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On December 27 2017 11:09 youngjiddle wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2017 03:17 pvsnp wrote:On December 26 2017 10:37 youngjiddle wrote:On December 26 2017 04:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 26 2017 02:07 youngjiddle wrote:On December 25 2017 18:07 Tyrhanius wrote:On December 25 2017 10:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 24 2017 17:28 Tyrhanius wrote:
Just a reminder that :
Rogue lost vs Bunny, Dark lost vs SoS, impact and solar vs Innovation, byul lost vs Zest, Soo lost vs Classic and gumiho.
That's clear Zerg isn't OP in any MU. Just a reminder that in that very same qualifier, exactly one Terran won exactly one series that was not a TvT (Gumiho beat soO). Every other time a Terran played a Protoss or Zerg, they lost. So TY, Maru, Inno, etc all failed to win a series over any Protoss or Zerg (mostly Protoss). Oh, and both qualifying matches were PvP, which obviously led to both qualified players being Protoss. Before the qualifier I was thinking Protoss needed some help, afterward I'm thinking some nerfs might be in order, especially with PvT. The IEM qualifier didn't have much in the way of PvZ, though I hear Protoss still struggles quite a bit there. Regardless of the actual balance state. we most likely won't get any changes until around January 5th or so, what with the holiday season. Why lying like that and say there is only a single non TvT won by a T ? Except Bunny 2-1 Dear, Gumiho 2-1 Creator, innovation has beaten solar and impact, Maru 2-1Patience, Ryung 2-0 Trap, + Bunny vs Rogue and gumiho vs soo. We all can see good T are all stopped by a good Protoss, no need to lie and to pretend they're doing worst that they actually do. try to just ignore pvsnp, I've found him to be the most biased and stupid balance whiner on these forums since I've started posting more often. Merry Christmas to you too! In my experience, such character assassinations tend to say more about the poster than the target, but hey, if you want to spend your Christmas Day making petty flame posts, I wish you only the best.  EDIT: Oh wait, you're the same guy who tried to flame me in the Protossed thread, aren't you? On December 22 2017 02:24 youngjiddle wrote:On December 20 2017 14:55 pvsnp wrote:
This line is obviously not referring to ladder losses, but rather community disgust towards Protoss bullshit at the highest levels of competitive SC2. Same goes for the rest of the article.
You're just attacking a strawman of "lol everyone who disagrees is a noob and needs to get good," and come off as a Protoss apologist (deliberately or not I will not speculate).
Now it's certainly possible, even probable, that the hostile comments and such are from people who hate Protoss as a result of losing on ladder........but that's an unproven (and unprovable) assumption. Characterizing them all as such without a shred of proof is the very definition of a strawman.
And I believe the popular term for Protoss "strategy" would be "bullshit."
Why that term is popular at all is the real question here. fuck off tbh Yeah, I guess character assassination is actually an improvement from raw profanity in your case. Up your game man, I know you can do better! @Tyrhanius On December 25 2017 18:07 Tyrhanius wrote:On December 25 2017 10:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 24 2017 17:28 Tyrhanius wrote:
Just a reminder that :
Rogue lost vs Bunny, Dark lost vs SoS, impact and solar vs Innovation, byul lost vs Zest, Soo lost vs Classic and gumiho.
That's clear Zerg isn't OP in any MU. Just a reminder that in that very same qualifier, exactly one Terran won exactly one series that was not a TvT (Gumiho beat soO). Every other time a Terran played a Protoss or Zerg, they lost. So TY, Maru, Inno, etc all failed to win a series over any Protoss or Zerg (mostly Protoss). Oh, and both qualifying matches were PvP, which obviously led to both qualified players being Protoss. Before the qualifier I was thinking Protoss needed some help, afterward I'm thinking some nerfs might be in order, especially with PvT. The IEM qualifier didn't have much in the way of PvZ, though I hear Protoss still struggles quite a bit there. Regardless of the actual balance state. we most likely won't get any changes until around January 5th or so, what with the holiday season. Why lying like that and say there is only a single non TvT won by a T ? Except Bunny 2-1 Dear, Gumiho 2-1 Creator, innovation has beaten solar and impact, Maru 2-1Patience, Ryung 2-0 Trap, + Bunny vs Rogue and gumiho vs soo. We all can see good T are all stopped by a good Protoss, no need to lie and to pretend they're doing worst that they actually do. I was referring to only the Stage 2 qualifiers, I somehow thought that TY and Maru made it to Stage 2. My bad, sorry about that. And I do agree with you that TvP is the problem here, TvZ is balanced pretty well atm. Merry Christmas! You copied and pasted only the "fuck off" part and left out all the other comments and context. so my point still stands. Yes of course, I forgot that “fuck off” has a huge number of completely different meanings depending on the context. My bad. Please, enlighten me as to what exactly you actually meant when you said “fuck off,” and how it isn’t actually raw profanity in the slightest. Next you’ll be telling me that: On December 26 2017 02:07 youngjiddle wrote:On December 25 2017 18:07 Tyrhanius wrote:On December 25 2017 10:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 24 2017 17:28 Tyrhanius wrote:
Just a reminder that :
Rogue lost vs Bunny, Dark lost vs SoS, impact and solar vs Innovation, byul lost vs Zest, Soo lost vs Classic and gumiho.
That's clear Zerg isn't OP in any MU. Just a reminder that in that very same qualifier, exactly one Terran won exactly one series that was not a TvT (Gumiho beat soO). Every other time a Terran played a Protoss or Zerg, they lost. So TY, Maru, Inno, etc all failed to win a series over any Protoss or Zerg (mostly Protoss). Oh, and both qualifying matches were PvP, which obviously led to both qualified players being Protoss. Before the qualifier I was thinking Protoss needed some help, afterward I'm thinking some nerfs might be in order, especially with PvT. The IEM qualifier didn't have much in the way of PvZ, though I hear Protoss still struggles quite a bit there. Regardless of the actual balance state. we most likely won't get any changes until around January 5th or so, what with the holiday season. Why lying like that and say there is only a single non TvT won by a T ? Except Bunny 2-1 Dear, Gumiho 2-1 Creator, innovation has beaten solar and impact, Maru 2-1Patience, Ryung 2-0 Trap, + Bunny vs Rogue and gumiho vs soo. We all can see good T are all stopped by a good Protoss, no need to lie and to pretend they're doing worst that they actually do. try to just ignore pvsnp, I've found him to be the most biased and stupid balance whiner on these forums since I've started posting more often. is not actually an insult, but rather the highest of compliments. No. In the post where I say "fuck off", there was a larger conversations that lead up to the "fuck off" you still seem to ignore to push your point of me being an asshole. Your whole arguement was that protoss wins were "bullshit" and I was not buying it. Again, you choose to ignore it and push your own reasoning based on incorrect facts, just like you did saying Terrans did not win a single non TvT above. You just say things as factual but aren't even true, like I find it so funny when you say "At the pro level, bio is not really viable", yet I saw multiple terrans going bio at the gsl qualifier, like innovation, and winning. I don't understand where you get your facts. More hilarious were your comments on the stalker, where you claimed the change to be massively imbalanced and claimed terrans would not win with the change. lo and behold winrates turned back to 52% and the race distribution has been balanced at the pro level.
