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Careful, this is not a thread that is about balance or top level, it is more about the the experience of an enthusiasitic casual SC2 Player, I think there are a lot of us here.
Not only since last season I often get matched to players who are fooling their MMR. I mean they have finished a season several times 2-3 leagues above me. I am currently playing on a solid gold MMR with a 50/50WR but currently I get matches with 5x ex Diamond players or once even a 6x ex Master player which are currently ranked in gold or platinum.
These players are of course much better than me, but they have their MMR because they often loose 20 or more games in a row on purpose (e.g. 20games in 20 minutes) and these players are destroying the ladder experience of enthusiasitic casual SC2 players like me. Why? Because when I check the profile or the match history I see that my opponent is definitly much better than me, and he fooled his MMR for a reason (which I will not discuss), and I ever had a chance, I was only his cannon fodder....
I think there would be a very simple way to fix such behaviour of these players. The only way to fool the MMR is to leave many games in a short time.
Therefore I would suggest that by doing so the "Play Again" button shall be on a cooldown. And by repeatedly doing so this cool down shall double each time.
To be more precise, if a game is started, and left or disconnected within a time limit of e.g. 2 ingame minutes (tbd.) the matchmaking / Play again button will be deactivated for at least 3 minutes. If it's then after this cooldown activated again and the player leaves that game again, the next set cooldown will be 6 minutes, (12 minutes after 3rd and
48 minutes after 5th leaving)
The only way to reset the cooldown shall be by playing longer games of lets say minimum 7 minutes.
With an algorithm like this are often server accesses to confidential files protected, so programming something like this shall be very easy.
If it would be implemented, I think the MMR and the Matchmaking experience could be really improved, because if it's strictly punished to exploit the MMR by leaving many games more players will stay at their skill ceiling and beeing better matched against players of similar skills.
The drawbacks are maybe that unranked play becomes useless and you have to accept to lose many games if you start over with a new race or if you want to practice a new build on ladder. Players that are disconnected from a game by accident are affected as well, but e.g. I was never DCed from a game twice in a row....
What is your opinion on that?
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Welp, I was a few times in diamond too. But since I dont play enough I got demoted a lot. I never left a single game at the start.
Last season I had 20:0 in Gold league, this season it is 19:3 in Gold league.I even play random because its kind of boring. Its the shitty system.
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MMR decay and a couple of douches that tank their MMR because playing and bm'ing worse players is fun to them.
The decay isn't that big a problem. About the tanking... I would say it's not that bad, but it is. I face one or two every day I really ladder. In lower leagues, it might as well be much worse...
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or the algorithm could just be adjusted to ignore any game shorter than say 3 in-game minutes for calculating MMR.
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As more people leave the game, the player pool will become stronger overall, as the majority of players who stick around are the ones who are the most dedicated to the game. I am a 17X masters player but I cant get out of diamond this season. I am sure this is contributing more than people who lose 20x games on purpose. Also, players playing unranked seems to be skewing the ladder as well, I am facing GMs who are playing unranked all too often. That said, maybe in the leagues below diamond this might be a problem, but I haven't encountered this particular problem.
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On December 12 2014 23:42 StreetWise wrote:
As more people leave the game, the player pool will become stronger overall, as the majority of players who stick around are the ones who are the most dedicated to the game. I am a 17X masters player but I cant get out of diamond this season. I am sure this is contributing more than people who lose 20x games on purpose. Also, players playing unranked seems to be skewing the ladder as well, I am facing GMs who are playing unranked all too often. That said, maybe in the leagues below diamond this might be a problem, but I haven't encountered this particular problem.
I'm bordering on Dia/Master and I certianly have seen it. It occurs quite frequently I play against people that just instantly leave their game, I'll check their match history, and they've done it 20 times before.
Sole purpose is being nasty and ruining the experience for people in lower ranks. Immature toxic behavior.
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... Maybe. But a lot better way would be to not count games shorter than 1 minute to MMR.
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On December 12 2014 23:41 tar wrote:
or the algorithm could just be adjusted to ignore any game shorter than say 3 in-game minutes for calculating MMR.
On December 12 2014 23:57 Tuczniak wrote:
... Maybe. But a lot better way would be to not count games shorter than 1 minute to MMR.
Then there are still players who want to be annoying by leaving games against races they don't like to play. I would say this would worse the problem even... because then anybody would be enabled to leave any game without consequence when they don't play against the race they want to, or not playing the race they want while playing random....
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On December 12 2014 23:57 Tuczniak wrote:
... Maybe. But a lot better way would be to not count games shorter than 1 minute to MMR.
Even without a problem this is a smart idea.
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On December 12 2014 23:59 Yrr wrote:Show nested quote +On December 12 2014 23:57 Tuczniak wrote:
... Maybe. But a lot better way would be to not count games shorter than 1 minute to MMR. Even without a problem this is a smart idea.
No, because:
On December 12 2014 23:59 Zulu23 wrote:
Then there are still players who want to be annoying by leaving games against races they don't like to play. I would say this would worse the problem even... because then anybody would be enabled to leave any game without consequence when they don't play against the race they want to, or not playing the race they want while playing random....
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On December 12 2014 23:59 Zulu23 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 12 2014 23:41 tar wrote:
or the algorithm could just be adjusted to ignore any game shorter than say 3 in-game minutes for calculating MMR. Show nested quote +On December 12 2014 23:57 Tuczniak wrote:
... Maybe. But a lot better way would be to not count games shorter than 1 minute to MMR. Then there are still players who want to be annoying by leaving games against races they don't like to play. I would say this would worse the problem even... because then anybody would be enabled to leave any game without consequence when they don't play against the race they want to, or not playing the race they want while playing random....
You're an idiot if you play Random to cheese and leave if you have an unfavorable matchup/map. Gives real Random players a bad name.
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Well I guess it happens that even some of them are playing SC2
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On December 13 2014 00:03 Zulu23 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 12 2014 23:59 Yrr wrote:On December 12 2014 23:57 Tuczniak wrote:
... Maybe. But a lot better way would be to not count games shorter than 1 minute to MMR. Even without a problem this is a smart idea. No, because: Show nested quote +On December 12 2014 23:59 Zulu23 wrote:
Then there are still players who want to be annoying by leaving games against races they don't like to play. I would say this would worse the problem even... because then anybody would be enabled to leave any game without consequence when they don't play against the race they want to, or not playing the race they want while playing random....
Okay then do what CS:GO does. If you leave a competitive match (equals ladder here) you cant play ladder for a short amount of time. With increasing time for each new penalty. Enable this rule for the first 1-3 minutes of a game.
