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Maru wins Code S Season 1, achieves "6SL" - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 General
50 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 Next All
CaRn1FeX
Profile Joined January 2003
Germany203 Posts
May 22 2023 20:06 GMT
#21
I'm inrterested in seeing if this continues to be that heavily Terran favored or if the other races will catch up eventually. Currently the patch feels very terran favoured... Stormgate, please hurry
tommey.liang
Profile Joined November 2020
United States362 Posts
May 22 2023 20:13 GMT
#22
Congrats to Maru on achieving a historic, probably, unparalled, 6SL. For some reason I couldn't watch any of the GSL matches from this season and only checked the results on the Liquipedia pages. Just feel like it's not the same anymore with so many players having gone to military, retired and/or past their prime.
FF, KH, Persona, Uncharted, Yakuza | Porter, Illenium, MitiS, Dabin, Seven Lions, Petit Biscuit | Diablo II, SC2 | Pho, sushi, tacos
Pandain
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States12989 Posts
May 22 2023 21:26 GMT
#23
Pretty sure there's a seventh in the works as well if not eight
Glorfindelio
Profile Joined October 2022
204 Posts
May 22 2023 21:55 GMT
#24
You love to see it. Can't say it was my favorite GSL semi-round ever, haha. But these types of victories are always well-deserved. Grats to the man!
Fanatic-Templar
Profile Joined February 2010
Canada5819 Posts
May 22 2023 22:53 GMT
#25
An all-Terran bracket won by the winningest GSL player of all time. Man, I remember writing this back before Maru won his fifth GSL:

On July 29 2022 11:36 Fanatic-Templar wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 29 2022 05:08 veniss wrote:
On one hand: As P&W wrote, I would like to see the G5L awarded in my lifetime.


Seems inevitable as long as the tournament keeps going. It's not like these players are getting replaced by newer talent.

Honestly, I said this when Maru won his 4th GSL too, but he's past the point where the number getting bigger means anything to me. He's already achieved maximum impressiveness for me.


And it just keeps getting more true with time.

I can't blame Maru, he's actually a fun player to watch and winning is literally his job, it's just a sign of the times I guess.

Add that to the GomTvT bracket and the offline group stage, and this has been my least favourite GSL in a long, long time.
I bear this sig to commemorate the loss of the team icon that commemorated Oversky's 2008-2009 Proleague Round 1 performance.
Agh
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States948 Posts
May 23 2023 07:09 GMT
#26
Least we don't have to wait too long for esl summer. Not the biggest fan of their bracket/grouping practices but hopefully nobody gets robbed of being able to make a run.
I may appear to be an emotionless sarcastic pos, but just like an onion when you pull off more and more layers you find the exact same thing everytime and you start crying
Slydie
Profile Joined August 2013
1914 Posts
May 23 2023 18:11 GMT
#27
On May 23 2023 05:06 CaRn1FeX wrote:
I'm inrterested in seeing if this continues to be that heavily Terran favored or if the other races will catch up eventually. Currently the patch feels very terran favoured... Stormgate, please hurry


Is it really unit balance, though? 4 Terrans in top4 can also happen because:
-The maps are T favoured.
-The other races lack talent in Korea atm.

When Z has dominated in the past, the maps have always been at least as important as the patch.
Buff the siegetank
Athenau
Profile Joined March 2015
569 Posts
May 23 2023 20:28 GMT
#28
The EU and AM regionals both had PvZ finals, so GSL looks like an outlier so far.
CaRn1FeX
Profile Joined January 2003
Germany203 Posts
May 23 2023 21:02 GMT
#29
On May 24 2023 05:28 Athenau wrote:
The EU and AM regionals both had PvZ finals, so GSL looks like an outlier so far.