So are we going back to facts instead of insults? Sorry pal, that ship's already sailed.
It's true that your insults were part of a larger conversation, but it's a conversation which I no longer feel any need to engage in. Because there's no need to discuss seriously with anyone who routinely resorts to character assassination, unilaterally decides on a personal interpretation of reality, and attempts to impose it on me. I find it extremely amusing that you of all people are accusing me of misconstruing the facts when in this post alone you've done nothing more than construct and viciously assault a straw man of my position. The irony is overwhelming.
I'm more than happy to laugh at your fallacies, but is blatantly obvious that there's nothing of substance to be gained here. There is simply no point in trying to conduct a civil discussion with an uncivilized person.
In your own words, fuck off.
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On December 27 2017 11:52 pvsnp wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2017 11:09 youngjiddle wrote:On December 27 2017 03:17 pvsnp wrote:On December 26 2017 10:37 youngjiddle wrote:On December 26 2017 04:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 26 2017 02:07 youngjiddle wrote:On December 25 2017 18:07 Tyrhanius wrote:On December 25 2017 10:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 24 2017 17:28 Tyrhanius wrote:
Just a reminder that :
Rogue lost vs Bunny, Dark lost vs SoS, impact and solar vs Innovation, byul lost vs Zest, Soo lost vs Classic and gumiho.
That's clear Zerg isn't OP in any MU. Just a reminder that in that very same qualifier, exactly one Terran won exactly one series that was not a TvT (Gumiho beat soO). Every other time a Terran played a Protoss or Zerg, they lost. So TY, Maru, Inno, etc all failed to win a series over any Protoss or Zerg (mostly Protoss). Oh, and both qualifying matches were PvP, which obviously led to both qualified players being Protoss. Before the qualifier I was thinking Protoss needed some help, afterward I'm thinking some nerfs might be in order, especially with PvT. The IEM qualifier didn't have much in the way of PvZ, though I hear Protoss still struggles quite a bit there. Regardless of the actual balance state. we most likely won't get any changes until around January 5th or so, what with the holiday season. Why lying like that and say there is only a single non TvT won by a T ? Except Bunny 2-1 Dear, Gumiho 2-1 Creator, innovation has beaten solar and impact, Maru 2-1Patience, Ryung 2-0 Trap, + Bunny vs Rogue and gumiho vs soo. We all can see good T are all stopped by a good Protoss, no need to lie and to pretend they're doing worst that they actually do. try to just ignore pvsnp, I've found him to be the most biased and stupid balance whiner on these forums since I've started posting more often. Merry Christmas to you too! In my experience, such character assassinations tend to say more about the poster than the target, but hey, if you want to spend your Christmas Day making petty flame posts, I wish you only the best. EDIT: Oh wait, you're the same guy who tried to flame me in the Protossed thread, aren't you? On December 22 2017 02:24 youngjiddle wrote:On December 20 2017 14:55 pvsnp wrote:
This line is obviously not referring to ladder losses, but rather community disgust towards Protoss bullshit at the highest levels of competitive SC2. Same goes for the rest of the article.
You're just attacking a strawman of "lol everyone who disagrees is a noob and needs to get good," and come off as a Protoss apologist (deliberately or not I will not speculate).
Now it's certainly possible, even probable, that the hostile comments and such are from people who hate Protoss as a result of losing on ladder........but that's an unproven (and unprovable) assumption. Characterizing them all as such without a shred of proof is the very definition of a strawman.
And I believe the popular term for Protoss "strategy" would be "bullshit."
Why that term is popular at all is the real question here. fuck off tbh Yeah, I guess character assassination is actually an improvement from raw profanity in your case. Up your game man, I know you can do better! @Tyrhanius On December 25 2017 18:07 Tyrhanius wrote:On December 25 2017 10:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 24 2017 17:28 Tyrhanius wrote:
Just a reminder that :
Rogue lost vs Bunny, Dark lost vs SoS, impact and solar vs Innovation, byul lost vs Zest, Soo lost vs Classic and gumiho.
That's clear Zerg isn't OP in any MU. Just a reminder that in that very same qualifier, exactly one Terran won exactly one series that was not a TvT (Gumiho beat soO). Every other time a Terran played a Protoss or Zerg, they lost. So TY, Maru, Inno, etc all failed to win a series over any Protoss or Zerg (mostly Protoss). Oh, and both qualifying matches were PvP, which obviously led to both qualified players being Protoss. Before the qualifier I was thinking Protoss needed some help, afterward I'm thinking some nerfs might be in order, especially with PvT. The IEM qualifier didn't have much in the way of PvZ, though I hear Protoss still struggles quite a bit there. Regardless of the actual balance state. we most likely won't get any changes until around January 5th or so, what with the holiday season. Why lying like that and say there is only a single non TvT won by a T ? Except Bunny 2-1 Dear, Gumiho 2-1 Creator, innovation has beaten solar and impact, Maru 2-1Patience, Ryung 2-0 Trap, + Bunny vs Rogue and gumiho vs soo. We all can see good T are all stopped by a good Protoss, no need to lie and to pretend they're doing worst that they actually do. I was referring to only the Stage 2 qualifiers, I somehow thought that TY and Maru made it to Stage 2. My bad, sorry about that. And I do agree with you that TvP is the problem here, TvZ is balanced pretty well atm. Merry Christmas! You copied and pasted only the "fuck off" part and left out all the other comments and context. so my point still stands. Yes of course, I forgot that “fuck off” has a huge number of completely different meanings depending on the context. My bad. Please, enlighten me as to what exactly you actually meant when you said “fuck off,” and how it isn’t actually raw profanity in the slightest. Next you’ll be telling me that: On December 26 2017 02:07 youngjiddle wrote:On December 25 2017 18:07 Tyrhanius wrote:On December 25 2017 10:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 24 2017 17:28 Tyrhanius wrote:
Just a reminder that :
Rogue lost vs Bunny, Dark lost vs SoS, impact and solar vs Innovation, byul lost vs Zest, Soo lost vs Classic and gumiho.