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Russian Federation195 Posts
You're an idiot if you play Random to cheese and leave if you have an unfavorable matchup/map. Gives real Random players a bad name.
it's pretty stupid if you play random to cheese allready since you are beeing scouted early allmost every time because an opponent wants to check your race
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Czech Republic12129 Posts
On December 13 2014 00:15 Yrr wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2014 00:03 Zulu23 wrote:On December 12 2014 23:59 Yrr wrote:On December 12 2014 23:57 Tuczniak wrote:
... Maybe. But a lot better way would be to not count games shorter than 1 minute to MMR. Even without a problem this is a smart idea. No, because: On December 12 2014 23:59 Zulu23 wrote:
Then there are still players who want to be annoying by leaving games against races they don't like to play. I would say this would worse the problem even... because then anybody would be enabled to leave any game without consequence when they don't play against the race they want to, or not playing the race they want while playing random....
Okay then do what CS:GO does. If you leave a competitive match (equals ladder here) you cant play ladder for a short amount of time. With increasing time for each new penalty. Enable this rule for the first 1-3 minutes of a game.
Then you have people like me, who leave every game with barcode, since they are usually cheaters and I don't play cheaters.
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Actually your idea of the always increasing cooldown on the Play button is a really good one. Nice.
On December 12 2014 23:57 Tuczniak wrote:
... Maybe. But a lot better way would be to not count games shorter than 1 minute to MMR.
That's actually a horrible idea. It essentially allows you to filter your opponents. Let's say you already played against A and he destroyed you and you don't feel you have a chance, if you meet him again, you can just leave for free without change in your MMR.
Or worse, let's say you don't like to play against Zerg, you can just leave every game you're matched up against Zerg, again, for free.
Terrible idea, as it is presented, and I can't believe many in this thread backed up that idea...
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On December 13 2014 00:31 deacon.frost wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2014 00:15 Yrr wrote:On December 13 2014 00:03 Zulu23 wrote:On December 12 2014 23:59 Yrr wrote:On December 12 2014 23:57 Tuczniak wrote:
... Maybe. But a lot better way would be to not count games shorter than 1 minute to MMR. Even without a problem this is a smart idea. No, because: On December 12 2014 23:59 Zulu23 wrote:
Then there are still players who want to be annoying by leaving games against races they don't like to play. I would say this would worse the problem even... because then anybody would be enabled to leave any game without consequence when they don't play against the race they want to, or not playing the race they want while playing random....
Okay then do what CS:GO does. If you leave a competitive match (equals ladder here) you cant play ladder for a short amount of time. With increasing time for each new penalty. Enable this rule for the first 1-3 minutes of a game. Then you have people like me, who leave every game with barcode, since they are usually cheaters and I don't play cheaters.
You are exaggerating a lot here, dont you think.
I dont think you are that much better than other leavers
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Czech Republic12129 Posts
On December 13 2014 00:41 Yrr wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2014 00:31 deacon.frost wrote:On December 13 2014 00:15 Yrr wrote:On December 13 2014 00:03 Zulu23 wrote:On December 12 2014 23:59 Yrr wrote:On December 12 2014 23:57 Tuczniak wrote:
... Maybe. But a lot better way would be to not count games shorter than 1 minute to MMR. Even without a problem this is a smart idea. No, because: On December 12 2014 23:59 Zulu23 wrote:
Then there are still players who want to be annoying by leaving games against races they don't like to play. I would say this would worse the problem even... because then anybody would be enabled to leave any game without consequence when they don't play against the race they want to, or not playing the race they want while playing random....
Okay then do what CS:GO does. If you leave a competitive match (equals ladder here) you cant play ladder for a short amount of time. With increasing time for each new penalty. Enable this rule for the first 1-3 minutes of a game. Then you have people like me, who leave every game with barcode, since they are usually cheaters and I don't play cheaters. You are exaggerating a lot here, dont you think. I dont think you are that much better than other leavers
Well, frankly, I don't like hiding behind barcodes. So I give them a free win. I don't feel bad, I am diamond noob, I play max. 2 barcodes a day.
I am not saying I am better. I was leaving games against random players, because they are the cheesiest players out there. Why to play them, I want to play a macro game, there's no fun for me in playing 5 minute game guessing what race he plays and what cheese he choose. Though it was unranked and unranked has already a pretty wide range for your opponents so who cares about MMR in the end(I played against silver after 5 wins in a row... true silver player with 1/4 of my APM(and my APM is pretty low)).
The system is broken already when you play unranked against ranked and you don't have to demote yourself(or lower the MMR). I played against gold, silver many times. Don't get how the match making matched it. Poor guys, I feel sorry for them 
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Sorry to say but I think you and people with similar reasons should not be a reason to overthink upcoming rules.
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Czech Republic12129 Posts
On December 13 2014 01:01 Yrr wrote:
Sorry to say but I think you and people with similar reasons should not be a reason to overthink upcoming rules.
I can live with the punishment, but I want to solve bigger problems First, and yes I mean cheating.
Also, as I stated, if I play unranked, I don't get any punishment(since you are all aiming for ranked play) and I still play against ranked opponents who are levels beyond(or over) me. When I played unranked I played several players I wasn't supposed to play against a week. From both extremes(GM/high masters and gold/silver). It's already broken by Blizzard, this solution won't help much IMO. Or am I lucky when I play unranked on these extremes?
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On December 13 2014 01:05 deacon.frost wrote:
but I want to solve bigger problems First, and yes I mean cheating.
Bigger to you maybe. Besides can't Blizzard to both if they had the will? A multi million $ developer can surely achieve this, right?
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In a previous thread someone pointed out about how having short games not effect MMR, I thought it a fine idea, but clearly it could be easily abused.
Must be ways to deal with this though, otherwise what's the point in having MMR or different skilled ladders in the first place?
To my mind if a player is in say masters or diamond, that player has zero right to be playing ranked or unranked vs. bronze to gold players. To say otherwise isn't in the spirit of fair competition. Yeah yeah, life isn't fair, deal with it, man up. Send to /dev/null please.
Similarly a platinum should never be able to play vs. bronze and silver for example.
Wont jump on my soap box this time round, but I do hope Blizzard are taking notes.
Big skill difference in match ups = less fun, less fun = less players sticking about in SC2.
EDIT TO ADD: If in previous seasons a player achieved masters status, then that player should never be matched up against lower league players in future.
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In BW you didn't have to play matchups you didn't like.
Anyway I leave ZvZs now and I would still if MMR didn't count.
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Problem with dealing with leavers in sc2 is that normal games usually end in one player leaving the game, so it's kinda hard to distinguish that from people just spamming leave.
A time limit could work, but then leavers will just leave at (time limit)+1s. So yeah you're making leavers only be able to find a game every (queue time+time limit+1s) instead of (queue time+1s). Problem is, you have to keep the time limit really low in order to not punish people for getting surprised by cheese. I mean imagine getting proxy 2-gated three games in a row and receiving a punishment on top of that.
