EPT"Destiny I" Financial Report - Page 11
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Iksf
United Kingdom444 Posts
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bluQ
Germany1724 Posts
On August 12 2014 02:19 woopr wrote: Destiny is nothing compared to what KeSPA is so he should stop acting like he's an equal to them. him/his tournament's value is nowhere close to KeSPA's value so locking them out of his next tournament is pretty dumb. What the .... I mean .... I can't ... Did you read ANYTHING he wrote? Liek ... anything? | ||
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Melix
United States89 Posts
Out of curiosity, was there any further correspondence between you and Kespa after the letter you wrote? I don't read the letter as foreclosing Kespa's participation -- it seems like Chuddinator was asking you to elaborate on the case for why their participation would be beneficial to them. If the conversation stopped there just because the letter comes off as presumptuous I think you might have lost an opportunity. If there was further dialogue it would be interesting to hear how it went. Also, did you have a prior relationship with any of these Kespa folks? If they didn't have any idea who you were a skeptical reply wouldn't be that unusual. | ||
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kyllinghest
Norway1607 Posts
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Grovbolle
Denmark3815 Posts
On August 12 2014 01:56 Destiny wrote: I keep seeing this a lot, but this has nothing to do with personal feelings, it's 100% business oriented. I have a product (my tournament) that I want to be successful. This product also offers players a very easy way to make money - all they have to do is play in an online tournament for 3 days (assuming they make it to at least the semi-finals. There's a considerable amount of "risk" that has to be taken in regards to the investment of the product. I (along with the community crowd-funding, to some extent) am shouldering almost all of that "risk" in the hope for a potential payout. If the tournament is a large success, then my risk was worth it. If it's a massive failure, then I lose everything I risk, which in this case means damage to my brand plus community backlash plus the inability for me to crowd fund a second tournament. KeSPA had the opportunity to "help" me with my brand for virtually nothing. Sending any KeSPA players, even b-teamers, could have bolstered viewership for the tournament. They are only playing online. It's an easy opportunity for them to make money. It's not risking or endangering their brand really much at all. It's not like this is a KeSPA sanctioned or KeSPA sponsored tournament. For them to completely forgo even sending b-teamers to my tournament means they had zero desire to involved in the investment part of the tournament, even though the "risk" for them was nearly non-existent and the "reward "(players earning money, plus positive exposure to KeSPA's player's team's brands etc...on Gameheart) could have been decent. If I'm happy with the viewership that I received for this tournament, why on earth would I reward KeSPA by inviting them now that the risk has been largely mitigated instead of just inviting similar people from last time? Liquid and EG were both kind to me in setting up invites for my tournament; I would much rather have Bunny/Taeja in my tournament since Liquid helped me set the first one up in regards to giving me access to their players vs letting KeSPA leech off of the success of a tournament that they didn't help whatsoever. This has nothing to do with "lolbutthurt" or "omg feelings" and it's 100% business related. If you are too scared to take part in the initial round of investment for a company then why on earth would you go back to the company later hoping to reap the same rewards that initial investors got? It's all about us - the viewers, what we want is what will get you money, especially since you want 100% crowdfunding. It's like saying that those who didn't back a kickstarter can't buy the product after it goes into production if it's a success. | ||
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BamBam
745 Posts
On August 12 2014 01:56 Destiny wrote: I keep seeing this a lot, but this has nothing to do with personal feelings, it's 100% business oriented. I have a product (my tournament) that I want to be successful. This product also offers players a very easy way to make money - all they have to do is play in an online tournament for 3 days (assuming they make it to at least the semi-finals. There's a considerable amount of "risk" that has to be taken in regards to the investment of the product. I (along with the community crowd-funding, to some extent) am shouldering almost all of that "risk" in the hope for a potential payout. If the tournament is a large success, then my risk was worth it. If it's a massive failure, then I lose everything I risk, which in this case means damage to my brand plus community backlash plus the inability for me to crowd fund a second tournament. KeSPA had the opportunity to "help" me with my brand for virtually nothing. Sending any KeSPA players, even b-teamers, could have bolstered viewership for the tournament. They are only playing online. It's an easy opportunity for them to make money. It's not risking or endangering their brand really much at all. It's not like this is a KeSPA sanctioned or KeSPA sponsored tournament. For them to completely forgo even sending b-teamers to my tournament means they had zero desire to involved in the investment part of the tournament, even though the "risk" for them was nearly non-existent and the "reward "(players earning money, plus positive exposure to KeSPA's player's team's brands etc...on Gameheart) could have been decent. If I'm happy with the viewership that I received for this tournament, why on earth would I reward KeSPA by inviting them now that the risk has been largely mitigated instead of just inviting similar people from last time? Liquid and EG were both kind to me in setting up invites for my tournament; I would much rather have Bunny/Taeja in my tournament since Liquid helped me set the first one up in regards to giving me access to their players vs letting KeSPA leech off of the success of a tournament that they didn't help whatsoever. This has nothing to do with "lolbutthurt" or "omg feelings" and it's 100% business related. If you are too scared to take part in the initial round of investment for a company then why on earth would you go back to the company later hoping to reap the same rewards that initial investors got? While certainly the caliber of players participating could of increased as a result of select few kespa players, I highly doubt the tournament overall would of been that much better off. At 20k viewers on average per day, you're already beating views on the redbull lan, and halfway from overcoming the views on HSC. Plus, I do feel there is something to be said about the "foreign magic" that is rarely played up on instead of "random korean vs other korean". However, I think its nieve to believe that any major organizer would be gun-ho on any project like yours when you first present it to them. Of course, you could just bypass kespa entirely and go straight to the teams themselves as been done previously with other organizers, which if you *really* want koreans in, that would probably be the best way about doing it. Of course, there is always the business approach. If kespa now likes the idea of letting their players play, you can always demand a "donation" to be made for their willingness to assist in growing the tournament. If they refuse, then so what? You just add in more foreigners and get more viewers. If they accept, then you can consider the donation as part of their risk premium. | ||
