Updated Balance Test Map - Page 5

On September 26 2013 06:33 Squat wrote:


Mines aren't nearly as big a part of TvP as they are in TvZ.

On September 26 2013 06:29 Everlong wrote:
So you have to build more Missile Turrets (say 3), which is 300 minerals. Well, good luck defending some well thought Warpgate/Immortal bust.. Or Voidray allin, or you know, Blink allin, the list goes on..

I hate to rain on the party of everyone who is excited about the oracle, but this acceleration and speed buff actually means that you literally can't run your workers away from them, ever. Before there was room for an oracle user to stutter step micro in the same direction as the workers, to kill off as many as it could before they actually got out of its range and stayed there. Now it really doesn't matter if you move your drones or not. This makes this the dumbest harass to view / 'defend' in the game, lol. Not to mention that there's like nothing that can catch this thing now. Complete silliness. Blizzard seems to love pulling random changes out of their bum to try with Protoss even more than with the other races

On September 26 2013 04:37 Everlong wrote:
These changes do absolutely nothing to resolve the IMBA in T v P matchup. The 10 minute push is devastating to P, NOTHING u can do vs MMMM. Mass Marauder and Stim own P everytime. PERIOD. P either needs a unit to help this, or terran needs BUFFED ALA REDUCE DAMAGE VS ARMORED UNITS. Colossus does nothing, medivacs heal everything, u need at least 4-5 colossus to be effective and its impossible to get that many collasuss considering there cost. How everyone doesn't see this is beyond belief.. everyone knows terran is OP... especially vs P

And all you trolls can sit here and say stop crying, ur a noob, etc... but we all know its true.

I was hoping to read some good news that blizzard finally realizes how OP terran is with mules, medivacs, mines, SCANS, and just making marine mauarder and owning everything and everyone. It's ridiculous and boring.

P.S. I just had to copy this from Bnet forums, I find it hilarious :D

On September 26 2013 06:39 awesomoecalypse wrote:


1.) Oracles are now the same speed as Mutas, except much harder to mass, with less regen and no splash. Anything that can catch a mutalisk can catch an Oracle
2.) You can still run away from Oracles, you just can't do it by move-commanding your entire worker line in one direction and expecting that to cut the Oracle dps in half. If you split your workers and send them in different directions, you're still going to make it much harder for the Oracle to kill them then if you just let your workers sit there. Countermicro hasn't been removed, but it has been made more challenging than a single move command.

Oh boy. You think it's reasonable to compare these to mutalisks at all?

So is you thinking that having to do extreme micro as if this is some intense avoid-the-banelings game is now the new way people should be handling 150/150 harass air harass units.

On September 26 2013 06:48 awesomoecalypse wrote:


When someone says "nothing can catch this unit", when the unit is the exact same speed as another unit that fills a similar role for another race, then yes pointing out their equivalent speed is relevant. Obviously there are significant differences, but "OMG a 150/150 harass unit with speed 4 is so imba!!11!" is just not really a supportable statement.



Correct, I think an expensive harass unit being effectively neutralized by a single move command given to a whole worker line is silly, and that countermicro should be somewhat more involved than that. Its not like "split your workers when you see an Oracle" is some sort of impossible task.

On September 26 2013 04:08 feardragon wrote:
I was kinda excited for the attempted DT change. I know a lot of people were complaining about it but I liked that it would reward people that could use them well. I do like the proposed changes though, including the oracle one.

On September 26 2013 04:03 KrazyTrumpet wrote:
I mean, trying to buff Revelation is nice and all, but I can't really imagine a situation in which I would rather use Revelation instead of having better Observer placement. idk, perhaps I'm underestimating things. My dream would be to have Stargate tech be so viable that you can skip out on Robo tech entirely if you choose to

These Oracle changes are 10x better than a gas cost reduction though, that's for damn sure.

Widow Mine change seems a lot more reasonable. Always better to undernerf than overnerf, IMO.

But it's already not neutralized. It's already great in situations where the worker lines have to be abandoned, and a ton of damage is done from mining that is lost. Think ab out how quickly money comes in from a given mineral line, whatever saturation you'd like. That just stops. This is the backbone of worker harass damage - getting worker kills is the juicy bonus and before t his change the oracle was already doing fine there. It kills workers faster than banshees or mutas (by far with mutas, though, really, i have to maintain that it's really stupid to be comparing these units to begin with because they are fundamentally different. Banshee / oracle comparisons are valid.) Besides, you can't have everything in one unit. While this unit has a distinct profile of worker line harassment, it also has two spells to cast

On September 26 2013 06:53 boxerfred wrote:


Yeah, unfortunately someone saw that DTs are used in every matchup as a one-hit kill or a lategame harass, which doesn't need to be buffed at all. But if you're in for useless changes, why wouldn't you make Lingspeed available without any upgrade? Or why wouldn't you remove the seeker missile? Or why wouldn't you buff the speed of a banshee, and shorten its acceleration?

Ah, obviously we have a protoss here.