In my experience as a silver/gold, i find one or two leavers every two ladder sessions or so, so I wouldn't say it's that bad of a problem, and most certainly not worth the false positives.
But then again, I got promoted to gold after a three game loss-streak and a leaver, so I might be biased.
e: On December 13 2014 01:19 fruity. wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2014 01:05 deacon.frost wrote:
but I want to solve bigger problems First, and yes I mean cheating.
Bigger to you maybe. Besides can't Blizzard to both if they had the will? A multi million $ developer can surely achieve this, right?
They're not doing one or the other, why do you expect them to suddenly do both at the same time?
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i hit low masters with zerg but i can't get my terran out of gold league o_o
i sometimes leave games if i don't feel like a certain match up / map though
they're just pixel points
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On December 13 2014 01:29 Epamynondas wrote:
In my experience as a silver/gold, i find one or two leavers every two ladder sessions or so, so I wouldn't say it's that bad of a problem, and most certainly not worth the false positives.
My experience in Silver isn't leavers, it's people who previously left (tanked their MMR from Diamond/Master) and are now trolling Silver. The skill gap is so blatantly obvious when playing I know even before I check their rank history that they are MMR tankers.
It got so bad last season I just stopped playing. I came back this season for the old school maps, but my first game was against someone with 5x Diamond league finishes playing in Bronze. Said fuck it, haven't played since. Went back to playing BW with friends.
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On December 13 2014 01:40 vesicular wrote:
My experience in Silver isn't leavers, it's people who previously left (tanked their MMR from Diamond/Master) and are now trolling Silver. The skill gap is so blatantly obvious when playing I know even before I check their rank history that they are MMR tankers.
It got so bad last season I just stopped playing. I came back this season for the old school maps, but my first game was against someone with 5x Diamond league finishes playing in Bronze. Said fuck it, haven't played since. Went back to playing BW with friends.
Please reread this Blizzard!!!
Shit like this is all too common in low league. Christ I'm jumping back on the soap box after all
I best unsubscribe this thread before I start getting nervous facial twitches as I read posts.
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On December 13 2014 01:40 vesicular wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2014 01:29 Epamynondas wrote:
In my experience as a silver/gold, i find one or two leavers every two ladder sessions or so, so I wouldn't say it's that bad of a problem, and most certainly not worth the false positives. My experience in Silver isn't leavers, it's people who previously left (tanked their MMR from Diamond/Master) and are now trolling Silver. The skill gap is so blatantly obvious when playing I know even before I check their rank history that they are MMR tankers. It got so bad last season I just stopped playing. I came back this season for the old school maps, but my first game was against someone with 5x Diamond league finishes playing in Bronze. Said fuck it, haven't played since. Went back to playing BW with friends.
Yes, this is the exact problem that should be fixed.
If you play a game a week you want it to be a fun and fair fight. Not a game verse some Diamond troller with self awareness problems.
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Hmm, I guess Im one of the few who don't have much of a problem with MMR tankers. Even if I lose to them, those are the losses I don't mind. I don't really get why people do it though, playing against people way worse than you isn't that fun, unless you're just doing crazy dumb stuff I guess.
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On December 13 2014 01:53 SetGuitarsToKill wrote:
Hmm, I guess Im one of the few who don't have much of a problem with MMR tankers. Even if I lose to them, those are the losses I don't mind.
The problem isn't losing, you expect to lose 50% of the time because of how the matchmaking works. The problem is that playing MMR tankers is an absolute waste of time. I've got a lot of other things I can use my time for than being trolled in Silver league.
I think this is the problem Blizzard needs to understand better. Time is a valuable resource and people have an abundance of options on what to do with their time. If what people get out of the game is not valuable to them, they will do something else.
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I don't play in lower leagues, but I think MMR decay is a large part of the problem. I pretty much completely quit for a year and a half and played almost no ladder games, and by the time I started playing actively again I had gone from GM MMR to platinum league. It took me 90 games to get from platinum to master with over 80% winrate. Other friends I know have recently had similar things. I don't know how common it is to throw games, but I assure you the people who decayed are as annoyed as you are.
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On December 13 2014 02:20 Pokebunny wrote:
I don't play in lower leagues, but I think MMR decay is a large part of the problem. I pretty much completely quit for a year and a half and played almost no ladder games, and by the time I started playing actively again I had gone from GM MMR to platinum league. It took me 90 games to get from platinum to master with over 80% winrate. Other friends I know have recently had similar things. I don't know how common it is to throw games, but I assure you the people who decayed are as annoyed as you are.
Yeah, it's definitely an issue with both MMR decay and the system being too strict on promotions. I'm a 4x master's player still in plat, it isn't much fun for either me or the opponent.
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On December 13 2014 00:32 ZenithM wrote:
Actually your idea of the always increasing cooldown on the Play button is a really good one. Nice.
Yeah thanks.
Actually there is not an immediate problem while you get matched with a MMR down tanking player. The problem arises when they finish tanking and start playing again.
They have certainly better mechanics or a better game sence, if not both even off race.
If they get punished enough for tanking there will be a skill balance again within the MMR, I'm sure.
I do not agree that a former master has no "right" to play in lower leagues, but a demotion should be honestly acieved, by just losing legitly to better players.
Having a decay is fine, but it should be somewhat weaker, and after 3-4 seasons not playing at all the MMR should be resetable by the player if he chooses.
That brings me also to the point where either each player shall have a seperate MMR for each race, while Unranked play shall be discontinued because a player in the ranked and the unranked que with the same MMR can be matched, and we all know that the MMR of Unranked develops independet of the Ranked play MMR. That means a Ranked Master Zerg can have a gold like MMR while playing Terran unranked and he is very probably a better player than his opponent that is let's say beeing ranked in gold with his mainrace..
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On December 13 2014 02:18 vesicular wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2014 01:53 SetGuitarsToKill wrote:
Hmm, I guess Im one of the few who don't have much of a problem with MMR tankers. Even if I lose to them, those are the losses I don't mind. The problem isn't losing, you expect to lose 50% of the time because of how the matchmaking works. The problem is that playing MMR tankers is an absolute waste of time. I've got a lot of other things I can use my time for than being trolled in Silver league. I think this is the problem Blizzard needs to understand better. Time is a valuable resource and people have an abundance of options on what to do with their time. If what people get out of the game is not valuable to them, they will do something else.
It is not only a waste of time, you don't even have the chance to learn something from that game. It's just the worst game expereince you can have...
