• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 08:17
CET 14:17
KST 22:17
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12
Community News
ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career !8Weekly Cups (Dec 8-14): MaxPax, Clem, Cure win4Weekly Cups (Dec 1-7): Clem doubles, Solar gets over the hump1Weekly Cups (Nov 24-30): MaxPax, Clem, herO win2BGE Stara Zagora 2026 announced15
StarCraft 2
General
When will we find out if there are more tournament ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career ! Weekly Cups (Dec 8-14): MaxPax, Clem, Cure win RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview Weekly Cups (Dec 1-7): Clem doubles, Solar gets over the hump
Tourneys
$5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship RSL Offline Finals Info - Dec 13 and 14! Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) Winter Warp Gate Amateur Showdown #1: Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 504 Retribution Mutation # 503 Fowl Play Mutation # 502 Negative Reinforcement Mutation # 501 Price of Progress
Brood War
General
FlaSh on: Biggest Problem With SnOw's Playstyle screp: Command line app to parse SC rep files How Rain Became ProGamer in Just 3 Months BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ [BSL21] RO8 Bracket & Prediction Contest
Tourneys
Small VOD Thread 2.0 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] WB SEMIFINALS - Saturday 21:00 CET [BSL21] RO8 - Day 2 - Sunday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Game Theory for Starcraft Current Meta Simple Questions, Simple Answers Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Survivor II: The Amazon Sengoku Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine The Games Industry And ATVI YouTube Thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TL+ Announced Where to ask questions and add stream?
Blogs
The (Hidden) Drug Problem in…
TrAiDoS
I decided to write a webnov…
DjKniteX
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
Thanks for the RSL
Hildegard
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1552 users

Rogue: Climbing the Ladder - Rank 2 - Road to BlizzCon

Forum Index > SC2 General
71 CommentsPost a Reply
1 2 3 4 Next All

Rogue: Climbing the Ladder - Rank 2 - Road to BlizzCon

Text byTL.net ESPORTS
Graphics byshiroiusagi
October 24th, 2017 15:22 GMT
Photo Credit: Shayla
Rogue
Lee Byung Ryul


Climbing the Ladder


by Olli


Banelings waddle up the natural ramp, looking for any potential connection. It makes little difference at this point, the game is Rogue's. A massive army of hydralisks and queens forces its way up, shooting down all interceptors before they can do any harm. herO realizes his defeat and concedes. Rogue has qualified for the WCS Global Finals. On match point, with his back against the wall, against one of the most dangerous players in StarCraft II, Rogue has done what seemed impossible only a few weeks ago. When all odds were stacked against him, Rogue pulled through.

His rather weak 2600 WCS points are boosted massively by two tournament victories towards the end of the year—IEM Shanghai and GSL Super Tournament. Had Rogue not won both of them, he would not be here. That BlizzCon qualifying run, stretching across two championships, included wins over (T)GuMiho, (P)Stats, (Z)Dark, (T)ByuN, (P)herO, (T)Maru, (P)Dear, (T)INnoVation, and (P)herO again. Had Rogue lost any of these series, he would not be here. So is this just who Rogue is now? A player who, when the clutch is required, performs to the very best of his ability and outplays even the best in the world? We commonly associated these last minute runs with his team-mate sOs, a player that specializes in bringing out the best when it counts. It appears we must begin to describe Rogue in similar terms.

"Is this just who Rogue is now? A player who, when the clutch is required, performs to the very best of his ability and outplays even the best in the world?"
But how did this happen? At the start of the year, Rogue crashed out of the GSL in the first round and did not even qualify for SSL. There was talk of him playing more Overwatch than StarCraft II, and even retirement was murmured to be an option for him. When Rogue tore his path through the IEM Shanghai championship to win his first ever trophy, he appeared a fundamentally changed player. Instead of relying on trickery and deception, Rogue outplayed his opponents in standard games. He exploited every chink in their armor, made subtle but intelligent adjustments and simply outclassed them. He brought to the table the kind of standard finesse we usually associate with Zergs like (Z)Dark and (Z)soO, but not Rogue. How did he go from a Proleague wildcard to a sturdy macro player?


Rogue overcomes INnoVation in standard macro games.




