In Short: After the first sponsorship contract with LG ended, IM had been operating as LG-IM for several more months under the belief that LG would extend their sponsorship, but received no actual payment during the period. However, LG eventually decided not to extend the sponsorship, only informing IM several months after the actual decision deadline (this is IM and KeSPA's claim). KeSPA wants LG to compensate and recognize IM, as they had been freeloading on IM for several months without actually giving them any support.
President Jeon: "We won't just watch if they become a company exploits young players."
협회가 확인한 바에 따르면, IM팀과 LG전자의 정상적인 후원 계약은 지난해(2012년) 10월까지였고, 그 이후 현재(2013년 8월)까지 IM팀이 LG전자로부터 후원금을 지급받지 못한 채 LG전자 로고와 LG-IM팀명 만 유지하며 강동훈 감독이 사재나 소규모 서브 스폰으로 팀을 운영해 왔다. 강동훈 감독은 어렵게 팀을 운영하는 과정에서 많은 빚을 지게 된 것도 확인되었다.
As KeSPA confirmed, Incredible Miracle and LG's contract was until the October of 2012, and after that, IM hasn't been payed, and Coach Kang has run the team with his own expense and the money from sub-sponsors. It was also confirmed that he got some debts.
협회는 강동훈 감독이 “잘못된 계약을 바로 잡아달라”는 요청에 따라 과거 협회-연맹 간의 갈등관계를 떠나 e스포츠를 대표하는 기관으로 e스포츠 팀 운영 환경 개선을 위해 사실확인을 했고, LG전자와 강동훈 감독 양쪽 의견을 모두 청취했다.
By the request of the coach, "to correct the contract", KeSPA investigated on the case as a organization represents the Korean esports scene, and listened to the both sides.
LG전자와 IM팀 강동훈 감독은 2012년 10월 계약 만료를 전후해 계약연장에 대해 논의했고, LG전자 측에서는 11월 경 재계약 금액과 조건을 제시했으며 그에 대해 사실상 양자가 합의해 연장 계약이 확정된 것처럼 보였다. LG전자는 LG그룹(회장 구본무) 블로그에 IM팀 인터뷰를 게재하는 등 실질적인 LG전자가 후원하는 LG그룹의 e스포츠 게임단으로 활동 하였다. 연장계약에 대한 계약서도 LG전자가 제안해 상호 검토한 것으로 확인됐다.
LG and IM discussed about the contract extension around the extension on October, 2012. LG offered a new contract on the November, and virtually both agreed, so it looked like they agreed the extension. IM went on for activities for LG, including being interviewed for LG's blog. It was also confirmed that the contract was offered by LG, and the both side looked through it.
2012년 12월에도 LG전자 행사에 참석했다. 이러한 과정 속에서 IM팀은 LG전자의 확약을 믿고, 다른 주요한 스폰사의 제의를 모두 거절하는 기회비용도 지불해야 했다. 또한 2013년 4월까지 지속적으로 양자는 활동관계를 공유하며 스폰서 재계약을 위한 협의를 지속했으나 끝내 계약은 성사되지 못했다.
Even on the December, IM participated for LG's events. Through this, IM believed that LG would affirm the contract, refusing other offers from sponsors. Also, until the April of 2013, They continuously shared activities, and kept discussing for the renewal, but it failed.
LG전자는 계약 연장 논의를 계약 만료기간 전후 2개월로 설정했고, 2012년 12월 말경 재계약으로 어렵다는 것을 통보했으니 “잘못한 것이 없다”라고 답변하고 있으나, 실제 재계약 논의기간 중 LG전자는 수차례 계약을 확약한 바 있고, 최종 재계약 불가를 양자가 모두 확실하게 인지한 시기는 2013년 4월로 재계약 논의기간이 4개월 더 지난 시점이었다.
LG claims they set the renegotiation period to 2 months after the first contract ended, and that they notified that it would be difficult to renew around the end of December 12, thus they had done "nothing wrong." However, during the period, LG had continuously confirmed the contract, and the time when both parties recognized that the renewal was impossible was actually the April of 2013, four more months later.
협회는 해당내용을 모두 인지하고 실무차원에서 재계약이 원활히 이뤄질 수 있도록 LG전자와 IM팀을 중재하고자 했으나, LG전자는 기회비용 보상비 차원에서 천 만원 정도의 향후 행사약속 수준으로 무마시키고자 했다.
The Association recognized all the facts above, and tried to arbitrate LG and IM, but LG tried to cover this up with a promise of events with a reward around $10, 000
On August 08 2013 18:50 Thinasy wrote: Wait what, so IM has been wearing the LG tag + promoting LG stuff without getting paid since October of 2012?
That's not the most important thing. They refused sponsors with hope for another contract with LG according to source, which didn't quite work out for them.
Hope that LG still continues the sponsorship (and does it in a good manner) after this turmoil. Damn, who've thought Props to KeSPA for stepping up. Government rules!
I guess this is what every IM member has been talking about when they say the team hasn't been doing good behinds the scenes, and they still even won the GSTL.
Wow LG is kinda being either put out to be a douchebag or is infact just a douchebag if what is said to be true. I can not understand they need this long to have a negotiation all they while there products get a free advertisement.
On August 08 2013 19:10 IcedBacon wrote: This is really fucked up, everyone just assumed IM was doing the best amongst the eSF teams in terms of sponsorships. Guess not :/
They SHOULD have, but LG kind of screwed them over. Hopefully they get there shit together.
Wait, what? The only thing worse than wasting money on sponsoring esports is getting a many-times-over backlash over being unethical in a scandal such as this. I hope further details come out and this is clarified and sorted out. It would make no sense for LG to not pay sponsorship money to "LGIM". SC2 isn't their only team - they have 2 LoL teams, and that's WAY more watched in Korea. I would imagine there would be significant public backlash against LG in Korea if this is true and came out badly in the press.
On August 08 2013 19:10 IcedBacon wrote: This is really fucked up, everyone just assumed IM was doing the best amongst the eSF teams in terms of sponsorships. Guess not :/
Hopefully they get there shit together.
I serisouly doubt it atm. Let's wait for LG answer... I better understand now why IM manager went on TL to ask for support.
On August 08 2013 19:14 Jacmert wrote: Wait, what? The only thing worse than wasting money on sponsoring esports is getting a many-times-over backlash over being unethical in a scandal such as this. I hope further details come out and this is clarified and sorted out. It would make no sense for LG to not pay sponsorship money to "LGIM". SC2 isn't their only team - they have 2 LoL teams, and that's WAY more watched in Korea. I would imagine there would be significant public backlash against LG in Korea if this is true and came out badly in the press.
That's hard to quantify, because in SC2 they are one of the best teams, while their LoL teams pretty much only serve as the gatekeepers for OCL. They are a top 16 team in Korea at best, which makes me doubt that their exposure is that great in LoL.
On August 08 2013 19:16 Taipoka wrote: This is just bad, hope it be fired. Btw. Where are all that "KeSPA is the big bad wolf" people?
This might be into KeSPA's own intrest aswell. As to why i think KeSPA will stick it up for IM.
KeSPA is very dependend of there sponsors to, they wanne make an example of how sponsors can not so easily abuse a team without getting a backlash from the media and community.
It's a bit early to bring out the pitchforks, but this really doesn't reflect well on LG.
As for KeSPA, I'm sure they have their own reasons for doing this investigation, be it a prospective pickup of IM or something else. Maybe IM went to KeSPA with this because they thought ESF wouldn't have the punching power required to get LG to listen.
On August 08 2013 18:58 Big-t wrote: Shame on you LG....
Edit: If Kespa manages to get LG paying, could this be a loosening to ESFs and KESPAs "cold war"?
We really don't know how here if there is still a cold war between the two organizations. There's little information around of how the status between eSF and Kespa is. We only have the fanboy wars in every live report thread ^^
this is quite bad from LG no question about it. but IM strikes me as unbelivably naive reading this "article". you dont advertise a sponser for 10 months without getting payed just because of some promise. maybe you would give them some extra time like 2-3 months out of respect and goodwill but 10!? i dont really understand why they would be so patient and even turn down other sponsors.
:/ eSports seems to be a synonym for getting screwed over by being naiv. Why would you wait that long and even refuse other sponsors? Why wouldn't they use the other sponsors to pressure LG if LG was that important to them. This whole thing just doesn't add up.
Coach Park? Dunno if Hirai's last name is Park, so I can say if thats a typo or not. I'm quite surprised that such a big company like LG would screw up like this
On August 08 2013 18:55 partydude89 wrote: sucks for LGIM. Intresting that Kespa is getting involved.
Well Kespa would get involved in such affairs if, for instance, they wanted LG-IM to join Kespa and participate in ProLeague....
Thinking this further, this probably means the end of GSTL, too. Unless GOM manages to drag a bunch of foreign teams into their team league to replace IM, NSH and Azubu.
Wow, for shame LG. I was really happy that you were supproting IM, now this? I feel like KeSPA is stepping in because they were looking at adding LG-IM into the "KeSPA ranks" with the new League of Legends Pro League and next seasons SPL
On August 08 2013 19:31 Damnight wrote: :/ eSports seems to be a synonym for getting screwed over by being naiv. Why would you wait that long and even refuse other sponsors? Why wouldn't they use the other sponsors to pressure LG if LG was that important to them. This whole thing just doesn't add up.
Because those teams don't have a powerful organization like Kespa behind them, that is making sure something like this doesn't happen. eSF obviously is not powerful enough, as IM rather ran to Kespa than eSF for investigation...
On August 08 2013 18:55 partydude89 wrote: sucks for LGIM. Intresting that Kespa is getting involved.
Well Kespa would get involved in such affairs if, for instance, they wanted LG-IM to join Kespa and participate in ProLeague....
Thinking this further, this probably means the end of GSTL, too. Unless GOM manages to drag a bunch of foreign teams into their team league to replace IM, NSH and Azubu.
Too many people here don't realize KeSPA is basically a government organization, not just for those 8 teams. This case has absolute no indication about them join proleague.
On August 08 2013 19:31 Damnight wrote: :/ eSports seems to be a synonym for getting screwed over by being naiv. Why would you wait that long and even refuse other sponsors? Why wouldn't they use the other sponsors to pressure LG if LG was that important to them. This whole thing just doesn't add up.
Perhaps because LG is one of the bigger company's in Korea ? Though 10 months seem long we do not know what was promised by LG as a contract deal in the negotiations, perhaps it was to tempting for the IM coach to pass up and it would secure him and his team of a great long term contract.
LG "can" offer contracts smaller less wealthy sponsors simply can not.
It's easy to judge coach Hirai on being naieve, but honestly we have no idea what was talked about.
On August 08 2013 18:55 partydude89 wrote: sucks for LGIM. Intresting that Kespa is getting involved.
Well Kespa would get involved in such affairs if, for instance, they wanted LG-IM to join Kespa and participate in ProLeague....
Thinking this further, this probably means the end of GSTL, too. Unless GOM manages to drag a bunch of foreign teams into their team league to replace IM, NSH and Azubu.
Just merge the leagues already
Actually I really don´t know why they didn´t already... We need a WCS-team-league!
On August 08 2013 18:55 partydude89 wrote: sucks for LGIM. Intresting that Kespa is getting involved.
Well Kespa would get involved in such affairs if, for instance, they wanted LG-IM to join Kespa and participate in ProLeague....
Thinking this further, this probably means the end of GSTL, too. Unless GOM manages to drag a bunch of foreign teams into their team league to replace IM, NSH and Azubu.
Just merge the leagues already
Actually I really don´t know why they didn´t already... We need a WCS-team-league!
Kespa can just wait and add teams like IM/MVP and eventually win out without losing any power that they might in a merge. :/
Wow. :/ This sucks for IM. I'd really hoped they'd get the contract renewed, especially after how well they did in 2012 in individual leagues. Hopefully things get sorted.