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On December 12 2014 23:59 Zulu23 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 12 2014 23:41 tar wrote:
or the algorithm could just be adjusted to ignore any game shorter than say 3 in-game minutes for calculating MMR. Show nested quote +On December 12 2014 23:57 Tuczniak wrote:
... Maybe. But a lot better way would be to not count games shorter than 1 minute to MMR. Then there are still players who want to be annoying by leaving games against races they don't like to play. I would say this would worse the problem even... because then anybody would be enabled to leave any game without consequence when they don't play against the race they want to, or not playing the race they want while playing random....
good point. that'd really be too easy to exploit.
I'm jumping on the delay-play-button-wagon then!
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Well you could implement the doesnt count if game ends before 3 minutes rule AND add a marker to the player that leaves games early alot to make them be more likely matched up with other early quitters......let them play each other
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Ladder would just be a leavefest. You don't like that matchup, you don't like that player, you don't like that map and you already vetoed 3, etc. you just leave the game.
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And what would stop player from leaving at the hypothetical 3 minute mark? The point is that you cant stop players from losing on purpose and therefor wont be able to stop people from tanking their MMR. The only way to stop this would be to make the system recognize the difference between a player losing on purpose and a player losing because they played worse, and honestly that is impossible. Just deal with it and continue playing its not like every game you play is like that. Shoot maybe even check the replay to see what you could have done better.
EDIT: and by impossible I mean without ruining the experience for other legitimate players.
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I don't think it's as straight forward as you make it sound, OP.
Way back when, before Master League was even implemented, I was a pretty solid Diamond player, but I haven't really played in years. So when I log on now (maybe 5 game every two weeks), there are still a lot of Diamond players I can beat, because I still have a lot of the muscle memory, but there are also gold players who straight up beat me because I don't know the cheeses they are playing, because I don't know what's going on in the meta, etc.
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Yeah sure you CAN still exploit a system like that. Still there needs good balance between an appropiate punishment after leaving a game and not punishing legit players that loses a game early.
BUT consider, now you can tank down 30 games in less then 30 minutes. If there would be an system to exploit, where you need to wait lets say 3-4 minutes before quiting unpunished and without a Cooldown on the play again / matchmaking button. Every 4-5 minutes you could quit a game (6-7 in 30 minutes).
I think thats just enough waste of time to compensate for the waste of time of the players who suffer under the tankers....
There could be also a random time in place between 3-6 minutes that hinders on using bots to optimize the tanking without punishment.
After all if one started a game and was already 4 or 5 minutes playing (and not beeing afk) it is very likely that he is continuing playing and not quiting....
So far we haven't such a system. Imho, I would find it useful because it would improve the game experience on the casual level quite a lot without affecting the game at all on the professional competitive level.
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Maybe it's just me but I think there are a ton of ex-Masters players that are gold->diamond not because of the system changing drastically but mainly because they don't play as seriously or as much anymore and are burnt out on the game. I was a 15 time masters but now I switched races and just playing for fun now and plat/diamond. A few of players that I play against seem to be the same.
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First off games can end legitimately under 4 minutes, you will also be punishing players that get cheesed 5 times in a row. As I said you cant "fix" this issue without causing others for people. Besides that there are people that don't like certain match ups etc. many reasons people leave games early not even for the purpose of tanking MMR that will be punished.
Second even if we were to implement your system think of the people that would need to work on the project plus their pay. Now imagine from the business point of view, is the issue even worth solving for the time/money you need to invest with no return? My point being we shouldn't even be discussing this as it wont happen.
EDIT: I think you are really exaggerating the suffering you go through playing superior players. I can almost guarantee you those games last less than 10 minutes. At this point I'm surprised you aren't trying to get rid of ads on cable because of the time they are wasting from your evening trying to watch Game of Thrones.
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On December 13 2014 05:27 Kazahk wrote:
First off games can end legitimately under 4 minutes, you will also be punishing players that get cheesed 5 times in a row.
First off, set it to 3 minutes and they legitimately can't, short of scouting a proxy gate and leaving on sighting it or a drone rush its going to be more than that.
Secondly why should it punish them for being cheesed, it should just not count the game to the MMR. It actually helps a player being cheesed if they come inside the limit.
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You don't see an issue with people not having their MMR affected by leaving the second they scout cheese?
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On December 13 2014 05:27 Kazahk wrote:
Now imagine from the business point of view, is the issue even worth solving for the time/money you need to invest with no return? My point being we shouldn't even be discussing this as it wont happen.
EDIT: I think you are really exaggerating the suffering you go through playing superior players. I can almost guarantee you those games last less than 10 minutes. At this point I'm surprised you aren't trying to get rid of ads on cable because of the time they are wasting from your evening trying to watch Game of Thrones.
Imagine less and less enthusiastic and average skilled players are interested in the game ... I think it would affect business a lot. It's the community that is brings the money foundation of the game, not so much the Pro-Gaming licenses.
If we dont watch we dont play and the game is dead.....
and I don't watch Game of Thrones with ads, my VODs are ad free....
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It was a joke not meant literally. You bought the game they don't care if you don't play.
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On December 13 2014 05:42 Kazahk wrote:
You don't see an issue with people not having their MMR affected by leaving the second they scout cheese?
yea some player just send out scout, if they smell cheese they can just quit the game and their MMR stays the same
fair huh lol
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On December 13 2014 05:54 Kazahk wrote:
It was a joke not meant literally. You bought the game they don't care if you don't play.
They do. The fact they still invest hundreds of thousands of dollars into SC2 as a franchise tells us they really do care whether we play the game buddy.
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I mean they don't care that one person doesn't play. Most people don't care and que up another game.
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For me this all comes down to the fact that the MMR algorithm doesn't distinguish between players playing a lot (like +10 games/day) and the others playing only once in a while (or taking breaks of several weeks/months) !
- if you stop playing for a while your MMR goes down (or rather stays at a fixed value while the average MMR of the playing ladder goes up), this makes you match against lower-skilled players even without loosing games on purpose !
- the game should match people not only using MMR points as a reference, but also using the frequency of play, so that "casual" players (who don't play much) wouldn't be matched against more "hardcore" players (who play a lot)
It's not just a question of loosing games on purpose (some higher ranked players use lower ranked accounts for fun, while streaming, or when doing "training courses" to help their students to learn how to play better). It's no secret that more competitive players play "more" than "casuals" who will leave after just a few games lost.
I think the simplest solution to this problem is to use the average frequency of games (lost or won doesn't matter). Whether you loose games on purpose, rush/cheese, ladder a lot of games per day to climb up, all players who want more competition/challenge than other players will inevitably grind games instead of playing less it's a very simple principle really.
So if the system detects players playing less games than others then it should match these kinds of players against similarly "minded" players. And if or after you play more you progressively get matched against the more competitive pool of players. This would solve most of the problems by moving "aggressive" players away from the less inclined ones.
