• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 08:45
CEST 14:45
KST 21:45
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins EWC 202521Tournament Spotlight: FEL Cracow 20259Power Rank - Esports World Cup 202580RSL Season 1 - Final Week9[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall15
Community News
[BSL 2025] H2 - Team Wars, Weeklies & SB Ladder2EWC 2025 - Replay Pack2Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced35BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams10Weekly Cups (July 14-20): Final Check-up0
StarCraft 2
General
#1: Maru - Greatest Players of All Time Serral wins EWC 2025 Greatest Players of All Time: 2025 Update Power Rank - Esports World Cup 2025 EWC 2025 - Replay Pack
Tourneys
Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) TaeJa vs Creator Bo7 SC Evo Showmatch Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $10,000 live event Esports World Cup 2025
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 484 Magnetic Pull Mutation #239 Bad Weather Mutation # 483 Kill Bot Wars Mutation # 482 Wheel of Misfortune
Brood War
General
Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced Help: rep cant save Shield Battery Server New Patch [G] Progamer Settings StarCraft & BroodWar Campaign Speedrun Quest
Tourneys
[BSL] Non-Korean Championship - Final weekend [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China CSL Xiamen International Invitational
Strategy
Does 1 second matter in StarCraft? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Muta micro map competition [G] Mineral Boosting
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Total Annihilation Server - TAForever [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok) Path of Exile
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread UK Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Stop Killing Games - European Citizens Initiative
Fan Clubs
INnoVation Fan Club SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Korean Music Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Gtx660 graphics card replacement Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TeamLiquid Team Shirt On Sale The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Ping To Win? Pings And Their…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Socialism Anyone?
GreenHorizons
Eight Anniversary as a TL…
Mizenhauer
Flash @ Namkraft Laddernet …
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 671 users

Maru wins Code S Season 1, achieves "6SL"

Forum Index > SC2 General
50 CommentsPost a Reply
Normal

Maru wins Code S Season 1, achieves "6SL"

Text byTL.net ESPORTS
May 22nd, 2023 05:48 GMT

Maru Wins 2023 Code S Season 1

Maru extends his historic record with a sixth Code S title

by Wax

The greatest GSL player of all time has added another championship to his untouchable legacy.

Maru, already the only player to have won five Code S championships, clinched a record-breaking sixth title with his 4-2 victory over Cure in the Code S Season 1 finals.

[image loading]

2023 GSL Code S Season 1

Considered a virtually invincible Terran vs. Terran player through most of the 2020's, Maru had looked unusually vulnerable since late 2022, suffering an unexpected string of losses. One of those losses had come at the hands of Cure himself, who had triumphed during their RO8 group stage match.

However, the Maru that showed up to AfreecaTV's Jamsil studio for the final day of GSL Code S was right back in untouchable form. After a 3-1 victory over Bunny in the semifinals, Maru advanced on to rematch Cure in the grand finals. Cure had just barely survived his semifinal clash with ByuN, winning 3-2 after ByuN's chronic wrist issues flared up in game five.

Maru put on a TvT masterclass in the grand finals, demonstrating championship-quality play in every phase of the game. To Cure's credit, he showed he was Maru's near-equal in mid-game Marine-Tank combat, which was how he took game one in the series. However, Cure was outclassed by Maru in the late-game, with Maru winning the last two games of the series through his mastery of endgame armies. After using Battlecruisers to finish off Cure in game five, Maru closed out the series with a stunning comeback victory in game six where he defeated Cure's own Battlecruisers with mass Marine-Raven.

With the victory, Maru washed off a second place jinx that had been weighing on his mind since he had gone one for five in his last five major tournament finals (any other player would consider this a fantastic 'problem' to have). Buoyed by his victory, the often understated Terran announced atypically ambitious goals for the rest of the year, saying "Recently, I was losing every time I reached the finals, so I wasn't very confident. But since I've proven myself with this result, I'll try to win number seven and eight." Then again, is it really that ambitious? After all, when the only "6SL" champion in history is involved, otherwise impossible goals may be quite reasonable.

AfreecaTV CEO Jung Chan Yong was present in the studio to pin a sixth GSL badge to Maru's jersey, but he had a gift for all GSL fans as well. Mr. Jung announced that the following season of GSL would be returning to full offline/live play from the FreecUP studio, a much welcome return to normalcy after the mostly-online Season 1.

Match Recaps

Semifinal #1: Cure 3 - 2 ByuN (VOD)

Game One - Dragon Scales (ByuN win): ByuN opened with 2-Barracks Reapers, with one in the main and another proxied out on the map. While ByuN got in a few SCV kills against Cure's 1-Rax Reactor opening, he didn't inflict critical damage. ByuN tried to keep applying pressure by proxying his Factory and Starport as well, but Cure was actually ahead on his production buildings and was in no danger.

With Cure on defense for the time being, ByuN decided to risk taking a much faster expansion back at home. Cure eventually broke out of ByuN's soft-contain and expanded, taking down the proxied Factory in the process. This snowballed into Cure having a huge early Tank advantage of four to zero, but for whatever reason, Cure continued to play the game out extremely defensively. This allowed ByuN to get away with his fast expansion without any repercussions and start mass Marine-Medivac production.

ByuN got his signature multi-directional attacks going, and Cure struggled to keep up with the combination of ground and drop attacks. Amidst the chaos, Cure was goaded into moving out with his Marines and Tanks, but ended up taking a terrible fight against ByuN's well-positioned army. With his main force wiped out, Cure surrendered the first GG.

Game Two - Babylon (ByuN win): Cure risked a CC-first build to start, while ByuN went for a typical Barracks-Factory-CC opener. ByuN got in a few SCV kills with a Reaper-Hellion strike, but was otherwise content to join Cure in a slow macro build-up during the early game. The two player's plans soon diverged, with Cure going for standard bio while ByuN decided to go for
Mech (perhaps due to forgetting Stim?).

Considering mech was involved, the game ended up being decided in relatively quick fashion. Cure tried to exploit mech's immobility with a Marine-Medivac drop into the opposing main, which netted him SCV kills at the cost of heavy army losses. ByuN pounced on this opportunity, pushing rapidly across the map with his deadly Tank-Viking-Raven army. Unable to face this force head on, Cure diverted some of his troops for a semi-basetrade. ByuN got the better end of this exchange by far, smashing the portion of Cure's army left behind on defense while minimizing losses back at home. Left with a 40+ supply advantage as the mech player, ByuN easily closed the game out at around the 13-minute mark.

Game Three - Ancient Cistern (Cure win): ByuN went for an aggressive cheese to try and close the series out, proxying two Barracks inside of Cure's natural. However, Cure pulled off a near perfect defense after scouting ByuN's empty main, predicting exactly where the enemy Reapers would initially enter and having his troops there to greet them.

