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On October 02 2013 19:41 dabom88 wrote:
When Blizzard first announced WCS, people hated it because it had legitimately bad problems.
2 seasons later... people still hate it and the problems have not been fixed. And that doesn't look like it'll be changing any time soon.
Since SC2's inception, it seems as though Blizzard has really stuck their fingers in their ears and their heads in the ground, ignoring a lot of the major criticisms people had with them. Korea's the region that that's been effected the most by their ignorance, and it's the region that's suffering the most as the result of it.
And really, should anyone really be surprised? Problems have been apparent for a long time. Players have asked Blizzard to fix them. And Blizzard has stubbornly refused or ignored them. And as much as I love SC2, Blizzard just does not seem to get that their game and approach to e-sports needs major fixing. And as a result, I really find it sad that I don't think there's any more hope for SC2 in Korea. There isn't going to be some kind messiah savior for it. No magic bullet. No healing potion. The Korean audience has made it clear that they don't care for SC2 in its current state, and Blizzard really doesn't look like they're going to do anything to change that. So, unfortunately, that's probably gonna be it. I really hope I'm wrong, but I expect SC2 to continue to decline until it eventually becomes incredibly niche like WC3 in Korea.
As for the rest of the world, it's probably more resilient. SC2 still pretty popular outside of Korea. I can't make any predictions for SC2 outside of Korea right now, as the writing on the wall isn't as clear as it is in Korea.
Sad part is if you think Wc3 is dead in Korea. Its actually MORE popular then sc2 in Korea according various sources.
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Fionn ist totally correct. And you do need a soft region lock by residence. As stated it doesn´t help the region at all if some top players (whereever they come from) rush over for 2weeks, grab the top places and the money and leave again to be seen in 3months again. I´ve been saying this for months, if you want to strengthen the local scene, you have to make the top players commit to it. And the point with season finals, yeah totally agree.
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1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
Region lock with the current WCS system and I retire
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On October 02 2013 20:14 Rickyvalle21 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2013 19:41 dabom88 wrote:
When Blizzard first announced WCS, people hated it because it had legitimately bad problems.
2 seasons later... people still hate it and the problems have not been fixed. And that doesn't look like it'll be changing any time soon.
Since SC2's inception, it seems as though Blizzard has really stuck their fingers in their ears and their heads in the ground, ignoring a lot of the major criticisms people had with them. Korea's the region that that's been effected the most by their ignorance, and it's the region that's suffering the most as the result of it.
And really, should anyone really be surprised? Problems have been apparent for a long time. Players have asked Blizzard to fix them. And Blizzard has stubbornly refused or ignored them. And as much as I love SC2, Blizzard just does not seem to get that their game and approach to e-sports needs major fixing. And as a result, I really find it sad that I don't think there's any more hope for SC2 in Korea. There isn't going to be some kind messiah savior for it. No magic bullet. No healing potion. The Korean audience has made it clear that they don't care for SC2 in its current state, and Blizzard really doesn't look like they're going to do anything to change that. So, unfortunately, that's probably gonna be it. I really hope I'm wrong, but I expect SC2 to continue to decline until it eventually becomes incredibly niche like WC3 in Korea.
As for the rest of the world, it's probably more resilient. SC2 still pretty popular outside of Korea. I can't make any predictions for SC2 outside of Korea right now, as the writing on the wall isn't as clear as it is in Korea. Sad part is if you think Wc3 is dead in Korea. Its actually MORE popular then sc2 in Korea according various sources.
Link one source -.-
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WCS isn't THAT bad, it's more about the game. The bo5 between best protoss and best zerg of the world produced mere 14 LR pages, the passion's lacking hardcore.
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Aotearoa39261 Posts
On October 02 2013 20:10 TaishiCi wrote:
Wow the ignorance of people... WCS system is hurting Koreans even more than foreigners.
The system helps foreigners much more than Koreans.
Agreed. Instituting a region lock would simply exacerbate this problem.
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With the hints we got from Dayshi and uzer about WCS Challenger not qualifying for Premier League 2014, we can safely assume that the WCS will be changed. But Blizzard said that they want to make reasonable changes slowly rather than swiftly, so it remains to be seen if these changes will be enough to stop the bleeding and stabilize shaky foundations.
In the end, the solution has been clear for the most part since the implementation : have players live in their playing regions.
On October 02 2013 20:18 Plexa wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2013 20:10 TaishiCi wrote:
Wow the ignorance of people... WCS system is hurting Koreans even more than foreigners.