Just my 2 cents.
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On December 13 2014 06:36 ProbeAbility wrote:
For me this all comes down to the fact that the MMR algorithm doesn't distinguish between players playing a lot (like +10 games/day) and the others playing only once in a while (or taking breaks of several weeks/months) !
- if you stop playing for a while your MMR goes down (or rather stays at a fixed value while the average MMR of the playing ladder goes up), this makes you match against lower-skilled players even without loosing games on purpose !
- the game should match people not only using MMR points as a reference, but also using the frequency of play, so that "casual" players (who don't play much) wouldn't be matched against more "hardcore" players (who play a lot)
It's not just a question of loosing games on purpose (some higher ranked players use lower ranked accounts for fun, while streaming, or when doing "training courses" to help their students to learn how to play better). It's no secret that more competitive players play "more" than "casuals" who will leave after just a few games lost.
I think the simplest solution to this problem is to use the average frequency of games (lost or won doesn't matter). Whether you loose games on purpose, rush/cheese, ladder a lot of games per day to climb up, all players who want more competition/challenge than other players will inevitably grind games instead of playing less it's a very simple principle really.
So if the system detects players playing less games than others then it should match these kinds of players against similarly "minded" players. And if or after you play more you progressively get matched against the more competitive pool of players. This would solve most of the problems by moving "aggressive" players away from the less inclined ones.
Just my 2 cents.
Interesting and how would you deal with players that play a lot teamgames, too but not so many 1v1s?
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They aren't necessarily fooling their MMR. I made Master last year but where am I right now, even after playing close to 10 games every day? I am in top 8 platinum, struggling to break through to the next rank.
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well, the system isnt perfect either. I got demoted from dia to gold in a couple season on Na because I didnt play that regularly. I play Zerg in EU (main race) but I like to ladder with the other races too so I got P in NA and T in Korea. I dont give freewins to anybody but in NA nowadays it s not even funny. And suddenly I face an exmaster, who s also gold, and he hadnt been dropping games either. We talked a bit after the game and he said he was seriously considering quitting altogether because of this.
Another friend of mine on EU (AureS, perhaps you ve heard of him) was demoted to diamond despite having being masters forever, and he went 59 4 and still wasnt promoted. Those games were no fun for him or for his opponents (I imagine).
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The problem isn't with players having their MMR lowered due to decay.
Just the delay on being able to cue for a new game seems like a perfect solution. 3 games in a row under a minute? Take a 5 min break. 5 more in the last half hour? Come back in an hour and see if you can play normally. 3 more?! Now we're calling the internet police and put you in a room with just a horny dog.
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I haven't really seen a problem on ladder. Sure there're your bad apples, they've always been there, but the typical ladder experience is fine. Seeing someone who's a 10X+ master in even gold or silver means nothing since the game has been out for 4 years. Not only may the player's skill have degraded significantly from a long break, but leagues have shifted dramatically. I'm in plat now (ex-masters, I would estimate mid or low-mid) and the players I play would be at high diamond/low masters from when I laddered before.
Many of them have a good sense of timing attacks and good micro/macro. In plat back in the day, a toss wouldn't be able to run an immo/sentry allin before 12 minutes. That's completely changed now.
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Some of these occurrences are from guys who get their account boosted, for a price, and don't pay up. So the booster will tank 30 games in a row.
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On December 14 2014 00:01 Sjokola wrote:
The problem isn't with players having their MMR lowered due to decay.
Just the delay on being able to cue for a new game seems like a perfect solution. 3 games in a row under a minute? Take a 5 min break. 5 more in the last half hour? Come back in an hour and see if you can play normally. 3 more?! Now we're calling the internet police and put you in a room with just a horny dog.
I dont know, I mean you can just remake. In Brood War you wouldnt usually play right away, there were lag issues, etc etc. But still it was fine.
Sometimes your internet (or your opponent s) act up and it s unplayable so you just leave. You shouldnt be punished for that.
there s also the problem of ranked vs unranked.
I d rather see a return to BW era gamemaking along the ladder we have, where you can make a lobby and play. Add a feature like "counts for ladder" or something and let s roll. Of course with restrictions, like you cant play a given player more than 3 times or smthg. But it would allow people to select their maps and MU and desired skill level.
On December 14 2014 00:16 EndOfLineTv wrote:
Some of these occurrences are from guys who get their account boosted, for a price, and don't pay up. So the booster will tank 30 games in a row.
people do that? Really?
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I switched to random which made me drop 2 leagues and I am working my way back up. Sometimes this means I play against people with my main race that I simply destroy. I have had that happen to me back in the day and I just move on, and try to learn from the loss. I think people take this issue way too seriously.
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On December 14 2014 00:25 WGT-Baal wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2014 00:01 Sjokola wrote:
The problem isn't with players having their MMR lowered due to decay.
Just the delay on being able to cue for a new game seems like a perfect solution. 3 games in a row under a minute? Take a 5 min break. 5 more in the last half hour? Come back in an hour and see if you can play normally. 3 more?! Now we're calling the internet police and put you in a room with just a horny dog. I dont know, I mean you can just remake. In Brood War you wouldnt usually play right away, there were lag issues, etc etc. But still it was fine. Sometimes your internet (or your opponent s) act up and it s unplayable so you just leave. You shouldnt be punished for that. there s also the problem of ranked vs unranked. I d rather see a return to BW era gamemaking along the ladder we have, where you can make a lobby and play. Add a feature like "counts for ladder" or something and let s roll. Of course with restrictions, like you cant play a given player more than 3 times or smthg. But it would allow people to select their maps and MU and desired skill level. Show nested quote +On December 14 2014 00:16 EndOfLineTv wrote:
Some of these occurrences are from guys who get their account boosted, for a price, and don't pay up. So the booster will tank 30 games in a row. people do that? Really?
Yep.... Kids ask me to boost their account on a daily basis. Some of my Gm friends boost for money all the time. They now ask to be paid in full
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On December 14 2014 01:36 EndOfLineTv wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2014 00:25 WGT-Baal wrote:On December 14 2014 00:01 Sjokola wrote:
The problem isn't with players having their MMR lowered due to decay.