On August 08 2013 19:41 Spoink wrote: I wouldnt read too much into Kespa helping IM, since IM plays in the LoL Hot6 champions tournament with pretty much only Kespa Teams (and MVP).
How could this possibly happen on IM's side of things? What madness could drive a manager to effectively fake a sponsorship that seemingly expired months before?
On August 08 2013 18:55 partydude89 wrote: sucks for LGIM. Intresting that Kespa is getting involved.
Well Kespa would get involved in such affairs if, for instance, they wanted LG-IM to join Kespa and participate in ProLeague....
Thinking this further, this probably means the end of GSTL, too. Unless GOM manages to drag a bunch of foreign teams into their team league to replace IM, NSH and Azubu.
Just merge the leagues already
Kespa is not in desperate need of more teams, and too many teams in a team league is a bad thing, too. A merge would only benefit Kespa. They would simply pick the best teams (IM and MVP) and discard the rest.
On August 08 2013 19:41 Spoink wrote: I wouldnt read too much into Kespa helping IM, since IM plays in the LoL Hot6 champions tournament with pretty much only Kespa Teams (and MVP).
There are still quite a bunch of non KeSPA teams there. 2 Najin teams (coached by Reach), 2 Xenics teams (coached by Yellow), CTU (a university team similar to what NSHoseo was, but cooperating with STX staff), the MVP teams of course, 2x LG-IM and MiG Blitz (coached by a former CJ player). They aren't at a point yet where EVERYTHING except MVP Ozone is KeSPA teams there - they are still rather the minority (although 6/8 teams in the RO8 are KeSPA).
On August 08 2013 19:02 Capped wrote: How do you all feel now your sitting there with your scumbag monitors and TV's? hehehe
I own nothing LG for a reason, sad it crossed over to LGIM though, hope it gets resolved!
Horrible, but not as much because i have it since 09 so yeah.
it wouldn't bother me a bit. If I own a LG Monitor it is still a high quality monitor, no mather what happened with the sponsorship. PLUS: it isn't LGs fault, that they still wear their logo besides not getting paid for it. Every other professional sportsteam in another sport would take off the logo the moment the contract ends.
On August 08 2013 19:43 WigglingSquid wrote: How could this possibly happen on IM's side of things? What madness could drive a manager to effectively fake a sponsorship that seemingly expired months before?
Naivety, which is what most of these ESF-managers seem to live off of.
On August 08 2013 19:02 Capped wrote: How do you all feel now your sitting there with your scumbag monitors and TV's? hehehe
I own nothing LG for a reason, sad it crossed over to LGIM though, hope it gets resolved!
Horrible, but not as much because i have it since 09 so yeah.
it wouldn't bother me a bit. If I own a LG Monitor it is still a high quality monitor, no mather what happened with the sponsorship. PLUS: it isn't LGs fault, that they still wear their logo besides not getting paid for it. Every other professional sportsteam in another sport would take off the logo the moment the contract ends.
Sure it isn't LG's fault that IM trusts their promises, but it's not like they're squeaky clean here.
Amazing how the pitchforks are ready for one of the biggest sponsors around in SC2 who has been supporting one of the biggest teams for a long time anyway.
I mean it would suck if it ends like this, but let's not forget all the good done before that.
IM shouldn't have continued to use LG's image after the deal was not renewed and LG is not contractually obligated to pay them for it. IM should have had more foresight and better management, trying to get additional or different sponsors once they started to realize that LG was not going to renew.
Damn suck's for IM. Would be really bad if they lost the LG sponsorship, LG-IM has such a nice ring to it. Really great to see kespa getting involved and helping out though.
I was going to say that LG isn't contractually obliged to pay because the contract was never renewed even if IM was still sporting the LG stuff but this:
On August 08 2013 19:54 ETisME wrote: they even did a commercial just for LG wtf
If true, and LG knew about this, then IM can make a proper case here (if they didn't get paid for the ad).
On August 08 2013 19:02 Capped wrote: How do you all feel now your sitting there with your scumbag monitors and TV's? hehehe
I own nothing LG for a reason, sad it crossed over to LGIM though, hope it gets resolved!
Horrible, but not as much because i have it since 09 so yeah.
it wouldn't bother me a bit. If I own a LG Monitor it is still a high quality monitor, no mather what happened with the sponsorship. PLUS: it isn't LGs fault, that they still wear their logo besides not getting paid for it. Every other professional sportsteam in another sport would take off the logo the moment the contract ends.
Two threads on the go and I disagree with you in both of them lol
Really boycott LG, IM players have worked their ass off winning so much major and medium tournament titles, giving LG like one of the best exposure/publicity over SC2 community even whole Esport scene and they don't pay up.
Really good move from Kespa to use their weight to try to counter this unfair cheap shot.
On August 08 2013 20:04 d2bonzai wrote: Really boycott LG, IM players have worked their ass off winning so much major and medium tournament titles, giving LG like one of the best exposure/publicity over SC2 community even whole Esport scene and they don't pay up.
Really good move from Kespa to use their weight to try to counter this unfair cheap shot.
Yeah no kidding.
IEM World Championship was LGIEM for christ sake. It's not as though LG weren't well represented in that time. They should pay up to save face.
Not sure about Korean law, but there's definitely grounds for action here if they wanted to take a case (in London, as they usually do). As for KeSPA helping out IM, I wouldn't read too much into that, it's in their interests to stop companies screwing over Korean teams regardless of their affiliation.
Pretty shady move from IM. They didn't have a contract, that's not on LG. Making a public scandal of it is despicable. Instead of boycotting LG product, better to boycott IM matches.
i now hate LG. man just got a new LG dishwasher. on a serious note though it a really dick move from LG hope KeSPA can put enough pressure on them to make it right.
On August 08 2013 20:12 Darkstar_X wrote: Pretty shady move from IM. They didn't have a contract, that's not on LG. Making a public scandal of it is despicable. Instead of boycotting LG product, better to boycott IM matches.
It's so easy to spot LG employees in threads like this.
I'm not surprised at all that Kespa is getting involved, I expect that they want to absorb the ESF (or at least the good portions of it) sometime before the beginning of the next proleague, which is in December.
But I really hope that LG fulfils their promise to IM, they've kept thier faith in them for the past 8-9 months without any money and not without reason since it seems that LG was telling them the contract would be renewed. If LG wants to end it, they should pay up first.
On August 08 2013 20:12 Darkstar_X wrote: Pretty shady move from IM. They didn't have a contract, that's not on LG. Making a public scandal of it is despicable. Instead of boycotting LG product, better to boycott IM matches.
It's so easy to spot LG employees in threads like this.
Just kidding.
Sort of.
LOL.
On a serious note, if LG was misleading them, and knowingly continue to use IM services than that's shady. At the same time, lack of business sense from the head of IM aggravates the issue.
Wow. I'm surprised both by LG's behaviour and by the fact the greatest star among eSF teams was helped by KeSPA after all. Or does it mean IM will play in next Proleague season? The eSF/KeSPA trade lock will last only until September!
On August 08 2013 20:20 chOty wrote: Well LGIM and MVP LoL are kespa teams its just there SC2 side that has still remained under eSF. Hopefully that changes.
On August 08 2013 20:20 chOty wrote: Well LGIM and MVP LoL are kespa teams its just there SC2 side that has still remained under eSF. Hopefully that changes.
On August 08 2013 20:20 chOty wrote: Well LGIM and MVP LoL are kespa teams its just there SC2 side that has still remained under eSF. Hopefully that changes.
On August 08 2013 20:20 chOty wrote: Well LGIM and MVP LoL are kespa teams its just there SC2 side that has still remained under eSF. Hopefully that changes.
No they are not Kespa teams.
Playing in OGN Champions =/= KeSPA Team
Najin, Xenics, CTU, MiG (technically not an organization) and formerly Azubu are all non KeSPA organizations.
Except from the first 2 pages, people are missing the bigger story here is that Kespa is supporting an ESF team which is very un-Kespa like - Perhaps a new mentality since the OSL/GSL WCS merger or just comforting them as they transition into Proleague?
On August 08 2013 20:20 chOty wrote: Well LGIM and MVP LoL are kespa teams its just there SC2 side that has still remained under eSF. Hopefully that changes.
Wait, how are LG-IM and MVP KeSPA teams?
Please stop referring to IM as LG-IM, now.
Well they are still officially called that, IM is giving free shit to LG
On August 08 2013 20:12 Darkstar_X wrote: Pretty shady move from IM. They didn't have a contract, that's not on LG. Making a public scandal of it is despicable. Instead of boycotting LG product, better to boycott IM matches.
It's so easy to spot LG employees in threads like this.
On August 08 2013 20:20 chOty wrote: Well LGIM and MVP LoL are kespa teams its just there SC2 side that has still remained under eSF. Hopefully that changes.
What? I never heard of something like that before. Any source?
Maybe this has affected the team's performance? I imagine the players have all been worried about it FOR THE LAST 10 MONTHS and it's affected their mental game.
On August 08 2013 20:20 chOty wrote: Well LGIM and MVP LoL are kespa teams its just there SC2 side that has still remained under eSF. Hopefully that changes.
Wait, how are LG-IM and MVP KeSPA teams?
Please stop referring to IM as LG-IM, now.
Until the players and journalists stop referring to the team as LG-IM, I think I'll keep calling them that - there has been no word from the team that they're no longer being sponsored by LG, despite them (apparently) not getting any money.
On August 08 2013 20:20 chOty wrote: Well LGIM and MVP LoL are kespa teams its just there SC2 side that has still remained under eSF. Hopefully that changes.
What? I never heard of something like that before. Any source?
They play in OGN's tournament, the guy is confusing that with being a KeSPA team
On August 08 2013 20:27 -JMT- wrote: a pretty stupid move from IM to work without a contract to be honest, but if LG won´t pay them now they will get a huge shitstorm thrown at them.
In which case, that sounds like a pretty clever move from IM.
On August 08 2013 20:22 Mackus wrote: Except from the first 2 pages, people are missing the bigger story here is that Kespa is supporting an ESF team which is very un-Kespa like - Perhaps a new mentality since the OSL/GSL WCS merger or just comforting them as they transition into Proleague?
Well cause Kespa dominance in the e-sports scene in Korea is now guaranteed, inc. in SC2 with proleague teams looking much healthier than GSTL. No reason for Kespa to have beef against eSF especially once the trade-lock is over.
People not involved in the scene taking guesses of finacial situations they have no idea how are in real life.
Yeah this is not what forums are about !
An OP starts a hype around the finacial situation regarding Incredible Miracle with absolutley no knowledge regarding the current situation. It gives false hope to hundreds of interested fans and is just a castle made of sand.
If LG cares about their market in Korea I don't see them not paying, I think as high as 50% of their market is youngsters and maybe 25-30% of them w atch / play sc2 or just involve on esports. If they don't pay whether they can be prove that they are right but IM / Kespa insists on doing so, their market on Korea will just fall heavily.
On August 08 2013 20:31 Artunit wrote: If LG cares about their market in Korea I don't see them not paying, I think as high as 50% of their market is youngsters and maybe 25-30% of them w atch / play sc2 or just involve on esports. If they don't pay whether they can be prove that they are right but IM / Kespa insists on doing so, their market on Korea will just fall heavily.
You're so oversizing it lol SC2 as a whole basically cover half a million people at max internationally. That's very small for a company like LG.
On August 08 2013 20:31 Artunit wrote: If LG cares about their market in Korea I don't see them not paying, I think as high as 50% of their market is youngsters and maybe 25-30% of them w atch / play sc2 or just involve on esports. If they don't pay whether they can be prove that they are right but IM / Kespa insists on doing so, their market on Korea will just fall heavily.
25-30% of their market maybe be people who play games, be it on an XBOX/PS or PC. No way in hell does 25-30% watch esports. I think you might not grasp how big LG is.