The system helps foreigners much more than Koreans.
Agreed. Instituting a region lock would simply exacerbate this problem.
In the bigger scale, nobody cares about Korea anymore especially if Koreans don't. The money isn't in Korea and I don't see the point in subsidizing the best players in the world. It doesn't make any sense at all. If Korea wants to put all its money on a game that will be dominated by China, that's their problem, not ours.
I would be like the NHL building an European league so that they keep their players there (and yes Europe + Russia have more and better player cue IHWC but they don't have the public of the NHL - neither do the USA apparently but that's another story)
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Germany5450 Posts
On October 02 2013 20:14 Rickyvalle21 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2013 19:41 dabom88 wrote:
When Blizzard first announced WCS, people hated it because it had legitimately bad problems.
2 seasons later... people still hate it and the problems have not been fixed. And that doesn't look like it'll be changing any time soon.
Since SC2's inception, it seems as though Blizzard has really stuck their fingers in their ears and their heads in the ground, ignoring a lot of the major criticisms people had with them. Korea's the region that that's been effected the most by their ignorance, and it's the region that's suffering the most as the result of it.
And really, should anyone really be surprised? Problems have been apparent for a long time. Players have asked Blizzard to fix them. And Blizzard has stubbornly refused or ignored them. And as much as I love SC2, Blizzard just does not seem to get that their game and approach to e-sports needs major fixing. And as a result, I really find it sad that I don't think there's any more hope for SC2 in Korea. There isn't going to be some kind messiah savior for it. No magic bullet. No healing potion. The Korean audience has made it clear that they don't care for SC2 in its current state, and Blizzard really doesn't look like they're going to do anything to change that. So, unfortunately, that's probably gonna be it. I really hope I'm wrong, but I expect SC2 to continue to decline until it eventually becomes incredibly niche like WC3 in Korea.
As for the rest of the world, it's probably more resilient. SC2 still pretty popular outside of Korea. I can't make any predictions for SC2 outside of Korea right now, as the writing on the wall isn't as clear as it is in Korea. Sad part is if you think Wc3 is dead in Korea. Its actually MORE popular then sc2 in Korea according various sources.
Even if that was true - remember that the popularity of a game at PC bangs and their popularity as an spectator sport doesn't necessarily have to be correlated.
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On October 02 2013 20:18 juvenal wrote:
WCS isn't THAT bad, it's more about the game. The bo5 between best protoss and best zerg of the world produced mere 14 LR pages, the passion's lacking hardcore.
People are to busy soaking up the drama, rather than watching.
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still FXO is one of my favorite team and the qxc all kill can't be wiped from starcraft 2 history.
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On October 02 2013 20:18 Plexa wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2013 20:10 TaishiCi wrote:
Wow the ignorance of people... WCS system is hurting Koreans even more than foreigners.
The system helps foreigners much more than Koreans.
Agreed. Instituting a region lock would simply exacerbate this problem.
If we have OSL and GSL (with its old prize pools which are bigger then WCS) in parallalel instead of 1 WCS I think it will be ok as it was always like this with MSL and OSL.
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On October 02 2013 20:15 TeeTS wrote:
Fionn ist totally correct. And you do need a soft region lock by residence. As stated it doesn´t help the region at all if some top players (whereever they come from) rush over for 2weeks, grab the top places and the money and leave again to be seen in 3months again. I´ve been saying this for months, if you want to strengthen the local scene, you have to make the top players commit to it. And the point with season finals, yeah totally agree.
I think region lock is fine as long as the prize pool reflects the strength of the regions. I think Korea would be in much worse shape if WCS was region locked and prize pool is the same AND we have no season finals.
That means a player could only win $60,000 by winning all 3 WCS Koreas whereas they got like $40,000+ by winning one GSL.
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They should have kept GSL and OSL, PL and GSTL and add WCS to Korea!
Then they could have had a region lock, where the only koreans allowed to play outside of KOREA, would be the ones living abroad or with a Foreign team!
Instead they transformed KOREA into a one tournament only country..Instead of GSL and OSL, they have WCS with much less prize pool..
this is so fucked up.. but i don't care i still like SC2 and to play it.. even if there is less tournaments, money and players there will always be a scene 
Look at BW it's getting stronger.. SC2 will always have it's space!