That's clear Zerg isn't OP in any MU. Just a reminder that in that very same qualifier, exactly one Terran won exactly one series that was not a TvT (Gumiho beat soO). Every other time a Terran played a Protoss or Zerg, they lost. So TY, Maru, Inno, etc all failed to win a series over any Protoss or Zerg (mostly Protoss). Oh, and both qualifying matches were PvP, which obviously led to both qualified players being Protoss. Before the qualifier I was thinking Protoss needed some help, afterward I'm thinking some nerfs might be in order, especially with PvT. The IEM qualifier didn't have much in the way of PvZ, though I hear Protoss still struggles quite a bit there. Regardless of the actual balance state. we most likely won't get any changes until around January 5th or so, what with the holiday season. Why lying like that and say there is only a single non TvT won by a T ? Except Bunny 2-1 Dear, Gumiho 2-1 Creator, innovation has beaten solar and impact, Maru 2-1Patience, Ryung 2-0 Trap, + Bunny vs Rogue and gumiho vs soo. We all can see good T are all stopped by a good Protoss, no need to lie and to pretend they're doing worst that they actually do. try to just ignore pvsnp, I've found him to be the most biased and stupid balance whiner on these forums since I've started posting more often. is not actually an insult, but rather the highest of compliments. No. In the post where I say "fuck off", there was a larger conversations that lead up to the "fuck off" you still seem to ignore to push your point of me being an asshole. Your whole arguement was that protoss wins were "bullshit" and I was not buying it. Again, you choose to ignore it and push your own reasoning based on incorrect facts, just like you did saying Terrans did not win a single non TvT above. You just say things as factual but aren't even true, like I find it so funny when you say "At the pro level, bio is not really viable", yet I saw multiple terrans going bio at the gsl qualifier, like innovation, and winning. I don't understand where you get your facts. More hilarious were your comments on the stalker, where you claimed the change to be massively imbalanced and claimed terrans would not win with the change. lo and behold winrates turned back to 52% and the race distribution has been balanced at the pro level. So are we going back to facts instead of insults? Sorry pal, that ship's already sailed. It's true that your insults were part of a larger conversation, but it's a conversation which I no longer feel any need to engage in. Because there's no need to discuss seriously with anyone who routinely resorts to character assassination, unilaterally decides on a personal interpretation of reality, and attempts to impose it on me. I find it extremely amusing that you of all people are accusing me of misconstruing the facts when in this post alone you've done nothing more than construct and viciously assault a straw man of my position. The irony is overwhelming. I'm more than happy to laugh at your fallacies, but is blatantly obvious that there's nothing of substance to be gained here. There is simply no point in trying to conduct a civil discussion with an uncivilized person. In your own words, fuck off.
Lol dear god people get so angry talking about a game
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On December 27 2017 14:01 starkiller123 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2017 11:52 pvsnp wrote:On December 27 2017 11:09 youngjiddle wrote:On December 27 2017 03:17 pvsnp wrote:On December 26 2017 10:37 youngjiddle wrote:On December 26 2017 04:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 26 2017 02:07 youngjiddle wrote:On December 25 2017 18:07 Tyrhanius wrote:On December 25 2017 10:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 24 2017 17:28 Tyrhanius wrote:
Just a reminder that :
Rogue lost vs Bunny, Dark lost vs SoS, impact and solar vs Innovation, byul lost vs Zest, Soo lost vs Classic and gumiho.
That's clear Zerg isn't OP in any MU. Just a reminder that in that very same qualifier, exactly one Terran won exactly one series that was not a TvT (Gumiho beat soO). Every other time a Terran played a Protoss or Zerg, they lost. So TY, Maru, Inno, etc all failed to win a series over any Protoss or Zerg (mostly Protoss). Oh, and both qualifying matches were PvP, which obviously led to both qualified players being Protoss. Before the qualifier I was thinking Protoss needed some help, afterward I'm thinking some nerfs might be in order, especially with PvT. The IEM qualifier didn't have much in the way of PvZ, though I hear Protoss still struggles quite a bit there. Regardless of the actual balance state. we most likely won't get any changes until around January 5th or so, what with the holiday season. Why lying like that and say there is only a single non TvT won by a T ? Except Bunny 2-1 Dear, Gumiho 2-1 Creator, innovation has beaten solar and impact, Maru 2-1Patience, Ryung 2-0 Trap, + Bunny vs Rogue and gumiho vs soo. We all can see good T are all stopped by a good Protoss, no need to lie and to pretend they're doing worst that they actually do. try to just ignore pvsnp, I've found him to be the most biased and stupid balance whiner on these forums since I've started posting more often. Merry Christmas to you too! In my experience, such character assassinations tend to say more about the poster than the target, but hey, if you want to spend your Christmas Day making petty flame posts, I wish you only the best. EDIT: Oh wait, you're the same guy who tried to flame me in the Protossed thread, aren't you? On December 22 2017 02:24 youngjiddle wrote:On December 20 2017 14:55 pvsnp wrote:
This line is obviously not referring to ladder losses, but rather community disgust towards Protoss bullshit at the highest levels of competitive SC2. Same goes for the rest of the article.
You're just attacking a strawman of "lol everyone who disagrees is a noob and needs to get good," and come off as a Protoss apologist (deliberately or not I will not speculate).
Now it's certainly possible, even probable, that the hostile comments and such are from people who hate Protoss as a result of losing on ladder........but that's an unproven (and unprovable) assumption. Characterizing them all as such without a shred of proof is the very definition of a strawman.
And I believe the popular term for Protoss "strategy" would be "bullshit."
Why that term is popular at all is the real question here. fuck off tbh Yeah, I guess character assassination is actually an improvement from raw profanity in your case. Up your game man, I know you can do better! @Tyrhanius On December 25 2017 18:07 Tyrhanius wrote:On December 25 2017 10:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 24 2017 17:28 Tyrhanius wrote:
Just a reminder that :
Rogue lost vs Bunny, Dark lost vs SoS, impact and solar vs Innovation, byul lost vs Zest, Soo lost vs Classic and gumiho.
That's clear Zerg isn't OP in any MU. Just a reminder that in that very same qualifier, exactly one Terran won exactly one series that was not a TvT (Gumiho beat soO). Every other time a Terran played a Protoss or Zerg, they lost. So TY, Maru, Inno, etc all failed to win a series over any Protoss or Zerg (mostly Protoss). Oh, and both qualifying matches were PvP, which obviously led to both qualified players being Protoss. Before the qualifier I was thinking Protoss needed some help, afterward I'm thinking some nerfs might be in order, especially with PvT. The IEM qualifier didn't have much in the way of PvZ, though I hear Protoss still struggles quite a bit there. Regardless of the actual balance state. we most likely won't get any changes until around January 5th or so, what with the holiday season. Why lying like that and say there is only a single non TvT won by a T ? Except Bunny 2-1 Dear, Gumiho 2-1 Creator, innovation has beaten solar and impact, Maru 2-1Patience, Ryung 2-0 Trap, + Bunny vs Rogue and gumiho vs soo. We all can see good T are all stopped by a good Protoss, no need to lie and to pretend they're doing worst that they actually do. I was referring to only the Stage 2 qualifiers, I somehow thought that TY and Maru made it to Stage 2. My bad, sorry about that. And I do agree with you that TvP is the problem here, TvZ is balanced pretty well atm. Merry Christmas! You copied and pasted only the "fuck off" part and left out all the other comments and context. so my point still stands. Yes of course, I forgot that “fuck off” has a huge number of completely different meanings depending on the context. My bad. Please, enlighten me as to what exactly you actually meant when you said “fuck off,” and how it isn’t actually raw profanity in the slightest. Next you’ll be telling me that: On December 26 2017 02:07 youngjiddle wrote:On December 25 2017 18:07 Tyrhanius wrote:On December 25 2017 10:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 24 2017 17:28 Tyrhanius wrote:
Just a reminder that :
Rogue lost vs Bunny, Dark lost vs SoS, impact and solar vs Innovation, byul lost vs Zest, Soo lost vs Classic and gumiho.