Just the delay on being able to cue for a new game seems like a perfect solution. 3 games in a row under a minute? Take a 5 min break. 5 more in the last half hour? Come back in an hour and see if you can play normally. 3 more?! Now we're calling the internet police and put you in a room with just a horny dog. I dont know, I mean you can just remake. In Brood War you wouldnt usually play right away, there were lag issues, etc etc. But still it was fine. Sometimes your internet (or your opponent s) act up and it s unplayable so you just leave. You shouldnt be punished for that. there s also the problem of ranked vs unranked. I d rather see a return to BW era gamemaking along the ladder we have, where you can make a lobby and play. Add a feature like "counts for ladder" or something and let s roll. Of course with restrictions, like you cant play a given player more than 3 times or smthg. But it would allow people to select their maps and MU and desired skill level. On December 14 2014 00:16 EndOfLineTv wrote:
Some of these occurrences are from guys who get their account boosted, for a price, and don't pay up. So the booster will tank 30 games in a row. people do that? Really? Yep.... Kids ask me to boost their account on a daily basis. Some of my Gm friends boost for money all the time. They now ask to be paid in full
Wow, that's really sad.
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On December 14 2014 01:48 rotta wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2014 01:36 EndOfLineTv wrote:On December 14 2014 00:25 WGT-Baal wrote:On December 14 2014 00:01 Sjokola wrote:
The problem isn't with players having their MMR lowered due to decay.
Just the delay on being able to cue for a new game seems like a perfect solution. 3 games in a row under a minute? Take a 5 min break. 5 more in the last half hour? Come back in an hour and see if you can play normally. 3 more?! Now we're calling the internet police and put you in a room with just a horny dog. I dont know, I mean you can just remake. In Brood War you wouldnt usually play right away, there were lag issues, etc etc. But still it was fine. Sometimes your internet (or your opponent s) act up and it s unplayable so you just leave. You shouldnt be punished for that. there s also the problem of ranked vs unranked. I d rather see a return to BW era gamemaking along the ladder we have, where you can make a lobby and play. Add a feature like "counts for ladder" or something and let s roll. Of course with restrictions, like you cant play a given player more than 3 times or smthg. But it would allow people to select their maps and MU and desired skill level. On December 14 2014 00:16 EndOfLineTv wrote:
Some of these occurrences are from guys who get their account boosted, for a price, and don't pay up. So the booster will tank 30 games in a row. people do that? Really? Yep.... Kids ask me to boost their account on a daily basis. Some of my Gm friends boost for money all the time. They now ask to be paid in full Wow, that's really sad.
Still better than getting to higher leagues than what you deserve through maphacking.
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Well, here is one who leave games. Why do I do it? I am so tired of 4 years of SC2 with so few changes in some MU... I usually enter unranked and want to play TvZ, TvT or TvP. As there is no tool to look for specific MU, I need to leave games till find what I was looking for. I am low Diamond and sometimes even play real noobs. What can I do? Is really so difficult for Blizzard to créate a "Search MU" Button? I dont think so, but here we are after five years and still so difficult to practice. If you have no friends or are in some clan, how can you play 20 TvZs in a row if you want??? Impossible.
Imagine this: You are Protoss and want to play PvZ. Go hit the MU button with the option of PvZ and you will find only Zergs. May the wait be too big, but it will be worth it. Its better tan play 20 games with 10 Ts, 7 Ps and only 3 Zs, when you are looking only for TvZ.
I watch streams and every tournament and want to practice. The A.I. is not worth it, so I want a practice partner and is really difficult to find it because of our work or whatever. So I enter SC2 and look for TvP. If I leave 5 games (happens to me every day) I lose a lot of time. Instead I preffer to wait same time till find the MU I want.
Its not about farming. And I hate randoms...
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On December 14 2014 02:39 Dvriel wrote:
Well, here is one who leave games. Why do I do it? I am so tired of 4 years of SC2 with so few changes in some MU... I usually enter unranked and want to play TvZ, TvT or TvP. As there is no tool to look for specific MU, I need to leave games till find what I was looking for. I am low Diamond and sometimes even play real noobs. What can I do? Is really so difficult for Blizzard to créate a "Search MU" Button? I dont think so, but here we are after five years and still so difficult to practice. If you have no friends or are in some clan, how can you play 20 TvZs in a row if you want??? Impossible.
Imagine this: You are Protoss and want to play PvZ. Go hit the MU button with the option of PvZ and you will find only Zergs. May the wait be too big, but it will be worth it. Its better tan play 20 games with 10 Ts, 7 Ps and only 3 Zs, when you are looking only for TvZ.
I watch streams and every tournament and want to practice. The A.I. is not worth it, so I want a practice partner and is really difficult to find it because of our work or whatever. So I enter SC2 and look for TvP. If I leave 5 games (happens to me every day) I lose a lot of time. Instead I preffer to wait same time till find the MU I want.
Its not about farming. And I hate randoms...
Agreed, at least Unranked should have this option.
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I think the number of people "fooling" the mmr by purposely losing is way below the number of people behing hit by mmr decay tbh.
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MMR is just bad at the moment. Fooling is not the problem. I just doesn't match most people's strength, especially not casual players that are often inactive.
In the past it did match your strength (while the placement in the "league" had nothing to do with your MMR), now more than often it does match your activity.
As a casual who is often inactive and then starts again I used to be in Masters. Now every time I'm restarting I am in gold, kill most gold people that I almost feel bad for them and still not get promoted. Atm I'm again at 40w/10l as a Z in gold, I even had a 14 wins straight streak. Promotion? Of course nooo... still getting the same bad gold opponents. I'm probably the guy you would think of doing MMR fooling. But in reality the current MMR system is just bad. It forces people to either be really active or just don't play at all, because playing a few games each week doesn't get you anywhere even though you still might have the skill.
I guess if I played like above 100 games I would get promoted, but I just don't feel like grinding 100 games against opponents that are just not good enough to learn anything against. So I go to custom - or just stop playing again, frustrated by Match Making. I don't know why Blizzard can't learn what people motivates to play a game. Hint: An inactivity-punishing MMR system is NOT MOTIVATING AT ALL. Not for me and not for the people I get matched against... So Blizzard actually kills the fun of two people at once with this system.
Thanks.
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It's something I'm noticing too while ranking up as random on a second account (which was inactive). I started as diamond playing diamond opponents, I'm now 44-10 and I'm still diamond and playing diamond opponents. Furthermore, I NEVER got more than 12 points when I won, always around 6-7, and -17/-18 when I lost. The problem, imo, isn't how low you get placed because of MMR decay, but rather how hard it is to get back into your old mmr even when you're doing massing win streaks.
When you are inactive, they should fix it so that you can increase your MMR quickier, pretty much how it already is when you start on a completely fresh account, in that situation you can get from platinum to masters in like 20 games.
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On December 14 2014 02:50 rotta wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2014 02:39 Dvriel wrote:
Well, here is one who leave games. Why do I do it? I am so tired of 4 years of SC2 with so few changes in some MU... I usually enter unranked and want to play TvZ, TvT or TvP. As there is no tool to look for specific MU, I need to leave games till find what I was looking for. I am low Diamond and sometimes even play real noobs. What can I do? Is really so difficult for Blizzard to créate a "Search MU" Button? I dont think so, but here we are after five years and still so difficult to practice. If you have no friends or are in some clan, how can you play 20 TvZs in a row if you want??? Impossible.