Its just regionals for less strong regions than KR
dysenterymd
Profile Joined January 2019
1223 Posts
May 23 2023 21:19 GMT
#30
On May 24 2023 03:11 Slydie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 23 2023 05:06 CaRn1FeX wrote:
I'm inrterested in seeing if this continues to be that heavily Terran favored or if the other races will catch up eventually. Currently the patch feels very terran favoured... Stormgate, please hurry


Is it really unit balance, though? 4 Terrans in top4 can also happen because:
-The maps are T favoured.
-The other races lack talent in Korea atm.

When Z has dominated in the past, the maps have always been at least as important as the patch.

I think Protoss is definitely suffering vs Terran, but balance seems mostly fine otherwise.

4T semifinals is still an outlier though, and it took herO and Dark both underperforming.
Serral | Inno | sOs | soO | Has | Classic
angry_maia
Profile Joined August 2020
314 Posts
May 24 2023 16:27 GMT
#31
On May 24 2023 06:19 dysenterymd wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 24 2023 03:11 Slydie wrote:
On May 23 2023 05:06 CaRn1FeX wrote:
I'm inrterested in seeing if this continues to be that heavily Terran favored or if the other races will catch up eventually. Currently the patch feels very terran favoured... Stormgate, please hurry


Is it really unit balance, though? 4 Terrans in top4 can also happen because:
-The maps are T favoured.
-The other races lack talent in Korea atm.

When Z has dominated in the past, the maps have always been at least as important as the patch.

I think Protoss is definitely suffering vs Terran, but balance seems mostly fine otherwise.

4T semifinals is still an outlier though, and it took herO and Dark both underperforming.


Is it really a case of Protoss suffering balance wise? A plausible alternative is just the current set of active players. Looking at aligulac, the third best protoss is Classic who ranks at #11. Imo, regardless of the patch, I would not favor current classic against any players in the top 10 with many of them absolutely dominating him.

Overall, it just feels like, Maru, Byun, Clem, Cure, Bunny, Oliveira is just skill for skill a much stronger line up than Hero, Maxpax, Classic, Showtime, Stats, Creator, and I don't think there was any recent patch in which the former would not dominate the latter.

I think the best hope is to wait for (hopefuly) Stats + Classic to get back to their best selves (plausibly never happens) and for Maxpax to play in offline tournaments (also might never happen).

Overall, the set of active pro players is just too small to make any kinds of conclusive remarks about balance solely based on results.
tigera6
Profile Joined March 2021
3395 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-24 16:45:08
May 24 2023 16:44 GMT
#32
Classic has been very good lately, I would put him on top 10 depending on the form. He has been even more consistent than herO in PvT as well. But I do agree with your overall point that we dont have enough top level Protoss that are on equal footing with those top Terran. After herO, MaxPAx and Classic, there is a noticable gap to the next best PvT whether its Showtime, Astrea or Creator, or even Nightmare.

Having said that, I dont have an issue if they remove the nerf on Battery Overcharge and Disruptor shot. I think those 2 make it way too hard for Protoss to defend against the Terran 2 base push or post-Colossi tech. And I personally believe the reason for those 2 nerfs was because of PvZ, not PvT.
Charoisaur
Profile Joined August 2014
Germany15943 Posts
May 24 2023 18:50 GMT
#33
Classic is a multiple Starleague champ and he had now plenty of time to get back in shape. I can't hear this x players just happen to be better talk anymore, the perception of how good a player is is based on results and balance influences which players get good results.

Right now this should be more obvious than ever with a simple balance patch changing the situation from "Zerg players are just better than everyone" to "Terran players are just better than everyone"
Many of the coolest moments in sc2 happen due to worker harassment
Fanatic-Templar
Profile Joined February 2010
Canada5819 Posts
May 25 2023 00:12 GMT
#34
On May 25 2023 01:27 angry_maia wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 24 2023 06:19 dysenterymd wrote:
On May 24 2023 03:11 Slydie wrote:
On May 23 2023 05:06 CaRn1FeX wrote:
I'm inrterested in seeing if this continues to be that heavily Terran favored or if the other races will catch up eventually. Currently the patch feels very terran favoured... Stormgate, please hurry


Is it really unit balance, though? 4 Terrans in top4 can also happen because:
-The maps are T favoured.
-The other races lack talent in Korea atm.