On August 08 2013 20:31 Artunit wrote: If LG cares about their market in Korea I don't see them not paying, I think as high as 50% of their market is youngsters and maybe 25-30% of them w atch / play sc2 or just involve on esports. If they don't pay whether they can be prove that they are right but IM / Kespa insists on doing so, their market on Korea will just fall heavily.
Interesting numbers. Is IM really that valuable to LG for exposure? That would be like 10-15% of their whole Korean target group covered by IM, no?
On August 08 2013 20:31 Artunit wrote: If LG cares about their market in Korea I don't see them not paying, I think as high as 50% of their market is youngsters and maybe 25-30% of them w atch / play sc2 or just involve on esports. If they don't pay whether they can be prove that they are right but IM / Kespa insists on doing so, their market on Korea will just fall heavily.
Please show sources. I guess this is just your theories and I believe you are so far away from the true numbers you cant even believe it because if you did, you had never written in the first case
On August 08 2013 20:31 Artunit wrote: If LG cares about their market in Korea I don't see them not paying, I think as high as 50% of their market is youngsters and maybe 25-30% of them w atch / play sc2 or just involve on esports. If they don't pay whether they can be prove that they are right but IM / Kespa insists on doing so, their market on Korea will just fall heavily.
Interesting numbers. Is IM really that valuable to LG for exposure? That would be like 10-15% of their whole Korean target group covered by IM, no?
They don't need IM to cover that group anyway, several TV ads in prime time might be better than sponsor IM for a year.
I want to know why KESPA is involved? Not that i think it's bad, but doesn't that mean LGIM are going to be KESPA affiliated?
Now on the subject of the matter, lets put you in charge of LG Electronics, and your being asked to pay a sponsorship deal which you have already said in December 2012 "looks unlikely" to renew. They are not going to pay anything more to IM so IM need to leave it, remove affiliation with LG and carry on and look for new sponsors or even trim the squad if you can't keep yourself out of debt with all the sponsors they already have
list of sponsors; LG SteelSeries ASRock Kingston HyperX Coca-Cola Nvidia Googims Company Super Flower Cooler Master 3R System DXRACER
Pretty sure they can find another sponsor to go with the masses they already have. Im sure LOTS of teams would love to have that kind of list for Sponsors, hell its nearly as long as EGs!
Brings back interesting memories of when the coach wrote on TL to show LG that their sponsorship was worth it... Normally you'd say it's stupid by IM to keep this unclear for so long, but on the other hand they probably had no better option. They probably felt it was more likely to somehow work out in the end then that they were gonna find a new big sponsor.
IM are one of the biggest teams (if not the biggest) in the EsF. Are they really so desperate for sponsorship that they'll keep promoting a sponsor for 10 months off the back of a verbal promise? Seems like the management at IM are mugs to me.
*edit* also this is probably the one decent thing I've ever seen Kespa do. Even if it is most likely in their own interest still pretty big of them to step up like this.
i like kespa being objective here. there might be a little rivalry going on between the two organizations but i'm glad they set that aside to step in and defend im, being the more influential body. as for ulterior motives, the only one i see here is that it is in their interest as well to not have sponsors thinking they can fuck with esports teams. whatever the case/s may be, kespa is acting for the good of esports
On August 08 2013 20:37 Pandemona wrote: I want to know why KESPA is involved? Not that i think it's bad, but doesn't that mean LGIM are going to be KESPA affiliated?
Now on the subject of the matter, lets put you in charge of LG Electronics, and your being asked to pay a sponsorship deal which you have already said in December 2012 "looks unlikely" to renew. They are not going to pay anything more to IM so IM need to leave it, remove affiliation with LG and carry on and look for new sponsors or even trim the squad if you can't keep yourself out of debt with all the sponsors they already have
list of sponsors; LG SteelSeries ASRock Kingston HyperX Coca-Cola Nvidia Googims Company Super Flower Cooler Master 3R System DXRACER
Pretty sure they can find another sponsor to go with the masses they already have. Im sure LOTS of teams would love to have that kind of list for Sponsors, hell its nearly as long as EGs!
I don't know if any of them promised the same level of funding though. LG-IM has the LG because they presumably gave them quite a bit of money (or promised to). I think certain companies have started funding KeSPA teams privately, but we don't call it (I think Twitch and Razer started funding KT? Don't take my word on it though) Twitch-Razer-KT Rolster right? Sure they do their part for the team, just like how those other sponsors do their parts for LG-IM, but at the end of the day, the money still isn't coming in.
On August 08 2013 20:37 Pandemona wrote: I want to know why KESPA is involved? Not that i think it's bad, but doesn't that mean LGIM are going to be KESPA affiliated?
Now on the subject of the matter, lets put you in charge of LG Electronics, and your being asked to pay a sponsorship deal which you have already said in December 2012 "looks unlikely" to renew. They are not going to pay anything more to IM so IM need to leave it, remove affiliation with LG and carry on and look for new sponsors or even trim the squad if you can't keep yourself out of debt with all the sponsors they already have
list of sponsors; LG SteelSeries ASRock Kingston HyperX Coca-Cola Nvidia Googims Company Super Flower Cooler Master 3R System DXRACER
Pretty sure they can find another sponsor to go with the masses they already have. Im sure LOTS of teams would love to have that kind of list for Sponsors, hell its nearly as long as EGs!
I don't know if any of them promised the same level of funding though. LG-IM has the LG because they presumably gave them quite a bit of money (or promised to). I think certain companies have started funding KeSPA teams privately, but we don't call it (I think Twitch and Razer started funding KT? Don't take my word on it though) Twitch-Razer-KT Rolster right? Sure they do their part for the team, just like how those other sponsors do their parts for LG-IM, but at the end of the day, the money still isn't coming in.
No doubt the money from LG was more than the others i agree. But that doesn't mean what they are getting from the other 8 sponsors (2 of which are huge companies(Nvidia/Coca Cola) are going to be "small" money in total. They should be able to run a team or keep building sponsors without LG. I don't get why they are challenging LG to force them into paying, that is now how Sponsorships are earnt/dealt with. Is very silly otherwise
Kespa see the writing on the wall...sponsors, teams and pro's dropping like the proverbials...good to see them getting involved but I don't like the look of this.
On August 08 2013 20:37 Pandemona wrote: I want to know why KESPA is involved? Not that i think it's bad, but doesn't that mean LGIM are going to be KESPA affiliated?
Now on the subject of the matter, lets put you in charge of LG Electronics, and your being asked to pay a sponsorship deal which you have already said in December 2012 "looks unlikely" to renew. They are not going to pay anything more to IM so IM need to leave it, remove affiliation with LG and carry on and look for new sponsors or even trim the squad if you can't keep yourself out of debt with all the sponsors they already have
list of sponsors; LG SteelSeries ASRock Kingston HyperX Coca-Cola Nvidia Googims Company Super Flower Cooler Master 3R System DXRACER
Pretty sure they can find another sponsor to go with the masses they already have. Im sure LOTS of teams would love to have that kind of list for Sponsors, hell its nearly as long as EGs!
If i am not mistaken the majority of these sponsors only provide there product to IM instead of funds, wich is the opposite of what EG has.
On August 08 2013 20:37 Pandemona wrote: I want to know why KESPA is involved? Not that i think it's bad, but doesn't that mean LGIM are going to be KESPA affiliated?
Now on the subject of the matter, lets put you in charge of LG Electronics, and your being asked to pay a sponsorship deal which you have already said in December 2012 "looks unlikely" to renew. They are not going to pay anything more to IM so IM need to leave it, remove affiliation with LG and carry on and look for new sponsors or even trim the squad if you can't keep yourself out of debt with all the sponsors they already have
list of sponsors; LG SteelSeries ASRock Kingston HyperX Coca-Cola Nvidia Googims Company Super Flower Cooler Master 3R System DXRACER
Pretty sure they can find another sponsor to go with the masses they already have. Im sure LOTS of teams would love to have that kind of list for Sponsors, hell its nearly as long as EGs!
I don't know if any of them promised the same level of funding though. LG-IM has the LG because they presumably gave them quite a bit of money (or promised to). I think certain companies have started funding KeSPA teams privately, but we don't call it (I think Twitch and Razer started funding KT? Don't take my word on it though) Twitch-Razer-KT Rolster right? Sure they do their part for the team, just like how those other sponsors do their parts for LG-IM, but at the end of the day, the money still isn't coming in.
No doubt the money from LG was more than the others i agree. But that doesn't mean what they are getting from the other 8 sponsors (2 of which are huge companies(Nvidia/Coca Cola) are going to be "small" money in total. They should be able to run a team or keep building sponsors without LG. I don't get why they are challenging LG to force them into paying, that is now how Sponsorships are earnt/dealt with. Is very silly otherwise
They have huge debt already, ofc they can't run like this forever, otherwise why bother to request help from KeSPA president. Their coach already said they have a lot of debts, and experiencing hard time right now.
On August 08 2013 20:37 Pandemona wrote: I want to know why KESPA is involved? Not that i think it's bad, but doesn't that mean LGIM are going to be KESPA affiliated?
Now on the subject of the matter, lets put you in charge of LG Electronics, and your being asked to pay a sponsorship deal which you have already said in December 2012 "looks unlikely" to renew. They are not going to pay anything more to IM so IM need to leave it, remove affiliation with LG and carry on and look for new sponsors or even trim the squad if you can't keep yourself out of debt with all the sponsors they already have
list of sponsors; LG SteelSeries ASRock Kingston HyperX Coca-Cola Nvidia Googims Company Super Flower Cooler Master 3R System DXRACER
Pretty sure they can find another sponsor to go with the masses they already have. Im sure LOTS of teams would love to have that kind of list for Sponsors, hell its nearly as long as EGs!
On August 08 2013 19:38 Waxangel wrote: some context: KeSPA chairman is a member of Parliament, and KeSPA represents the interests of several other big companies
it makes sense to go through them as a more influential and powerful body to solve a greivance like this
They also have 2 LoL teams, I don't think it necessarily means anything because esf can't really do much compared to the influence kespa has.
On August 08 2013 20:37 Pandemona wrote: I want to know why KESPA is involved? Not that i think it's bad, but doesn't that mean LGIM are going to be KESPA affiliated?
Now on the subject of the matter, lets put you in charge of LG Electronics, and your being asked to pay a sponsorship deal which you have already said in December 2012 "looks unlikely" to renew. They are not going to pay anything more to IM so IM need to leave it, remove affiliation with LG and carry on and look for new sponsors or even trim the squad if you can't keep yourself out of debt with all the sponsors they already have
list of sponsors; LG SteelSeries ASRock Kingston HyperX Coca-Cola Nvidia Googims Company Super Flower Cooler Master 3R System DXRACER
Pretty sure they can find another sponsor to go with the masses they already have. Im sure LOTS of teams would love to have that kind of list for Sponsors, hell its nearly as long as EGs!
I don't know if any of them promised the same level of funding though. LG-IM has the LG because they presumably gave them quite a bit of money (or promised to). I think certain companies have started funding KeSPA teams privately, but we don't call it (I think Twitch and Razer started funding KT? Don't take my word on it though) Twitch-Razer-KT Rolster right? Sure they do their part for the team, just like how those other sponsors do their parts for LG-IM, but at the end of the day, the money still isn't coming in.
No doubt the money from LG was more than the others i agree. But that doesn't mean what they are getting from the other 8 sponsors (2 of which are huge companies(Nvidia/Coca Cola) are going to be "small" money in total. They should be able to run a team or keep building sponsors without LG. I don't get why they are challenging LG to force them into paying, that is now how Sponsorships are earnt/dealt with. Is very silly otherwise
That is absolutely true, but we'll have to see whether LG "promised," in word alone or if they signed some documents for it. It seems weird to me as well that the head coach decided to keep LG in the LG-IM part, causing personal debt of about ~10k. Doesn't actually seem like a whole lot of money, but KeSPA wants to mediate which isn't a bad thing. At least KeSPA gets it done.
there i am thinking small teams are quite stupid or naive believing in promises... AND THEN IT HAPPENS TO MY FAVORITE TEAM?!
would have expected more from IM management, and even more from a sponsor with the name LG... i mean this is messed up, should be peanuts for LG if they really wanted to sponsor IM, so this dragging out makes 0 sense to me, yes or no, end or continue, why this middle ground pile of shit?
