On August 07 2014 16:18 kalstrams wrote: [Anyone who is fairly educated can find largest European country in the map since it is quite difficult to miss.
On August 07 2014 16:18 kalstrams wrote: [Anyone who is fairly educated can find largest European country in the map since it is quite difficult to miss.
Only if we count Russia as European country, which might be debatable considering the fact that most it's territory lies in Asia. However, European part of Russia is larger than Ukraine, so I guess it just depends on how you look at it.
Ukraine is for sure largest European country that lies fully in Europe.
On August 07 2014 17:27 Creager wrote: Aaaaaand esports just became a political stage.
not really, just the heat of the moment. Esports is populated with young (and nerdy lol) it mainly doesn't give a shit. Unless there's a manager who spoils the fun.
This will be the best tournaments if KR wont visit russia. But they will. Because it's their money, their job. Most of this "political" ppl in Ukraine dont even know there is a game SC2, so they will not care about gamers that will visit russian.
On August 07 2014 18:11 DeinSchatten wrote: This will be the best tournaments if KR wont visit russia.
Would you mind elaborating on your thought process behind this?
Meh, he's probably looking forward to see more European players in it. It's similar how some people in the U.S. are more interested in a specific college sport than its professional counterpart.
On August 06 2014 23:39 Faust852 wrote: Looks like pros don't really want to go to Russia :}
We're not sending players for a couple of reasons. Firstly, Russias rampant homophobia. Not only is it morally repugnant, but it puts our players at risk. Korean males are culturally very comfortable with being close to each other. Holding hands, sitting on others laps etc, not at all uncommon. In Russia this could be mistaken for gay behavior and may result in misunderstandings that could even lead to violence. There are plenty of incidents where gay or "we thought he was gay" people have been beaten in Russia. Secondly, Russias belligerence in how they're acting with the Ukraine is reason enough to keep our players out on both moral grounds and with concern to their own safety.
TB, I love you and your team but to read this is pretty painful.
First of all this whole "homophobia" thing is completely blew out of scale by the western media that tried to depict Russia as a country dangerous for gay people- it's not as easy as in some place like California but it's far from the worst. Your post unfortunately denotes a huge amount of ignorance on actual facts and about Russia itself, but I know it's not your fault because you're also brainwashed by western media. Russia has a huge amount of Chinese and southern east Asia visitors who - just like Koreans - act the way you described and there's never episodes like the one you describe where there's episodes that could lead to violence, especially on foreigners.
Second, the U.S. itself has some of the most homophobic states (and most racist states too) but you never hear about someone not sending players to a certain state because they're racist and homophobic there. Also, most of the allies of the U.S. (i.e. Saudi Arabia) execute homosexual people and put them in jail. Then Obama goes on TV and says he has no patience for countries that have homophobic remarks like Russia but forgets about their buddies like those middle eastern states from which they get oil from. And then someone like you thinks damn he's right and just pictures Russia as the bad guys forgetting EVERY super-power (US, Russia, China) is equally bad for different reasons. Some western people are so stupid to think to "boycott" Russia for this homophobia reason - which as I said is nothing more than a huge media thing against Russia that started pre-olympics due to tensions that were rising over Snowden and other issues - but you never see some American, UK or EU citizen boycott vacation in Dubai, despite the fact that it's a city built on slavery and where there are some of the strongest anti-gay laws. The view that one country is evil (Russia) and one is good (US, UK or whatever) just shows how much naive you are and the hilarious thing is that you're trying to come out as a good guy for boycotting Russia's event or rather, you have a valid reason not to support Russia- but really, what you're showing is your narrow fielded view. The U.S. does just as many bad things as Russia, and historically speaking have done even more. You probably must not know how things are in China- because you don't boycott there but that country is on far worst human rights ground than Russia and U.S.
Before you think I am biased because I am Russian, I want to tell you two things: One is that I lived most of my life in California, one year in the UK and the least amount itself in Russia and when I come back here I always remember how unfair Russians are treated by the rest of the west, especially lately. You are doing nothing more than a disservice for Russian fans. There's aton of Russian SC2 fans, and I know myself a lot of people who love (or maybe now loved) your team and players but reading this stuff is pretty sad and pathetic sorry. This boycott thing working just shows how good the U.S. media campaign is really, nothing more
But I watched Rocky IV, and Apollo Creed was downright murdered in the ring, ok?! So don't tell me that Russia isn't bad. But I think things will work themselves out in the future, because once Russia sees how brave and good hearted we (North) Americans are, we will learn to work together and the divides which separate us will be brought down.