That's clear Zerg isn't OP in any MU. Just a reminder that in that very same qualifier, exactly one Terran won exactly one series that was not a TvT (Gumiho beat soO). Every other time a Terran played a Protoss or Zerg, they lost. So TY, Maru, Inno, etc all failed to win a series over any Protoss or Zerg (mostly Protoss). Oh, and both qualifying matches were PvP, which obviously led to both qualified players being Protoss. Before the qualifier I was thinking Protoss needed some help, afterward I'm thinking some nerfs might be in order, especially with PvT. The IEM qualifier didn't have much in the way of PvZ, though I hear Protoss still struggles quite a bit there. Regardless of the actual balance state. we most likely won't get any changes until around January 5th or so, what with the holiday season. Why lying like that and say there is only a single non TvT won by a T ? Except Bunny 2-1 Dear, Gumiho 2-1 Creator, innovation has beaten solar and impact, Maru 2-1Patience, Ryung 2-0 Trap, + Bunny vs Rogue and gumiho vs soo. We all can see good T are all stopped by a good Protoss, no need to lie and to pretend they're doing worst that they actually do. try to just ignore pvsnp, I've found him to be the most biased and stupid balance whiner on these forums since I've started posting more often. is not actually an insult, but rather the highest of compliments. No. In the post where I say "fuck off", there was a larger conversations that lead up to the "fuck off" you still seem to ignore to push your point of me being an asshole. Your whole arguement was that protoss wins were "bullshit" and I was not buying it. Again, you choose to ignore it and push your own reasoning based on incorrect facts, just like you did saying Terrans did not win a single non TvT above. You just say things as factual but aren't even true, like I find it so funny when you say "At the pro level, bio is not really viable", yet I saw multiple terrans going bio at the gsl qualifier, like innovation, and winning. I don't understand where you get your facts. More hilarious were your comments on the stalker, where you claimed the change to be massively imbalanced and claimed terrans would not win with the change. lo and behold winrates turned back to 52% and the race distribution has been balanced at the pro level. So are we going back to facts instead of insults? Sorry pal, that ship's already sailed. It's true that your insults were part of a larger conversation, but it's a conversation which I no longer feel any need to engage in. Because there's no need to discuss seriously with anyone who routinely resorts to character assassination, unilaterally decides on a personal interpretation of reality, and attempts to impose it on me. I find it extremely amusing that you of all people are accusing me of misconstruing the facts when in this post alone you've done nothing more than construct and viciously assault a straw man of my position. The irony is overwhelming. I'm more than happy to laugh at your fallacies, but is blatantly obvious that there's nothing of substance to be gained here. There is simply no point in trying to conduct a civil discussion with an uncivilized person. In your own words, fuck off. Lol dear god people get so angry talking about a game
My Christmas hangover got worse over the day, makes me tetchy. 
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On December 27 2017 11:52 pvsnp wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2017 11:09 youngjiddle wrote:On December 27 2017 03:17 pvsnp wrote:On December 26 2017 10:37 youngjiddle wrote:On December 26 2017 04:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 26 2017 02:07 youngjiddle wrote:On December 25 2017 18:07 Tyrhanius wrote:On December 25 2017 10:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 24 2017 17:28 Tyrhanius wrote:
Just a reminder that :
Rogue lost vs Bunny, Dark lost vs SoS, impact and solar vs Innovation, byul lost vs Zest, Soo lost vs Classic and gumiho.
That's clear Zerg isn't OP in any MU. Just a reminder that in that very same qualifier, exactly one Terran won exactly one series that was not a TvT (Gumiho beat soO). Every other time a Terran played a Protoss or Zerg, they lost. So TY, Maru, Inno, etc all failed to win a series over any Protoss or Zerg (mostly Protoss). Oh, and both qualifying matches were PvP, which obviously led to both qualified players being Protoss. Before the qualifier I was thinking Protoss needed some help, afterward I'm thinking some nerfs might be in order, especially with PvT. The IEM qualifier didn't have much in the way of PvZ, though I hear Protoss still struggles quite a bit there. Regardless of the actual balance state. we most likely won't get any changes until around January 5th or so, what with the holiday season. Why lying like that and say there is only a single non TvT won by a T ? Except Bunny 2-1 Dear, Gumiho 2-1 Creator, innovation has beaten solar and impact, Maru 2-1Patience, Ryung 2-0 Trap, + Bunny vs Rogue and gumiho vs soo. We all can see good T are all stopped by a good Protoss, no need to lie and to pretend they're doing worst that they actually do. try to just ignore pvsnp, I've found him to be the most biased and stupid balance whiner on these forums since I've started posting more often. Merry Christmas to you too! In my experience, such character assassinations tend to say more about the poster than the target, but hey, if you want to spend your Christmas Day making petty flame posts, I wish you only the best. EDIT: Oh wait, you're the same guy who tried to flame me in the Protossed thread, aren't you? On December 22 2017 02:24 youngjiddle wrote:On December 20 2017 14:55 pvsnp wrote:
This line is obviously not referring to ladder losses, but rather community disgust towards Protoss bullshit at the highest levels of competitive SC2. Same goes for the rest of the article.
You're just attacking a strawman of "lol everyone who disagrees is a noob and needs to get good," and come off as a Protoss apologist (deliberately or not I will not speculate).
Now it's certainly possible, even probable, that the hostile comments and such are from people who hate Protoss as a result of losing on ladder........but that's an unproven (and unprovable) assumption. Characterizing them all as such without a shred of proof is the very definition of a strawman.
And I believe the popular term for Protoss "strategy" would be "bullshit."
Why that term is popular at all is the real question here. fuck off tbh Yeah, I guess character assassination is actually an improvement from raw profanity in your case. Up your game man, I know you can do better! @Tyrhanius On December 25 2017 18:07 Tyrhanius wrote:On December 25 2017 10:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 24 2017 17:28 Tyrhanius wrote:
Just a reminder that :
Rogue lost vs Bunny, Dark lost vs SoS, impact and solar vs Innovation, byul lost vs Zest, Soo lost vs Classic and gumiho.
That's clear Zerg isn't OP in any MU. Just a reminder that in that very same qualifier, exactly one Terran won exactly one series that was not a TvT (Gumiho beat soO). Every other time a Terran played a Protoss or Zerg, they lost. So TY, Maru, Inno, etc all failed to win a series over any Protoss or Zerg (mostly Protoss). Oh, and both qualifying matches were PvP, which obviously led to both qualified players being Protoss. Before the qualifier I was thinking Protoss needed some help, afterward I'm thinking some nerfs might be in order, especially with PvT. The IEM qualifier didn't have much in the way of PvZ, though I hear Protoss still struggles quite a bit there. Regardless of the actual balance state. we most likely won't get any changes until around January 5th or so, what with the holiday season. Why lying like that and say there is only a single non TvT won by a T ? Except Bunny 2-1 Dear, Gumiho 2-1 Creator, innovation has beaten solar and impact, Maru 2-1Patience, Ryung 2-0 Trap, + Bunny vs Rogue and gumiho vs soo. We all can see good T are all stopped by a good Protoss, no need to lie and to pretend they're doing worst that they actually do. I was referring to only the Stage 2 qualifiers, I somehow thought that TY and Maru made it to Stage 2. My bad, sorry about that. And I do agree with you that TvP is the problem here, TvZ is balanced pretty well atm. Merry Christmas! You copied and pasted only the "fuck off" part and left out all the other comments and context. so my point still stands. Yes of course, I forgot that “fuck off” has a huge number of completely different meanings depending on the context. My bad. Please, enlighten me as to what exactly you actually meant when you said “fuck off,” and how it isn’t actually raw profanity in the slightest. Next you’ll be telling me that: On December 26 2017 02:07 youngjiddle wrote:On December 25 2017 18:07 Tyrhanius wrote:On December 25 2017 10:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 24 2017 17:28 Tyrhanius wrote:
Just a reminder that :
Rogue lost vs Bunny, Dark lost vs SoS, impact and solar vs Innovation, byul lost vs Zest, Soo lost vs Classic and gumiho.