ByuN tried to make up for his disadvantageous start with Cyclone drop and Liberator harassment, but Cure continued to be rock solid on defense. ByuN had no choice but to follow Cure into a Marine-Tank macro game on worse footing.

Cure's advantage mostly manifested in superior tech, namely Ravens. With the superior Raven count, Cure was able to push across the map and set up a strong siege line just outside of ByuN's base. As Cure's forces slowly pushed in, ByuN split up his forces to try and defend and counter-drop at the same time. Unfortunately for ByuN, his backdoor drop achieved very little, whereas he took heavy damage from Cure's Marine-Tank push before finally repulsing the attack.

Trailing in both economy and army, ByuN forced a doomed basetrade before surrendering the map.

Game Four - Royal Blood (Cure win): ByuN's love of proxies continued in game four, as he went for another 2-Barracks Reaper opener (one in main, one proxied in center). Unfortunately for ByuN, Cure made the perfect blind read by going for THREE Barracks Reapers out of his main. After picking off ByuN's first two Reapers, Cure gathered his own Reapers for an attack that forced a GG at around the 4:15 mark (it didn't help that ByuN was down around 200-300 minerals per minute due to mis-rallying his SCVs).

Game Five - Gresvan (Cure win): The two Terrans started diverging builds once more— ByuN opening Rax-CC while Cure went for Rax-Factory-CC—but neither player took a meaningful advantage in the early going. Cure added on a fast second starport to go into focused Viking and Liberator production, whereas ByuN opted for a faster third Command Center.

The game swung in ByuN's favor after a pre-stim skirmish between Raven-Tank-Marine forces, where ByuN's 3-to-2 Raven advantage allowed him to eke out a victory. Cure was forced into a defensive stance, while ByuN prepared to pummel Cure with his aggressive Marine-Medivac style.

The game appeared to go ByuN's way, as he strained Cure's defenses heavily with his constant attacks. While some of ByuN's attacks were chewed up by waiting defenders, the big picture view saw ByuN freely take map control while pinning Cure in a corner of the map.

Tragically, ByuN's stress-induced wrist pain recurred at this critical juncture, and he called for a pause to recover. Perhaps it's just confirmation bias from what we know of ByuN's wrist condition, but ByuN seemed to slow down after this point in the game. Cure took advantage of a brief respite in attacks, marching his Marine-Tank-Viking-Liberator force across the map to take out a few key bases. While ByuN retained the lead, it kept the game within Cure's reach.

ByuN tried to keep playing his aggressive style, but Cure was able to slowly creep out onto the map, taking more and more territory. With Cure eventually matching ByuN in infantry upgrades, and finally completing the advanced ballistics upgrade for Liberators, ByuN found less and less opening to exploit.

After forcing Cure to spread out his forces on defense, ByuN went for his ace in the hole with a massive frontal Marine attack. However, Cure had just enough Tanks in position to turn it into a slaughter, and the game swung decisively in Cure's favor. The might of Cure's tech units finally surpassed ByuN's mobility advantage, and he eventually forced the ByuN to surrender the series at just over 29:00 on the clock.

Semifinal #2: Bunny 1 - 3 Maru (VOD)

Game One - Royal Blood (Bunny win): The two Terrans opened with similar-ish Rax-Factory-CC openers, and initially looked to be headed toward a passive Marine-Tank build-up. However, Bunny went for an unorthodox play, plopping down extra factories to go for mech. Bunny did a great drop of masking his intent, and surprised Maru with a fast Tank + Hellbat timing attack. Hellbats proved to be quite strong at the early-middle phase of the game, costing Maru over thirty SCV's in a desperate defense. Maru tried a last-ditch counterattack after barely holding, but GG'd out after Bunny easily halted the attack.

Game Two - NeoHumanity (Maru win): The two players' openers diverged with Maru opening CC-first against Bunny's Rax-Fact-CC. Bunny was able to annoy Maru a bit by performing some Banshee harass and poking around with Tanks and Ravens, but ultimately wasn't able to affect Maru's plan too much. That plan happened to be going for fast 1/1 upgrades & stim-shield Marines, which Maru had used to defeat ByuN back in the group stage.

It seemed like Bunny would have enough troops to stop Maru's 1/1 timing, but the element of surprise worked in Maru's favor. Bunny caught Maru's initial Marine-Tank-Medivac move-out, but he briefly lost track of the troops in the fog of war. Bunny made the ill-fated decision of placing his Ravens and Vikings at the edge of the map to defend against a potential drop, while Maru's actual plan was a frontal attack. Maru's Ravens were allowed to fly up and Matrix all of Bunny's Tanks for free, followed by a deadly charge of 1/1 Marines. Maru's initial attack inflicted significant damage, and a follow-up attack extracted the GG from Bunny in just over 9 minutes of game-time.

Game Three - Ancient Cistern (Maru win): Maru started off with a 'light' cheese, opening up with 2-Barracks Reapers (1 proxy, 1 main) while also getting a fast expansion. However, this backfired on Maru, as he lost his initial 2 Reapers due to uncharacteristically poor micro. Bunny counterattacked with a small cadre of Reaper-Hellion, killing off some SCV's and securing a healthy early lead.

Bunny seemed like he might have a chance to put the game away quickly, setting up a siege outside Maru's natural with Ravens and Tanks. However, thanks to some good Raven usage from Maru and slow reactions from Bunny, Maru crushed the besieging force to get himself back in the running.

Still, the game favored Bunny moderately, with Maru's sole advantage being his faster infantry upgrades. Maru played the scenario out patiently, looking for an opportunity to seize back the momentum. That chance came in a big Marine-Tank battle in the middle of the map, where Maru fought from a superior position with his 2/2 Marines against Bunny's 1/1 infantry. While both sides lost similar amounts of supply, Maru cut significantly into Bunny's tank count and brought the game back to virtually even (if not favoring himself due to his infantry upgrades).

The two players continued to exchange blows with neither side coming out conclusively ahead, but Maru eventually found a game-deciding move. After launching a diversionary strike on one side of the map, Maru walked his main force up to one of Bunny's key expansions on the opposite end. Bunny engaged in a bloody defensive battle, losing a significant chunk of his SCVs and army. The blow proved to be too much to recover from, and Bunny GG'd out minutes later.

Game Four - Gresvan (Maru win): Maru and Bunny engaged in some intense Hellion-Reaper fighting to start game four, with neither player coming out conclusively ahead. Both players took a short breather to secure their third bases and prepare for a Marine-Tank war, and the hostilities quickly resumed once they had stimmed Marines and Medivacs.