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1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
On October 02 2013 20:18 Plexa wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2013 20:10 TaishiCi wrote:
Wow the ignorance of people... WCS system is hurting Koreans even more than foreigners.
The system helps foreigners much more than Koreans.
Agreed. Instituting a region lock would simply exacerbate this problem.
But AM deserve a WCS region! for some reason
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Aotearoa39261 Posts
On October 02 2013 20:21 DiMano wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2013 20:18 Plexa wrote:On October 02 2013 20:10 TaishiCi wrote:
Wow the ignorance of people... WCS system is hurting Koreans even more than foreigners.
The system helps foreigners much more than Koreans.
Agreed. Instituting a region lock would simply exacerbate this problem. If we have OSL and GSL (with its old prize pools which are bigger then WCS) in parallalel instead of 1 WCS I think it will be ok as it was always like this with MSL and OSL.
Do you honestly think we'll have OSL and GSL both running concurrently with the current state of SC2 in Korea? Think about it.
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It's the same fucking mistake like with the global economy. Let's merge everything into a single giant global shit that we can control. Turns out it doesn't work again. Oh well.. At least in video-game industry the results don't have such harsh impact on people's lives.
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On October 02 2013 20:18 juvenal wrote:
WCS isn't THAT bad, it's more about the game. The bo5 between best protoss and best zerg of the world produced mere 14 LR pages, the passion's lacking hardcore.
Well, it was pretty, pretty early in the middle of the week. Even I missed it and I have a free day and was actually PUMPED to see it.
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On October 02 2013 20:18 Scarecrow wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2013 20:14 Rickyvalle21 wrote:On October 02 2013 19:41 dabom88 wrote:
When Blizzard first announced WCS, people hated it because it had legitimately bad problems.
2 seasons later... people still hate it and the problems have not been fixed. And that doesn't look like it'll be changing any time soon.
Since SC2's inception, it seems as though Blizzard has really stuck their fingers in their ears and their heads in the ground, ignoring a lot of the major criticisms people had with them. Korea's the region that that's been effected the most by their ignorance, and it's the region that's suffering the most as the result of it.
And really, should anyone really be surprised? Problems have been apparent for a long time. Players have asked Blizzard to fix them. And Blizzard has stubbornly refused or ignored them. And as much as I love SC2, Blizzard just does not seem to get that their game and approach to e-sports needs major fixing. And as a result, I really find it sad that I don't think there's any more hope for SC2 in Korea. There isn't going to be some kind messiah savior for it. No magic bullet. No healing potion. The Korean audience has made it clear that they don't care for SC2 in its current state, and Blizzard really doesn't look like they're going to do anything to change that. So, unfortunately, that's probably gonna be it. I really hope I'm wrong, but I expect SC2 to continue to decline until it eventually becomes incredibly niche like WC3 in Korea.
As for the rest of the world, it's probably more resilient. SC2 still pretty popular outside of Korea. I can't make any predictions for SC2 outside of Korea right now, as the writing on the wall isn't as clear as it is in Korea. Sad part is if you think Wc3 is dead in Korea. Its actually MORE popular then sc2 in Korea according various sources. Link one source -.-
I can't really be bothered to look one up (I didn't make the previous post that you're replying to) but in PC Baang statistics WC3 was outranking SC2 in usage/playtime/whatever, mind you I believe I saw it last pre-HOTS so it could have (maybe) changed since.
edit: I bothered, you can find a tonne of weekly/monthly stats here; http://gametrics.com/news/News02_View.aspx?seqid=14149
Also the listing on the right
also: ![[image loading]](http://www.gametrics.com/GameTricsUpFiles/NewsTitleFiles/2013090403.jpg)
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On October 02 2013 20:21 DiMano wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2013 20:18 Plexa wrote:On October 02 2013 20:10 TaishiCi wrote:
Wow the ignorance of people... WCS system is hurting Koreans even more than foreigners.
The system helps foreigners much more than Koreans.
Agreed. Instituting a region lock would simply exacerbate this problem. If we have OSL and GSL (with its old prize pools which are bigger then WCS) in parallalel instead of 1 WCS I think it will be ok as it was always like this with MSL and OSL.
I think the question is whether OSL/GSL was economical viable IF we had the 3 regional WCS on top of it. That is a LOT of content.
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On October 02 2013 20:17 lichter wrote:
Region lock with the current WCS system and I retire
Well, with like 5 pro gamers/teams/coaches retiring a day, that wouldn't make the world implode, would it? 
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EPT