"Thank you. I came here tonight… and I didn’t know what to expect. I’ve seen a lot of people hating me… and I didn’t know… what to feel about that, so… I guess I didn’t like you much either. During this fight… I seen a lot of changing: the way you felt about me… and the way I felt about you. In here… there were two guys… killing each other. But I guess that’s better than million. What I’m trying to say is… if I can change… and you can change… everybody can change! I just want to say one thing to my kid… who should be home sleeping. Merry Christmas, kid! I love you!" - Rocky Balboa, Rocky IV
On August 06 2014 23:39 Faust852 wrote: Looks like pros don't really want to go to Russia :}
We're not sending players for a couple of reasons. Firstly, Russias rampant homophobia. Not only is it morally repugnant, but it puts our players at risk. Korean males are culturally very comfortable with being close to each other. Holding hands, sitting on others laps etc, not at all uncommon. In Russia this could be mistaken for gay behavior and may result in misunderstandings that could even lead to violence. There are plenty of incidents where gay or "we thought he was gay" people have been beaten in Russia. Secondly, Russias belligerence in how they're acting with the Ukraine is reason enough to keep our players out on both moral grounds and with concern to their own safety.
TB, I love you and your team but to read this is pretty painful.
First of all this whole "homophobia" thing is completely blew out of scale by the western media that tried to depict Russia as a country dangerous for gay people- it's not as easy as in some place like California but it's far from the worst. Your post unfortunately denotes a huge amount of ignorance on actual facts and about Russia itself, but I know it's not your fault because you're also brainwashed by western media. Russia has a huge amount of Chinese and southern east Asia visitors who - just like Koreans - act the way you described and there's never episodes like the one you describe where there's episodes that could lead to violence, especially on foreigners.
Second, the U.S. itself has some of the most homophobic states (and most racist states too) but you never hear about someone not sending players to a certain state because they're racist and homophobic there. Also, most of the allies of the U.S. (i.e. Saudi Arabia) execute homosexual people and put them in jail. Then Obama goes on TV and says he has no patience for countries that have homophobic remarks like Russia but forgets about their buddies like those middle eastern states from which they get oil from. And then someone like you thinks damn he's right and just pictures Russia as the bad guys forgetting EVERY super-power (US, Russia, China) is equally bad for different reasons. Some western people are so stupid to think to "boycott" Russia for this homophobia reason - which as I said is nothing more than a huge media thing against Russia that started pre-olympics due to tensions that were rising over Snowden and other issues - but you never see some American, UK or EU citizen boycott vacation in Dubai, despite the fact that it's a city built on slavery and where there are some of the strongest anti-gay laws. The view that one country is evil (Russia) and one is good (US, UK or whatever) just shows how much naive you are and the hilarious thing is that you're trying to come out as a good guy for boycotting Russia's event or rather, you have a valid reason not to support Russia- but really, what you're showing is your narrow fielded view. The U.S. does just as many bad things as Russia, and historically speaking have done even more. You probably must not know how things are in China- because you don't boycott there but that country is on far worst human rights ground than Russia and U.S.
Before you think I am biased because I am Russian, I want to tell you two things: One is that I lived most of my life in California, one year in the UK and the least amount itself in Russia and when I come back here I always remember how unfair Russians are treated by the rest of the west, especially lately. You are doing nothing more than a disservice for Russian fans. There's aton of Russian SC2 fans, and I know myself a lot of people who love (or maybe now loved) your team and players but reading this stuff is pretty sad and pathetic sorry. This boycott thing working just shows how good the U.S. media campaign is really, nothing more
Even if Russia isn't as anti-gay as you claim, there's still this 'little' thing.
On August 07 2014 00:27 TotalBiscuit wrote: Russias belligerence in how they're acting with the Ukraine is reason enough to keep our players out on both moral grounds and with concern to their own safety.
On August 06 2014 21:35 Cinek357 wrote: Does anyone know if Huligan is former WC3 human player Xyligan?
lol XyLigan, it's funny to suddenly remember someone like this after so long. He was a very promising Human player, now I'm trying to remember more about him.
Holy shit, seriously? Is that TB's post for real? Russia suddenly became one of the most dangerous places on Earth for gays, like really? With all of the gay clubs in Moscow and Saint-Pete, with gays freely walking holding hands down the streets?
Nice brainwashed view of Russia you got there, TB. Way to react on that propaganda bullshit your government-controlled media's feeding you.
I'm sorry if I sound butthurt (which I do), but that TB's post just caught me off guard. I am a fan of his, watching his every video, and to hear such a bullshit from a personality I was looking up to that much. That just hurts.
TB, let me tell you one thing: there are shit load of gays in major Russian towns and gay clubs, too. Your justification not to send your players in Moscow, a fucking capital, where hundreds if not thousands of gays living freely, is just fucking stupid and ignorant on so many levels it's laughable. I live in Saint-Pete, I see gays on the streets and in a subway almost every day, I've never seen anyone saying a single word to them, let alone hurt in some way. And now you're telling me that your players are in danger in a secure place with mostly nerds, security, cameras? Yeah, way to go man.
Oh, and what the fuck the Ukraine has to do with this? There are thousands of Ukrainians living in Russia, there are thousands of Ukrainian refugees streaming from Ukraine now, getting themselves places to live and work.
Again, sorry for the rant, I'm just extremely astounded and disappointing by the ignorance and short-slightness of one of my favorite personalities. Welp,I guess you can't fight the bullshit spewing media machine some people choose to feed off from.