Winrate


60.13% vs. Terran
65.22% vs. Protoss
64.06% vs. Zerg

Rank


Circuit Standings
8

WCS Points


5600



The answer is quite simple. When Rogue won IEM Shanghai, he had been top of the Korean ladder for a good amount of time. His MMR then—and now—is astonishing. Rogue regularly occupies the top spots on the Korean ladder with not one, but two accounts at, and sometimes above, 7000 MMR. To put that in comparison, Serral and ShoWTimE were hailed in the international scene for reaching that mark in Europe. Rogue did it in Korea, where the best players in the world hold their practice sessions, and held that high MMR for months straight. This meant that he consistently played against only the very best in the scene—the INnoVations, the soOs, the Darks and the Stats of the world. His skill guaranteed him an even better practice situation, and improved him yet again.

It is time to start looking towards the Korean ladder as a valuable indicator of skill. "Ladder doesn't matter" is foolish commentary. Nonsense. All the best Korean players have, for years, said in interviews that ladder is their primary tool for practice. They take it seriously. And as such, the examples of players reaching top spots on the Korean ladder and then carrying that skill over into tournaments is extremely long. Then-(P)Liquid'HerO reached the top of the Korean ladder before his breakout performances at Dreamhack, MLG and NASL. IM_(P)Seed's GSL championship was predated by a surge to #1 on ladder. (T)Maru's Starleague championship shortly after the beta of Heart of the Swarm was only shocking to those that had not followed his absurd ladder record at the time. (P)Zest's all-kill against SKT, his GSL championship following immediately after, as well as his domination of 2014 as a whole were all accompanied by him holding the top spot on the Korean ladder for almost the whole year. (T)TY and (P)Stats battled for the top spot early this year, when TY won WESG and IEM Katowice and Stats took home his GSL Championship. (T)INnoVation, in his stretch of dominance this year, was second only to Rogue on ladder. Rogue himself is only the latest in a long, long list of champions built on the Korean ladder.

Rogue's self-reinvention happened behind closed doors, and we had little chance to witness it. The WCS system is partially to blame—a player who loses early in a season has very few competitions to play in for a long time. But the signs were there. His sustained high ladder ranking should have been the indicator we needed that things were beginning to look up for Rogue. And they sure did. Rogue used his time out of the spotlight superbly. He fixed tendencies that kept him down and replaced them with better. No longer will he rely on specially crafted builds that fall apart if countered correctly. He now appears entirely confident in his own skill and ability to outplay even the very best in the world, and plays accordingly. No longer is he the player who was sent out specifically to snipe certain opponents on certain maps by his team in Proleague, but he is now a player you would send out against anyone—because he is that good. And he finally has the championship trophies to prove it.

And so it happens that Rogue, a player who, until the very last map we saw him play, had not even qualified for BlizzCon, enters the tournament as one of its greatest favorites. No other player in the world can claim to possess the same form Rogue is in at the moment. But form is temporary. Class is permanent. Now is the time for Rogue to show that he is not a one-time appearance, and that he does not run purely on form. All the signs for true greatness and skill are there. Now is the time to show his true class.








Writer: Olli
Editor: Zealously, munch
Photo Credit: DreamHack, Shayla
Statistics: Aligulac
Facebook Twitter Reddit
TL+ Member
Pandain
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States12989 Posts
October 24 2017 15:27 GMT
#2
Great article, rogue is a hell of a story
Cricketer12
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
United States13990 Posts
October 24 2017 15:28 GMT
#3
Rogue is looking damn good, but will be go full dear...
Chain 1 Arthalion Chain 2 Urgula Chain 3 Mululu Chain 4 Lukias
Twinkle Toes
Profile Joined May 2012
United States3605 Posts
October 24 2017 15:31 GMT
#4
Rogue may not be the best, but he will be one of the greatest!
Bisu - INnoVation - Dark - Rogue - Stats
ZigguratOfUr
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
Iraq16955 Posts
October 24 2017 15:36 GMT
#5
Since KR ladder ranks matter, does that mean 7k MMR number 1 GM Serral will crush Gumi?
Fango
Profile Joined July 2016
United Kingdom8987 Posts
October 24 2017 15:37 GMT
#6
On October 25 2017 00:36 ZigguratOfUr wrote:
Since KR ladder ranks matter, does that mean 7k MMR number 1 GM Serral will crush Gumi?