Imagine this: You are Protoss and want to play PvZ. Go hit the MU button with the option of PvZ and you will find only Zergs. May the wait be too big, but it will be worth it. Its better tan play 20 games with 10 Ts, 7 Ps and only 3 Zs, when you are looking only for TvZ.
I watch streams and every tournament and want to practice. The A.I. is not worth it, so I want a practice partner and is really difficult to find it because of our work or whatever. So I enter SC2 and look for TvP. If I leave 5 games (happens to me every day) I lose a lot of time. Instead I preffer to wait same time till find the MU I want.
Its not about farming. And I hate randoms... Agreed, at least Unranked should have this option.
I like this Idea, then Unranked play would serve a good purpose....
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On December 14 2014 05:44 Zulu23 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2014 02:50 rotta wrote:On December 14 2014 02:39 Dvriel wrote:
Well, here is one who leave games. Why do I do it? I am so tired of 4 years of SC2 with so few changes in some MU... I usually enter unranked and want to play TvZ, TvT or TvP. As there is no tool to look for specific MU, I need to leave games till find what I was looking for. I am low Diamond and sometimes even play real noobs. What can I do? Is really so difficult for Blizzard to créate a "Search MU" Button? I dont think so, but here we are after five years and still so difficult to practice. If you have no friends or are in some clan, how can you play 20 TvZs in a row if you want??? Impossible.
Imagine this: You are Protoss and want to play PvZ. Go hit the MU button with the option of PvZ and you will find only Zergs. May the wait be too big, but it will be worth it. Its better tan play 20 games with 10 Ts, 7 Ps and only 3 Zs, when you are looking only for TvZ.
I watch streams and every tournament and want to practice. The A.I. is not worth it, so I want a practice partner and is really difficult to find it because of our work or whatever. So I enter SC2 and look for TvP. If I leave 5 games (happens to me every day) I lose a lot of time. Instead I preffer to wait same time till find the MU I want.
Its not about farming. And I hate randoms... Agreed, at least Unranked should have this option. I like this Idea, then Unranked play would serve a good purpose....
MU Search would be a serious improvement for everyone looking to improve....
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On December 14 2014 05:56 SuperYo1000 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2014 05:44 Zulu23 wrote:On December 14 2014 02:50 rotta wrote:On December 14 2014 02:39 Dvriel wrote:
Well, here is one who leave games. Why do I do it? I am so tired of 4 years of SC2 with so few changes in some MU... I usually enter unranked and want to play TvZ, TvT or TvP. As there is no tool to look for specific MU, I need to leave games till find what I was looking for. I am low Diamond and sometimes even play real noobs. What can I do? Is really so difficult for Blizzard to créate a "Search MU" Button? I dont think so, but here we are after five years and still so difficult to practice. If you have no friends or are in some clan, how can you play 20 TvZs in a row if you want??? Impossible.
Imagine this: You are Protoss and want to play PvZ. Go hit the MU button with the option of PvZ and you will find only Zergs. May the wait be too big, but it will be worth it. Its better tan play 20 games with 10 Ts, 7 Ps and only 3 Zs, when you are looking only for TvZ.
I watch streams and every tournament and want to practice. The A.I. is not worth it, so I want a practice partner and is really difficult to find it because of our work or whatever. So I enter SC2 and look for TvP. If I leave 5 games (happens to me every day) I lose a lot of time. Instead I preffer to wait same time till find the MU I want.
Its not about farming. And I hate randoms... Agreed, at least Unranked should have this option. I like this Idea, then Unranked play would serve a good purpose.... MU Search would be a serious improvement for everyone looking to improve....
Yeah, that would be an awesome improvement...
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Since I changed from 1v1 ladder to 4v4 unranked, I dont have these problems anymore.
Earlier, MMA faker, hacker and everything else annoyed me, when I lost, i was stressed and my mindset gone bad and when I won I didnt care much. The game made less and less fun but I still enjoyed esport alot.
Then I just played unrankend 4v4, where no skill is needed, where you dont care if you lose ( my allies, like in MOBAs, just accuse your allies ) and you can use crazy shit tactics. The fun rises, who cares about losing and i got my fun again. And yeah, I can play random now, who cares I dont know how to toss, I can enjoy 100% of the game and not 33%.
Just start playing unranked 1v1 or 4v4, much more fun, less stress, who cares about all the flaws.
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What if you are the person winning 20+ games in a row in under 2 minutes each because people are leaving to tank there MMR? Does that mean you won't be able to click the play again button either? How would the system be able to differentiate ? -_- ...
Need to just have a better ladder system lol...
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OP, I have reasons to think that you you may be blowing it out of proportion. If encountering a player from 2-3 leagues above you happens like every third game or so, then surely that would require a solution. Fair. However, I'm certain that it's much less than that.
The Idea of making changes to ladder experience of all people because of that doesn't seem reasonable to me.
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On December 14 2014 07:24 GGzerG wrote:
What if you are the person winning 20+ games in a row in under 2 minutes each because people are leaving to tank there MMR? Does that mean you won't be able to click the play again button either? How would the system be able to differentiate ? -_- ....
Well, that would be a pain, too but I don't see this happen because you would never be matched vs. a tanking person so many times in a row. The penalty shall apply only to the person that quits the game early, and not to the winning person.
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When the OP first posted this, I had not met this problem but wholeheartedly agreed it is a problem, but for the past few days I'm lucky if i don't meet a diamond (or master) player ranked this season in gold or platinum.
Sadly, while I doubt anything will happen to try and fix this in one way or another, I still have to say it's pretty disheartening to constantly meet players that are obviously better than you just because they decided to drop to a lower league and troll people.
Funnily though a few of them are pretty bad, but still not bad enough to lose in a lower league too often, since I won 2 games and lost at least 3 due to micro mistakes or bad decision making while the rest were stomps, however they are obviously good enough to make the difference if needed, I mean they did get to that much higher league in the first place after all, so that skill is not going to just miraculously go away just because now they chose to play in a much lower league.
So if this seems to be the only way ladder can be played nowadays, I think that people will continue to lose interest in the game and the viewership will continue to go down in tournaments due to people feeling no longer any appeal towards a game that only brought frustration.
There could be many more things said, like for example how while different games have way more BM during matches they still have lots of people both playing and watching tournaments or how that BM or trolling seems to have an opposite effect on the players.
I guess if we want to have a future as players in the lower part of the ladder, someone will say we just have to get better by hitting that concrete wall in both skill gap and decision making that separates us from the higher part of the ladder until the wall gets bored with us and falls on its own accord.