On August 06 2014 23:39 Faust852 wrote: Looks like pros don't really want to go to Russia :}
We're not sending players for a couple of reasons. Firstly, Russias rampant homophobia. Not only is it morally repugnant, but it puts our players at risk. Korean males are culturally very comfortable with being close to each other. Holding hands, sitting on others laps etc, not at all uncommon. In Russia this could be mistaken for gay behavior and may result in misunderstandings that could even lead to violence. There are plenty of incidents where gay or "we thought he was gay" people have been beaten in Russia. Secondly, Russias belligerence in how they're acting with the Ukraine is reason enough to keep our players out on both moral grounds and with concern to their own safety.
Second, the U.S. itself has some of the most homophobic states (and most racist states too) but you never hear about someone not sending players to a certain state because they're racist and homophobic there. Also, most of the allies of the U.S. (i.e. Saudi Arabia) execute homosexual people and put them in jail. Then Obama goes on TV and says he has no patience for countries that have homophobic remarks like Russia but forgets about their buddies like those middle eastern states from which they get oil from. And then someone like you thinks damn he's right and just pictures Russia as the bad guys forgetting EVERY super-power (US, Russia, China) is equally bad for different reasons.
Calling flat out bullshit on this one, mixed race guy here who has been extensively through Russia, Japan, Korea, Europe, Israel, Dubai, etc. and I've also been extensively through the southern US. The level of violence and police corruption is far worse in Russia than exists anywhere in the USA. There is plenty of terrible bigotry and prejudice in the USA, but Russia is far beyond that, the level of suspicion, disdain and aggression many Russians have for foreigners is crazy, literally groups of teenagers just walk around getting drunk and fucking shit up and assaulting people, none of this is uncommon, and they without a doubt target foreigners, racial minorities and people they perceive as being gay and it is for the most part ignored by the police there. In the US, you might wind up in a small town where people let you know you aren't welcome, but you are almost never going to be randomly assaulted, and police actually respond and take you seriously for the most part if a situation escalates to that.
I will grant that the middle east is far worse than Russia is in terms of persecution of LGBT individuals and people that are minorities to those countries, and is abominable. However most of those countries are not considered overall developed nations even if Dubai in particular is. As developed countries go, Russia is probably the worst major super power in regard to how it treats their gays, and the apologists who say that "well we aren't really that bad" or compare themselves to states that have banned same sex marriage, none of our celebrities are on tv telling people to execute gays, like some have in Russia.
Russia is fucking absolutely terrible and terrifying compared to the US in every single way when it comes to homophobia, the extent of it, the severity of the reaction to it, the criminality of it, and the likelihood that you will be attacked or killed as a result of being one or being perceived to be one and it is not even remotely close to the USA.
Further, as TB pointed out, none of this is a criticism or protest of the way in which Russia or any other country has chosen to govern themselves or treat sexual or racial minorities, but a valid reaction to protecting his players by not taking them to a country with active violence and political hostility, and local culture that will be hostile to the way his Korean players naturally act. There's no way shape or form he should "just tell them to knock it off" for a few days, your tournament isn't worth the safety risk.
And I frankly don't care what the Russians say anecdotally about "I've never seen anything blah blah blah" I've been there for 2 weeks and 3 weeks and saw multiple messed up scenarios including people getting randomly assaulted and I had multiple people try and pick fights with me just for being an American, literally walking down the street minding my own business and have someone yell at me scenarios.
On August 07 2014 20:53 bbkpoker wrote: And I frankly don't care what the Russians say anecdotally about "I've never seen anything blah blah blah" I've been there for 2 weeks and 3 weeks and saw multiple messed up scenarios including people getting randomly assaulted and I had multiple people try and pick fights with me just for being an American, literally walking down the street minding my own business and have someone yell at me scenarios.
Frankly, do you think anybody cares about your anecdotes?
On August 07 2014 20:53 bbkpoker wrote: And I frankly don't care what the Russians say anecdotally about "I've never seen anything blah blah blah" I've been there for 2 weeks and 3 weeks and saw multiple messed up scenarios including people getting randomly assaulted and I had multiple people try and pick fights with me just for being an American, literally walking down the street minding my own business and have someone yell at me scenarios.
I got assaulted by "muricans" yelling "fucking commie" at me in the US. Prove me wrong.
The fact is, the level of violence in Russia is exactly the same as in any other western/EU country. Hell I'm working in the Saint-Pete's university and there are loads of Americans, black, brown, everyone, as well as Brits, Indians, Chinese, Koreans, easterners. Most of them living in Russia, working for multiple months, I see thousands of tourists on the streets every day and you don't see them getting hurt or yelled at.
Are you telling me Russian people are some barbarians walking the streets with baseball bats searching for anyone to rip their head off? Like, really? Please, most of the people here are civilized, they work everyday, they have families and children, and they don't give a fuck about foreigners and gay people, just like any European country. I can google you multiple videos from the UK where some teenage retards assault people because they have some sort of a game where you must knock a person with one hit. Let's assume all Brits are inadequate fighting cunts who like to assault everyone just for fun, right?
Please, stop spewing your bullshit, it's really getting old.