I bet that the reason why KeSPA is stepping in was because IM was planning to join the next proleague season, and with LG now not being a sponsor it's no longer a possibility to IM, so they have to back out unless they get the money and possibly another main sponsor
On August 08 2013 21:00 Cinim wrote: I bet that the reason why KeSPA is stepping in was because IM was planning to join the next proleague season, and with LG now not being a sponsor it's no longer a possibility to IM, so they have to back out unless they get the money and possibly another main sponsor
Could also be because KeSPA might be a third party to mediate these sorts of talks. I can't think of any other eSports bodies with the same sort of experience dealing with sponsors and teams.
On August 08 2013 20:37 Pandemona wrote: I want to know why KESPA is involved? Not that i think it's bad, but doesn't that mean LGIM are going to be KESPA affiliated?
Now on the subject of the matter, lets put you in charge of LG Electronics, and your being asked to pay a sponsorship deal which you have already said in December 2012 "looks unlikely" to renew. They are not going to pay anything more to IM so IM need to leave it, remove affiliation with LG and carry on and look for new sponsors or even trim the squad if you can't keep yourself out of debt with all the sponsors they already have
list of sponsors; LG SteelSeries ASRock Kingston HyperX Coca-Cola Nvidia Googims Company Super Flower Cooler Master 3R System DXRACER
Pretty sure they can find another sponsor to go with the masses they already have. Im sure LOTS of teams would love to have that kind of list for Sponsors, hell its nearly as long as EGs!
I don't know much about IM specifically (tho I did know about the LG thing), but I know it used to be pretty standard for Korean teams in the early days of SC2, to accept really really one-sided sponsorship agreements just as a 'get a foot in the door' kind of thing, and because it will look good in proposing future sponsors I guess.
I.E being sponsored by Coke might mean idk, free coke and no money. And no the kind of coke you could unload on the mean streets of korea either (not that they really have those anyway... I dont even know where you COULD buy drugs here, Itaewon maybe --?).
LG is a sh*t company for doing this. I had my eye on some IPS monitors from them but no more. For a korean company with almost no footprint internationally versus Samsung, I think their e-sports team was a good way to get visibily with a very young, upwardly mobile demographic. Screw them. I guess my next monitor will be a Samsung; their PLS tech is better anyways.
The way I read it I don't see why this is LG's fault per se. Of course I have no further knowledge but as it is said here it just reads like IM continued without having a proper contract and wore the LG name without proper consent and now they just don't have a viable claim. Seems to me these pro teams often just have lousy management when it comes to finances, contracts, attracting new sponsors on time etc. I wouldn't even know why sponsors at all would be eager to sponsor pro teams when there is such a chance of backlash and the community can be so damn immature.
On August 08 2013 21:11 Markwerf wrote: The way I read it I don't see why this is LG's fault per se. Of course I have no further knowledge but as it is said here it just reads like IM continued without having a proper contract and wore the LG name without proper consent and now they just don't have a viable claim. Seems to me these pro teams often just have lousy management when it comes to finances, contracts, attracting new sponsors on time etc. I wouldn't even know why sponsors at all would be eager to sponsor pro teams when there is such a chance of backlash and the community can be so damn immature.
Well said, but I believe LG didn't tell IM on time that they won't sponsor anymore, they drag out the decision for several months after the deadline. And still feels like there is no legal action which can be done against LG, IM can only get some compensation due to media pressure on LG.
On August 08 2013 21:20 Drake wrote: so it rly seems IM and mvp are getting in proleague ^^ and with that kespa instant care about them ^^
KESPA functions like a trade group or a labor union. They have a strong interest here in setting a favorable precedent and showing solidarity with IM. Don't read too much into this.
On August 08 2013 21:18 blamekilly wrote: IM aren't as good as they used to be. Did LG want to jump ship and sponsor a different team?
Have you been watching sc2 at all in 2013?
First won IEM Katowice
The IEM World Championship had 4/4 IM players in the semis
MVP won WCS EU, Losira made the ro8 in WCS KR. MVP barely lost to Bogus at the WCS Season Finals in the semis
All of their players minus Fenix and Ragnarok are at least in WCS challenger
First stomped his way to the ro8 in the recent OSL and qualified for a 5th place spot in the seasonal final
Finally, they won the gstl recently.
Not that I don't agree that they're still doing well, but this isn't as good as winning 5 GSL titles and a GSTL in 2011... Plus however many foreign titles they won in 2011, I know Mvp won a MLG but not sure about any others.
On August 08 2013 21:18 blamekilly wrote: IM aren't as good as they used to be. Did LG want to jump ship and sponsor a different team?
Have you been watching sc2 at all in 2013?
First won IEM Katowice
The IEM World Championship had 4/4 IM players in the semis
MVP won WCS EU, Losira made the ro8 in WCS KR. MVP barely lost to Bogus at the WCS Season Finals in the semis
All of their players minus Fenix and Ragnarok are at least in WCS challenger
First stomped his way to the ro8 in the recent OSL and qualified for a 5th place spot in the seasonal final
Finally, they won the gstl recently.
Not that I don't agree that they're still doing well, but this isn't as good as winning 6 GSL titles and a GSTL in 2011... Plus however many foreign titles they won in 2011, I know Mvp won a MLG but not sure about any others.
That was mostly MVP and Nestea's doing though. IM has developed a lot more depth since then, not to mention the level of competition skyrocketing with 7 Kespa teams joining in and there being less GSLs each year. I'd say they're still holding strong considering those factors.
On August 08 2013 21:45 EnPo wrote: Big respect to KeSPA for doing that! Seems like that KeSPA and Esf are getting more together.
Well if EGTL is actually leaving Proleague, that's a pretty big hole in their rolster. With the future of the GSTL shaky because of the breakup of NSH and some shaky participation by some teams like Azubu; it makes more sense that they merge.
All these federations exist only if there is a market for their product which is good games and in Korea SC2 is relegated to a distant 3rd to LOL and Dota II. The heady days of BW dominating esports is over and it's a big period of adaptation right now.
What the f*ck? How can a massive corporation like LG do this??? I'm glad Kespa is helping out in this situation, this is downright exploitation... I really loved LG as a sponsor for IM, I hope the fix this and continue to sponsor IM, otherwise I'm seriously boycotting LG products for the next decade.
On August 08 2013 21:11 Markwerf wrote: The way I read it I don't see why this is LG's fault per se. Of course I have no further knowledge but as it is said here it just reads like IM continued without having a proper contract and wore the LG name without proper consent and now they just don't have a viable claim. Seems to me these pro teams often just have lousy management when it comes to finances, contracts, attracting new sponsors on time etc. I wouldn't even know why sponsors at all would be eager to sponsor pro teams when there is such a chance of backlash and the community can be so damn immature.
Well said, but I believe LG didn't tell IM on time that they won't sponsor anymore, they drag out the decision for several months after the deadline. And still feels like there is no legal action which can be done against LG, IM can only get some compensation due to media pressure on LG.
These two posts illustrate my thoughts. Sounds like LG say maybe then said no later on. Good on Kespa's part to get involved although it does seem odd since IM is an ESF team.
On August 08 2013 21:11 Markwerf wrote: The way I read it I don't see why this is LG's fault per se. Of course I have no further knowledge but as it is said here it just reads like IM continued without having a proper contract and wore the LG name without proper consent and now they just don't have a viable claim. Seems to me these pro teams often just have lousy management when it comes to finances, contracts, attracting new sponsors on time etc. I wouldn't even know why sponsors at all would be eager to sponsor pro teams when there is such a chance of backlash and the community can be so damn immature.
Well said, but I believe LG didn't tell IM on time that they won't sponsor anymore, they drag out the decision for several months after the deadline. And still feels like there is no legal action which can be done against LG, IM can only get some compensation due to media pressure on LG.
These two posts illustrate my thoughts. Sounds like LG say maybe then said no later on. Good on Kespa's part to get involved although it does seem odd since IM is an ESF team.
Then as soon as you stop getting paid, remove the name. It's really simple.
On August 08 2013 21:45 EnPo wrote: Big respect to KeSPA for doing that! Seems like that KeSPA and Esf are getting more together.
Well if EGTL is actually leaving Proleague, that's a pretty big hole in their rolster. With the future of the GSTL shaky because of the breakup of NSH and some shaky participation by some teams like Azubu; it makes more sense that they merge.
All these federations exist only if there is a market for their product which is good games and in Korea SC2 is relegated to a distant 3rd to LOL and Dota II. The heady days of BW dominating esports is over and it's a big period of adaptation right now.
3rd? I highly doubt that. Dota 2 isn't even broadcasted on TV and barely has any big Korean teams in it. In Korea I'm pretty sure SC2 is bigger.
On August 08 2013 22:02 marvellosity wrote: Most of all it just seems really stupid from IM, really.
Yeah, it seems odd that IM would be turning down offers when they never had an actual contract with LG again. It's fucked that LG was still using them for commercials and stuff, but some of the negligence is on the IM side.
On August 08 2013 21:18 blamekilly wrote: IM aren't as good as they used to be. Did LG want to jump ship and sponsor a different team?
Have you been watching sc2 at all in 2013?
First won IEM Katowice
The IEM World Championship had 4/4 IM players in the semis
MVP won WCS EU, Losira made the ro8 in WCS KR. MVP barely lost to Bogus at the WCS Season Finals in the semis
All of their players minus Fenix and Ragnarok are at least in WCS challenger
First stomped his way to the ro8 in the recent OSL and qualified for a 5th place spot in the seasonal final
Finally, they won the gstl recently.
Not that I don't agree that they're still doing well, but this isn't as good as winning 5 GSL titles and a GSTL in 2011... Plus however many foreign titles they won in 2011, I know Mvp won a MLG but not sure about any others.
Not to mention two GSL runner-ups as well...
Not that it isnt a great achievement what happened in 2011, but there were TEN GSL's in 2011, and thats including the Blizzard Cup.
There will likely be 4 this year, and there was 5 last year.
On August 08 2013 21:45 EnPo wrote: Big respect to KeSPA for doing that! Seems like that KeSPA and Esf are getting more together.
Well if EGTL is actually leaving Proleague, that's a pretty big hole in their rolster. With the future of the GSTL shaky because of the breakup of NSH and some shaky participation by some teams like Azubu; it makes more sense that they merge.
All these federations exist only if there is a market for their product which is good games and in Korea SC2 is relegated to a distant 3rd to LOL and Dota II. The heady days of BW dominating esports is over and it's a big period of adaptation right now.
3rd? I highly doubt that. Dota 2 isn't even broadcasted on TV and barely has any big Korean teams in it. In Korea I'm pretty sure SC2 is bigger.
It'd be funny if SOSPA would become more popular than Proleague, though
On August 08 2013 21:45 EnPo wrote: Big respect to KeSPA for doing that! Seems like that KeSPA and Esf are getting more together.
Well if EGTL is actually leaving Proleague, that's a pretty big hole in their rolster. With the future of the GSTL shaky because of the breakup of NSH and some shaky participation by some teams like Azubu; it makes more sense that they merge.
All these federations exist only if there is a market for their product which is good games and in Korea SC2 is relegated to a distant 3rd to LOL and Dota II. The heady days of BW dominating esports is over and it's a big period of adaptation right now.
3rd? I highly doubt that. Dota 2 isn't even broadcasted on TV and barely has any big Korean teams in it. In Korea I'm pretty sure SC2 is bigger.
It'd be funny if SOSPA would become more popular than Proleague, though
What the f*ck? How can a massive corporation like LG do this??? I'm glad Kespa is helping out in this situation, this is downright exploitation... I really loved LG as a sponsor for IM, I hope the fix this and continue to sponsor IM, otherwise I'm seriously boycotting LG products for the next decade.