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DeadByDawn
United Kingdom476 Posts
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SkaPunk
United States471 Posts
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imrusty269
United States1404 Posts
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pretender58
Germany713 Posts
On August 12 2014 02:37 DeadByDawn wrote: Only 1% of the viewers contributed - shame. I contributed $20 but I was not able to spare the time to watch! Glad to hear it was a success. Not everyone has the financial means to contribute, even when someone wants to do so, e. g. students. I would be perfectly comfortable with running ads in the breaks, as I could contribute in that way. | ||
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TotalBiscuit
United Kingdom5437 Posts
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Rustug
1488 Posts
Loved the tournament and I hope you'll organize another. You talked about Perks. He're some Perks you might consider. (I've also added what I would pay). Amount - Perk $5 - Wallpaper with the tournament logo. $10 - Replay-pack with all the tournament games. $20 - Original Tournament Soundtrack. $30 - Replay-pack & Original Tournament Soundtrack. Why not sell your tournament assets as Perks and distribute them after the tournament? I'm guessing you'll be wanting "fresh" assets for Destiny II, anyway.  Also, F.Y.I, I've backed a few projects on Kickstarter and Indiegogo and several of them used backerkit.com to assist in distributing. PS, I was one of the backers of this tournament and I'm a satisfied customer. :D | ||
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IndigoS
Canada7 Posts
On August 12 2014 01:56 Destiny wrote: This has nothing to do with "lolbutthurt" or "omg feelings" and it's 100% business related. If you are too scared to take part in the initial round of investment for a company then why on earth would you go back to the company later hoping to reap the same rewards that initial investors got? Well, it was clearly a poor business decision on the part of KeSPA to have not contributed towards Destiny I, but it seems to me that it would now make perfect sense for them to want to get on board. Obviously this is a bit of a scumbag move, but the logical decision nevertheless. On August 12 2014 01:56 Destiny wrote: If I'm happy with the viewership that I received for this tournament, why on earth would I reward KeSPA by inviting them now that the risk has been largely mitigated instead of just inviting similar people from last time? Liquid and EG were both kind to me in setting up invites for my tournament; I would much rather have Bunny/Taeja in my tournament since Liquid helped me set the first one up in regards to giving me access to their players vs letting KeSPA leech off of the success of a tournament that they didn't help whatsoever. If you feel that KeSPA's original aversion towards Destiny I reflected poorly on the organization's management as a whole, I'd certainly not fault you for that. It demonstrates an almost inexcusable lack of awareness on their part. However, going forward, I believe that you should not view any future involvement as "rewarding" KeSPA, but rather as growth for your own brand. You might want to consider more carefully the potential benefits of associating yourself with such an organization and having more top-tier Koreans available to you. If you have already done so and are satisfied with your current resources, then of course the correct choice might be to cut ties. Just be aware of what you are locking yourself out of. At the end of the day, I personally believe that Destiny I was a fantastic tournament with great player talent, even without KeSPA, and that their involvement is not necessary at this point in time. However, I also fail to see any tangible risks that you would take on by associating yourself with them; it seems as if cooperation would be a win-win for both parties. Thanks again for putting on such a great show, and good luck going forward! | ||
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Zprit
92 Posts
Anyway, I can totally understand why they didn't let players play this time. | ||
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stakiman
Bulgaria42 Posts
Definitely will tune up next time!!~ Love the transparency. It makes me feel genuinely interested in how the tournament turns out as a whole, not just what the final bracket results are. Thanks! | ||
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orvinreyes
577 Posts
1. I was expecting to see "financials" thru proper reports i.e., income statements, balance sheets, cash flow. My guess is that your $1,800 just broke you even if you factor in your working capital, utilities, equipment, cost of living, etc. What about a provision for taxes if you decide to go big and official on this? 2. IMO, Kespa is just making sound business decision here, no need to hate on them. But now that proleague is over, their demand will dip slightly, so you may have more leverage during this lull, until the KeSPA cup, that is. 3. What about ad revenues from the actual Twitch stream, any report on that? | ||
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JimSocks
United States968 Posts
mostly foreigners with a sprinkle of korean. less invites, more qualifiers. inno disrespecting the tourny, was BS, and he still won. and i don't mind destiny made $1800. back in the days casters were making 5 figures, doing jack all. (and now they're playing hearthstones) destiny organized the whole thing, and still supporting SC2. | ||
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pretender58
Germany713 Posts
On August 12 2014 02:55 orvinreyes wrote: 3. What about ad revenues from the actual Twitch stream, any report on that? Destiny didn´t run any ads. | ||
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JimSocks
United States968 Posts
edit: also, destiny saving esports. more viewers than redbull, taiwan (nobody wants to watch ZvZ mirror matchups all day long) | ||
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TommyP
United States6231 Posts
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