That's clear Zerg isn't OP in any MU. Just a reminder that in that very same qualifier, exactly one Terran won exactly one series that was not a TvT (Gumiho beat soO). Every other time a Terran played a Protoss or Zerg, they lost. So TY, Maru, Inno, etc all failed to win a series over any Protoss or Zerg (mostly Protoss). Oh, and both qualifying matches were PvP, which obviously led to both qualified players being Protoss. Before the qualifier I was thinking Protoss needed some help, afterward I'm thinking some nerfs might be in order, especially with PvT. The IEM qualifier didn't have much in the way of PvZ, though I hear Protoss still struggles quite a bit there. Regardless of the actual balance state. we most likely won't get any changes until around January 5th or so, what with the holiday season. Why lying like that and say there is only a single non TvT won by a T ? Except Bunny 2-1 Dear, Gumiho 2-1 Creator, innovation has beaten solar and impact, Maru 2-1Patience, Ryung 2-0 Trap, + Bunny vs Rogue and gumiho vs soo. We all can see good T are all stopped by a good Protoss, no need to lie and to pretend they're doing worst that they actually do. try to just ignore pvsnp, I've found him to be the most biased and stupid balance whiner on these forums since I've started posting more often. is not actually an insult, but rather the highest of compliments. No. In the post where I say "fuck off", there was a larger conversations that lead up to the "fuck off" you still seem to ignore to push your point of me being an asshole. Your whole arguement was that protoss wins were "bullshit" and I was not buying it. Again, you choose to ignore it and push your own reasoning based on incorrect facts, just like you did saying Terrans did not win a single non TvT above. You just say things as factual but aren't even true, like I find it so funny when you say "At the pro level, bio is not really viable", yet I saw multiple terrans going bio at the gsl qualifier, like innovation, and winning. I don't understand where you get your facts. More hilarious were your comments on the stalker, where you claimed the change to be massively imbalanced and claimed terrans would not win with the change. lo and behold winrates turned back to 52% and the race distribution has been balanced at the pro level. So are we going back to facts instead of insults? Sorry pal, that ship's already sailed. It's true that your insults were part of a larger conversation, but it's a conversation which I no longer feel any need to engage in. Because there's no need to discuss seriously with anyone who routinely resorts to character assassination, unilaterally decides on a personal interpretation of reality, and attempts to impose it on me. I find it extremely amusing that you of all people are accusing me of misconstruing the facts when in this post alone you've done nothing more than construct and viciously assault a straw man of my position. The irony is overwhelming. I'm more than happy to laugh at your fallacies, but is blatantly obvious that there's nothing of substance to be gained here. There is simply no point in trying to conduct a civil discussion with an uncivilized person. In your own words, fuck off.
tip tip tip tip tip m' lady
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everybody complaining about theses patches. But marines, banelings and adepts are still broken like...forever \m/
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On December 28 2017 00:57 StarscreamG1 wrote:
everybody complaining about theses patches. But marines, banelings and adepts are still broken like...forever \m/
How so? Bio prity much sucks at the pro level right now, adepts got nerfed awhile back and are not really matchup defining in any mu. Banes might need to be looked at if blizzard adjusts hydra bane to make bio better and help Protoss in pvz. But I don't understand your post.
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On December 27 2017 22:57 youngjiddle wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2017 11:52 pvsnp wrote:On December 27 2017 11:09 youngjiddle wrote:On December 27 2017 03:17 pvsnp wrote:On December 26 2017 10:37 youngjiddle wrote:On December 26 2017 04:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 26 2017 02:07 youngjiddle wrote:On December 25 2017 18:07 Tyrhanius wrote:On December 25 2017 10:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 24 2017 17:28 Tyrhanius wrote:
Just a reminder that :
Rogue lost vs Bunny, Dark lost vs SoS, impact and solar vs Innovation, byul lost vs Zest, Soo lost vs Classic and gumiho.
That's clear Zerg isn't OP in any MU. Just a reminder that in that very same qualifier, exactly one Terran won exactly one series that was not a TvT (Gumiho beat soO). Every other time a Terran played a Protoss or Zerg, they lost. So TY, Maru, Inno, etc all failed to win a series over any Protoss or Zerg (mostly Protoss). Oh, and both qualifying matches were PvP, which obviously led to both qualified players being Protoss. Before the qualifier I was thinking Protoss needed some help, afterward I'm thinking some nerfs might be in order, especially with PvT. The IEM qualifier didn't have much in the way of PvZ, though I hear Protoss still struggles quite a bit there. Regardless of the actual balance state. we most likely won't get any changes until around January 5th or so, what with the holiday season. Why lying like that and say there is only a single non TvT won by a T ? Except Bunny 2-1 Dear, Gumiho 2-1 Creator, innovation has beaten solar and impact, Maru 2-1Patience, Ryung 2-0 Trap, + Bunny vs Rogue and gumiho vs soo. We all can see good T are all stopped by a good Protoss, no need to lie and to pretend they're doing worst that they actually do. try to just ignore pvsnp, I've found him to be the most biased and stupid balance whiner on these forums since I've started posting more often. Merry Christmas to you too! In my experience, such character assassinations tend to say more about the poster than the target, but hey, if you want to spend your Christmas Day making petty flame posts, I wish you only the best. EDIT: Oh wait, you're the same guy who tried to flame me in the Protossed thread, aren't you? On December 22 2017 02:24 youngjiddle wrote:On December 20 2017 14:55 pvsnp wrote:
This line is obviously not referring to ladder losses, but rather community disgust towards Protoss bullshit at the highest levels of competitive SC2. Same goes for the rest of the article.
You're just attacking a strawman of "lol everyone who disagrees is a noob and needs to get good," and come off as a Protoss apologist (deliberately or not I will not speculate).
Now it's certainly possible, even probable, that the hostile comments and such are from people who hate Protoss as a result of losing on ladder........but that's an unproven (and unprovable) assumption. Characterizing them all as such without a shred of proof is the very definition of a strawman.
And I believe the popular term for Protoss "strategy" would be "bullshit."