Both Terrans had the idea to slip a drop into the opposing main, except Maru went with two Medivacs while Bunny only sent in one. Maru's drop did quite a bit more economic damage, but he lingered too long and lost all of his Marines. That gave Bunny a window to counterattack with his army advantage, but he deliberated a bit in choosing his target. He eventually settled for a drop into Maru's natural, but by then Maru was ready with another drop into Bunny's main. This perpetual basetrade did not favor Bunny at all, and he took far more economic damage than he meted out at the other end of the map.

Still having a slight army supply lead, Bunny consolidated his forces for a frontal attack. However, Maru's army was ahead where it really mattered, having three Ravens to Bunny's zero. Maru's Ravens shut down Bunny's Tanks, nullifying the counterattack and forcing the final GG out of Bunny.

Grand Finals: Cure 2 - 4 Maru



Game One - Altitude (Cure win): Maru and Cure began the finals with a hellacious game on Altitude. Cure won the mindgames to start, pulling out a CC-first build against Maru's Rax-CC. Still, some dogged Medivac harassment from Maru was enough to put the game in a fairly even state as the two players prepared for an all-out Marine-Tank war.

Maru took an aggressive stance first, playing with most of his army on Cure's side of the map. While Cure's defense prevented Maru from inflicting any serious damage, the map control allowed Maru to take a slightly faster fourth base. After focusing on defense, Cure briefly tipped the scales in his favor by sneaking out a detachment of Marines to raid Maru's bases. However, Maru matched Cure tit-for-tat, abusing the lack of Marines to punish Cure's own expansions.

After a brief pause to stabilize, the two players dove straight back into bloody combat. Cure looked for another big backdoor attack, taking a somewhat risky army-for-SCV's trade. However, it ended up working out for Cure, with a failed counter-drop from Maru forcing him to finally withdraw from Cure's territory and take a more defensive stance.

The positions were flipped, with Cure's main army crossing into the enemy half of the map while Maru became the one looking for opportunities to backdoor. However, this went much more poorly for Maru than it did for Cure, as his first major counter saw him take heavy casualties from defensive Tank fire. Cure exploited this sudden army gap ruthlessly, chasing down Maru's forces and taking down key expansions. Cure refused to give Maru an avenue back into the game, snowballing to victory at around 21:40 on the clock.

Game Two - Dragon Scales (Maru win): We got our first proxy-Reaper sighting of the finals in game two with Maru opening 2-Barracks (1 proxy, 1 main). Despite having his proxy Barracks scouted by Cure's scouting SCV, Maru committed even harder to his cheese by proxying a Factory and Starport as well (these went unscouted).

Whereas Cure easily held off a similar cheese from Byun in his semifinal match, this time he was lulled into a false sense of security and went for quick cloak Banshee tech. Maru capitalized with an off-beat Reaper-Hellion attack that killed 8 SCV's, which he followed with a Viking-Reaper-Tank push. While the arrival of Cloaked Banshees forced Maru to retreat, he had already expanded and assumed a commanding lead. Cure briefly went through the motions of playing the game out before GG'ing out with a last ditch attack.

Game Three - Gresvan (Cure win): Maru opted to go Hellion-heavy in the early-game, while Cure played it safe with two quick Cyclones. Cure got the better of the early skirmishes, but Maru seemed unfazed as he put down two fast Engineering Bays despite his army disadvantage.

Cure became the first player in the RO4 to actually exploit Maru's fast upgrades, bringing along his Tanks, Marines, and Vikings (having swapped his Starport to Reactor) along for a quick push. The key moment of the game came just after Cure sieged up his first two tanks, and Maru came to counter with his own Tanks supported by Ravens. Cure unsieged his Tanks just before the Interference Matrix projectiles could hit, letting him walk his Tanks away and waste Maru's precious Raven energy.

Cure relocated his Tanks and laid siege again as his Vikings gave him full vision. Surveying the situation, Cure saw that Maru was even weaker than expected, and he made the call to land his Vikings for an all-out attack. Cure's forces blasted through the defenses, dealing game-ending damage. Maru allowed himself one final drop attempt and then GG'd out.

Game Four - Babylon (Maru win): Never one to shy away from cheese in a dicey situation, Maru went for full-on proxy 2-Barracks Reapers as his opener. While Cure had defeated ByuN's similar cheese easily by correctly guessing which direction the Reapers would enter from, he wasn't so lucky against Maru and lost a significant number of SCVs to four unimpeded Reapers. However, Cure soon got Maru back with a Hellion drop, leaving the two players near par.

The ensuing Marine-Tank war saw the two players continue to stay neck and neck, with neither player able to seize a meaningful advantage. The pace of the game gradually slowed down, with both players making the late-game transition and focusing on air units.

The game stayed even for several minutes after moving to the Viking-Raven-Liberator phase, with the two players settling into a half-map split. However, after several inconclusive air battles, Maru finally swung the game in his favor at around the 21:00 mark. Despite trailing in Viking count, Maru outgunned Cure in the sky thanks to his superior upgrades and Raven support. Having established air superiority, Maru pushed his way to victory with Tanks and Liberators.

Game Five - Ancient Cistern (Maru win): It was Cure's turn to dip into the cheese well, proxying two Barracks for an early Reaper attack. While Maru did well to parry Cure's first few thrusts, a belated attack from an unexpected angle netted Cure enough SCV kills to make his opener worth it.

However, Cure's marginal lead was erased once the two players entered the Marine-Medivac phase. Maru found an unguarded drop path into Maru's natural, and he was able to gun down several SCVs and a researching Engineering Bay.

Unlike previous games where Maru had looked to go on the offensive with an advantage, Maru went for an entirely different approach by trying to secure five bases and transitioning into the late game very quickly. While Cure's powerful mid-game Marine-Tank army looked threatening at moments, Maru got into mass Raven and Battlecruiser production without facing any real danger. Not only that, but the Marines he sent on suicide missions to free up population inflicted a fair bit of damage, furthering improving his situation.

Cure followed suit and tried to match Maru in an air transition, but without the Battlecruisers. However, Cure didn't realize until too late that he needed to commit completely to the air war. Maru had been quick to divest out of Marine-Medivac entirely, whereas Cure retained the vestiges of a mid-game Marine-Tank army with a high Tank count. Maru absolutely smashed Cure in the first full-fledged air battle, forcing the GG.

Game Six - Royal Blood (Maru win): Reaper cheese was on the table once more as Maru opened the game with 2 Barracks (1 proxy, 1 main). In a callback to game two, Maru proxied a Factory as well. However, this time Cure made sure to check up on the proxy location with a belated SCV scout, discovering the proxy Factory. Maru abruptly changed plans, decommitting from hard aggression and expanding quickly back at home. This risky move ended up biting Maru in the behind, as he was ill-prepared for Cure's Tank-Viking push that soon came knocking. The push dealt what initially seemed like fatal damage, but a desperate Marine-Medivac counter from Maru evened things up considerably. Once Maru removed the encroaching army from his doorstep, he was left in a playable, if disadvantaged, position.

