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New Launch Maps - Legacy of the Void

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
1 2 3 4 Next All
NewSunshine
Profile Joined July 2011
United States5938 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-11-10 05:58:17
November 10 2015 05:52 GMT
#1
As we know, Blizzard is well-reputed for their cracking reputation at making maps for their games. The Legacy of the Void beta, however, had sparsely any new content to speak of, just 2 maps showcasing a smattering of the new assets. Now that the launch of LotV is upon us, however, they have opened the floodgates, unleashing several new maps to be played as of... well, now. Or whenever you people finish the campaign, if you still bother with that.

Thus I shall present each of the new maps, and instead of flat bashing them in classic Blizzard-hate fashion, I shall render an honest opinion - as a mapmaker myself. By the way, here's my twitter page. Yes I make maps. I promise you this is mine. Not that you really care.

1v1 maps:
+ Show Spoiler +
All the lens flares you are about to see are real, and not faked in any way. Seriously, look at Blizzard, not me.


Prion Terraces
[image loading]

So there's a lot not to like about this map. I make no odds about this. Both your third and fourth bases are golds, and the map is packed to the gills with expansions to begin with. The main is surrounded by completely pathable terrain, so have fun with Stalkers I guess. If Blizzard is willing to rebalance the game around these anomolous elements, though, it could be good to have maps like this in the game.

Central Protocol
[image loading]

Alright, so they could have given us Bel'Shir Beach, but we got this. 4 spawns, none of which appear to be disabled. A flat main choke, and a back door into the main at that. Unlike the other maps I'm showing you, however, it's actually relatively short on total base count at 14. The third base options are wide open, but again, if Blizzard really wants to balance around having maps like these, I'm not complaining.

Ulrena
[image loading]

Imagine taking the short rush pathing of Klontas Mire, the island betwixt close air spawns from Scrap Station, and made it worse, you basically have this. The island is a gold for TBD reasons, the rush distance is even shorter than Klontas, and there are about 1000% too many expansions, in places where expansions don't belong in any way. Seriously, check out the third base.

Dusk Towers
[image loading]

Similar in design to Alterzim Stronghold, but with a rush distance that makes a bit more sense, Dusk Flares is an in-base map with some slightly unusual terrain features. It recycles the overall center idea from Eternal Scar, in a way that encourages you to move forawrd, so not a bad idea from Blizzard on this one. On the other hand, it doesn't come into play until you have 4 bases, which is one too many.

2v2 maps:

Distant Plane
[image loading]

Distant Plane is a nice demonstration of the new tileset from The Void, but the map closely resembles the HotS beta map Fractured Glacier. It's been scaled up a bit to better fit 2v2, complete with 300% more gold bases. It's a straightforward map, what do you want.

Fields of Death
[image loading]

To be honest, I'm not sure what's going on here. I think it's a 2v2 map.

3v3 maps:

Doraelus Hills
[image loading]

The layout here is reminiscent of the old 3v3 map Vault of Secrets. You have a short rush distance between teams, and a large number of expansions stowed behind backdoors with a series of rocks protecting them. There are a lot of gold bases though, so you know it's a LotV map.

Avalon Labs
[image loading]

This map... has 6 Xel'Naga towers. And an easy 6 collective bases per team. With a total of 6 players. No triangles here.

4v4 maps:

Asper Mountain
[image loading]

So this is where Blizzard starts shamelessly stealing my ideas. Like this one. And this one.This is a 4v4 map with a split-team concept and short rush distances. Overall it actually looks decent, however. Also, gold bases guys. There's even a double-gold, which new players will have a hard time understanding, but it's Legacy of the Void. Are you still reading this shit?

Hidden Caves
[image loading]

Once again, leave it to Blizzard to perform unabashed plagiarism on the community. Of what you might ask? Leave it to me to show Blizzard how it's done. They've taken the solid layout I created and reimagined it for LotV - although weirdly it has no gold bases. Less than mine, even. You guys figure it out.
"If you find yourself feeling lost, take pride in the accuracy of your feelings." - Night Vale
GiveMeCake
Profile Joined October 2010
148 Posts
November 10 2015 06:37 GMT
#2
Make a post detailing what parts or ideas Blizzard has plagiarized including pictures with clear examples and you'll get tons more support, I think.