This is what massive corporations do... especially with an e-sport team which means very little to them considering how big they are. Im really glad KESPA is helping out right now, lets see what this means to the future of the relationship between KESPA and ESF.
I just hope it works out for the best for the team (manager and players) and for the league(leagues). A team like IM will and should always have a sponsor ready to sign them with the stellar performances they keep on showing (even with the new and extremely hard competition from the KeSPA teams).
I bet its a bazillion times cheaper to write a check to some koreans so they can buy rice and internet compared to letting the world know how a mega corporation freeloaded on some nerds expecting to be paid, for months.
wow. sounds like me not buying LG crap anymore.
edit: known fact: LG IM kept the LG tag on their stuff after the sponsorship contract ended.
they mustve had good reasons to do so ( like ''the check is in the mail")
On August 08 2013 22:50 Kevin_Sorbo wrote: thats fuckin stupid. P.R. mess...
I bet its a bazillion times cheaper to write a check to some koreans so they can buy rice and internet compared to letting the world know how a mega corporation freeloaded on some nerds expecting to be paid, for months.
wow. sounds like me not buying LG crap anymore.
As much as I would like for LGIM to get some money for this, I don't think it'll matter much to the world whether or not people know that LG freeloaded on some Starcraft team for a few months. The amount of money (and the whoke thing for that matter) is too insignificant.
On August 08 2013 22:23 Cracy wrote: I love how people jump to conclusion. Not. Some of you behave as you have never seen real life.
We have not enough data...
It's quite annoying really. We only heard one side of the story and it's obviously going to be heavily biased towards the pro-gaming team.
No one here knows exactly what happened and just taking the singular story as fact is irresponsible.
I doubt KeSPA would get involved if they did not know the ins and outs of what has been going on between LG and IM. And considering they heavily back up IM i'd say we hear more then just one side of the story.
On August 08 2013 22:50 Kevin_Sorbo wrote: thats fuckin stupid. P.R. mess...
I bet its a bazillion times cheaper to write a check to some koreans so they can buy rice and internet compared to letting the world know how a mega corporation freeloaded on some nerds expecting to be paid, for months.
wow. sounds like me not buying LG crap anymore.
As much as I would like for LGIM to get some money for this, I don't think it'll matter much to the world whether or not people know that LG freeloaded on some Starcraft team for a few months. The amount of money (and the whoke thing for that matter) is too insignificant.
Hmm, the thing that strikes me the most is that coach Kang has made personal debts to keep the team running. That's some personal drama right there. Also, I don't know whether LG is the only one to blame...
For one, nothing really counts until it's on paper, all promises aside, why the hell wait so many months... If a big sponsor doesn't pay when you expect them to, don't you let ur lawyer contact theirs the next day?
On August 08 2013 22:56 Panozen wrote: Hmm, the thing that strikes me the most is that coach Kang has made personal debts to keep the team running. That's some personal drama right there. Also, I don't know whether LG is the only one to blame...
For one, nothing really counts until it's on paper, all promises aside, why the hell wait so many months... If a big sponsor doesn't pay when you expect them to, don't you let ur lawyer contact theirs the next day?
If Koach Kang would be in debt ... you think he would get a lawyer then ? I mean sure, those guys are practicly free these day's right ?
Now let's put him up vs LG's 50 lawyers, that will scare LG from there "promise" !
here we have a clear indicator that results mean very little for sponsorship viability in sc2. teams and players should take note, you need to bring more than results to the table for marketability.
KeSPA was founded in 2000 after the approval of the Ministry of Culture, Sports and Tourism. Its official goal is to make e-Sports an official sporting event, and to solidify the commercial position of e-Sports in all sectors.
KeSPA mediating between LG and IM is what they're supposed to do. Good to see that the current leadership at least is aware of this.
I'm an avid IM fan, but it seems like they were continuing like they had a sponsor for months when they did not. Perhaps if they would have dropped LG off of their name and player wardrobes, they might have shown LG how much less coverage they were getting.
KeSPA was founded in 2000 after the approval of the Ministry of Culture, Sports and Tourism. Its official goal is to make e-Sports an official sporting event, and to solidify the commercial position of e-Sports in all sectors.
KeSPA mediating between LG and IM is what they're supposed to do. Good to see that the current leadership at least is aware of this.
Well, LG isn't a KeSPA member, so really this is them working overtime.
Kespa kissing IM's ass.. I think this shows that Kespa wants the big teams under their protection to gain monopoly on the market. If the same thing was happening to some other team like NSH, FXO or Prime they wouldnt give a shit though
KeSPA was founded in 2000 after the approval of the Ministry of Culture, Sports and Tourism. Its official goal is to make e-Sports an official sporting event, and to solidify the commercial position of e-Sports in all sectors.
KeSPA mediating between LG and IM is what they're supposed to do. Good to see that the current leadership at least is aware of this.
Well, LG isn't a KeSPA member, so really this is them working overtime.
They would probably love it if LGIM went to join PL though since they need a replacing team if EGTL won't play another season.
On August 08 2013 23:04 dreamseller wrote: here we have a clear indicator that results mean very little for sponsorship viability in sc2. teams and players should take note, you need to bring more than results to the table for marketability.
maybe IM keeping the LG tag was just them aiming for some brownie points with LG and trying to prove a strong case that they're willing to take the partnership further
thats bullshit... Hopefully they'll get compensated or pick up another mainline sponsor.
as other have pointed out, bringing in results and printing tags on clothes doesnt seem to be enough, teams definitely need to work on promoting sponsors much more than what korean teams are currently doing, in fact the only team that does it enough (based on the fact that its the only team I can instantly connect sponsors to) is EG.
KeSPA was founded in 2000 after the approval of the Ministry of Culture, Sports and Tourism. Its official goal is to make e-Sports an official sporting event, and to solidify the commercial position of e-Sports in all sectors.
KeSPA mediating between LG and IM is what they're supposed to do. Good to see that the current leadership at least is aware of this.
Well, LG isn't a KeSPA member, so really this is them working overtime.
Obviously, but the KeSPA we now love and/ or hate isn't necessarily what originally was intended.
On August 08 2013 18:57 Ammanas wrote: Think it says something about the skills of eSF when one of their teams has to ask Kespa to investigate something like this...
Completely off topic. This could also happen to a KeSPA team. ---------------------------------
Much love and respect to KeSPA for trying to help IM out on this.
Sorry LG, but if you fail to be fair in the business you run, I'm never going to buy anything from your company again! Sending them a mail about it as well. This situation is just ridiculous. LG abused IM's respect for them.
Lots of biased posting here. IM could have removed LG from the team name but they didn't because they thought the contract was getting extended. "Free" advertising for a while is fine but it is all almost august 2013 now. What did they expect after all this time? Contract appearing out of the blue?
Reading this thread is painful for me. Much more that qq'ing about OP, nerfs and so on.
From an objective point of view all we have here are claims of some people, who have a position allowing them to use public for their support.
Regardless the truth in their statements.
If what they are saying is true, the person responsible for sponsorships in the IM team should lose job immediately for allowing the team to were the LG tags for almost a year without contract. In most cases people do sth like this you are looking for a fraud.
Also, deciding not to buy a company's merchendise because of what PR people did or did not is plain stupid. That a group of people in a company made (if...) a mistake, doesn't mean their products got worse.
And honestly this actions may only backfire your beloved teams in the long term.
Well that really sucks! Now i won't ever buy an LG product :D
Will IM soon be on KeSpa? I guess it would make sence for them, since they are the only eSF team on the same level as the Kespa teams... Also the fact that Kespa helps them out is a sign imho.
On August 09 2013 00:06 Cracy wrote: Reading this thread is painful for me. Much more that qq'ing about OP, nerfs and so on.
From an objective point of view all we have here are claims of some people, who have a position allowing them to use public for their support.
Regardless the truth in their statements.
If what they are saying is true, the person responsible for sponsorships in the IM team should lose job immediately for allowing the team to were the LG tags for almost a year without contract. In most cases people do sth like this you are looking for a fraud.
Also, deciding not to buy a company's merchendise because of what PR people did or did not is plain stupid. That a group of people in a company made (if...) a mistake, doesn't mean their products got worse.
And honestly this actions may only backfire your beloved teams in the long term.
Your arguments don't make sense at all. How will it backfire on our "beloved teams"? Basically, what you're saying is that we should let this happen, just like this and that it is IM's fault? If we let this go unpunished, other companies will do the exact same thing, you know...
Sending LG a mail about how disappointed you are will perhaps make them realize how big of an error they made by not fulfilling their promise(s) to IM.
It is my opinion that a company that treats their partners like dirt, deserves some kind of punishment.
EDIT: Congratulations to all the mentally dysfunctional people saying that it is IM's own fault. We MUST show some good will, just like IM did, if we want to make eSports a viable thing!
I applaud Kespa for supporting IM through this, whether IM will compete in proleague or not.
I call for a boycott of LG products in esports until this situation is resolved.... This is simply unacceptable and is at best an exploitation of the IM team
On August 08 2013 18:57 Ammanas wrote: Think it says something about the skills of eSF when one of their teams has to ask Kespa to investigate something like this...
Completely off topic. This could also happen to a KeSPA team.
Thats somewhat wrong. Most core members of KeSPA have sticked with their respective team for a decade or longer. Why? They own the team and has layered, corporate-like management
Meanwhile Hirai basically runs and coaches the team by himself, hes the owner. BoxeR doesnt run T1 right? Hes just coaching, same as Coach Kim, January, Coach Park, Coach Lee etc
You could argue that if the company pulls put, team would go kaputt either ways. But if one decides to pick up your team, they must be serious about the business, which ensures much better stability than random sponsorship
Douchebag move from LG. I'm glad I never supported the company by buying any of their products in my entire life.
IM should be paid appropriately for all the advertising they provided thus far, and IM should look for a better main sponsor. A company that ACTUALLY keeps their word.
On August 08 2013 18:57 Ammanas wrote: Think it says something about the skills of eSF when one of their teams has to ask Kespa to investigate something like this...
Skills? It actually says a lot more about how much clout Kespa has in Korea.
On August 09 2013 00:18 MetalxStorm wrote: I applaud Kespa for supporting IM through this, whether IM will compete in proleague or not.
I call for a boycott of LG products in esports until this situation is resolved.... This is simply unacceptable and is at best an exploitation of the IM team
that would be overreacting. what will companies think of the lynch-mob mentality of the esports fanbase? it will most likely be off-putting
I agree to some extent. I think its one thing if a company decides to withdraw sponsorship, that is fine. But LG really got screwed over here. They could have been operating under a different title sponsor for half a year and actually been receiving money for it. I'm not trying to go for a lynch-mob mentality, but LG and other companies need to know this is unacceptable and will not be tolerated by the teams or the fans.
On August 09 2013 00:18 MetalxStorm wrote: I applaud Kespa for supporting IM through this, whether IM will compete in proleague or not.
I call for a boycott of LG products in esports until this situation is resolved.... This is simply unacceptable and is at best an exploitation of the IM team
that would be overreacting. what will companies think of the lynch-mob mentality of the esports fanbase? it will most likely be off-putting
I agree to some extent. I think its one thing if a company decides to withdraw sponsorship, that is fine. But LG really got screwed over here. They could have been operating under a different title sponsor for half a year and actually been receiving money for it. I'm not trying to go for a lynch-mob mentality, but LG and other companies need to know this is unacceptable and will not be tolerated by the teams or the fans.
How about you wait for the other side of the story?
oh wait doesn't matte rcause the other side isn't at eam with your beloved players so they don't count right?.
On August 09 2013 00:26 IAmBelieve wrote: guy's this isn't kespa caring about eSF, in OGN LoL LGIM Is a KesPA team.