Having found success with defensive play in the previous game, Maru decided on a similar approach in game two. Except, previously, Maru had started with an advantage as a buffer, and this time he would cede complete mid-game control to Cure. The game ended up resembling some of Maru's TvZ's, with Maru staying holed up in a corner of the map while his opponent expanded freely. But unlike Maru's TvZ's, this was a mirror, and his opponent could theoretically make just as powerful an army.

Cure seemed to have adapted from the previous game, making a faster air transition and adding more Ravens to his Viking mix. Maru briefly tried to match Cure, but then pivoted into a throwback army of Marines supported by mass Ravens (this was probably due to his dwindling resources). Intentional or not, this ended up being an exceptionally cruel move from Maru, making it seem as if he had intentionally taught Cure the wrong lesson in the previous game.

Having primed Cure to focus on air superiority, Maru mercilessly attacked him where his ground defense was weak by Matrixing Tanks and charging in with mass Marines. As it turns out, it's okay to trade Ravens and Tanks one for one when the rest of your army is composed of the most cost efficient unit in the game. Maru burst out of his little corner of the map, reclaiming expansions that Cure had boldly taken with his map control. Going for Battlecruisers only made this situation worse for Cure, as armor-shredded BC's can't stand up to mass Marines. Cure could only use them to get in some token harassment, as Maru continued to reclaim more bases and achieve a true 50/50 split of the map.

At around 29:00, Maru gathered his Marine-Raven force for the game-ending push. The unstoppable army cut a path straight across the map and into Cure's main, disabling every Tank along the way. With his production camped, Cure signed off on Maru's 6SL with his final GG.



Credits and acknowledgements

Writer: Wax
Images: AfreecaTV
Records and Statistics: Aligulac.com and Liquipedia

Facebook Twitter Reddit
TL+ Member
Telephone
Profile Joined October 2010
United States140 Posts
May 22 2023 06:13 GMT
#2
Katowice was obviously a fluke. Incredible games.
dbRic1203
Profile Joined July 2019
Germany2655 Posts
May 22 2023 07:55 GMT
#3
Omg 15 games of consecutive TvT
How did anyone watch the entirety of it all in one sitting?
MaxPax
Edpayasugo
Profile Joined April 2013
United Kingdom2215 Posts
May 22 2023 08:11 GMT
#4
GG Maru
FlaSh MMA INnoVation FanTaSy MKP TY Ryung | soO Dark Rogue | HuK PartinG Stork State
M3t4PhYzX
Profile Joined March 2019
Poland4195 Posts
May 22 2023 08:34 GMT
#5
*yawn*

GGs I guess..
odi profanum vulgus et arceo
Radulix
Profile Joined February 2022
Czech Republic1 Post
May 22 2023 08:51 GMT
#6
On May 22 2023 16:55 dbRic1203 wrote:
Omg 15 games of consecutive TvT
How did anyone watch the entirety of it all in one sitting?


...and write an article about it
Harris1st
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Germany6928 Posts
May 22 2023 08:55 GMT
#7
On May 22 2023 15:13 Telephone wrote:
Katowice was obviously a fluke. Incredible games.


Bit of a weird take since Oliveira didn't even play here. Maybe Oliveira is even better?

Anyway, congratz to Maru the best Korean Starcraft 2 player ever!
Go Serral! GG EZ for Ence. Flashbang dance FTW
Ciaus_Dronu
Profile Joined June 2017
South Africa1848 Posts
May 22 2023 09:16 GMT
#8
On May 22 2023 16:55 dbRic1203 wrote:
Omg 15 games of consecutive TvT
How did anyone watch the entirety of it all in one sitting?


It does boggle the mind.
I sure as hell didn't XD

GG Maru I suppose. Doesn't feel quite the same as the previous GSL wins.
tigera6
Profile Joined March 2021
3397 Posts
May 22 2023 09:40 GMT
#9
On May 22 2023 17:55 Harris1st wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 22 2023 15:13 Telephone wrote:
Katowice was obviously a fluke. Incredible games.


Bit of a weird take since Oliveira didn't even play here. Maybe Oliveira is even better?

Anyway, congratz to Maru the best Korean Starcraft 2 player ever!

We never said Ragnarok is better than Serral, and Maru 4-0 Oliveira in PigFest should really say it all, couple with their overall head to head.
Harris1st
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Germany6928 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-22 11:27:34
May 22 2023 11:17 GMT
#10
On May 22 2023 18:40 tigera6 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 22 2023 17:55 Harris1st wrote:
On May 22 2023 15:13 Telephone wrote:
Katowice was obviously a fluke. Incredible games.


Bit of a weird take since Oliveira didn't even play here. Maybe Oliveira is even better?

Anyway, congratz to Maru the best Korean Starcraft 2 player ever!

We never said Ragnarok is better than Serral, and Maru 4-0 Oliveira in PigFest should really say it all, couple with their overall head to head.


Ah I see. I didn't catch Pig Festival. I was confused why you basically brought up a match (Maru vs Oliveira) which couldn't even have taken place in this tournament. I am also confused what this has to do with Ragnarok and Serral?

So please either explain your stream of thought a bit better or refrain from using random players from random tournaments to "support" an argument.
EDIT: I don't necessarily disagree with you here, fyi.
Go Serral! GG EZ for Ence. Flashbang dance FTW
Balnazza
Profile Joined January 2018
Germany1175 Posts
May 22 2023 11:59 GMT
#11
On May 22 2023 15:13 Telephone wrote:
Katowice was obviously a fluke. Incredible games.


Why? Maru is extremly consistent at not winning the World Championship...

I honestly respect everyone who watched through all of that. I'm usually not against mirrors (and in TvT atleast there is a guaranteed terran loser which is nice), but so much of it in a row? Oh boy...
Hope Dark and herO can show up for the next iteration and bring a bit of diversity. Another Ro4 TvT would be...awkward.
"Wenn die Zauberin runter geht, dann macht sie die Beine breit" - Khaldor, trying to cast WC3 German-only
tigera6
Profile Joined March 2021
3397 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-22 12:26:18
May 22 2023 12:10 GMT
#12
On May 22 2023 20:17 Harris1st wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 22 2023 18:40 tigera6 wrote:
On May 22 2023 17:55 Harris1st wrote:
On May 22 2023 15:13 Telephone wrote:
Katowice was obviously a fluke. Incredible games.


Bit of a weird take since Oliveira didn't even play here. Maybe Oliveira is even better?

Anyway, congratz to Maru the best Korean Starcraft 2 player ever!

We never said Ragnarok is better than Serral, and Maru 4-0 Oliveira in PigFest should really say it all, couple with their overall head to head.


