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StarDraKe
France65 Posts
( taking appart tastosis as it is clearly a trademark) I agree, that most of the time this is not very true and maybe it’s part of what the shoutcasters have to do but I always thought it’s also their way to translate their emotion of that moment. We all have different best series, games, players, move and that’s good. All in all, it’s good to point out that it’s not necessarily the last one the best and it’probably don t serve the game but it doesn’t hurt it too. Good article! | ||
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feardragon
United States973 Posts
On July 26 2018 23:48 Olli wrote: You're ignoring the second part of the article entirely. This isn't just about hyperbole. I responded to the 2nd part in my first post. Someone else responded only to tge first partvof my post so I was only responding to their argument there. | ||
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almightytivi
22 Posts
I have no doubt they are doing this with upper-management intentions, corporate intentions, maybe Blizzard intentions. This is the classic issue of those with boots-on-the-ground know what to do and would be better off if left to their own devices, but upper-management, those that sign their checks, or choose whether these casters will be invited again to cast the next tournament, keeps trying to micro-manage the shit out of our casters. The casters are one of us... let them be like us... if it was a Meh final, let them say what we think... it was a Meh final. We don't need so much positivity. We need and want caster expertise as well on psychology of the players. I'm SO DAMN ANNOYED that Zest getting 4-0'ed didn't have a huge 10 minute commentary on how this could happen to him, dissect, the re-dissect WTF happened... not taking ONE game, or how Maru really bested Zest 4-0, where did all of Zest skills just miss the mark? Or convince us how really Maru is that much better, or how Jin Air is the best player in the world... Maru wins, he gets what... 60-70% of the prize winnings? If Zest wins, well he gets 100% + maybe some fees or buying some dinners and gifts for those that helped him practice. To me, a 4-0 finals doesn't deserve less commentary and analysis, it deserves more for how this could happen, how or why was Maru's play so exceptional, how or why Zest's was so failing. Instead, we get positivity commentary about how periods of domination can be so exciting and great. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On July 26 2018 23:47 feardragon wrote: You might say Oli is using a hyperbole about how often hyperboles are used by “casters” in the scene. TBF, if we mainly look at offline events and neglect online stuff tastosis make up a big part of the casting now that they also cast wcs regularly. Maybe even most of the offline casting. So the point still kinda stands that way  I agree with the general statements in this article, why hyperbole is bad for the casting, etc. Don't really think it is a widespread issue among the casters though, calling out tastosis for it is still worth something though  | ||
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dankobanana
Croatia244 Posts
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Waxangel
United States33602 Posts
On July 26 2018 23:47 feardragon wrote: You might say Oli is using a hyperbole about how often hyperboles are used by “casters” in the scene. goddammit I was gonna use that joke don't sell me that simplified narrative that Olli 'hates' casters, he's a much more complex human being with a lot of depth to him  | ||
Soularion
Canada2764 Posts
I think sc2 as a community sometimes has the need to validate the game, by saying stuff like 'sc2 is better than its ever been!' 'this is the best player ever!' 'this is the best game ever!'. Stuff like that just isn't true, at least not absolutely true, if you go through and look at the history of the game, and other esports don't do it. You never see LoL casters being like 'holy shit, is Royal the best team ever?' or 'wow, Kingzone are the best korean team of all time!'. Other esports are very cautious about putting things into context, even traditional sports. You don't really see commentators for regular sports ever call something the greatest ever until it is well-vetted. It's easy to brush it under the rug and say 'oh, but it doesn't happen THAT often!' but no, it really does, and it seriously irks me - and a lot of TL writers, I imagine - to hear it so consistently in events. It's just part of how people cast, I guess. | ||
Olli
Austria24422 Posts
On July 27 2018 00:01 Waxangel wrote: goddammit I was gonna use that joke don't sell me that simplified narrative that Olli 'hates' casters, he's a much more complex human being with a lot of depth to him You're the worst Wax | ||
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Boggyb
2855 Posts