Um no. The Champions is not primarily a KeSPA-run thing, its basically Korea's version of the LCS broadcasted by the most popular video game broadcaster in Korea. Najin and LG-IM and MVP are all non KeSPA teams involved in the Champions.
It stinks LG is getting ousted because this makes us look somewhat bad but i like that kespa is stepping in and protect other korean teams. Nice move on their part and if there was an agreement whether formal or not its interesting that LG asked them to continue to do things without an official contract in place. if thats how I understand it. weird situation. Cool of kespa tho.
On August 09 2013 00:18 MetalxStorm wrote: I applaud Kespa for supporting IM through this, whether IM will compete in proleague or not.
I call for a boycott of LG products in esports until this situation is resolved.... This is simply unacceptable and is at best an exploitation of the IM team
that would be overreacting. what will companies think of the lynch-mob mentality of the esports fanbase? it will most likely be off-putting
I agree to some extent. I think its one thing if a company decides to withdraw sponsorship, that is fine. But LG really got screwed over here. They could have been operating under a different title sponsor for half a year and actually been receiving money for it. I'm not trying to go for a lynch-mob mentality, but LG and other companies need to know this is unacceptable and will not be tolerated by the teams or the fans.
How about you wait for the other side of the story?
oh wait doesn't matte rcause the other side isn't at eam with your beloved players so they don't count right?.
hmmm... yea I should wait to hear the multi-billion dollar companies side of the story screwing over a team made up of people my age... that seems morally acceptable. Its not that LG's side doesnt matter, its a David getting screwed by Goliath story. Guess who I'm gonna support?
On August 09 2013 00:18 MetalxStorm wrote: I applaud Kespa for supporting IM through this, whether IM will compete in proleague or not.
I call for a boycott of LG products in esports until this situation is resolved.... This is simply unacceptable and is at best an exploitation of the IM team
that would be overreacting. what will companies think of the lynch-mob mentality of the esports fanbase? it will most likely be off-putting
I agree to some extent. I think its one thing if a company decides to withdraw sponsorship, that is fine. But LG really got screwed over here. They could have been operating under a different title sponsor for half a year and actually been receiving money for it. I'm not trying to go for a lynch-mob mentality, but LG and other companies need to know this is unacceptable and will not be tolerated by the teams or the fans.
How about you wait for the other side of the story?
oh wait doesn't matte rcause the other side isn't at eam with your beloved players so they don't count right?.
hmmm... yea I should wait to hear the multi-billion dollar companies side of the story screwing over a team made up of people my age... that seems morally acceptable. Its not that LG's side doesnt matter, its a David getting screwed by Goliath story. Guess who I'm gonna support?
Agree, even if most of fault is due to IM coach/managers not following up with the contract or something, we should still support them to get at least some compensation from LG. They hurt too much from this, not LG. Just like wall street against main street, support the side who got hurt more.
On August 09 2013 00:18 MetalxStorm wrote: I applaud Kespa for supporting IM through this, whether IM will compete in proleague or not.
I call for a boycott of LG products in esports until this situation is resolved.... This is simply unacceptable and is at best an exploitation of the IM team
that would be overreacting. what will companies think of the lynch-mob mentality of the esports fanbase? it will most likely be off-putting
I agree to some extent. I think its one thing if a company decides to withdraw sponsorship, that is fine. But LG really got screwed over here. They could have been operating under a different title sponsor for half a year and actually been receiving money for it. I'm not trying to go for a lynch-mob mentality, but LG and other companies need to know this is unacceptable and will not be tolerated by the teams or the fans.
How about you wait for the other side of the story?
oh wait doesn't matte rcause the other side isn't at eam with your beloved players so they don't count right?.
hmmm... yea I should wait to hear the multi-billion dollar companies side of the story screwing over a team made up of people my age... that seems morally acceptable. Its not that LG's side doesnt matter, its a David getting screwed by Goliath story. Guess who I'm gonna support?
yeah lets just blindly believe the beloved team. cause they are the little angels and we can trust them 100%. cause they play starcraft right?.
On August 09 2013 00:18 MetalxStorm wrote: I applaud Kespa for supporting IM through this, whether IM will compete in proleague or not.
I call for a boycott of LG products in esports until this situation is resolved.... This is simply unacceptable and is at best an exploitation of the IM team
that would be overreacting. what will companies think of the lynch-mob mentality of the esports fanbase? it will most likely be off-putting
I agree to some extent. I think its one thing if a company decides to withdraw sponsorship, that is fine. But LG really got screwed over here. They could have been operating under a different title sponsor for half a year and actually been receiving money for it. I'm not trying to go for a lynch-mob mentality, but LG and other companies need to know this is unacceptable and will not be tolerated by the teams or the fans.
How about you wait for the other side of the story?
oh wait doesn't matte rcause the other side isn't at eam with your beloved players so they don't count right?.
hmmm... yea I should wait to hear the multi-billion dollar companies side of the story screwing over a team made up of people my age... that seems morally acceptable. Its not that LG's side doesnt matter, its a David getting screwed by Goliath story. Guess who I'm gonna support?
yeah lets just blindly believe the beloved team. cause they are the little angels and we can trust them 100%. cause they play starcraft right?.
What do you think LG will have to say about this? "We paid them, they're lying!"??? Get real dude. There is no reason why IM would spread false information like that. All that they would achieve by doing so, is dissuading other companies from sponsoring them in the future. If you are unwilling to think before you post stuff on these forums, don't bother posting it at all.
On August 09 2013 00:18 MetalxStorm wrote: I applaud Kespa for supporting IM through this, whether IM will compete in proleague or not.
I call for a boycott of LG products in esports until this situation is resolved.... This is simply unacceptable and is at best an exploitation of the IM team
that would be overreacting. what will companies think of the lynch-mob mentality of the esports fanbase? it will most likely be off-putting
I agree to some extent. I think its one thing if a company decides to withdraw sponsorship, that is fine. But LG really got screwed over here. They could have been operating under a different title sponsor for half a year and actually been receiving money for it. I'm not trying to go for a lynch-mob mentality, but LG and other companies need to know this is unacceptable and will not be tolerated by the teams or the fans.
How about you wait for the other side of the story?
oh wait doesn't matte rcause the other side isn't at eam with your beloved players so they don't count right?.
hmmm... yea I should wait to hear the multi-billion dollar companies side of the story screwing over a team made up of people my age... that seems morally acceptable. Its not that LG's side doesnt matter, its a David getting screwed by Goliath story. Guess who I'm gonna support?
yeah lets just blindly believe the beloved team. cause they are the little angels and we can trust them 100%. cause they play starcraft right?.
As I have stated previously, all potential sponsors need to know this is unacceptable throughout the industry. Not just because its IM... who also has LoL teams btw.
And its also not like IM was crying about this the whole time... They kept it quiet for almost a year while their team was slowly sinking into debt.
And its not just trusting IM 100%... in case you missed it here is the news article
Aside from that, this really sucks. While I am sure we are not getting the whole picture, this is really sad and unacceptable from LG. Glad KeSPA is putting pressure to get this figured out.
The wording is a bit shaky and it's hard to grasp what happened.
Let's just wait for the verdict. Honestly though, 10,000USD isn't enough to bring a team out of debt for running on self-funds for nearly a year. In fact, it's unfair to your secondary sponsors that they play second fiddle to LG.
On August 08 2013 18:53 Clefairy wrote: KeSPA saving a eSF team. New president is really great.
While this is great for unity and stuff. IT is not ok for players not getting paid. Korea's teams need to have more weight to thrown around.
This has happened too often for teams to remain suckers same thing with players. Maybe you shouldn't jump ship if your sponsor is ~1 month behind payment, but in the end you are an idiot if you continue to support anything without getting paid for what 8 months? The same applies to a team not paying a contracted salary or putting up the money for you to go to an event.
On August 09 2013 00:06 Cracy wrote: Reading this thread is painful for me. Much more that qq'ing about OP, nerfs and so on.
From an objective point of view all we have here are claims of some people, who have a position allowing them to use public for their support.
Regardless the truth in their statements.
If what they are saying is true, the person responsible for sponsorships in the IM team should lose job immediately for allowing the team to were the LG tags for almost a year without contract. In most cases people do sth like this you are looking for a fraud.
Also, deciding not to buy a company's merchendise because of what PR people did or did not is plain stupid. That a group of people in a company made (if...) a mistake, doesn't mean their products got worse.
And honestly this actions may only backfire your beloved teams in the long term.
Your arguments don't make sense at all. How will it backfire on our "beloved teams"? Basically, what you're saying is that we should let this happen, just like this and that it is IM's fault? If we let this go unpunished, other companies will do the exact same thing, you know...
Sending LG a mail about how disappointed you are will perhaps make them realize how big of an error they made by not fulfilling their promise(s) to IM.
It is my opinion that a company that treats their partners like dirt, deserves some kind of punishment.
EDIT: Congratulations to all the mentally dysfunctional people saying that it is IM's own fault. We MUST show some good will, just like IM did, if we want to make eSports a viable thing!
On August 09 2013 00:18 MetalxStorm wrote: I applaud Kespa for supporting IM through this, whether IM will compete in proleague or not.
I call for a boycott of LG products in esports until this situation is resolved.... This is simply unacceptable and is at best an exploitation of the IM team
that would be overreacting. what will companies think of the lynch-mob mentality of the esports fanbase? it will most likely be off-putting
You see... some people do understand that. Any large corporation in the world will do anything to diminish risk. Including cutting losses. Hey, there's a thought. Let's give them some money to show our good will and never deal with them again...
And I have never said it is IM's fault. I provided you with alternative stories. I stand by what I have written much earlier.
WE DON'T KNOW ENOUGH TO LYNCH ANYONE.
Now, be a big boy and don't listen to press releases... And if you start answering people try reading all they have written. It helps understanding what they are saying.
Interesting, the one eSF team that everyone thought had no sponsorship problems, in fact, has a sponsorship problem. Not paying IM while they freely show LG as their primary sponsor for months on end is some pretty shitty business practices(assuming what we are being told is all true) by LG. Hopefully this gets resolved.
On August 09 2013 00:06 Cracy wrote: Reading this thread is painful for me. Much more that qq'ing about OP, nerfs and so on.
From an objective point of view all we have here are claims of some people, who have a position allowing them to use public for their support.
Regardless the truth in their statements.
If what they are saying is true, the person responsible for sponsorships in the IM team should lose job immediately for allowing the team to were the LG tags for almost a year without contract. In most cases people do sth like this you are looking for a fraud.
Also, deciding not to buy a company's merchendise because of what PR people did or did not is plain stupid. That a group of people in a company made (if...) a mistake, doesn't mean their products got worse.
And honestly this actions may only backfire your beloved teams in the long term.
Your arguments don't make sense at all. How will it backfire on our "beloved teams"? Basically, what you're saying is that we should let this happen, just like this and that it is IM's fault? If we let this go unpunished, other companies will do the exact same thing, you know...
Sending LG a mail about how disappointed you are will perhaps make them realize how big of an error they made by not fulfilling their promise(s) to IM.
It is my opinion that a company that treats their partners like dirt, deserves some kind of punishment.
EDIT: Congratulations to all the mentally dysfunctional people saying that it is IM's own fault. We MUST show some good will, just like IM did, if we want to make eSports a viable thing!
On August 09 2013 00:18 MetalxStorm wrote: I applaud Kespa for supporting IM through this, whether IM will compete in proleague or not.
I call for a boycott of LG products in esports until this situation is resolved.... This is simply unacceptable and is at best an exploitation of the IM team
that would be overreacting. what will companies think of the lynch-mob mentality of the esports fanbase? it will most likely be off-putting
You see... some people do understand that. Any large corporation in the world will do anything to diminish risk. Including cutting losses. Hey, there's a thought. Let's give them some money to show our good will and never deal with them again...
And I have never said it is IM's fault. I provided you with alternative stories. I stand by what I have written much earlier.
WE DON'T KNOW ENOUGH TO LYNCH ANYONE.
