Next Balance Patch the 28th February. - Page 19

On February 27 2014 01:14 vthree wrote:


Sure, Protoss will lose probes if mines get in the mineral line. But 12 probes to a single mine? Yet, that is just bad play. I mean hellions are OP too if they get in the base and you line up your workers.

On February 27 2014 01:14 Big J wrote:


And even when Zergs learned this, they were still a very powerful tool, weren't they?

On February 27 2014 01:14 vthree wrote:


Sure, Protoss will lose probes if mines get in the mineral line. But 12 probes to a single mine? Yeah, that is just bad play. I mean hellions are OP too if they get in the base and you line up your workers.

On February 27 2014 01:21 forsooth wrote:

Of course they were. Why wouldn't they be?

On February 27 2014 01:22 Big J wrote:


but I think that was the point of the discussion. They might have a strong role in the metagame.

On February 27 2014 01:22 Big J wrote:


but I think that was the point of the discussion. They might have a strong role in the metagame.

On February 27 2014 01:12 forsooth wrote:

I'm having déjà vu, seems to me Zerg players made the exact same complaint about widow mines when HotS first came out and ended up learning how to send out a few units ahead of the army to trigger mines. If they could accomplish it with low HP, low range units, there's no reason at all why Protoss can't accomplish the same thing with much higher HP, higher range units.

On February 27 2014 01:28 forsooth wrote:

Having an effect on the metagame and claiming that vikings and mines will make attacking Terran completely out of the question are not really the same thing though. One is a general assumption with a pretty reasonable basis, the other is a kind of silly theorycraft that was already disproved in another matchup when the same complaint was made.

On February 27 2014 01:32 ETisME wrote:

Going back to the very first post you quoted, I think what he said actually can become a problem.

wol late game terran with heavy ghost marauder Viking is incredibly powerful due to the obs sniping and cloak ghosts emp everything and stim a move in

Widow mine might put more focus on "abuse" over the lack of less vulnerable/solid cloak reveal unit for protoss and might be problematic in the future.

I guess we will just have to see how it goes.

On February 27 2014 01:33 Bagi wrote:

Zealots and lings work differently though, you can't really burrow your mines under your bio army against lings because their speed makes it possible to wrap around the bio army before the mines detonate causing huge friendly fire to the terran army, this is obviously even worse when fighting on creep. To offset ling mobility mines are often placed ahead of the army, which makes it possible to set them off with smaller squads of lings.

Zealots in comparison are fewer and less mobile, they cannot swarm the terran army like lings can and lose most of their mobility after the first charge forward. This makes kiting zealots into mines that are below the terran army or even slightly behind it a much more valid tactic.

On February 26 2014 10:57 sandman1678 wrote:


1. Really its harder on the attacker than the defender I didn't Know that....Oh wait yeah I did its called a DEFENDERS ADVANTAGE.
2. Yeah of course you have to learn to split your army, but know you don't have to learn to do that to get into higher league unfortunately. There are plenty of players that have made it diamond masters just off of cheese and timing builds.
3. Oh course you have to macro at home if your pushing same rule applies for ever race not just terrans.
4. Of course its harder to do it than it is in theory but not being able to do it personally doesn't mean its unbalanced it just means you need to get better.
5. You have KNOW IDEA rather Terrans or Protosses apm is higher. Nor does apm relate to skill in any way. Anybody can sit and spam in the early game and fake a high apm is how effect your moves per minute are not how many of them you do.
6. Up unitl the last few months timing attacks and all-ins were used alot how many times do you remember seeing scv pulls or big 10-12 minuted pushes. I remember watching forgg, MVP, MMA, Taeja and many other Terrans bust out big 8-12 minute pushes. It wasn't until about october-November last year after the hellbat nerf when the pushes started to calm down some.
7. Everything I said above except for the late game micro doesn't require all that much skill at all to do. Stimming in and out to bait a photon overcharge a little bit before you plan to attack not hard. Stimming in then dropping up into the main isn't all that hard. Nor is just focus firing down a small army and running in to the main.
8. Its not easy for toss either when the Terran is playing right, they have to split their army correctly defend multiple locations, continue to macro, and find some way of applying pressure or far to far behind. However, Alot of terrans will over commit to attack a 2base templar tech protoss and lose. Any race turtled up on 2bases just needs to be contained while you macro.
9. If a Protoss opens colossi you should already know how to deal with this. Before Protoss started opening Templar and opened colossi every game the win rate was in favor of Terran it turned around when Protoss started opening Templar.
10. And I suppose you would also be comfortable saying everytime their were low numbers of Protoss in code S it was because of imbalance.

On February 26 2014 12:51 seak99 wrote:



Thanks for making my case for me

Sometimes it takes a bit of time before a strategy or unit is utilized properly. Hence it may have been in the game a while but never been nerfed.

People have been complaining about protoss for a long time. Some of it warranted, some of it not. But David Kim is doing this to balance at the top level, so it doesn't matter for the rest of us gamers right

On February 26 2014 22:39 RaZorwire wrote:


You're right, but just as a sidenote; it's definitely possible to kite marines so that they do less damage than they would have if they weren't controlled at all. If you spend too much time running, and not enough time stopping to shoot, they will miss out on potential attacks and do less damage. It's true that you can't cancel attacks, but you will perform worse if you kite incorrectly.

On February 26 2014 22:39 Ghanburighan wrote:
In terms of design, isn't the hydra superior to the marine then? Someone who kites hydras well is doing something more impressive than someone who kites marines... The problem is that hydras don't seem to need to kite much...

On February 27 2014 02:52 NayASC wrote:
the WM buff will literally break PvT, templar opener will not be viable anymore because of the splash of widow mines vs chargelots now, this will be a big problem and will also bring lots of SCV pulls because the protoss will have to go collosus opener.