Yes
Zest, sOs, PartinG, Dark, and Maru are the real champs. ROOT_herO is overrated. Snute, Serral, and Scarlett are the foreigner GOATs
Durnuu
Profile Joined September 2013
13322 Posts
October 24 2017 15:37 GMT
#7
On October 25 2017 00:36 ZigguratOfUr wrote:
Since KR ladder ranks matter, does that mean 7k MMR number 1 GM Serral will crush Gumi?

Zest will win Blizzcon :O
BUNNYYYYYYYYY https://i.imgur.com/BiCF577.png
Morbidius
Profile Joined November 2010
Brazil3449 Posts
October 24 2017 15:47 GMT
#8
Weird how half of the article is talking about how KR ladder is the best thing since sliced bread and a true indicator of skill, but Serral topping it doesn't even make him top 10.
Has foreign StarCraft hit rock bottom?
hexhaven
Profile Joined July 2014
Finland953 Posts
October 24 2017 15:53 GMT
#9
Taking bets on who the last article is about!
WriterI shoot events. | http://www.jussi.co/esports
Olli
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
Austria24422 Posts
October 24 2017 15:56 GMT
#10
On October 25 2017 00:47 Morbidius wrote:
Weird how half of the article is talking about how KR ladder is the best thing since sliced bread and a true indicator of skill, but Serral topping it doesn't even make him top 10.


What I hear is that Serral's rank is inflated due to holidays in Korea where nobody practiced. In Rogue's case, his ladder skill translated over into tournaments - Serral's hasn't (yet). I do think it will soon though.
Administrator"Declaring anything a disaster because aLive popped up out of nowhere is just downright silly."
SetGuitarsToKill
Profile Blog Joined December 2013
Canada28396 Posts
October 24 2017 16:03 GMT
#11
Uh you guys made a mistake. You accidentally released the #1 player's article first and also mistitled it. Should say 1 instead of 2
Community News"As long as you have a warp prism you can't be bad at harassment" - Maru | @SetGuitars2Kill
engesser1
Profile Blog Joined December 2016
264 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-10-24 16:25:32
October 24 2017 16:14 GMT
#12
In my opinion, KR ladder is a little bit different than EU. This is not about how bad or good they are, it's all about non-standard games. I saw only on the KR ladder, godlike games (rare to see some tricks, micro while you speaking on a phone or weird macro games and more). As for me, Rogue, as like as Maru or sOs, the real high MMR players. They are ready to show you how to deal with every kind of anything. Naturally born geniuses that is what you can see behind KR MMR ladder.
Hope, Rogue vs Dark in final.
And yes, Rogue #1.
This photo is so cool. Best part of article.
Maru, he is the reason why i'm still playing and watching sc2
Nakajin
Profile Blog Joined September 2014
Canada8989 Posts
October 24 2017 16:22 GMT
#13
So INno will be arriving at Anaheim as the favorite for the third time lets hope he can finally have a good performance.
Writerhttp://i.imgur.com/9p6ufcB.jpg
Argonauta
Profile Joined July 2016
Spain4958 Posts
October 24 2017 16:25 GMT
#14
youtu.be


"From #1 in the ladder to #1 in IEM shanghai to #1 in our hearts"

Indeed Artosis Indeed
Rogue | Maru | Scarlett | Trap
TL+ Member
pvsnp
Profile Joined January 2017
7676 Posts
October 24 2017 16:26 GMT
#15
Inb4 this thread devolves into raging about Inno as #1 instead of actually talking about Rogue
Denominator of the Universe
TL+ Member
The_Templar
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
your Country52797 Posts
October 24 2017 16:26 GMT
#16
On October 25 2017 00:53 hexhaven wrote:
Taking bets on who the last article is about!

TaeJa?
Moderatorshe/her
TL+ Member
curufinwe_wins
Profile Joined August 2017
68 Posts
October 24 2017 16:30 GMT
#17
On October 25 2017 00:47 Morbidius wrote:
Weird how half of the article is talking about how KR ladder is the best thing since sliced bread and a true indicator of skill, but Serral topping it doesn't even make him top 10.