Ah I see. I didn't catch Pig Festival. I was confused why you basically brought up a match (Maru vs Oliveira) which couldn't even have taken place in this tournament. I am also confused what this has to do with Ragnarok and Serral?

So please either explain your stream of thought a bit better or refrain from using random players from random tournaments to "support" an argument.
EDIT: I don't necessarily disagree with you here, fyi.

Basically I am trying to explain that the fact that Oliveira beating Maru IEM, deservingly so, still doesnt make him the better player. The same way with Ragnarok beating Serral doesnt make him better than Serral. We have to see the "big picture" rather than focusing on one data point to suggest a conclusion/prediction.
Harris1st
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Germany6928 Posts
May 22 2023 12:46 GMT
#13
On May 22 2023 21:10 tigera6 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 22 2023 20:17 Harris1st wrote:
On May 22 2023 18:40 tigera6 wrote:
On May 22 2023 17:55 Harris1st wrote:
On May 22 2023 15:13 Telephone wrote:
Katowice was obviously a fluke. Incredible games.


Bit of a weird take since Oliveira didn't even play here. Maybe Oliveira is even better?

Anyway, congratz to Maru the best Korean Starcraft 2 player ever!

We never said Ragnarok is better than Serral, and Maru 4-0 Oliveira in PigFest should really say it all, couple with their overall head to head.


Ah I see. I didn't catch Pig Festival. I was confused why you basically brought up a match (Maru vs Oliveira) which couldn't even have taken place in this tournament. I am also confused what this has to do with Ragnarok and Serral?

So please either explain your stream of thought a bit better or refrain from using random players from random tournaments to "support" an argument.
EDIT: I don't necessarily disagree with you here, fyi.

Basically I am trying to explain that the fact that Oliveira beating Maru IEM, deservingly so, still doesnt make him the better player. The same way with Ragnarok beating Serral doesnt make him better than Serral. We have to see the "big picture" rather than focusing on one data point to suggest a conclusion/prediction.


Understood and agreed
Go Serral! GG EZ for Ence. Flashbang dance FTW
miau
Profile Joined July 2022
18 Posts
May 22 2023 13:01 GMT
#14
gomtvt
Yoshi Kirishima
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States10340 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-22 13:48:52
May 22 2023 13:48 GMT
#15
Only thing woulda made it more hype is if it went to G7, but it's still awesome!!

I actually forgot how often GSL finals are disappointing, and often one sided stomps, with many all-ins or cheeses making games end in 10 mins, or after the very first push. It's really nice to see a GSL Finals where most games are macro games and back and forth with lots of action, mixed in with a healthy amount of early rushes. When Stateless said it was one of the best GSL Finals, it probably is, just because it really was "a match".
Mid-master streaming MECH ONLY + commentary www.twitch.tv/yoshikirishima +++ "If all-in fails, all-in again."
[Phantom]
Profile Blog Joined August 2013
Mexico2170 Posts
May 22 2023 15:59 GMT
#16
The finals and Cure vs Byun games were surprisingly fun.


I'm very annoyed with Byun though. He is the guy with the byclicle that puts a stick through the wheel and falls. He should have beaten cure. He stopped minning gas for like 5 minutes for no reason at all and couldn't rebuild tanks and lost.

There was another game he threw. He just pushes himself too hard when there is no reason to. You can see it on his gameplay, and on his wrists.

As for Maru, a lot of people will dismiss this because GSL was downsized, but the level of play in this GSL was still very high and he was indeed the overall best player. He didn't only get the mythical G5L, the very next tournament he got his 6th. He is above any other Korean player in his career.
WriterTeamLiquid Staff writer since 2014 @Mortal_Phantom
Argonauta
Profile Joined July 2016
Spain4947 Posts
May 22 2023 16:09 GMT
#17
I am surprised people dislike mirrors so much... I saw all the games and they were hella fun!

GGs Maru, even tho it felt like a glorified Super-tournament.... the lineup was strong
Rogue | Maru | Scarlett | Trap
TL+ Member
CloudCat
Profile Joined May 2011
Singapore159 Posts
May 22 2023 17:39 GMT
#18
>Maru found an unguarded drop path into Maru's natural,
Typo?

For a long night of TvT, the games were surprisingly very fun! Enjoyed the actual back and forth and thankful that it wasn't a stomp
The_Red_Viper
Profile Blog Joined August 2013
19533 Posts
May 22 2023 18:25 GMT
#19
If there is one code s season which hardly should count as one, it definitely is this one. Having most of it played online just is such a big negative in my eyes that i cannot give much importance to this "6th gsl title". We are talking about a starleague here, they always had the most prestige in starcraft history, but this gsl only really had the same name as the ones before. (and it is arguable how much the gsls in past years are worth to begin with, with how the scene shrunk and all kinds of changes to it).

At least it seems that the next seasons will be played offline in person again, that's the best we can do now.
IU | Sohyang || There is no God and we are his prophets | For if ‘Thou mayest’—it is also true that ‘Thou mayest not.” | Ignorance is the parent of fear |
Slydie
Profile Joined August 2013
1917 Posts
May 22 2023 19:17 GMT
#20
I just finished watching the semis and the final, great games! I find it fantastic that a mirror matchup can have that much variety! Some more mech and maybe an attempt at pure bio could have been fun, but the sky terran games made up for it!
Buff the siegetank
CaRn1FeX
Profile Joined January 2003
Germany203 Posts
May 22 2023 20:06 GMT
#21
I'm inrterested in seeing if this continues to be that heavily Terran favored or if the other races will catch up eventually. Currently the patch feels very terran favoured... Stormgate, please hurry
tommey.liang
Profile Joined November 2020
United States362 Posts
May 22 2023 20:13 GMT
#22
Congrats to Maru on achieving a historic, probably, unparalled, 6SL. For some reason I couldn't watch any of the GSL matches from this season and only checked the results on the Liquipedia pages. Just feel like it's not the same anymore with so many players having gone to military, retired and/or past their prime.
FF, KH, Persona, Uncharted, Yakuza | Porter, Illenium, MitiS, Dabin, Seven Lions, Petit Biscuit | Diablo II, SC2 | Pho, sushi, tacos
Pandain
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States12989 Posts
May 22 2023 21:26 GMT
#23
Pretty sure there's a seventh in the works as well if not eight
Glorfindelio
Profile Joined October 2022
207 Posts
May 22 2023 21:55 GMT
#24
You love to see it. Can't say it was my favorite GSL semi-round ever, haha. But these types of victories are always well-deserved. Grats to the man!
Fanatic-Templar
Profile Joined February 2010
Canada5819 Posts
May 22 2023 22:53 GMT
#25
An all-Terran bracket won by the winningest GSL player of all time. Man, I remember writing this back before Maru won his fifth GSL:

On July 29 2022 11:36 Fanatic-Templar wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 29 2022 05:08 veniss wrote:
On one hand: As P&W wrote, I would like to see the G5L awarded in my lifetime.