I'm having trouble seeing how Blizzard copied you, the maps look pretty different, especially middle sections.

To be fair - Blizzard owns anything you make with the editor anyway.

These ideas can't be 'owned' really by anyone, and Blizzard are too 'big' a company to credit community members individually or publicly at launch. That would make their maps seam amateur in a way.
I had a dream I moved to Korea to become a GSL champion. I slept in PC bangs and practiced only vs the PC. I named my self Death and faced Life in the finals. I beat him, but ended up dying as I killed his last building.
[PkF] Wire
Profile Joined March 2013
France24239 Posts
November 10 2015 06:41 GMT
#3
Doesn't really make me want to play lotv. Those maps look very uninspiring.
NewSunshine
Profile Joined July 2011
United States5938 Posts
November 10 2015 06:42 GMT
#4
On November 10 2015 15:37 GiveMeCake wrote:
Make a post detailing what parts or ideas Blizzard has plagiarized including pictures with clear examples and you'll get tons more support, I think.

I'm having trouble seeing how Blizzard copied you, the maps look pretty different, especially middle sections.

To be fair - Blizzard owns anything you make with the editor anyway.

These ideas can't be 'owned' really by anyone, and Blizzard are too 'big' a company to credit community members individually or publicly at launch. That would make their maps seam amateur in a way.

I had hoped the bombastic wording of my post indicated my sarcasm. I must practice further.
"If you find yourself feeling lost, take pride in the accuracy of your feelings." - Night Vale
TelecoM
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States10890 Posts
November 10 2015 06:49 GMT
#5
The maps are great......I love them!
AKA: TelecoM[WHITE] Protoss fighting
GiveMeCake
Profile Joined October 2010
148 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-11-10 07:43:38
November 10 2015 07:43 GMT
#6
On November 10 2015 15:42 NewSunshine wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 10 2015 15:37 GiveMeCake wrote:
Make a post detailing what parts or ideas Blizzard has plagiarized including pictures with clear examples and you'll get tons more support, I think.

I'm having trouble seeing how Blizzard copied you, the maps look pretty different, especially middle sections.

To be fair - Blizzard owns anything you make with the editor anyway.

These ideas can't be 'owned' really by anyone, and Blizzard are too 'big' a company to credit community members individually or publicly at launch. That would make their maps seam amateur in a way.

I had hoped the bombastic wording of my post indicated my sarcasm. I must practice further.

If the entire thread is just a joke it wasn't very funny.
I had a dream I moved to Korea to become a GSL champion. I slept in PC bangs and practiced only vs the PC. I named my self Death and faced Life in the finals. I beat him, but ended up dying as I killed his last building.
Superouman
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
France2195 Posts
November 10 2015 07:54 GMT
#7
With this map pack, you successfully landed a job at blizz. congratulations
Search "[SO]" on B.net to find all my maps ||| Cloud Kingdom / Turbo Cruise '84 / Bone Temple / Eternal Empire / Zen / Purity and Industry / Golden Wall / Fortitude / Beckett Industries / Waterfall
ilikeredheads
Profile Joined August 2011
Canada1995 Posts
November 10 2015 08:06 GMT
#8
so gold bases are the new destructible rocks now?

this is the 2nd expansion and Blizzard still can't make proper maps...... Did they get a monkey to design these?
GreenMash
Profile Joined August 2012
Norway1746 Posts
November 10 2015 09:03 GMT
#9
Can you spawn anywhere on Central Protocol?
I love hellbats
alexanderzero
Profile Joined June 2008
United States659 Posts
November 10 2015 10:08 GMT
#10
To be clear I love LotV, but I do not love this ladder map pool. I'm just glad it's the off season because I can't imagine how painful it would be for pro-gamers to have to rely on these maps.

Prion Terraces in particular will produce some very odd games. A short rush distance, but an unpunished quick 3rd base will quickly slant the game in that player's favor.
I am a tournament organizazer.
KeksX
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Germany3634 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-11-10 10:16:39
November 10 2015 10:15 GMT
#11
I remember that David Kim said that they don't ever want to have a 100% pure standard same-old-same-old map pool that makes for the same games on different maps, and I wholeheartedly agree.

Now the ladder maps aren't perfect, but I told myself to not veto them for the next four weeks at least and give it a fair try.