Now, be a big boy and don't listen to press releases... And if you start answering people try reading all they have written. It helps understanding what they are saying.
Now, be a big boy and think like one: Why would IM spread false information about this whole situation? The truth will be found out anyway. If IM would lie, they would just dissuade other companies from offering them sponsorship in the future (like I said in my last comment, the last one on page 13 --> And if you start answering people try reading all they have written. It helps understanding what they are saying. <-- Same applies to you, good sir)
On August 08 2013 23:04 dreamseller wrote: here we have a clear indicator that results mean very little for sponsorship viability in sc2. teams and players should take note, you need to bring more than results to the table for marketability.
This! I hope more people read this!
Something EG realized ages ago. Some koreans seem to think 'Hey, I won a big tournament! Sponsors, you can now throw money at me!!'
Honestly, this looks bad for both sides. If LG is not interested in sponsoring them anymore, just come clean and say it. Don't let these progamers get their hopes high for nothing. This way it looks like they were leeching these guys (even though they don't need that).
And, IM, too, looks bad here. 10 months!?!? Are you kidding me!? If it was 1 or 2 months of waiting, ok, understandable (I wouldn't wait that long, too, though). Waiting for 10 months is being very naive. Looks like they wanted to pretend to be important, being backed by a big corporation, when there was nothing.
On August 08 2013 23:04 dreamseller wrote: here we have a clear indicator that results mean very little for sponsorship viability in sc2. teams and players should take note, you need to bring more than results to the table for marketability.
This! I hope more people read this!
Something EG realized ages ago. Some koreans seem to think 'Hey, I won a big tournament! Sponsors, you can now throw money at me!!'
Well this is kind of a touchy topic. In an ideal world (from my POV) the people who perform the best should get rewarded the most, which is obviously not the case and doesn't even need to be discussed anymore. However, I always felt that the Korean audience was a little bit "closer" to this, where they mostly value performance + professionalism/manners, while the Western audience is a bit farther away from this in that sense and puts more value into other things.
I don't think LG-IM did anything wrong the way they presented themselves. They delivered results and their players always seemed very professional and well-behaved. I think in Korea those two factors are still weighing the most, don't they? Unlike, as you mentioned, an organization like EG where they give their sponsors exposure mainly from the personality side with some results sprinkled in here and there.
I knew there was a reason not to discuss on Internet forums... I'll bite the bait one last time...
Tabashi, if what you said was true, no one would ever lie about things... Because the truth will come out... And yet, people lie.
And I don't exactly understand why do you talk about a lie. I certainly never said they had. PR isn't about the truth of lie. It's about perception. Creating a positive image or creating background for some future actions. Or... managing a fuck-up. You don't have to lie for that. You just have to cast some light on facts. I know because I do it for living every other day.
As for IM's faults - I just said that I would hold responsible the person who allowed the IM team to wear LG tags for a year if what was written here was true. That was a fuck-up. Even if you believe they will pay in the end. Even if you are lead to believe so. It still is a fuck-up. As for LG's faults - I said we have no information regarding their actions. Or even a decision making process.
Given the amount of information we have we can't blame anyone. It is entirely possible that LG screwed up or IM screwed up. And you know what - we will probably never know.
Amazing to think that EG gets so much crap from the community when they pay their players very well. And actually pay them, not just promise to pay them. And send their players to proper tournaments and give them accomodation to train. And get sponsorship deals with actual companies who give them money and goods. And these actually get delivered by these sponsors. All this should be normal and standard but it seems very rare because of all the dodgy rip-off merchants and scam-artists and criminals involved with SC2.
I've just been reading about Team Smi and their troubles, plus the NanoCloud debacle, then the Azubu conspiracy, and now this the LG-IM sponsorship masquerade. And previously the Maddelisk expose about her old team, the Dimaga wage denial, the Manilla tournament farce, the VeraLynn identity fraud, the Cloud prize-money deferral.
Sad to see all these terrible things keep happening in SC2. There are not too many whales out there, but seemingly a lot of sharks.
On August 08 2013 23:04 dreamseller wrote: here we have a clear indicator that results mean very little for sponsorship viability in sc2. teams and players should take note, you need to bring more than results to the table for marketability.
This! I hope more people read this!
Something EG realized ages ago. Some koreans seem to think 'Hey, I won a big tournament! Sponsors, you can now throw money at me!!'
Well this is kind of a touchy topic. In an ideal world (from my POV) the people who perform the best should get rewarded the most, which is obviously not the case and doesn't even need to be discussed anymore. However, I always felt that the Korean audience was a little bit "closer" to this, where they mostly value performance + professionalism/manners, while the Western audience is a bit farther away from this in that sense and puts more value into other things.
I don't think LG-IM did anything wrong the way they presented themselves. They delivered results and their players always seemed very professional and well-behaved. I think in Korea those two factors are still weighing the most, don't they? Unlike, as you mentioned, an organization like EG where they give their sponsors exposure mainly from the personality side with some results sprinkled in here and there.
It's not surprising that those pros who were with SC2 since the beginning would expect the scene to work like that, wasn't it that way in BW as well? where only the best players would become popular? Even korean LoL still works that way from what I heard in the interview Chobra did with Grilled, there's sadly not enough interest towards SC2 in Korea to sustain all those big sponsorship deals, IM's LoL squads are terrible so not even they can save the team.
On August 08 2013 23:04 dreamseller wrote: here we have a clear indicator that results mean very little for sponsorship viability in sc2. teams and players should take note, you need to bring more than results to the table for marketability.
This! I hope more people read this!
Something EG realized ages ago. Some koreans seem to think 'Hey, I won a big tournament! Sponsors, you can now throw money at me!!'
Well this is kind of a touchy topic. In an ideal world (from my POV) the people who perform the best should get rewarded the most, which is obviously not the case and doesn't even need to be discussed anymore. However, I always felt that the Korean audience was a little bit "closer" to this, where they mostly value performance + professionalism/manners, while the Western audience is a bit farther away from this in that sense and puts more value into other things.
I don't think LG-IM did anything wrong the way they presented themselves. They delivered results and their players always seemed very professional and well-behaved. I think in Korea those two factors are still weighing the most, don't they? Unlike, as you mentioned, an organization like EG where they give their sponsors exposure mainly from the personality side with some results sprinkled in here and there.
It's not surprising that those pros who were with SC2 since the beginning would expect the scene to work like that, wasn't it that way in BW as well? where only the best players would become popular? Even korean LoL still works that way from what I heard in the interview Chobra did with Grilled, there's sadly not enough interest towards SC2 in Korea to sustain all those big sponsorship deals, IM's LoL squads are terrible so not even they can save the team.
Yes, I certainly feel that the Korean audience still values the same things as they used to in BW, but I'm also just assuming this based on interviews as the one you mentioned. I guess it's a matter of target audience for LG-IM, since I would expect that to be WAY more Westerner heavy than for BW/LoL players/teams, which changes up the "success-formula" a little bit, so to speak.
On August 09 2013 02:06 Aeceus wrote: Sounds like IM's fault. You always assume the contract is over unless told otherwise.
Or you know, they were told otherwise:
LG and IM discussed about the contract extension around the extension on October, 2012. LG offered a new contract on the November, and virtually both agreed, so it looked like they agreed the extension. IM went on for activities for LG, including being interviewed for LG's blog. It was also confirmed that the contract was offered by LG, and the both side looked through it.
I remember seeing so many comments about IM having crazy sponsorship money in the past, now it looks like (fromm the comments) that without LG , IM is unsustainable? The coach has been having to use his own money as well as money from sub sponsors and has incurred some debts, that leaves me to beleive its unsustainable.
If the supposedly best off non kespa korean team is unsustainable how long can any of these teams expect to last. I understand SC2 sponsorship has probably decreased substantially in the past year or so, so its worrying.
OP should translate the official statement of KeSPA's president. It's pretty awesome and encouraging. The OP's article is a little confusing since it doesn't specify when the KeSPA made the announcement.
To be honest the situation looks reversed to what IM claims to me, it looks as if IM was leaching off of LG's name to keep up appearances not the other way around. Especially because the coach was paying money out of his own pocket, to keep up "appearances".
If he had been up front right away and said LG is no longer sponsoring IM from the begining and then was covering it out of his own pocket it would have been commendable, but this just looks like they where trying to keep up appearances and still be the big team with big sponsorship money (which isnt even true because apparently their other sponsorships dont even cover their expenses lol). Honestly I think IM probably gained more in terms of sustaining their image then LG did from the months of having their name there. Clearly LG did not see much of an ROI(if any) on this anyways otherwise they would have kept up the sponsorship, so thats my view on the matter.
The problem is, that these korean teams cant just put the sponsors name on their shirts and put it in their team tag and think that LG will get some sort of ROI, you have to do plugs and PR and be using LG products where the public can see it(EG has done a great job of doing this with kingston), this might be a failure of both parties, but like I said if LG was seeing an ROI they wouldnt be dropping IM in the first place.
Honestly though the sc scene has shrunk not grown in the past few years it doesnt have a much sway in terms of public perception of sponsors or anything, a few people can act outraged about it but i doubt anything will come out of it in terms of LG seeing any sort of negative effects from this. Their might be 50,000 people who know about this total. Most wont care, out of those who care how many actually buy LG products anyways(very few probably) and how many would stop buying LG products because of this (even fewer).
Whoa, so if I'm reading this right, LG never paid IM and now KeSPa is backing IM? Damn, never thought I'd see the two sides supporting each other :D On another note, doesn't Incredible Miracle have so many other sponsors?
Korean Esports is just one big joke. Players being forced to play 10 hours a day without getting paid and living in cramped conditions and some teams even take a cut out of their prize money. Team owners that think that results will magically solve your financial problems. In the end they are just wasting their time and I have no idea why so many kids wants to be "pro-gamers" in Korea.
On August 09 2013 02:21 astray71 wrote: Whoa, so if I'm reading this right, LG never paid IM and now KeSPa is backing IM? Damn, never thought I'd see the two sides supporting each other :D On another note, doesn't Incredible Miracle have so many other sponsors?
Thats what i thought, ive seen so many posts in the past year or 2 about how rich of a team IM is (this is just perception of other posters on the site). and how they are the most well sponsored korean team etc.
If the coach is having to pay out of his own pocket without LG this is clearly untrue, and i cant imagine how any South korean team could hope to sustain themselves going into the future. Sc2 isnt in its heyday anymore, and unfortunately i dont see an upwards swing in viewership or sponsorship money coming any time soon, maybe a small blip when the next expansion comes out but nothing major.
On August 09 2013 02:27 Bowzar wrote: Korean Esports is just one big joke. Players being forced to play 10 hours a day without getting paid and living in cramped conditions and some teams even take a cut out of their prize money. Team owners that think that results will magically solve your financial problems. In the end they are just wasting their time and I have no idea why so many kids wants to be "pro-gamers" in Korea.
Being a Korean esports competitor actually sounds like a really raw deal, all things considered. Bad pay unless you are in the "1%", insane hours, no job security and no future prospects :/
On August 09 2013 02:27 Bowzar wrote: Korean Esports is just one big joke. Players being forced to play 10 hours a day without getting paid and living in cramped conditions and some teams even take a cut out of their prize money. Team owners that think that results will magically solve your financial problems. In the end they are just wasting their time and I have no idea why so many kids wants to be "pro-gamers" in Korea.
Because not everything is like you said? Lets talk about SKT, KT, WJS, STARTALE, AXIOM, they dont look like you described. And about practicing, if you think about a athlete practicing hard physical activity for 6~8hrs a day, its about the same thing, if its not worst.
On August 09 2013 02:43 Fischbacher wrote: Being a Korean esports competitor actually sounds like a really raw deal, all things considered. Bad pay unless you are in the "1%", insane hours, no job security and no future prospects :/
If you think about it, every sport is this way. Only the top 1% or less gets a good payment.
