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On March 03 2017 20:13 ParksonVN wrote:
After watching Terran players got destroyed at GSL post liberator nerf, i'm quite surprised that Blizzard still proceed to this wm nerf. Even the very top Terrans couldn't stop adept+phoenix lately, how are we supposed to deal with that combo after wm nerf ?
This.
They really need to slow down this balance update mania. There will always be heaps of players complaining that IMBA this, IMBA that when they loose. Blizzard needs to take a longer look at things and, most importantly, wait for the meta to stabilize before they mess with stuff.
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is there an ETA when this patch is going live?
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It's almost as if the people at Blizzard don't watch any recent GSL games at all!!!
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On March 03 2017 20:31 sneakyfox wrote:Show nested quote +On March 03 2017 20:13 ParksonVN wrote:
After watching Terran players got destroyed at GSL post liberator nerf, i'm quite surprised that Blizzard still proceed to this wm nerf. Even the very top Terrans couldn't stop adept+phoenix lately, how are we supposed to deal with that combo after wm nerf ? This. They really need to slow down this balance update mania. There will always be heaps of players complaining that IMBA this, IMBA that when they loose. Blizzard needs to take a longer look at things and, most importantly, wait for the meta to stabilize before they mess with stuff.
I can understand they are in a rough position. When these changes were all announced, I saw post after post saying, 'these are so small, don't waste time testing them, just put them in'
Now everyone else on the other half is coming out and complaining they are so fast.
I, for one, am in favor of most of these. We'll see how it works out, and I don't necessarily think it's going to be all gloom and doom, after people start to adjust.
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So, assuming PvZ (on the Ground) was pretty much equal in HOTS, we ended up with the following in LoTV (compared to HotS):
Protoss.
Colossi - nerfed to the ground, not worth its price and plain unusable.
Sentry and Stalker - indirectly nerfed by introducing a ravager and lurker.
Zealot - regardless of a mediocre buff, hardcountered by baneling.
Adept - a unit that can't be used outside of allins/initial harass and is pretty much a protoss version of hellion for pvz. Nerfed numerous times after the release. Tbh the only unit that prevents zerg from having a 95% winrate in the MU.
Disruptor - don't even mention that piece of trash.
Meanwhile, zerg:
Ravager - a tier 1 unit that competely shuts down ANY protoss allin, opens a huge variety of allins for zerg, can be used on any stage of the game, vs any unit composition (even vs air), allows zerg to steamroll protoss tier 3 ground armies in the mix with banelings.
Baneling - got an HP buff, and with colosi completely gone makes zealots/adepts completely worthless starting from midgame.
Hydra - got a speed buff, HP buff, upgrades combined, and with colosi completely gone makes all other protoss ground units completely worthless on any stage of the game.
Lurker - Not as threatening but allows a whole new playstyle for a zerg.
SH - unit that stays in the game for the unknown reason and which true potential i believe is yet to be fully discovered, costs like a roach, moves like a speedling, evaporates nexuses in a blink of an eye.
So, In HotS, protoss relied on either colosi or sentry-stalker play. And zerg somehow managed to have a 50% rate vs that. In LotV both these styles are extinct due to ravager/colosi nerf. So protoss is left with severely nerfed ground army vs newly introduced zerg units and old zerg units significantly buffed. How does that make any fcking sense is mystery to me.
Now, you can whine about Carriers.
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On March 03 2017 20:11 avilo wrote:Making mech worse and worse patch after patch 
it has been publicly know that your brain is not capable enough to learn more than one passive build as a terran. Anyone with your free time could get far far ahead of you skillwise, mechanic wise and knowledge wise...
And yet you still suprised noone cares about your opinion in 2017...
P.S: Is not an insult, just not everyone can be smart, and don't start with that GM all races thing. 1st its NA ladder, 2nd you never went above rank 100, 3rd anyone could do it with being fulltime nothing
User was warned for this post
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On March 03 2017 20:54 insitelol wrote:
So, assuming PvZ (on the Ground) was pretty much equal in HOTS, we ended up with the following in LoTV (compared to HotS):
Protoss.
Colossi - nerfed to the ground, not worth its price and plain unusable.
Sentry and Stalker - indirectly nerfed by introducing a ravager and lurker.
Zealot - regardless of a mediocre buff, hardcountered by baneling.
Adept - a unit that can't be used outside of allins/initial harass and is pretty much a protoss version of hellion for pvz. Nerfed numerous times after the release. Tbh the only unit that prevents zerg from having a 95% winrate in the MU.
Disruptor - don't even mention that piece of trash.
Meanwhile, zerg:
Ravager - a tier 1 unit that competely shuts down ANY protoss allin, opens a huge variety of allins for zerg, can be used on any stage of the game, vs any unit composition (even vs air), allows zerg to steamroll protoss tier 3 ground armies in the mix with banelings.
Banleing - got an HP buff, and with colosi completely gone makes zealots/adepts completely worthless starting from midgame.
Hydra - got an HP buff, and with colosi completely gone makes all other protoss ground units completely worthless on any stage of the game.
Lurker - Not as threatening but allows a whole new playstyle for a zerg.
SH - unit that stays in the game for the unknown reason and which true potential i believe is yet to be fully discovered, costs like a roach, moves like a speedling, evaporates nexuses in a blink of an eye.
So, In HotS, protoss relied on eaither colosi or sentry stalker play. And zerg somehow managed to have a 50% rate vs that. In LotV both these styles are extinct due to ravager/colosi nerf. So protoss is left with severely nerfed ground army vs newly introduced zerg units and old zerg units significantly buffed. How does that make any fcking sense is mystery to me.
