TLO, Grubby advance from Group F of WCS EU Ro32

On March 03 2014 17:28 Orcasgt24 wrote:

Group G isn't for over a month??? What the hell!

On March 03 2014 17:32 mki wrote:

Yeah it's a shame but it's because there's quite a few other events going on right now also for WCS Points. WCS Katowice, TeamStory Cup and I'm sure I'm missing some other ones.

. Genius, a semifinalist in the previous WCS season, was unable to clear the hurdle of cross server lag and fell out in third place

On March 03 2014 17:28 Orcasgt24 wrote:

Group G isn't for over a month??? What the hell!

On March 03 2014 17:49 Sissors wrote:

Am I the only one who really dislikes these statements? We had the same in previous previews and recaps: Sure the cross server lag is an issue for those playing from Korea. But first of all it is their own decission to play in WCS EU from KR. However what I get more irritated about: again it isn't even considered that they were simply beaten because others played better. Apparantly the idea what a European beats a high level Korean is so weird that it must be lag, it cannot possibly be just skill.

On March 03 2014 18:01 Spect8rCraft wrote:

I'm tempted to make a FireCake joke.

On March 03 2014 18:21 Nightwishone wrote:

I totally agree... I get it that last year our hopes of a foreigner champion were destroyed, but can we have a more positive mindset now? Can we say - Europe holds!!! - instead of - our fate is doomed no matter what?

On March 03 2014 19:00 Waxangel wrote:


I broke the date parser :[

On March 03 2014 17:49 Sissors wrote:

Am I the only one who really dislikes these statements? We had the same in previous previews and recaps: Sure the cross server lag is an issue for those playing from Korea. But first of all it is their own decission to play in WCS EU from KR. However what I get more irritated about: again it isn't even considered that they were simply beaten because others played better. Apparantly the idea what a European beats a high level Korean is so weird that it must be lag, it cannot possibly be just skill.

On March 03 2014 19:51 Irrational_Animal wrote:
Well, cross-server lack certainly affects the relevant player both ingame and also in terms of strat selection as you are forced to play styles that are less reliant on micro (TLO said in the winners interview that he kinda knew that Genius had to rely on all ins/cheese). In the PVPs vs Grubby it was obvious that Genius just tried to build up a maxed out deathball as in this case it`s just important to set up a nice concave.
However, cross-server lag shouldn`t be brought up as an excuse for some reasons:
1) you can minimize the impact of it by getting somewhat used to playing it (Hyun is a good example)
2) unlike some Kespa stars, it`s not obvious whether Genius is in fact that much better skillwise as he had no official games in the last months
3) most of Genuis`losses simply came down to bad decision making (think of G3 vs TLO)

On March 03 2014 18:44 mouzChase wrote:


Couldn't agree more just well played by both of them (Grubby and TLO). They worked hard for that so lets not talk about lag, lets talk about progression !

On March 03 2014 23:56 Hez wrote:



I do think though that it's good to mention that there is lag there. If nothing else, it serves to inform people and to maybe spur blizz to do what they can about it. Obviously saying that that is the ONLY reason Genius lost is not ok, but mentioning the server lag is a good thing.

On March 03 2014 23:56 Hez wrote:



I do think though that it's good to mention that there is lag there. If nothing else, it serves to inform people and to maybe spur blizz to do what they can about it. Obviously saying that that is the ONLY reason Genius lost is not ok, but mentioning the server lag is a good thing.

On March 04 2014 02:52 BaneRiders wrote:


Well, that is what Waxangel does, he literally claims that lag is the ONLY reason WCS EU is not overrun by Koreans like WCS AM for example here: WCS EU - Ro32 Group D Preview (Season 1) Repeating such statements or similar ones is certainly disrespectful to EU players, and it makes Waxangle (and whoever else states this on TL) look rather ignorant and/or arrogant, especially seeing how many Koreans based in Europe as well as Korea that failed to make it to PL Group stage 2 so far. Please put some effort in explaining why people won/lost crucial maps (e.g.: San microing like a boss to keep his immortals alive with his warp prism against Miniraser) instead of putting it down to lag, because yeah, it is getting really old now and I don't particularly care to read more of such statements in the future. Hell, I bet people in EU can have severe lag too on a bad day, you don't have to sit in Korea for that.

On March 04 2014 07:19 LibertyRises wrote:
Stop being soft and seeing what you want to see. The lag is there. We all play starcraft and most of us have played cross server and know first hand whats up. So this segment of the foreigner community wanting us to pretend that cross server lag isnt a huge fucking issue at that level is pathetic. Wax didnt take away anything from their accomplishments he called it like it is. To me, and I maybe wrong, you guys seem like the biased ones in your interpretation of the article.

TLO and Grubby sure dont need you complaining for extra brownie points for them they are more than capable of beating Koreans at lans and we all know it stop being soft. How are we going to ever catch the Koreans in skill when youre literally willing to hide behind a wall of lag? Its not like they fear coming to your IEMS and Dreamhacks and taking foreigner money? God we are like prey to them with this thought process.

On March 04 2014 21:37 Sissors wrote:

You know I can turn your entire post around where you are always willing to hide behind lag? It just isn't an option in yout thought process that a Korean pro can be beaten by a non-Korean. It must be lag. Anything else is simply not an option for you. To me you seem to be incredibly biased.

On March 04 2014 21:37 Sissors wrote:

You know I can turn your entire post around where you are always willing to hide behind lag? It just isn't an option in yout thought process that a Korean pro can be beaten by a non-Korean. It must be lag. Anything else is simply not an option for you. To me you seem to be incredibly biased.

On March 04 2014 21:37 Sissors wrote:

You know I can turn your entire post around where you are always willing to hide behind lag? It just isn't an option in yout thought process that a Korean pro can be beaten by a non-Korean. It must be lag. Anything else is simply not an option for you. To me you seem to be incredibly biased.

On March 04 2014 22:17 Nebuchad wrote:


He literally wrote the opposite in the post you just quoted.

opinion of insecure and soft side of the foreign community.
[...]
Anything suggesting any less shows we need to step the fuck up and be rid of this defeatist attitude.

On March 05 2014 02:12 Sissors wrote:

You know that is exactly the point of my post? That is why I mentioned the 'turning around' part. That his logic could be turned around against him, which is pretty much the definition of the writing the opposite.


The fans of non-Koreans aren't the ones who feel so insecure that everytime one loses they have to blame lag, jetlag, the length of their network cable or a bad mouse. That is fully on the Korean-fans side.

Same for defeatist attitude, that is completely coming from you, where the only reason a non-Korean beats a Korean is because of lag. That is the definition of a defeatist attitude.

On March 05 2014 02:12 Sissors wrote:

You know that is exactly the point of my post? That is why I mentioned the 'turning around' part. That his logic could be turned around against him, which is pretty much the definition of the writing the opposite.