Why that term is popular at all is the real question here. fuck off tbh Yeah, I guess character assassination is actually an improvement from raw profanity in your case. Up your game man, I know you can do better! @Tyrhanius On December 25 2017 18:07 Tyrhanius wrote:On December 25 2017 10:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 24 2017 17:28 Tyrhanius wrote:
Just a reminder that :
Rogue lost vs Bunny, Dark lost vs SoS, impact and solar vs Innovation, byul lost vs Zest, Soo lost vs Classic and gumiho.
That's clear Zerg isn't OP in any MU. Just a reminder that in that very same qualifier, exactly one Terran won exactly one series that was not a TvT (Gumiho beat soO). Every other time a Terran played a Protoss or Zerg, they lost. So TY, Maru, Inno, etc all failed to win a series over any Protoss or Zerg (mostly Protoss). Oh, and both qualifying matches were PvP, which obviously led to both qualified players being Protoss. Before the qualifier I was thinking Protoss needed some help, afterward I'm thinking some nerfs might be in order, especially with PvT. The IEM qualifier didn't have much in the way of PvZ, though I hear Protoss still struggles quite a bit there. Regardless of the actual balance state. we most likely won't get any changes until around January 5th or so, what with the holiday season. Why lying like that and say there is only a single non TvT won by a T ? Except Bunny 2-1 Dear, Gumiho 2-1 Creator, innovation has beaten solar and impact, Maru 2-1Patience, Ryung 2-0 Trap, + Bunny vs Rogue and gumiho vs soo. We all can see good T are all stopped by a good Protoss, no need to lie and to pretend they're doing worst that they actually do. I was referring to only the Stage 2 qualifiers, I somehow thought that TY and Maru made it to Stage 2. My bad, sorry about that. And I do agree with you that TvP is the problem here, TvZ is balanced pretty well atm. Merry Christmas! You copied and pasted only the "fuck off" part and left out all the other comments and context. so my point still stands. Yes of course, I forgot that “fuck off” has a huge number of completely different meanings depending on the context. My bad. Please, enlighten me as to what exactly you actually meant when you said “fuck off,” and how it isn’t actually raw profanity in the slightest. Next you’ll be telling me that: On December 26 2017 02:07 youngjiddle wrote:On December 25 2017 18:07 Tyrhanius wrote:On December 25 2017 10:51 pvsnp wrote:On December 24 2017 17:28 Tyrhanius wrote:
Just a reminder that :
Rogue lost vs Bunny, Dark lost vs SoS, impact and solar vs Innovation, byul lost vs Zest, Soo lost vs Classic and gumiho.
That's clear Zerg isn't OP in any MU. Just a reminder that in that very same qualifier, exactly one Terran won exactly one series that was not a TvT (Gumiho beat soO). Every other time a Terran played a Protoss or Zerg, they lost. So TY, Maru, Inno, etc all failed to win a series over any Protoss or Zerg (mostly Protoss). Oh, and both qualifying matches were PvP, which obviously led to both qualified players being Protoss. Before the qualifier I was thinking Protoss needed some help, afterward I'm thinking some nerfs might be in order, especially with PvT. The IEM qualifier didn't have much in the way of PvZ, though I hear Protoss still struggles quite a bit there. Regardless of the actual balance state. we most likely won't get any changes until around January 5th or so, what with the holiday season. Why lying like that and say there is only a single non TvT won by a T ? Except Bunny 2-1 Dear, Gumiho 2-1 Creator, innovation has beaten solar and impact, Maru 2-1Patience, Ryung 2-0 Trap, + Bunny vs Rogue and gumiho vs soo. We all can see good T are all stopped by a good Protoss, no need to lie and to pretend they're doing worst that they actually do. try to just ignore pvsnp, I've found him to be the most biased and stupid balance whiner on these forums since I've started posting more often. is not actually an insult, but rather the highest of compliments. No. In the post where I say "fuck off", there was a larger conversations that lead up to the "fuck off" you still seem to ignore to push your point of me being an asshole. Your whole arguement was that protoss wins were "bullshit" and I was not buying it. Again, you choose to ignore it and push your own reasoning based on incorrect facts, just like you did saying Terrans did not win a single non TvT above. You just say things as factual but aren't even true, like I find it so funny when you say "At the pro level, bio is not really viable", yet I saw multiple terrans going bio at the gsl qualifier, like innovation, and winning. I don't understand where you get your facts. More hilarious were your comments on the stalker, where you claimed the change to be massively imbalanced and claimed terrans would not win with the change. lo and behold winrates turned back to 52% and the race distribution has been balanced at the pro level. So are we going back to facts instead of insults? Sorry pal, that ship's already sailed. It's true that your insults were part of a larger conversation, but it's a conversation which I no longer feel any need to engage in. Because there's no need to discuss seriously with anyone who routinely resorts to character assassination, unilaterally decides on a personal interpretation of reality, and attempts to impose it on me. I find it extremely amusing that you of all people are accusing me of misconstruing the facts when in this post alone you've done nothing more than construct and viciously assault a straw man of my position. The irony is overwhelming. I'm more than happy to laugh at your fallacies, but is blatantly obvious that there's nothing of substance to be gained here. There is simply no point in trying to conduct a civil discussion with an uncivilized person. In your own words, fuck off. tip tip tip tip tip m' lady
Thanks for proving my point.
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Does Blizzard know that their matchmaking kills their game?
Look at that:
https://imgur.com/a/8FMiG
What happened here, is that me and someone else had to play with an absolute beginner. Opponent had one disconnect before start, hence they got increased income, while we had that guy that we somehow tried to adapt to and integrate into our game, which was not possible in no way. We lost to P air after all with double zerg, while he blocked expansions. When he left I got 10k mins, even though he almost gathered nothing with the 6-7 drones he had on his bases each.
The question that comes up is, why is that? Why do long term players have to play with/agains starters constantly? Is that some left wing equality shit?
I know that noone enjoys that kind of matchmaking. Why can't players play with/against others on similar rank?
I started playing 3v3 rt a few weeks ago at platin1 and played up to master2. What I can say and observe again is that your own rank barely makes any difference in what kind of match you get, of course the average is increasing, but deveations stay huge. It is mostly random at the end of the day and you never know what you get.
However what I observe as well is that the more similar the teams/opponents ranks are the more fun it is to play. Furthermore it took me ages to get out of platin1/diamond3 cause these games were fully random and you cannot predict team/opponent behaviour at all on that level, they do random stuff all day. Whenever I got streaks of games with/against similar/same rank my results improved alot and I advanced into higher leagues fast. Actually MM should be the other way round. You should get out fast from bottom leagues, as an advanced player, and then progress should slow down, not the other way round.
For me and many others that kind of gameplay is a full waste of time and a fun killer and not what we are looking for when playing starcraft. Is there any chance that can be improved?
As well 1on1 should be counted into team game MMR, as that is the most important factor for the skill of a player, just as I suggested some pages before.
Another problem is that skill is distributed randomly amongst leages and ranks. You find 1on1 GM players on diamond 3 3v3rt and you find people that have started SC2 with f2p patch on diamond 3. The same is true with master 1-3. The rank of a player in 3v3 rt does only to a very small extent represent his skill.