Well remember Neeb has held a top 10 korean ladder literally continously since Sept 2016... With numerous forays into the #1 spot.

Also Zest has held top protoss honors quite a proportion of the time on ladder.
yht9657
Profile Joined December 2016
1810 Posts
October 24 2017 16:31 GMT
#18
I actually thought the last 2 articles would be released together...
Zealously
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
East Gorteau22261 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-10-24 16:48:40
October 24 2017 16:44 GMT
#19
I'm glad people aren't giving undue attention to the ramblings of some writer and properly focusing on what really matters, the ordering of players
AdministratorBreak the chains
The_Red_Viper
Profile Blog Joined August 2013
19533 Posts
October 24 2017 17:12 GMT
#20
I will be honest, i think the ladder "rant" should have been a seperate article. It feels a bit too much center of attention here for my liking. Not that it ruins the article, but i would have prefered a little less of that personally.
Still a good read though, i didn't comment a lot on the articles this year but i really enjoyed the road to blizzcon series again, thanks for doing it!

About the PR, i think the top 3 or so players could be in any order and you could make cases for it, so it doesn't really matter too much
With that being said, if you guys really care so much about PRs, then do your own here: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/starcraft-2/527600-community-pr-v8-a-new-chance-for-foreigners
IU | Sohyang || There is no God and we are his prophets | For if ‘Thou mayest’—it is also true that ‘Thou mayest not.” | Ignorance is the parent of fear |
1 2 3 4 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
WardiTV 2025
11:00
Playoffs
Clem vs RogueLIVE!
Creator vs TBD
Scarlett vs Spirit
ShoWTimE vs Cure
WardiTV1228
ComeBackTV 1056
TaKeTV 324
IndyStarCraft 178
Rex145
IntoTheiNu 20
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Lowko285
IndyStarCraft 178
Rex 145
Harstem 125
BRAT_OK 65
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 30017
Calm 4974
GuemChi 2654
Bisu 2308
Rain 2247
Horang2 844
Stork 723
actioN 540
Shuttle 490
Mini 256
[ Show more ]
firebathero 245
Larva 206
ggaemo 192
Mind 133
Aegong 113
hero 98
Killer 93
JYJ 75
Zeus 73
Barracks 69
Snow 69
Hyun 65
ToSsGirL 57
Bale 55
Mong 43
Shinee 37
Sacsri 30
sorry 26
soO 23
Terrorterran 19
910 18
Yoon 16
zelot 16
GoRush 15
ajuk12(nOOB) 13
Shine 11
JulyZerg 9
SilentControl 7
Dota 2
Gorgc3696
singsing3161
XcaliburYe140
League of Legends
C9.Mang0357
Counter-Strike
olofmeister1842
allub298
oskar117
Other Games
B2W.Neo1463
crisheroes389
Fuzer 262
XaKoH 132
hiko71
Trikslyr20
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 9
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 10 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Upcoming Events
OSC
44m
Big Brain Bouts
3h 44m
YoungYakov vs Jumy
TriGGeR vs Spirit
The PiG Daily
7h 44m
SHIN vs ByuN
Reynor vs Classic
TBD vs herO
Maru vs SHIN
TBD vs Classic
CranKy Ducklings
20h 44m
WardiTV 2025
21h 44m
Reynor vs MaxPax
SHIN vs TBD
Solar vs herO
Classic vs TBD
SC Evo League
23h 14m
Ladder Legends
1d 5h
BSL 21
1d 6h
Sziky vs Dewalt
eOnzErG vs Cross
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 20h
Ladder Legends
2 days
[ Show More ]
BSL 21
2 days
StRyKeR vs TBD
Bonyth vs TBD
Replay Cast
2 days
Wardi Open
2 days
Monday Night Weeklies
3 days
WardiTV Invitational
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
WardiTV Invitational
5 days
ByuN vs Solar
Clem vs Classic
Cure vs herO
Reynor vs MaxPax
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #4 - TS3
RSL Offline Finals
Kuram Kup

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
Slon Tour Season 2
CSL Season 19: Qualifier 1
WardiTV 2025
META Madness #9
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22

Upcoming

CSL Season 19: Qualifier 2
CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Big Gabe Cup #3
OSC Championship Season 13
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.