EPTLegacy of the Void Announced - Page 70
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Costanza9
Canada8 Posts
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Svizcy
Slovenia300 Posts
On November 08 2014 22:38 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: only 1 new unit for protoss and that 1 is kinda...weird. I would describe it as simply bad. 300 gas heavy unit...i would expect it to do some severe splash damage if it's there to replace collosi in late game armies. Collosie splash is getting nerfed so that toss wouldn't be so death ball dependant anymore, but it really looks bad atm. | ||
BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES51708 Posts
On November 08 2014 22:41 Costanza9 wrote: Its sad no one can take this reveal with a grain of salt. Hots and even wol alphas were nothing like the final versions, are people seriously this naive? in a way this is all feedback for the reveal, minus quality control. | ||
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[PkF] Wire
France24239 Posts
On November 08 2014 22:41 Costanza9 wrote: Its sad no one can take this reveal with a grain of salt. Hots and even wol alphas were nothing like the final versions, are people seriously this naive? You have to take into account this announcement isn't just about new units or graphical enhancements, it's a lot about their very philosophy of the game, and while they're showing a commendable willingness to move away from their hardcore beliefs, they still need to work on their concepts. That's mostly the reason why we're talking a lot about those changes (eco changes, warp in changes, etc) because those things work in synergy and have to be thought of carefully before any serious and commital choice is made. | ||
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KingAlphard
Italy1705 Posts
On November 08 2014 22:42 Svizcy wrote: I would describe it as simply bad. 300 gas heavy unit...i would expect it to do some severe splash damage if it's there to replace collosi in late game armies. Collosie splash is getting nerfed so that toss wouldn't be so death ball dependant anymore, but it really looks bad atm. I'd say it overlaps with the colossus. I mean, we already have that and storms, is there really a need for a 3rd ground AOE? Imo they should rather change the colossus. | ||
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a_flayer
Netherlands2826 Posts
On November 08 2014 22:42 Svizcy wrote: I would describe it as simply bad. 300 gas heavy unit...i would expect it to do some severe splash damage if it's there to replace collosi in late game armies. Collosie splash is getting nerfed so that toss wouldn't be so death ball dependant anymore, but it really looks bad atm. if the carrier is made useful again, then i'd say protoss has 2 new units. | ||
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Ljas
Finland725 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24239 Posts
On November 08 2014 22:45 Ljas wrote: If even a fraction of the whiners go through with their threats to stop watching and playing Starcraft 2 we'll have a much less toxic community to look forward to. Please stop with that. It's a thread about the announcements, the ones who disagree with the direction towards the game seems to be heading have the right to be vocal about it. I agree threats like "I won't play SC2 anymore if this goes through" aren't constructive, but we don't have to play yes men. | ||
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On November 08 2014 22:33 Sapphire.lux wrote: Big J was always quite rational and balanced in opinions, don't know what's going on lately? Big J, what don't you like about the increase in micro potential in all races? About rewarding players that expand past 3 bases? About toning down hard counters and promoting tactical play? I don't see those things! The economical changes as far as I have seen are that you have to expand earlier because your bases run out faster, which might be good or bad but far from the worker scaling stuff that people wanted. The saturation hasn't been changed according to the exhibition matches. The 12 worker change is nice, it removes a lot of rushes that are too hard to scout because scouting with your 6th worker was economically unreasonable, but with 12workers it is reasonable to send one away the moment the game starts. Some of the units show nice micro potential (ravager, Herc), others not so much. Most of the stuff is button-clickers and not movers-shooters which makes the game feel very warcrafty/protossy and more about selecting stuff fast and casting the right stuff on the right units than actual movement/positioning units. All of the units seem to be hardcounters. Like the Cyclone kiting nearly everything to death without being touchable or the ravager being complete nonsense against anything that isn't in siege mode. Stuff like picking up sieged tanks and speeding around with them goes exactly against the strategic ideas of Mech play, so does the cyclone. I've never really liked the idea behind the nydus. If you miss it, suddenly you have a whole army in your base. Many of the changes make it even harder to defend harass, which means more than ever you have to rely on your composition and timings punishing an opponent. (e.g. no more defensive warpins or PO vs air units is a massive, massive blow against mutalisk/speedivac play) To me it sounds like the game is getting less positional/tactical and more about abusing the opponents composition. Also Terran and Protoss get even stronger longrange options (talking new carriers, ~13leash range cyclones, new tanks) while zerg is cemented with 8-9range at max after the SH change. Which sounds to me like the balance of Z vs P/T is going to be all about catching the P/T in the open. If he doesn't go into the open... well, you expand and wait until he runs out of money. Which is the aspect about Zerg play I have been hating since WoL day 1. On November 08 2014 22:36 Ramiz1989 wrote: Yeah, I know, that is also very strange. Majority of time I've agreed with his opinions, but this just doesn't sound like him. He was among the guys who actually likes seeing Swarm Hosts vs. Siege Tanks battles and now he is whining about everything, don't really know... someone hacked his account? Well, I like them for the first 30mins of a game. Then one can usually predict the winner of a match based on the expansions taken and how much bank the players have and the game goes dull for another 30mins. That's where SHs become really stupid. | ||