On November 10 2015 19:08 alexanderzero wrote:

Prion Terraces in particular will produce some very odd games.


Which is exactly what they were trying to do. And I think we should give them a fair chance of trying this out.
digmouse
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
China6333 Posts
November 10 2015 10:18 GMT
#12
Holy shit Ulrena, I can't even.
TranslatorIf you want to ask anything about Chinese esports, send me a PM or follow me @nerddigmouse.
Destructicon
Profile Blog Joined September 2011
4713 Posts
November 10 2015 10:36 GMT
#13
To be fair, due to the economic model we don't really know for sure what a good map is any more. We have a few ideas but no clear model, so in that regard these maps are ok, we can consider them a learning experience for better or worse. However the map rotation better be up to speed this year, because if we find a map type that just doesn't work/produces bad games, I don't want to have to play on it for 6+ months.
WriterNever give up, never surrender! https://www.youtube.com/user/DestructiconSC
Meavis
Profile Blog Joined September 2011
Netherlands1300 Posts
November 10 2015 10:41 GMT
#14
On November 10 2015 17:06 ilikeredheads wrote:
so gold bases are the new destructible rocks now?

this is the 2nd expansion and Blizzard still can't make proper maps...... Did they get a monkey to design these?


I'll never understand this nor their inability to communicate with community mappers
"Not you."
deacon.frost
Profile Joined February 2013
Czech Republic12134 Posts
November 10 2015 10:42 GMT
#15
On November 10 2015 19:15 KeksX wrote:

Show nested quote +
On November 10 2015 19:08 alexanderzero wrote:

Prion Terraces in particular will produce some very odd games.


Which is exactly what they were trying to do. And I think we should give them a fair chance of trying this out.

I play to entertain myself, not to do beta testing for Blizzard. Unless they start paying me I will veto BS maps and not even try them.
I imagine France should be able to take this unless Lilbow is busy practicing for Starcraft III. | KadaverBB is my fairy ban mother.
KeksX
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Germany3634 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-11-10 10:52:15
November 10 2015 10:49 GMT
#16
On November 10 2015 19:42 deacon.frost wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 10 2015 19:15 KeksX wrote:

On November 10 2015 19:08 alexanderzero wrote:

Prion Terraces in particular will produce some very odd games.


Which is exactly what they were trying to do. And I think we should give them a fair chance of trying this out.

I play to entertain myself, not to do beta testing for Blizzard. Unless they start paying me I will veto BS maps and not even try them.



Okay. Thats why you have those vetos. So everyone is happy.

I agree however that they should work more with community mappers. They have some really fun maps, too. But please, please please please don't cry for a map pool of the same x-map layouts. Please. It was super boring. Sometimes I think of Overgrowth LE when I can't sleep.
Meavis
Profile Blog Joined September 2011
Netherlands1300 Posts
November 10 2015 10:53 GMT
#17
Maps are a reaction to the meta, not the shappers, the stale metas comes from poor unit design and blizzards inability to properly manage a map pool and rotate maps sensibly
"Not you."
ejozl
Profile Joined October 2010
Denmark3559 Posts
November 10 2015 10:57 GMT
#18
Maps look sweet at least aesthetically.
SC2 Archon needs "Terrible, terrible damage" as one of it's quotes.
Dekker
Profile Joined July 2010
Germany169 Posts
November 10 2015 11:00 GMT
#19
Ulrena looks like a goatse tilted to the right by 90°...
KeksX
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Germany3634 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-11-10 11:05:08
November 10 2015 11:00 GMT
#20
On November 10 2015 19:53 Meavis wrote:
Maps are a reaction to the meta, not the shappers, the stale metas comes from poor unit design and blizzards inability to properly manage a map pool and rotate maps sensibly


Maps are only a reaction to the meta if you treat them that way. If you want, maps can heavily influence the meta. And we had community maps that did just that. Fruitland anyone?

But the truth is people want the same old, big four player maps with the easy-to-take third and a fourth/fit nearby with a big main base and a gifted natural which is stupid not to take.
And then boom suddenly people start to complain about the fact that there's not enough diversity in gameplay.

Map Design is one of the pillars of RTS Game Design.

I mean, yeah I agree some of these maps don't look so good. But I'd rather have Blizzard try out new stuff / work with community mappers on new ideas than to gp back to a "standard map pool".
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