Seems inevitable as long as the tournament keeps going. It's not like these players are getting replaced by newer talent.

Honestly, I said this when Maru won his 4th GSL too, but he's past the point where the number getting bigger means anything to me. He's already achieved maximum impressiveness for me.


And it just keeps getting more true with time.

I can't blame Maru, he's actually a fun player to watch and winning is literally his job, it's just a sign of the times I guess.

Add that to the GomTvT bracket and the offline group stage, and this has been my least favourite GSL in a long, long time.
I bear this sig to commemorate the loss of the team icon that commemorated Oversky's 2008-2009 Proleague Round 1 performance.
Agh
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States971 Posts
May 23 2023 07:09 GMT
#26
Least we don't have to wait too long for esl summer. Not the biggest fan of their bracket/grouping practices but hopefully nobody gets robbed of being able to make a run.
I may appear to be an emotionless sarcastic pos, but just like an onion when you pull off more and more layers you find the exact same thing everytime and you start crying
Slydie
Profile Joined August 2013
1917 Posts
May 23 2023 18:11 GMT
#27
On May 23 2023 05:06 CaRn1FeX wrote:
I'm inrterested in seeing if this continues to be that heavily Terran favored or if the other races will catch up eventually. Currently the patch feels very terran favoured... Stormgate, please hurry


Is it really unit balance, though? 4 Terrans in top4 can also happen because:
-The maps are T favoured.
-The other races lack talent in Korea atm.

When Z has dominated in the past, the maps have always been at least as important as the patch.
Buff the siegetank
Athenau
Profile Joined March 2015
569 Posts
May 23 2023 20:28 GMT
#28
The EU and AM regionals both had PvZ finals, so GSL looks like an outlier so far.
CaRn1FeX
Profile Joined January 2003
Germany203 Posts
May 23 2023 21:02 GMT
#29
On May 24 2023 05:28 Athenau wrote:
The EU and AM regionals both had PvZ finals, so GSL looks like an outlier so far.


Its just regionals for less strong regions than KR
dysenterymd
Profile Joined January 2019
1237 Posts
May 23 2023 21:19 GMT
#30
On May 24 2023 03:11 Slydie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 23 2023 05:06 CaRn1FeX wrote:
I'm inrterested in seeing if this continues to be that heavily Terran favored or if the other races will catch up eventually. Currently the patch feels very terran favoured... Stormgate, please hurry


Is it really unit balance, though? 4 Terrans in top4 can also happen because:
-The maps are T favoured.
-The other races lack talent in Korea atm.

When Z has dominated in the past, the maps have always been at least as important as the patch.

I think Protoss is definitely suffering vs Terran, but balance seems mostly fine otherwise.

4T semifinals is still an outlier though, and it took herO and Dark both underperforming.
Serral | Inno | sOs | soO | Has | Classic
angry_maia
Profile Joined August 2020
314 Posts
May 24 2023 16:27 GMT
#31
On May 24 2023 06:19 dysenterymd wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 24 2023 03:11 Slydie wrote:
On May 23 2023 05:06 CaRn1FeX wrote:
I'm inrterested in seeing if this continues to be that heavily Terran favored or if the other races will catch up eventually. Currently the patch feels very terran favoured... Stormgate, please hurry


Is it really unit balance, though? 4 Terrans in top4 can also happen because:
-The maps are T favoured.
-The other races lack talent in Korea atm.

When Z has dominated in the past, the maps have always been at least as important as the patch.

I think Protoss is definitely suffering vs Terran, but balance seems mostly fine otherwise.

4T semifinals is still an outlier though, and it took herO and Dark both underperforming.


Is it really a case of Protoss suffering balance wise? A plausible alternative is just the current set of active players. Looking at aligulac, the third best protoss is Classic who ranks at #11. Imo, regardless of the patch, I would not favor current classic against any players in the top 10 with many of them absolutely dominating him.

Overall, it just feels like, Maru, Byun, Clem, Cure, Bunny, Oliveira is just skill for skill a much stronger line up than Hero, Maxpax, Classic, Showtime, Stats, Creator, and I don't think there was any recent patch in which the former would not dominate the latter.

I think the best hope is to wait for (hopefuly) Stats + Classic to get back to their best selves (plausibly never happens) and for Maxpax to play in offline tournaments (also might never happen).

Overall, the set of active pro players is just too small to make any kinds of conclusive remarks about balance solely based on results.
tigera6
Profile Joined March 2021
3397 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-24 16:45:08
May 24 2023 16:44 GMT
#32
Classic has been very good lately, I would put him on top 10 depending on the form. He has been even more consistent than herO in PvT as well. But I do agree with your overall point that we dont have enough top level Protoss that are on equal footing with those top Terran. After herO, MaxPAx and Classic, there is a noticable gap to the next best PvT whether its Showtime, Astrea or Creator, or even Nightmare.

Having said that, I dont have an issue if they remove the nerf on Battery Overcharge and Disruptor shot. I think those 2 make it way too hard for Protoss to defend against the Terran 2 base push or post-Colossi tech. And I personally believe the reason for those 2 nerfs was because of PvZ, not PvT.
Charoisaur
Profile Joined August 2014
Germany15958 Posts
May 24 2023 18:50 GMT
#33
Classic is a multiple Starleague champ and he had now plenty of time to get back in shape. I can't hear this x players just happen to be better talk anymore, the perception of how good a player is is based on results and balance influences which players get good results.

Right now this should be more obvious than ever with a simple balance patch changing the situation from "Zerg players are just better than everyone" to "Terran players are just better than everyone"
Many of the coolest moments in sc2 happen due to worker harassment
Fanatic-Templar
Profile Joined February 2010
Canada5819 Posts
May 25 2023 00:12 GMT
#34
On May 25 2023 01:27 angry_maia wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 24 2023 06:19 dysenterymd wrote:
On May 24 2023 03:11 Slydie wrote:
On May 23 2023 05:06 CaRn1FeX wrote:
I'm inrterested in seeing if this continues to be that heavily Terran favored or if the other races will catch up eventually. Currently the patch feels very terran favoured... Stormgate, please hurry


Is it really unit balance, though? 4 Terrans in top4 can also happen because:
-The maps are T favoured.
-The other races lack talent in Korea atm.

When Z has dominated in the past, the maps have always been at least as important as the patch.

I think Protoss is definitely suffering vs Terran, but balance seems mostly fine otherwise.

4T semifinals is still an outlier though, and it took herO and Dark both underperforming.


Is it really a case of Protoss suffering balance wise? A plausible alternative is just the current set of active players.