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TheBloodyDwarf
Finland7524 Posts
On November 08 2014 22:42 Svizcy wrote: I would describe it as simply bad. 300 gas heavy unit...i would expect it to do some severe splash damage if it's there to replace collosi in late game armies. Collosie splash is getting nerfed so that toss wouldn't be so death ball dependant anymore, but it really looks bad atm. Yeah, is it better than storm? Does this unit use energy? If so, ghost will rape it. | ||
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[PkF] Wire
France24239 Posts
On November 08 2014 22:50 Big J wrote: Some of the units show nice micro potential (ravager, Herc), others not so much. Most of the stuff is button-clickers and not movers-shooters which makes the game feel very warcrafty/protossy and more about selecting stuff fast and casting the right stuff on the right units than actual movement/positioning units. I agree I'd have liked to see more units that have "simple" micro potential like the marine or the stalker rather than the spell/abilities centered units they showed. | ||
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dBdHellRider
Sweden63 Posts
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Garmer
1286 Posts
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Svizcy
Slovenia300 Posts
On November 08 2014 22:45 KingAlphard wrote: I'd say it overlaps with the colossus. I mean, we already have that and storms, is there really a need for a 3rd ground AOE? Imo they should rather change the colossus. Well, that will depend on the neft to collosus. 3rd splash damage unit is there cause the main one is getting a nerf. Yea carriers will be interesting addition to late game armies, however i simply can't see any air-based armies being used in PvT as long as the marines are as they are...meaning to cost efficient vs any type of air. They might be just thinking we should go air vs mech type armies i belive. We didn't see any banshee use today but i am really really really scared of that one. +1 range, default cloak when build and a speed buff upgrade, this just blows my mind. Ofc it's early to disscuss unit balance right now but i am really scared of this game turning in the c&c3-kane's wrath counter system. | ||
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Ljas
Finland725 Posts
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SiroKO
France721 Posts
Wait for the beta before complaining about balance. Please also keep in mind that all LoTV units (HoTS + LoTV additions) will be tweaked during alpha & beta, in order to make these new additions balanced. In terms of pure game design, I really dislike the Cyclone. Unit looks dull and boring. The Herc, could be nice, could be terribad, I'm not sure. I hope it will be used as something else than an "anti-baneling" unit... On the other hand, all the Protoss and Zerg additions look really cool ! | ||
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RaFox17
Finland4581 Posts
Edit: Could somebody explain how the lurker is supposed to be good against anything? | ||
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[PkF] Wire
France24239 Posts
On November 08 2014 22:53 Ljas wrote: Of course, I don't mean to say that nobody's allowed to disagree, but there's a huge amount of people in this thread who are incapable to expressing themselves in a reasonable manner. I tend to excuse that kind of reaction because it actually shows how much they care for the game. You can be damn unreasonable and irrational when it comes to things that really matter to you.  | ||
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roym899
Germany426 Posts
And fewer resources per base meaning more bases is a pretty neat change imho. Gonna take a lot of rebalancing though i suppose. | ||
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Excelion
Bulgaria59 Posts
On November 08 2014 22:41 Costanza9 wrote: Its sad no one can take this reveal with a grain of salt. Hots and even wol alphas were nothing like the final versions, are people seriously this naive? True hots was full of bad designs in an alpha and even thou we where lucky some didn't go through lots do and turned into a very repetitive and declining month by month game. Now we see even more terrible ideas and designed, some of which even contradict their own philosophy(from the early days of WOL). And instead of having "Hey here are great unit concepts and changing that would make the game more robust and fun to watch, but we still need to balance them out" it is "Yeah we where totally out of ideas and we dont want to listen to anyone in the community who ever suggested solution or idea, so here are so stuff we randomly gathered and put left and right in the game with almost no instead of helping it balance out or be more entertaining for the views... we'd probably remove like 10% of the crap before release... " | ||
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