use of the cores? You need special programming and/or a lot of behind-the-scenes dirty work to manage all the loading of instructions and data, sending it to the right place, keeping all the data up to date and locking / simultaneous access of data / other concurrency issues. What about cache and RAM for the coprocessor cores on the card?

Again, like for GPGPU, challenges are in getting the execution resources to actually crunch through some useful instructions. Sometimes all the overheads make it not worth the trouble.

Anyway, people have talked about heterogeneous computing for a long time. Actually, there are some dual Windows / Android products that can switch modes, but that's just a x86 processor running Windows tag-teaming with an ARM processor that runs Android. Nvidia Tegra 3 and 4 have a quad-core architecture with a fifth companion low-power core, but I think that requires some support in the OS. Doesn't work on Windows RT now, AFAIK.

I don't know much about computer architecture though, just some ideas.


Haha, yup, context would've helped but my brain was slightly fried at the time.

I believe they were talking about how might soldering chips on to the motherboard which I think was rumoured to happen on Haswell would be beneficial, but it jumped to how GPUs are basically huge CPUs, so when we hit ~10nm chips, they're going to have so many transistors that it'll essentially be functioning like a GPU does right now, so wouldn't the logical step in the future be that CPUs become plug-in like GPUs are right now? I think they were talking about this technology in like, 2020.

Thanks Myrm. You basically confirmed what I thought was wrong, at least with the current technology, by making CPUs like GPUs, though I missed RAM, even though I can sort of think of ways to bypass that. But I was really looking for a more in-depth response into that area, which you provided, though I'd love to hear more if anyone's interested. Thanks! What do/did you major in, Myrm? XD
There is no one like you in the universe.
Rollin
Profile Joined March 2011
Australia1552 Posts
January 10 2013 05:46 GMT
#5213
On January 10 2013 14:36 Blisse wrote:What do/did you major in, Myrm? XD

He's an electrical engineer afaik. Crossing fingers I remembered correctly :D
Throw off those chains of reason, and your prison disappears. | Check your posting frequency timeline: http://www.teamliquid.net/mytlnet/post_activity_img.php
Myrmidon
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
United States9452 Posts
January 10 2013 07:03 GMT
#5214
This is taking a lot of space, so spoilering. Sometimes simple questions and simple answers need to go the distance.

+ Show Spoiler [response] +
You can always put RAM on the CPU add-in card, as you do a graphics card. That's what they're doing.


At a high level, you can think of processors and computing this way:
  • The more generalized the hardware and the more different kinds of instructions it can do, the more expensive / complicated / large die area / flexible / less efficient (power) / easy to program (more efficient for the programmer in terms of man-hours, feasibility) it is.
  • The more specialized the hardware and more fixed-function it is, the less expensive / less complicated / less die area / less flexible / more efficient / harder to program (particularly, more complicated tasks) it is.

CPUs are the most generalized, with GPUs more specialized than that. Because the GPU "cores" are simpler from not having to handle as many possible instructions and so on, they take less space per unit and you can stick more of them in a chip (of equal size) as CPU cores. Modern GPUs have hundreds or thousands of execution units inside, while some behemoth server CPUs have up to 16 (or so?) CPU cores in a chip.

The problem is that less types of computing jobs are suitable for running efficiently on GPUs than on the more general-purpose CPUs. All kinds of graphics calculations and some kinds of large scientific matrix calculations, etc. naturally work well on GPUs, particularly because they can work on data in parallel where the outcome of one operation is not needed by another piece.

There are a lot of fixed-function DSPs, FPGAs, etc. for very specialized tasks that pretty much just do one thing, so even further away from the general-purpose CPU. Sometimes people think about this difference as a software vs. hardware thing. Software = flexible, slower. i.e. runs on those general-purpose CPUs. Hardware = less flexible, faster.

I think some of the discussion could have been about the integrated GPUs that are found in most CPUs these days. The idea is that one day, all sorts of tasks can be offloaded to integrated GPU cores, much more so than they are today. And in a very seemless fashion, passing data back and forth between the integrated GPU portions and the CPU portions. And eventually, with everything right next to each other, sharing data easily (recall that passing data between CPU and a graphics card takes a relatively large amount of time in terms of CPU cycles, so co-location is of interest). That's particularly where AMD wants to go, because their x86 CPU cores are worse than Intel's, but their GPU cores are better than Intel's and certainly more established, at least for now.

As processes shrink, you can get more transistors per area (more or less, per money), so if you can find a way to make use of those extra transistors, you can get more performance.

+ Show Spoiler [oh yeah] +
Yes, I'm an EE grad student. I took a minimum number of courses in electronics and computer architecture, so pretty much anybody else who has studied any of these things knows more than me, yet alone anybody who works on anything related in industry or academia, even in other fields (computing, obviously, but more).
Medrea
Profile Joined May 2011
10003 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-11 00:53:22
January 11 2013 00:50 GMT
#5215
I think there are a handful of us that are involved with IEEE in some way.

SkyR is as well if I am not mistaken. Or he is going to be, either way, same train of thought.

Also FPGA's are not strictly fixed logic. They are programmable hardware. Thats not to say they are hardware that runs software. From a consumer PoV they are fixed though.
twitch.tv/medrea
Myrmidon
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
United States9452 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-11 01:06:02
January 11 2013 01:03 GMT
#5216
Yes, programmable. In fact, field-programmable.

Effectively fixed-function for the end user is what I was getting at (or at least much more so than GPUs), yeah, but that was mostly just me being sloppy with the language. These days all sorts of hardware are getting more flexible, traditional fixed-function parts being replaced with some combination of software or more-configurable hardware.
Medrea
Profile Joined May 2011
10003 Posts
January 11 2013 01:28 GMT
#5217
Ive always wondered how field programmable FPGA's actually are.

Im pretty sure you need some serious hardware.
twitch.tv/medrea
Craton
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States17281 Posts
January 11 2013 03:00 GMT
#5218
Where can I read more on the next line of CPUs/Video Cards that will be coming out?
twitch.tv/cratonz
Belial88
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5217 Posts
January 11 2013 03:02 GMT
#5219
Simple Question:

I have an 80gb x25-m ssd, standard 2.5 sata2, used on an am3 system (biostar a770e3) with w7 ultimate 64bit ahci.

Ive already sold off the computer, but didnt get to wipe the ssd or format it. Now im building a new computer, an intel build. What happens if i plug in the ssd to an lga1155 system (probably gonna go with a z77 ud3h)? I dont think it'd work, but is there a way to wipe it? Id install w7 from a usb, is there any sort of way to use the usb as a bootable media to wipe the ssd?

Or do i need to ask someone with a computer to let me use it to format my ssd? I got a laptop here, im sure i could open it up and stick a sata connector in to the ssd and wipe it but it'd probably be a pain in the ass.

thanks.
How to build a $500 i7-3770K Ultimate Computer:http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=392709 ******** 100% Safe Razorless Delid Method! http://www.overclock.net/t/1376206/how-to-delid-your-ivy-bridge-cpu-with-out-a-razor-blade/0_100
skyR
Profile Joined July 2009
Canada13817 Posts
January 11 2013 03:05 GMT
#5220
You can format during windows installation...
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