Can you define "current" as a percentage of the full lifespan of Legacy of the Void?
I bear this sig to commemorate the loss of the team icon that commemorated Oversky's 2008-2009 Proleague Round 1 performance.
Agh
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States971 Posts
May 27 2023 06:10 GMT
#35
On May 25 2023 03:50 Charoisaur wrote:
Classic is a multiple Starleague champ and he had now plenty of time to get back in shape. I can't hear this x players just happen to be better talk anymore, the perception of how good a player is is based on results and balance influences which players get good results.

Right now this should be more obvious than ever with a simple balance patch changing the situation from "Zerg players are just better than everyone" to "Terran players are just better than everyone"



it's definitely patch related, but doesn't completely omit cases where people are playing better (and in other cases barely playing at all [>insert group D here<]).

After watching the Maru vs Cure group series you already knew that was going to be the finals, even without seeing the rest of the matches or even the other group playing a single game.

Game state also affects players motivation to prepare and mentality overall. I don't think one tournament calls for a kneejerk response but if it becomes a trend something needs to be done to prevent the cascade effect.
I may appear to be an emotionless sarcastic pos, but just like an onion when you pull off more and more layers you find the exact same thing everytime and you start crying
Turbovolver
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Australia2394 Posts
May 27 2023 08:51 GMT
#36
On May 25 2023 03:50 Charoisaur wrote:
Right now this should be more obvious than ever with a simple balance patch changing the situation from "Zerg players are just better than everyone" to "Terran players are just better than everyone"

Remember when people thought Terran was screwed by this patch? I am still laughing about that.
The original Bogus fan.
AcrossFromTime
Profile Joined May 2020
29 Posts
May 27 2023 15:32 GMT
#37
Since other people have made some balance comments, I hope it's okay if I contribute one thought.

I don't think it's right to suggest that the game should be balanced around a hypothetical better player for a particular race. I think it has to be balanced around the current actually existing players. Whoever the best current player is for each race, they should each have an equal chance of winning a tournament, balance-wise. I think that if a game is going to be fun to watch, it has to be that way. But that's just my opinion.
JimmyJRaynor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada16702 Posts
May 28 2023 04:22 GMT
#38
"meet the new boss. same as the old boss..."
On May 23 2023 04:17 Slydie wrote:
I just finished watching the semis and the final, great games! I find it fantastic that a mirror matchup can have that much variety! Some more mech and maybe an attempt at pure bio could have been fun, but the sky terran games made up for it!

i agree and to add to your comment.
imo, Blizzard did a great job with all 3 mirrors.
David Kim and Dustin Browder and genius level game designers.
Ray Kassar To David Crane : "you're no more important to Atari than the factory workers assembling the cartridges"
nojok
Profile Joined May 2011
France15845 Posts
May 28 2023 05:26 GMT
#39
It can't be helped, protoss is picked by lesser gamers.
"Back then teams that won were credited, now it's called throw. I think it's sad." - Kuroky - Flap Flap Wings!
CicadaSC
Profile Joined January 2018
United States1710 Posts
May 28 2023 06:41 GMT
#40
On May 23 2023 05:06 CaRn1FeX wrote:
I'm inrterested in seeing if this continues to be that heavily Terran favored or if the other races will catch up eventually. Currently the patch feels very terran favoured... Stormgate, please hurry

sc2 is EXTREMELY terran favored, and protoss as well but not at the top level. zerg is weakest in gm and all levels below. only serral is exception to the rule atm. not even reynor winning or dark
Remember that we all come from a place of passion!!
Athenau
Profile Joined March 2015
569 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-28 13:57:02
May 28 2023 13:56 GMT
#41
On May 28 2023 15:41 CicadaSC wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 23 2023 05:06 CaRn1FeX wrote:
I'm inrterested in seeing if this continues to be that heavily Terran favored or if the other races will catch up eventually. Currently the patch feels very terran favoured... Stormgate, please hurry

sc2 is EXTREMELY terran favored, and protoss as well but not at the top level. zerg is weakest in gm and all levels below. only serral is exception to the rule atm. not even reynor winning or dark

Zerg wins 40-50% of premiere tournaments every year for three years straight--" Zerg players are just better". Zerg doesn't win everything for three months. THE SKY IS FALLING.
JJH777
Profile Joined January 2011
United States4407 Posts
May 29 2023 00:34 GMT
#42
On May 28 2023 22:56 Athenau wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 28 2023 15:41 CicadaSC wrote:
On May 23 2023 05:06 CaRn1FeX wrote:
I'm inrterested in seeing if this continues to be that heavily Terran favored or if the other races will catch up eventually. Currently the patch feels very terran favoured... Stormgate, please hurry

sc2 is EXTREMELY terran favored, and protoss as well but not at the top level. zerg is weakest in gm and all levels below. only serral is exception to the rule atm. not even reynor winning or dark

Zerg wins 40-50% of premiere tournaments every year for three years straight--" Zerg players are just better". Zerg doesn't win everything for three months. THE SKY IS FALLING.


And Zerg has won like 3mil more in prize money than the other two races over the games life. Zerg is still in first place even if you subtract Serral and Rogues winnings. Obviously not relevant to current balance but his post reads to me like he thinks Terrans been the best for a long time.
Turbovolver
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Australia2394 Posts
May 29 2023 00:52 GMT
#43
On May 28 2023 22:56 Athenau wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 28 2023 15:41 CicadaSC wrote:
On May 23 2023 05:06 CaRn1FeX wrote:
I'm inrterested in seeing if this continues to be that heavily Terran favored or if the other races will catch up eventually. Currently the patch feels very terran favoured... Stormgate, please hurry

sc2 is EXTREMELY terran favored, and protoss as well but not at the top level. zerg is weakest in gm and all levels below. only serral is exception to the rule atm. not even reynor winning or dark

Zerg wins 40-50% of premiere tournaments every year for three years straight--" Zerg players are just better". Zerg doesn't win everything for three months. THE SKY IS FALLING.

This would mean a lot more coming from someone other than the person who thought the sky was falling because snipe gained some counterplay.
The original Bogus fan.
Athenau
Profile Joined March 2015
569 Posts
May 29 2023 09:27 GMT
#44
On May 29 2023 09:52 Turbovolver wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 28 2023 22:56 Athenau wrote:
On May 28 2023 15:41 CicadaSC wrote:
On May 23 2023 05:06 CaRn1FeX wrote:
I'm inrterested in seeing if this continues to be that heavily Terran favored or if the other races will catch up eventually. Currently the patch feels very terran favoured... Stormgate, please hurry

sc2 is EXTREMELY terran favored, and protoss as well but not at the top level. zerg is weakest in gm and all levels below. only serral is exception to the rule atm. not even reynor winning or dark

Zerg wins 40-50% of premiere tournaments every year for three years straight--" Zerg players are just better". Zerg doesn't win everything for three months. THE SKY IS FALLING.