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Jonas :)
United States511 Posts
On July 26 2018 22:47 Waxangel wrote: I don't particularly agree with all the sentiments here (a good story is WORTH telling over and over again, simple or not), but I was quite entertained by your many, many caster clips. Also, how DARE you not mention the TRUE best game of all time, INnoVation vs TaeJa??? My boy Waxangel with the real truth. IMO Squirtle vs MVP is the most overhyped final. Parting vs Flash from HSC is the way better PvT final, IMO. Polt vs HerO in the final IEM Cologne 2014 was also at least as good (that series started off with a DRAW in game #1!) | ||
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Lorning
Belgica34432 Posts
In the same vein I've noticed a trend that, ironically, is part of the same phenomenon, yet results in the opposite effect. Commentators and even esports writers—I fully realize that we at TeamLiquid.net are at fault as well—tell stories by reducing players to a handful of core attributes. I think this has mostly to do with viewers/fans making their own narratives. We like to see players confirm what we say. See anything from the Artosis curse to the ByuN micro, like you said. This gives an extra dimension to watching the (E-)sport. Giving an extra reason to view: "Hey will this curse happen again???". Same thing happened recently during the world cup: This goal is a: - Banger - Set piece - Own goal - etc... | ||
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bartus88
Netherlands491 Posts
Tastosis are fantastic otherwise, but their overuse of hyperboles is a huge detriment to their casting. It can get very tiresome. | ||
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Dangermousecatdog
United Kingdom7084 Posts
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Olli
Austria24422 Posts
I think most casters are 'guilty' of it, even despite not pushing these on purpose. It's just that narratives originate somewhere, and then sort of become standard repertoire for all casters. I think the problem with that standard issue of caster phrases or player stereotypes is that it often overwrites talking points that are actually more pressing. But I've talked about this in the piece, and I don't know how better to put it than I did there. Not every victory is a function of a player's most notable trait. If INnoVation uses clever mindgames to take a series, then ditch the ‘mechanical robot’ stereotype and focus on his intelligence instead. If ByuN routinely mows through a pack of slow-banelings off creep, don't try to sell us on his incredible micro. Instead, tell us what he did to force the Zerg to resort to such a desperate move. StarCraft II is an incredibly difficult game, and you’re not giving players the credit they deserve when you don't explore the many other skills they've mastered. My issue with it is that players become these 'one-trick ponies' (ByuN's control, Rogue wants to take every game to lategame, TY does smart tactical moves, INnoVation's mechanics are awesome, etc.). And this is something I still see in almost every tournament. | ||
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Maynarde
Australia1286 Posts
On July 26 2018 23:52 almightytivi wrote: "I have no doubt they are doing this with good intentions..." Absolutely, WRONG. I have no doubt they are doing this with upper-management intentions, corporate intentions, maybe Blizzard intentions. *X-Files Theme Song* | ||
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Judgement
Netherlands152 Posts
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BisuDagger
Bisutopia19345 Posts
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rrrzzz
48 Posts
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Boggyb
2855 Posts
The other issue is that they don't have time to prepare something to say about every player that could possibly have a run in a weekend tournament so they just default to the defaults. Compare that to more traditional sports where casters are assigned a single game or series at a time and have days if not a week to prepare extensively. I'd say they still are just as lazy. Take a player like Brett Favre. At some point in time, he was given the label of gunslinger and any and all attempt to provide additional analysis completely stopped. | ||
EsportsJohn
United States4883 Posts
On July 27 2018 00:12 Jonas wrote:My boy Waxangel with the real truth. IMO Squirtle vs MVP is the most overhyped final. Parting vs Flash from HSC is the way better PvT final, IMO. Polt vs HerO in the final IEM Cologne 2014 was also at least as good (that series started off with a DRAW in game #1!) There are so many great finals that got swept under the rug. Leenock vs jjakji, Soulkey vs Innovation, sOs vs Innovation, Dear vs Maru, Puma vs MC, Life vs Mvp.... Edit: Dear vs Maru wasn't quite a finals, myb. | ||
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