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This is so awkward, I don't want to flame, but it's so bad, I could not keep it.
Situation: I started playing ranked again today. I have a solid 8:4 Winrate, I'm in Gold, last season I was in Platinum, never close to diamond skill and I can't win a straightforward game vs. my diamond friends.
My last two games I lost during the last sesson, The first ladder match I got was a TvT, against a Diamond Terran... ok, I said f***ing Matchmaking, he said he was decayed system.... sure....
Next game I was against a Platinum Random Player who cheesed the sh** out of me. Ok seems the system tests my MMR, maybe I get promoted soon.. I still have 8:6 Winrate....
Now 3rd Game today. I get a Gold player, he plays unranked... ok. a new account even probably a very new player (Level8) and I won ezpz....
After the game I saw he was indeed at least on a new account, his 10th 1v1 game (unranked only) he lost 8 of his 10 Games and HE WAS FAVORED....
That's pretty nasty.... I mean shall I buy a new account to get a better MMR?
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On December 12 2014 23:59 Zulu23 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 12 2014 23:41 tar wrote:
or the algorithm could just be adjusted to ignore any game shorter than say 3 in-game minutes for calculating MMR. Show nested quote +On December 12 2014 23:57 Tuczniak wrote:
... Maybe. But a lot better way would be to not count games shorter than 1 minute to MMR. Then there are still players who want to be annoying by leaving games against races they don't like to play. I would say this would worse the problem even... because then anybody would be enabled to leave any game without consequence when they don't play against the race they want to, or not playing the race they want while playing random....
I dont play vs Protoss if I dont want to. And noone can force me to play vs Protoss.
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I played a TON when HotS launched and was able to get into masters for 2 seasons. I play a lot less, and my skill at playing has decayed (but switching from playing on a desktop to a laptop didn't help either). Now my MMR should be around plat but I'm stuck in diamond because I play too many games for my MMR to reset but not enough to put me in plat.
Not all of this is intentional. Also like others said, the shrinking player pool and people playing unranked really mess with things. I tried switching races and played around an unranked gold MMR despite having a ranked diamond border. You get a lot of complaints "why are they putting me against diamonds?" or "Of course you're gonna win, you're diamond."
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This is the way it is im afraid, i dont agree with ur coolddown tho. im a solid plat player, ive played thousands and thousands of games. When i get holidays like right now i leave my league and climgb back up through gold, back to the top of my plat league and i start hitting lots of dias and master players even with the gold template. I dont care about my rank really i wish i could get rid of the starter screen showing the portraits, i use that button in game.
i do this cos i dont want to know what league the other guy is in, nor do i click on the profiles after games, i just dont care at all.
the cool down thing tho, not a great idea. right now im really struggling with terran and atm the games against them are good, but come the start of last season and the reverted wm buff i never saw them it was zvzvzvzvzvzvzvzvzvz zvp, i would leave some of the zvz games, even though its my fav matchup, i wanted to prac against p and t. So no, the cooldown would just limit my play or id have to keep swapping regions.
For me the way around this is to have a veto system like with maps except you can choose one race you want mm to prefer, have this in unranked play as yopu dont want to fuck up the ladders with people playing a mu they are good at, it wont be fair, in ur however who gives a fuck
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MMR is really scewed nowadays. I was playing a game the other day ranked as diamond and I was matched against a guy who was level 5 and he had absolutely no idea what he was doing. Did some one base roach drop against me which obviously failed. These sorts of games do not happen frequently but even Blizz should know better than to let these anomalies creep up.
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People Tanking down the MMR are killing the game, because they are simply destroying the fun on the game for the other player... Why? Playing versus a obvius much to good opponent is a waste of time...
Sadly you see I only right after the score screen in the profile of the opponent.... I mean 300APM in Gold leauge is supisions, and then 7x Master it was a game lost from the start...
This behavour kills the enthusiasm in the community, and the game will not be uphold for 5000 professional players.
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I think it's because the casual player base is shrinking faster than the top level player base. Normally this shouldn't be a problem as there should be much more people around Gold league than Diamond/Masters+.
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On December 31 2014 01:01 Zulu23 wrote:
People Tanking down the MMR are killing the game, because they are simply destroying the fun on the game for the other player... Why? Playing versus a obvius much to good opponent is a waste of time...
Sadly you see I only right after the score screen in the profile of the opponent.... I mean 300APM in Gold leauge is supisions, and then 7x Master it was a game lost from the start...
This behavour kills the enthusiasm in the community, and the game will not be uphold for 5000 professional players.
apm's probably the worst used indicator of skill. I have a friend in silver whos lowest minute is 300 and average is like 370. I played a korean gm protoss who had 102 apm in a ~12 minute game.
Something somewhat interesting is my unranked mmr has not moved ever? However during the start of new seasons or if i get removed from league my unranked opponents are closer to my real mmr. If they made a better way for players to warmup or offrace on ladder there wouldnt be as many games instantly over on the loadscreen.
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China6331 Posts
If my memory was correct, deliberately throwing games to lower MMR is a bannable offense, dunno whether reporting will work.
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this whole ranking system is kind of bodacious and in a way i mean that sarcastically.
the more i think about it, the more needless it all seems--
separate graphics for each rank, an MMR rating, and an entire system shaped around it.
if you think about it as well (especially as someone who comes from an era of PC gaming where matchmaking wasnt a thing) it is kind of absurd. carrying that general idea forward, each time you click play, youre reserving yourself to the fact that you dont know who youre going to be playing. instead, you should be quite happy that theres even a feature to let you quickplay against someone who is relatively around your calculated MMR.
i like the way it is now because its different and i get to be lazy while getting something done (practice).
we formed gaming groups, had personal boycotts against certain players, and advertised ourselves for casual or practice games. then you got to know the other players and what their general level of play was at, and went from there. that was part of the process that separated casual from non-casual. good players seek good--so on and so forth.
this was wholely your judgement and part of the community aspect of which you cannot measure in todays style of convenience gaming. in the past you did not just press the button and hope to hit someone you could have a tightly contested game with. you joined a game lobby or chat channel to organize a game with someone and to get the practice that you wanted to get, learning about your opponent in the process.
malicious intent is going to be around in any online game at any time. i understand how frustrating it might be to log in and waste time like this, but thats not the reason why you should give up on your experiences with a game when it seems that nothing is going the way it was designed to. the only reason why you should give up is if you can no longer reliably have fun while youre playing under good conditions, and as long as the game allows it, i dont see why you dont try forming your own groups or playing amongst new ingame friends in order to make use of those conditons. that is what confuses me the most--the system might be utter garbage, but why dont you rely on yourself to be able to get the games that you want
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|
|
|
EPT