This would mean a lot more coming from someone other than the person who thought the sky was falling because snipe gained some counterplay.

I thought it was a bad change if implemented without appropriate compensation elsewhere. But sure, that's totally the same as complaining that the game is extremely terran favored after three months, while blithely ignoring the last three years.
Harris1st
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Germany6928 Posts
May 30 2023 10:59 GMT
#45
I don't see the Terran heavy tournament finals as a balance problem (yet)

Katowice was a TvT final mainly because the Korean GOAT plays Terran and the Non-Korean GOAT had trouble with ZvZ
GSL S1 was a TvT final and semifinal because 80% of the best Koreans play Terran these days. Top Korean Protoss are a bit rusty still from military and the one active top top Zerg had a bad day

For me this is still coincidental. Now if this happens again, specially on an international stage, I would be inclined to call it pattern
Go Serral! GG EZ for Ence. Flashbang dance FTW
Ciaus_Dronu
Profile Joined June 2017
South Africa1848 Posts
May 30 2023 11:42 GMT
#46
On May 30 2023 19:59 Harris1st wrote:
I don't see the Terran heavy tournament finals as a balance problem (yet)

Katowice was a TvT final mainly because the Korean GOAT plays Terran and the Non-Korean GOAT had trouble with ZvZ
GSL S1 was a TvT final and semifinal because 80% of the best Koreans play Terran these days. Top Korean Protoss are a bit rusty still from military and the one active top top Zerg had a bad day

For me this is still coincidental. Now if this happens again, specially on an international stage, I would be inclined to call it pattern


While I agree with the overall point that we can't be too stressed yet, I think the bolded claim is hilarious. While I'd maybe agree there are somewhat more good terrans, only Maru and Cure are actually toptier. It's not like Bunny, Ryung and Gumiho are substantially better than Solar, Classic, Ragnarok, DRG and Creator.
Harris1st
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Germany6928 Posts
May 30 2023 12:05 GMT
#47
Well, the 80% is an arbitrary chosen number that I can't back up so fair point.

Personally, I'd put a non-hurting Byun above Solar/ DRG/ Rag and Bunny on the same tier as those. The Protoss players (Classic, herO, Stats) and Dark I excluded with my next sentence. Creator, Ryung and Gumi I don't know where to put
Go Serral! GG EZ for Ence. Flashbang dance FTW
Charoisaur
Profile Joined August 2014
Germany15958 Posts
May 30 2023 12:35 GMT
#48
I'd say it's:
tier 1: Maru, Dark, herO
tier 2: Cure, ByuN, Solar
tier 3: Classic, Ragnarok, DRG, Bunny, Creator
tier 4: the rest

So 50% of the top 6 players play terran.
I agree that variance played a part in the recent results we've seen, but from all we've seen I'm very worried about the TvP matchup
Many of the coolest moments in sc2 happen due to worker harassment
tigera6
Profile Joined March 2021
3397 Posts
May 30 2023 13:43 GMT
#49
On May 30 2023 21:35 Charoisaur wrote:
I'd say it's:
tier 1: Maru, Dark, herO
tier 2: Cure, ByuN, Solar
tier 3: Classic, Ragnarok, DRG, Bunny, Creator
tier 4: the rest

So 50% of the top 6 players play terran.
I agree that variance played a part in the recent results we've seen, but from all we've seen I'm very worried about the TvP matchup

In term of form from the recent GSL and last couple weeks, I would not put Dark and herO in tier 1, but herO is getting back there. Cure could be tier 1 because he is so solid overall. Classic should be tier 2 with how good he looks, tier 3 seems to be fair enough after adding Gumiho.
Charoisaur
Profile Joined August 2014
Germany15958 Posts
May 30 2023 17:30 GMT
#50
On May 30 2023 22:43 tigera6 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 30 2023 21:35 Charoisaur wrote:
I'd say it's:
tier 1: Maru, Dark, herO
tier 2: Cure, ByuN, Solar
tier 3: Classic, Ragnarok, DRG, Bunny, Creator
tier 4: the rest

So 50% of the top 6 players play terran.
I agree that variance played a part in the recent results we've seen, but from all we've seen I'm very worried about the TvP matchup

In term of form from the recent GSL and last couple weeks, I would not put Dark and herO in tier 1, but herO is getting back there. Cure could be tier 1 because he is so solid overall. Classic should be tier 2 with how good he looks, tier 3 seems to be fair enough after adding Gumiho.

Yeah but form in recent weeks/months is influenced by the balance patch so I tried to do a more general ranking based on the last 1-2 years.
Many of the coolest moments in sc2 happen due to worker harassment
relatively_simple
Profile Joined June 2023
3 Posts
June 22 2023 10:06 GMT
#51
--- Nuked ---
Normal
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
OSC
12:30
King of the Hill Weekly #220
CranKy Ducklings71
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Harstem 476
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 33727
Horang2 3573
Bisu 1772
Flash 1319
Jaedong 999
Hyun 854
Barracks 815
EffOrt 574
Larva 478
Mini 385
[ Show more ]
Soulkey 370
actioN 363
Last 191
Killer 185
GuemChi 129
ZerO 126
Snow 124
Zeus 121
ToSsGirL 106
JYJ72
Leta 69
Backho 65
Rush 55
Sharp 52
Movie 50
sSak 45
sorry 39
Sea.KH 29
zelot 25
sas.Sziky 24
yabsab 23
Sacsri 21
[sc1f]eonzerg 17
Icarus 16
Noble 16
Shinee 15
ajuk12(nOOB) 13
Hm[arnc] 10
Aegong 4
Terrorterran 1
Dota 2
Gorgc3405
qojqva1035
BananaSlamJamma239
XcaliburYe202
Counter-Strike
x6flipin585
markeloff54
kRYSTAL_21
Other Games
singsing2206
B2W.Neo1075
hiko459
DeMusliM374
Fuzer 322
ToD88
Happy56
ZerO(Twitch)15
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 75
• davetesta50
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis1716
• Jankos802
Other Games
• WagamamaTV248
Upcoming Events
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
3h 15m
The PondCast
21h 15m
Online Event
1d 3h
Korean StarCraft League
2 days
CranKy Ducklings
2 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
2 days
Mihu vs QiaoGege
Zhanhun vs Dewalt
Fengzi vs TBD
Online Event
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
4 days
Bonyth vs TBD
OSC
5 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL 20 Non-Korean Championship
FEL Cracow 2025
Underdog Cup #2

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL 20 Team Wars
CC Div. A S7
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025

Upcoming

BSL 21 Qualifiers
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #1
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #2
ASL Season 20
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
SEL Season 2 Championship
WardiTV Summer 2025
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
HCC Europe
Yuqilin POB S2
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.