Now, you can whine about Carriers.
Not fun part about hots is that even when zerg scouting the 2base crap protoss thorwed in... it was 50/50% win/loss even knowing whats going on...
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Reaper
-KD8 Grenade cooldown increased from 7 to 14.
Too late. Way too late.
I wonder how BlizzCon would have played out with this change and better maps :thinking: oh well what's done is done and it's not like ByuN is totally awful either.
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every change will ruin another aspect of the game. too many changes happening too often. Either that, or the game is just fundamentally flawed.
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On March 03 2017 20:56 PharaphobiaSC wrote:Show nested quote +On March 03 2017 20:54 insitelol wrote:
So, assuming PvZ (on the Ground) was pretty much equal in HOTS, we ended up with the following in LoTV (compared to HotS):
Protoss.
Colossi - nerfed to the ground, not worth its price and plain unusable.
Sentry and Stalker - indirectly nerfed by introducing a ravager and lurker.
Zealot - regardless of a mediocre buff, hardcountered by baneling.
Adept - a unit that can't be used outside of allins/initial harass and is pretty much a protoss version of hellion for pvz. Nerfed numerous times after the release. Tbh the only unit that prevents zerg from having a 95% winrate in the MU.
Disruptor - don't even mention that piece of trash.
Meanwhile, zerg:
Ravager - a tier 1 unit that competely shuts down ANY protoss allin, opens a huge variety of allins for zerg, can be used on any stage of the game, vs any unit composition (even vs air), allows zerg to steamroll protoss tier 3 ground armies in the mix with banelings.
Banleing - got an HP buff, and with colosi completely gone makes zealots/adepts completely worthless starting from midgame.
Hydra - got an HP buff, and with colosi completely gone makes all other protoss ground units completely worthless on any stage of the game.
Lurker - Not as threatening but allows a whole new playstyle for a zerg.
SH - unit that stays in the game for the unknown reason and which true potential i believe is yet to be fully discovered, costs like a roach, moves like a speedling, evaporates nexuses in a blink of an eye.
So, In HotS, protoss relied on eaither colosi or sentry stalker play. And zerg somehow managed to have a 50% rate vs that. In LotV both these styles are extinct due to ravager/colosi nerf. So protoss is left with severely nerfed ground army vs newly introduced zerg units and old zerg units significantly buffed. How does that make any fcking sense is mystery to me.
Now, you can whine about Carriers.
Not fun part about hots is that even when zerg scouting the 2base crap protoss thorwed in... it was 50/50% win/loss even knowing whats going on...
I'm not saying it was fun and "right" but it WAS in the game, and somehow zergs managed to live with that. Now, protoss is robbed of its core units/playstyles w/o any compensation. Or should i accept carriers as a substitute?
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Rofl if this patch goes through I'm 100% stopping this game. No point in playing a bad race ... blizz can't accept that only KR terrans are strong atm, it's like they agree that proxy oracles/pylon rush and 1 base ravagers rushes are legit skill-wise but WM are way too strong xD
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Yes, yes, please go back to WoL and just nerf Terran to the ground because literally ONE progamer can win most of his TvZs with Reapers!
And TvP mine nerf? Really?
Because nerfing Terran is always the answer.
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Personally, I believe these changes are ridiculous or at least too extensive.
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Finally the corruptor buff I've always wanted.
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theyre still buffing hydras?
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On March 03 2017 22:04 TT1 wrote:
theyre still buffing hydras?
Yeah this is the "redesign" zerg players got teased with. Hurray!
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We already talked lengths about the WM nerf against chargelots and adepts and it´s still a horrendous change.Post lib nerf combined with more time to explore various openings the early tank pushes are becoming more and more of a rarity so that just puts us back to pre 3.8 TvP where protoss was slightly favoured but now we have nerfed libs and mines? Lategame it´s hard to say how things are yet, bc´s are stronger but the tempest AA is still a hard counter and carriers are way better. But getting there isn´t very easy.
Nerfing reaper grenades isnt a bad idea but im a bit baffled we don´t see it combined with something like a revert of the queen AA range or something else to open up more early game TvZ harras. Without reaper cheeses 2 minute 3 hatch with 60+ drones before units is extremely strong and there´s almost no way to stop it.
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Regarding ZvT, there's 2 more things that need to be looked into:
Autoturret behind mineral line: Seems pretty dumb that zerg has to pull a whole mineral line every 30 seconds because of 2 ravens and nothing can be done until they get spire. Also it can be used as a distraction to helion runby.
Helion opening already gives terran the edge since it forces earlier units out for zerg, and terran can go fast third CC without worrying. Now with raven trading energy for drones and mining time, it might be too much.
1 base ravager: It's becoming popular fast and it seems pretty strong.
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On March 03 2017 22:14 xTJx wrote:
and terran can go fast third CC without worrying.
1 base ravager: It's becoming popular fast and it seems pretty strong.
You´re essentially saying the opposite.
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On March 03 2017 22:26 TheKhyira wrote:Show nested quote +On March 03 2017 22:14 xTJx wrote:
and terran can go fast third CC without worrying.
1 base ravager: It's becoming popular fast and it seems pretty strong. You´re essentially saying the opposite.
You know that reaper can scout right? I'm talking about 2 different scenarios.
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On March 03 2017 22:12 The_Red_Viper wrote:Yeah this is the "redesign" zerg players got teased with. Hurray!
After all Zerg buffs got reverted in 3.8, we finally get 10 more health for hydras!
Hurrah!
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EPT