Both of these problems mixed together create the nightmare of matchmaking that SC2 is. I have decided that it is not worth my time and turn my back to it again, even tho I'd like to play some SC2 in general.
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On January 02 2018 10:52 LSN wrote:Does Blizzard know that their matchmaking kills their game? Look at that: https://imgur.com/a/8FMiGWhat happened here, is that me and someone else had to play with an absolute beginner. Opponent had one disconnect before start, hence they got increased income, while we had that guy that we somehow tried to adapt to and integrate into our game, which was not possible in no way. We lost to P air after all with double zerg, while he blocked expansions. When he left I got 10k mins, even though he almost gathered nothing with the 6-7 drones he had on his bases each. The question that comes up is, why is that? Why do long term players have to play with/agains starters constantly? Is that some left wing equality shit? I know that noone enjoys that kind of matchmaking. Why can't players play with/against others on similar rank? I started playing 3v3 rt a few weeks ago at platin1 and played up to master2. What I can say and observe again is that your own rank barely makes any difference in what kind of match you get, of course the average is increasing, but deveations stay huge. It is mostly random at the end of the day and you never know what you get. However what I observe as well is that the more similar the teams/opponents ranks are the more fun it is to play. Furthermore it took me ages to get out of platin1/diamond3 cause these games were fully random and you cannot predict team/opponent behaviour at all on that level, they do random stuff all day. Whenever I got streaks of games with/against similar/same rank my results improved alot and I advanced into higher leagues fast. Actually MM should be the other way round. You should get out fast from bottom leagues, as an advanced player, and then progress should slow down, not the other way round. For me and many others that kind of gameplay is a full waste of time and a fun killer and not what we are looking for when playing starcraft. Is there any chance that can be improved? As well 1on1 should be counted into team game MMR, as that is the most important factor for the skill of a player, just as I suggested some pages before. Another problem is that skill is distributed randomly amongst leages and ranks. You find 1on1 GM players on diamond 3 3v3rt and you find people that have started SC2 with f2p patch on diamond 3. The same is true with master 1-3. The rank of a player in 3v3 rt does only to a very small extent represent his skill. Both of these problems mixed together create the nightmare of matchmaking that SC2 is. I have decided that it is not worth my time and turn my back to it again, even tho I'd like to play some SC2 in general.
thanks for sharing, its 3v3 lol no one takes it seriously
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Well the only option is to play 1on1 or fixed teams then, which is both way too serious for me at that point of time.
Let me provide a solution:
The whole teamgame system and ranking must be recreated from scratch.
- 3on3/4on4 fixed team is almost impossible to arrange anyway. Who can play with always the same 2-3 mates? I know noone. 2on2 is possible, as you only have to arrange with one guy.
SC2 requires a new system which allows players to use the same rank in RT and fixed team. That "skill level" of a player should be composed of the ingredients that I already showed some pages above.
That creates the opportunity to make teamgames fun, real challenging and more easily accessible for anyone, high level players included, which then would not have to grind through the low levels. As well you could play fixed team games without having to do placement matches every time you swap a player.
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i hope they release a final expansion that incorporates all the balance stuff learned from wol, hots, and lotv
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All big tournaments are in the 1v1 format, and the game is balanced for it. It's all about early aggression and allins in teamgames, since aggressive early game play can utilize multiple teammates, while defensive play can only protect one self. This is why teamgames are all about rushes and allins, and also why you see people who are bronze/silver in 1v1 get to diamond/masters in teamgames. Grinding early game cheese is much more effective in teamgames than in 1v1, which makes build diversity lacking, which means the only people left interested are the ones that enjoy grinding cheese.
I don't think your solutions to teamgames will solve anything. The player skill spread in teamgames is caused by few players, and few players are caused by low interest, which is caused by teamgames most of the time end up to be rush cesspools and 1-base play.
What you really need is a teamgame-specific balance, which probably won't be very compatible with 1v1. This is obviously not a very good solution either, and people have thought about this for a long time now, and most people have reached the conclusion that teamgames are nothing but casual fun that only gets worse the more players you add.
...Or blizzard already solved the problem with people wanting to play together and created Co-op with missions actually designed for multiple people.
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On January 02 2018 10:52 LSN wrote:Does Blizzard know that their matchmaking kills their game? Look at that: https://imgur.com/a/8FMiGWhat happened here, is that me and someone else had to play with an absolute beginner. Opponent had one disconnect before start, hence they got increased income, while we had that guy that we somehow tried to adapt to and integrate into our game, which was not possible in no way. We lost to P air after all with double zerg, while he blocked expansions. When he left I got 10k mins, even though he almost gathered nothing with the 6-7 drones he had on his bases each. The question that comes up is, why is that? Why do long term players have to play with/agains starters constantly? Is that some left wing equality shit? I know that noone enjoys that kind of matchmaking. Why can't players play with/against others on similar rank? I started playing 3v3 rt a few weeks ago at platin1 and played up to master2. What I can say and observe again is that your own rank barely makes any difference in what kind of match you get, of course the average is increasing, but deveations stay huge. It is mostly random at the end of the day and you never know what you get. However what I observe as well is that the more similar the teams/opponents ranks are the more fun it is to play. Furthermore it took me ages to get out of platin1/diamond3 cause these games were fully random and you cannot predict team/opponent behaviour at all on that level, they do random stuff all day. Whenever I got streaks of games with/against similar/same rank my results improved alot and I advanced into higher leagues fast. Actually MM should be the other way round. You should get out fast from bottom leagues, as an advanced player, and then progress should slow down, not the other way round. For me and many others that kind of gameplay is a full waste of time and a fun killer and not what we are looking for when playing starcraft. Is there any chance that can be improved? As well 1on1 should be counted into team game MMR, as that is the most important factor for the skill of a player, just as I suggested some pages before. Another problem is that skill is distributed randomly amongst leages and ranks. You find 1on1 GM players on diamond 3 3v3rt and you find people that have started SC2 with f2p patch on diamond 3. The same is true with master 1-3. The rank of a player in 3v3 rt does only to a very small extent represent his skill. Both of these problems mixed together create the nightmare of matchmaking that SC2 is. I have decided that it is not worth my time and turn my back to it again, even tho I'd like to play some SC2 in general.
Everyone knows only the 1v1 skill matters, the teamleague rank doesn't matter.
But it's quite paradoxal, because people play teamgames because it's easier to get master compared to reaching 1v1 master, but they complain that they are matched vs real 1v1 master and loses.
It seems :
"I play teamgames to farm noobs, but sometimes i'm myself the noob who got farmed and now it's frustrating lol."
Honestly, when i've faced Demuslin on 4v4 i wasn't like "woo it's so imbalance", but "Well it's cool to get matched vs some pro", but you imagine he destroyed us.
But sometimes you don't get a GM but a beginner, that's the game ^^
Also, better matchmaking would mean 20-30min to find a game.
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On January 02 2018 16:56 WaesumNinja wrote:
All big tournaments are in the 1v1 format, and the game is balanced for it. It's all about early aggression and allins in teamgames, since aggressive early game play can utilize multiple teammates, while defensive play can only protect one self. This is why teamgames are all about rushes and allins, and also why you see people who are bronze/silver in 1v1 get to diamond/masters in teamgames. Grinding early game cheese is much more effective in teamgames than in 1v1, which makes build diversity lacking, which means the only people left interested are the ones that enjoy grinding cheese.