When Z has dominated in the past, the maps have always been at least as important as the patch.

I think Protoss is definitely suffering vs Terran, but balance seems mostly fine otherwise.

4T semifinals is still an outlier though, and it took herO and Dark both underperforming.


Is it really a case of Protoss suffering balance wise? A plausible alternative is just the current set of active players.


Can you define "current" as a percentage of the full lifespan of Legacy of the Void?
I bear this sig to commemorate the loss of the team icon that commemorated Oversky's 2008-2009 Proleague Round 1 performance.
Agh
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States948 Posts
May 27 2023 06:10 GMT
#35
On May 25 2023 03:50 Charoisaur wrote:
Classic is a multiple Starleague champ and he had now plenty of time to get back in shape. I can't hear this x players just happen to be better talk anymore, the perception of how good a player is is based on results and balance influences which players get good results.

Right now this should be more obvious than ever with a simple balance patch changing the situation from "Zerg players are just better than everyone" to "Terran players are just better than everyone"



it's definitely patch related, but doesn't completely omit cases where people are playing better (and in other cases barely playing at all [>insert group D here<]).

After watching the Maru vs Cure group series you already knew that was going to be the finals, even without seeing the rest of the matches or even the other group playing a single game.

Game state also affects players motivation to prepare and mentality overall. I don't think one tournament calls for a kneejerk response but if it becomes a trend something needs to be done to prevent the cascade effect.
I may appear to be an emotionless sarcastic pos, but just like an onion when you pull off more and more layers you find the exact same thing everytime and you start crying
Turbovolver
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Australia2394 Posts
May 27 2023 08:51 GMT
#36
On May 25 2023 03:50 Charoisaur wrote:
Right now this should be more obvious than ever with a simple balance patch changing the situation from "Zerg players are just better than everyone" to "Terran players are just better than everyone"

Remember when people thought Terran was screwed by this patch? I am still laughing about that.
The original Bogus fan.
AcrossFromTime
Profile Joined May 2020
29 Posts
May 27 2023 15:32 GMT
#37
Since other people have made some balance comments, I hope it's okay if I contribute one thought.

I don't think it's right to suggest that the game should be balanced around a hypothetical better player for a particular race. I think it has to be balanced around the current actually existing players. Whoever the best current player is for each race, they should each have an equal chance of winning a tournament, balance-wise. I think that if a game is going to be fun to watch, it has to be that way. But that's just my opinion.
JimmyJRaynor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada16699 Posts
May 28 2023 04:22 GMT
#38
"meet the new boss. same as the old boss..."
On May 23 2023 04:17 Slydie wrote:
I just finished watching the semis and the final, great games! I find it fantastic that a mirror matchup can have that much variety! Some more mech and maybe an attempt at pure bio could have been fun, but the sky terran games made up for it!

i agree and to add to your comment.
imo, Blizzard did a great job with all 3 mirrors.
David Kim and Dustin Browder and genius level game designers.
Ray Kassar To David Crane : "you're no more important to Atari than the factory workers assembling the cartridges"
nojok
Profile Joined May 2011
France15845 Posts
May 28 2023 05:26 GMT
#39
It can't be helped, protoss is picked by lesser gamers.
"Back then teams that won were credited, now it's called throw. I think it's sad." - Kuroky - Flap Flap Wings!
CicadaSC
Profile Joined January 2018
United States1687 Posts
May 28 2023 06:41 GMT
#40
On May 23 2023 05:06 CaRn1FeX wrote:
I'm inrterested in seeing if this continues to be that heavily Terran favored or if the other races will catch up eventually. Currently the patch feels very terran favoured... Stormgate, please hurry

sc2 is EXTREMELY terran favored, and protoss as well but not at the top level. zerg is weakest in gm and all levels below. only serral is exception to the rule atm. not even reynor winning or dark
Remember that we all come from a place of passion!!
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