I don't think your solutions to teamgames will solve anything. The player skill spread in teamgames is caused by few players, and few players are caused by low interest, which is caused by teamgames most of the time end up to be rush cesspools and 1-base play.
What you really need is a teamgame-specific balance, which probably won't be very compatible with 1v1. This is obviously not a very good solution either, and people have thought about this for a long time now, and most people have reached the conclusion that teamgames are nothing but casual fun that only gets worse the more players you add.
...Or blizzard already solved the problem with people wanting to play together and created Co-op with missions actually designed for multiple people.
the only people left interested are the ones that enjoy grinding cheese
I am pretty sure that is wrong. TGs are good to interest new players to the game. I assume there are way more casual players than pro players and teamgames are played way more than 1on1s overall.
The player skill spread in teamgames is caused by few players, and few players are caused by low interest, which is caused by teamgames most of the time end up to be rush cesspools and 1-base play.
Thats wrong. Skill spread is due to cluttering of TGs. Barely anyone has enough time/will to play enough games of each TG mode so that their rank can come close to their skill. 22rt, 33rt, 44rt, 22 with bob, 22 with sally, 33 with bob and sally, 33 with bob and anton, 33 with sally and anton, 4on4 with with bob sally and anton, ....
Thats what I provide solution for. It was dump from beginning to clutter it up that much. What I suggest is 1 rank for each 22/33/44 for each player/race, no matter if they plays RT or fixed, that is based on 1on1 to a good extend when available.
most people have reached the conclusion that teamgames are nothing but casual fun that only gets worse the more players you add.
Exactly! But that it must be that way is just a belief. It doesn't require a seperate balance and I would not enjoy/play that at all if it got that.
@Tyrhanius
Everyone knows only the 1v1 skill matters, the teamleague rank doesn't matter.
Exactly that is going to be adressed. Then TG rank will matter more. Anyway TG rank does not know about that only the 1on1 skill matters, which is one source of problems.
But it's quite paradoxal, because people play teamgames because it's easier to get master compared to reaching 1v1 master
Thats wrong. Ppl play TGs over 1on1 as it puts less burden on their shoulders and hence is more casual. As well there is the soccer vs. tennis effect or lets call it dota vs. sc2 effect. It is about socializing, team interactions which, which make it more complex and less predictable. All those things and more of that kind. Abusers are minority I am sure.
Also, better matchmaking would mean 20-30min to find a game.
Thats obviously wrong. More than half of the deal about TG MM is to just put players on ranks that equal their skills more, without changing anything else. That would improve QOL alot already without changing anything about time it takes for MM to find players.
The second thing is to reduce deviations in MM, which would ofc increase times to find games, but not that much.
Third. If these changes that I suggest are implemented, more players will play TGs, as it will be more fun then, which will nullify the effect from above mostly or even in total will reduce time required.
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On January 02 2018 17:38 LSN wrote:Show nested quote +most people have reached the conclusion that teamgames are nothing but casual fun that only gets worse the more players you add. Exactly! But that it must be that way is just a belief.
Not in my experience, and I've been playing teamgames with my friends since beta...
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What you experience is the multiplication of deviance and players ranked off their skill level which ofc. gets more terrible the more players you add exponentially.
What I suggest fixes that. I want e. g. 1on1 GM players not to start at the bottom but be put on higher ranks in TGs. Especially all those guys who mostly/only play 1on1 and a very few time play teamgames can help TGs upper ranks to find higher quality games faster as those guys don't have to start in diamond 3 the few times they play teamgames, which overall will make them play more teamgames too - which then allows faster player finding of MM on higher ranks in return that will allow to reduce deviations.
Teamgames being shit and less and less good players playing teamgames go hand in hand and that must be broken off. Believing that it must be that way remains a belief.
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Russian Federation205 Posts
http://aligulac.com/misc/balance/
Balance for december
PvT 53 % , which is much better than people react
PvZ 42 % , which nobody care seems to be
Terrans whined hard in november with 54 % PvT , and protoss should shut their up with 42 % pvz ?
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On January 02 2018 18:48 Rail_sc2 wrote:http://aligulac.com/misc/balance/Balance for december PvT 53 % , which is much better than people react PvZ 42 % , which nobody care seems to be Terrans whined hard in november with 54 % PvT , and protoss should shut their up with 42 % pvz ?
And latest report : PvZ 48,6%.
And if you look GSL qualifier, Protoss have done really well.
Aslo, if you watch the league distribution, Zerg is now the least played race, and not Protoss anymore.
With 16tournaments won compared to 13 for T and Z, best foreigner is a T who has switched to P, and a long list of dude who sucessfully switch from another race to P, like classic, we can say P is the most sucessful race on LOTV (and on SC2 on general).
So yeah, not surprising they are not buffing protoss from just one aligulac report which is now around 50%.
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Czech Republic12129 Posts
On January 03 2018 00:38 Tyrhanius wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2018 18:48 Rail_sc2 wrote:http://aligulac.com/misc/balance/Balance for december PvT 53 % , which is much better than people react PvZ 42 % , which nobody care seems to be Terrans whined hard in november with 54 % PvT , and protoss should shut their up with 42 % pvz ? And latest report : PvZ 48,6%. And if you look GSL qualifier, Protoss have done really well. Aslo, if you watch the league distribution, Zerg is now the least played race, and not Protoss anymore. With 16tournaments won compared to 13 for T and Z, best foreigner is a T who has switched to P, and a long list of dude who sucessfully switch from another race to P, like classic, we can say P is the most sucessful race on LOTV (and on SC2 on general). So yeah, not surprising they are not buffing protoss from just one aligulac report which is now around 50%.
Classic switched long before LoTV, so let's leave him out of this. There were other players who should have switched when their chosen race wasn't suited for their style *cough* Flash *cough*
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On January 03 2018 01:43 deacon.frost wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2018 00:38 Tyrhanius wrote:On January 02 2018 18:48 Rail_sc2 wrote:http://aligulac.com/misc/balance/Balance for december PvT 53 % , which is much better than people react PvZ 42 % , which nobody care seems to be Terrans whined hard in november with 54 % PvT , and protoss should shut their up with 42 % pvz ? And latest report : PvZ 48,6%. And if you look GSL qualifier, Protoss have done really well. Aslo, if you watch the league distribution, Zerg is now the least played race, and not Protoss anymore. With 16tournaments won compared to 13 for T and Z, best foreigner is a T who has switched to P, and a long list of dude who sucessfully switch from another race to P, like classic, we can say P is the most sucessful race on LOTV (and on SC2 on general). So yeah, not surprising they are not buffing protoss from just one aligulac report which is now around 50%. Classic switched long before LoTV, so let's leave him out of this. There were other players who should have switched when their chosen race wasn't suited for their style *cough* Flash *cough*
The point is no Protoss, has switched to Z or T or decide to offrace to win a miror.
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EPT![[image loading]](https://imgur.com/a/8FMiG)