Whatever the result of this, in the end IM will not have a big sponsor anymore and will be screwed going into the future At least they got some cash by winning the GSTL. That should have some use.
On August 09 2013 02:27 Bowzar wrote: Korean Esports is just one big joke. Players being forced to play 10 hours a day without getting paid and living in cramped conditions and some teams even take a cut out of their prize money. Team owners that think that results will magically solve your financial problems. In the end they are just wasting their time and I have no idea why so many kids wants to be "pro-gamers" in Korea.
Being a Korean esports competitor actually sounds like a really raw deal, all things considered. Bad pay unless you are in the "1%", insane hours, no job security and no future prospects :/
This makes non-Koreans bitching about "not having opportunities" even more fun.
On August 09 2013 02:27 Bowzar wrote: Korean Esports is just one big joke. Players being forced to play 10 hours a day without getting paid and living in cramped conditions and some teams even take a cut out of their prize money. Team owners that think that results will magically solve your financial problems. In the end they are just wasting their time and I have no idea why so many kids wants to be "pro-gamers" in Korea.
Being a Korean esports competitor actually sounds like a really raw deal, all things considered. Bad pay unless you are in the "1%", insane hours, no job security and no future prospects :/
Not to mention being disowned by your own family if you fail. Almost all pro-gamers say that their parents were against them being pro-gamers until they earned some money. What happens to the players that didnt earn enough money and just ended up wasting their time?
On August 09 2013 02:06 Aeceus wrote: Sounds like IM's fault. You always assume the contract is over unless told otherwise.
Or you know, they were told otherwise:
LG and IM discussed about the contract extension around the extension on October, 2012. LG offered a new contract on the November, and virtually both agreed, so it looked like they agreed the extension. IM went on for activities for LG, including being interviewed for LG's blog. It was also confirmed that the contract was offered by LG, and the both side looked through it.
Maybe you should read the OP
"Virtually both agreed" is probably the key phrase. I hope at least both parties signed the contract, for their sake, and that there aren't any "get out of it for free" clauses.
On August 09 2013 02:37 Nirel wrote: Does that mean we're definitely going to IM in the next proleague?
No it means an organisation of Korean government that is meant to protect Korean e-sport teams from thing like this, is actually doing its job.
Mmm, perhaps. Either they're (finally) actually doing their job, or they see some sort of gain out of it. There were many situations in which they didn't help "protect" teams from things like this.
On August 09 2013 02:37 Nirel wrote: Does that mean we're definitely going to IM in the next proleague?
No it means an organisation of Korean government that is meant to protect Korean e-sport teams from thing like this, is actually doing its job.
keSPA didn't help on TSL, Slayers, NSHS, oGs
It's funny how theres an organization supposedly created for that very purpose but it ended up spreading lies, bullying teams and now doing one single task of publishing rosters list
On August 09 2013 02:37 Nirel wrote: Does that mean we're definitely going to IM in the next proleague?
No it means an organisation of Korean government that is meant to protect Korean e-sport teams from thing like this, is actually doing its job.
keSPA didn't help on TSL, Slayers, NSHS, oGs
It's funny how theres an organization supposedly created for that very purpose but it ended up spreading lies, bullying teams and now doing one single task of publishing rosters list
KeSPA is trying to get the OGN LOL going.
Since LGIM is one of their big teams there, they kinda want to spread their protectorate.
On August 09 2013 02:37 Nirel wrote: Does that mean we're definitely going to IM in the next proleague?
No it means an organisation of Korean government that is meant to protect Korean e-sport teams from thing like this, is actually doing its job.
keSPA didn't help on TSL, Slayers, NSHS, oGs
It's funny how theres an organization supposedly created for that very purpose but it ended up spreading lies, bullying teams and now doing one single task of publishing rosters list
KeSPA is trying to get the OGN LOL going.
Since LGIM is one of their big teams there, they kinda want to spread their protectorate.
I thought IM's LoL team was pretty bad.
Well, we know what this means: if IM doesn't get a good sponsor, and this entire thing falls through, they're gonna be cherry-picked by KeSPA once the trade-agreement ends.
On August 09 2013 02:13 larse wrote: OP should translate the official statement of KeSPA's president. It's pretty awesome and encouraging. The OP's article is a little confusing since it doesn't specify when the KeSPA made the announcement.
On August 09 2013 02:37 Nirel wrote: Does that mean we're definitely going to IM in the next proleague?
No it means an organisation of Korean government that is meant to protect Korean e-sport teams from thing like this, is actually doing its job.
keSPA didn't help on TSL, Slayers, NSHS, oGs
It's funny how theres an organization supposedly created for that very purpose but it ended up spreading lies, bullying teams and now doing one single task of publishing rosters list
KeSPA is trying to get the OGN LOL going.
Since LGIM is one of their big teams there, they kinda want to spread their protectorate.
I thought IM's LoL team was pretty bad.
Well, we know what this means: if IM doesn't get a good sponsor, and this entire thing falls through, they're gonna be cherry-picked by KeSPA once the trade-agreement ends.
IM.LoL is still good enough to have a team in top16. That's pretty good for Korea, tbh.
On August 09 2013 02:37 Nirel wrote: Does that mean we're definitely going to IM in the next proleague?
No it means an organisation of Korean government that is meant to protect Korean e-sport teams from thing like this, is actually doing its job.
keSPA didn't help on TSL, Slayers, NSHS, oGs
It's funny how theres an organization supposedly created for that very purpose but it ended up spreading lies, bullying teams and now doing one single task of publishing rosters list
KeSPA is trying to get the OGN LOL going.
Since LGIM is one of their big teams there, they kinda want to spread their protectorate.
I thought IM's LoL team was pretty bad.
Well, we know what this means: if IM doesn't get a good sponsor, and this entire thing falls through, they're gonna be cherry-picked by KeSPA once the trade-agreement ends.
I think kespa would rather work with IM than take the players, they need more teams.
On August 09 2013 02:37 Nirel wrote: Does that mean we're definitely going to IM in the next proleague?
No it means an organisation of Korean government that is meant to protect Korean e-sport teams from thing like this, is actually doing its job.
keSPA didn't help on TSL, Slayers, NSHS, oGs
It's funny how theres an organization supposedly created for that very purpose but it ended up spreading lies, bullying teams and now doing one single task of publishing rosters list
KeSPA is trying to get the OGN LOL going.
Since LGIM is one of their big teams there, they kinda want to spread their protectorate.
Funnily enough this information gets thrown around every time. LG-IM are top 16 in Korea at best in LoL, they literally only serve as the gatekeepers for the OCL right now and overhauled most of their roster just recently in desperate hope to make it out of the groupstages some day. They were often called the worst teams in OGN Champions this season.
Not saying that being top 16 and consistently qualifying for the, granted extremely competitive, tournament is bad, but they are far from being one of the big boys there.
On August 09 2013 02:37 Nirel wrote: Does that mean we're definitely going to IM in the next proleague?
No it means an organisation of Korean government that is meant to protect Korean e-sport teams from thing like this, is actually doing its job.
keSPA didn't help on TSL, Slayers, NSHS, oGs
It's funny how theres an organization supposedly created for that very purpose but it ended up spreading lies, bullying teams and now doing one single task of publishing rosters list
KeSPA is trying to get the OGN LOL going.
Since LGIM is one of their big teams there, they kinda want to spread their protectorate.
I thought IM's LoL team was pretty bad.
Well, we know what this means: if IM doesn't get a good sponsor, and this entire thing falls through, they're gonna be cherry-picked by KeSPA once the trade-agreement ends.
I think kespa would rather work with IM than take the players, they need more teams.
Don't you need like a sizeable deposit to participate in PL? Even if KeSPA wants IM in PL, if IM doesn't have the money to make it there, then there's only so much KeSPA can do to pave the road. :/
What i suggest from you guys is to contact the sponsor in question and let them know that it is really disapointing. Those companies have no ends to their greedyness its disgusting...
On August 09 2013 02:37 Nirel wrote: Does that mean we're definitely going to IM in the next proleague?
No it means an organisation of Korean government that is meant to protect Korean e-sport teams from thing like this, is actually doing its job.
keSPA didn't help on TSL, Slayers, NSHS, oGs
It's funny how theres an organization supposedly created for that very purpose but it ended up spreading lies, bullying teams and now doing one single task of publishing rosters list
KeSPA is trying to get the OGN LOL going.
Since LGIM is one of their big teams there, they kinda want to spread their protectorate.
I thought IM's LoL team was pretty bad.
Well, we know what this means: if IM doesn't get a good sponsor, and this entire thing falls through, they're gonna be cherry-picked by KeSPA once the trade-agreement ends.
I think kespa would rather work with IM than take the players, they need more teams.
Don't you need like a sizeable deposit to participate in PL? Even if KeSPA wants IM in PL, if IM doesn't have the money to make it there, then there's only so much KeSPA can do to pave the road. :/
It's a security deposit, to make sure teams don't drop mid season. It's possible that Kespa can change the rules if they really want more teams in PL.
On August 09 2013 02:37 Nirel wrote: Does that mean we're definitely going to IM in the next proleague?
No it means an organisation of Korean government that is meant to protect Korean e-sport teams from thing like this, is actually doing its job.
keSPA didn't help on TSL, Slayers, NSHS, oGs
It's funny how theres an organization supposedly created for that very purpose but it ended up spreading lies, bullying teams and now doing one single task of publishing rosters list
KeSPA is trying to get the OGN LOL going.
Since LGIM is one of their big teams there, they kinda want to spread their protectorate.
I thought IM's LoL team was pretty bad.
Well, we know what this means: if IM doesn't get a good sponsor, and this entire thing falls through, they're gonna be cherry-picked by KeSPA once the trade-agreement ends.
I think kespa would rather work with IM than take the players, they need more teams.
Don't you need like a sizeable deposit to participate in PL? Even if KeSPA wants IM in PL, if IM doesn't have the money to make it there, then there's only so much KeSPA can do to pave the road. :/
It's a security deposit, to make sure teams don't drop mid season. It's possible that Kespa can change the rules if they really want more teams in PL.
Do the teams get that deposit back at the end of the season?
Now all those interviews with IM players about their supervisor being troubled give sense. Didnt seem right to me for quite a long time. But not getting any money for almost a year while being one of the absolute top teams, that horrible. Hope they sort it out. Also I like this relation between IM and Kespa. Proleague gogo!
On August 09 2013 02:37 Nirel wrote: Does that mean we're definitely going to IM in the next proleague?
No it means an organisation of Korean government that is meant to protect Korean e-sport teams from thing like this, is actually doing its job.
keSPA didn't help on TSL, Slayers, NSHS, oGs
It's funny how theres an organization supposedly created for that very purpose but it ended up spreading lies, bullying teams and now doing one single task of publishing rosters list
KeSPA is trying to get the OGN LOL going.
Since LGIM is one of their big teams there, they kinda want to spread their protectorate.
I thought IM's LoL team was pretty bad.
Well, we know what this means: if IM doesn't get a good sponsor, and this entire thing falls through, they're gonna be cherry-picked by KeSPA once the trade-agreement ends.
I think kespa would rather work with IM than take the players, they need more teams.
Don't you need like a sizeable deposit to participate in PL? Even if KeSPA wants IM in PL, if IM doesn't have the money to make it there, then there's only so much KeSPA can do to pave the road. :/
It's a security deposit, to make sure teams don't drop mid season. It's possible that Kespa can change the rules if they really want more teams in PL.
Do the teams get that deposit back at the end of the season?
On August 09 2013 03:52 Gamegene wrote: why do people constantly berate kespa and treat the organization as a bad thing. besides their strict rules they're a mostly OK organization -_-
Because they only see stuff like the embargo against eSF-teams and silly DQ's and not the fact that they've kept the entire Korean esports industry going for 10+ years.
Hopefully with KeSPA pressure, LG will properly compensate IM... or even better, renew their sponsorship for real.
Seriously, at this moment in time, can you think of any other team in the world that deserves this sponsorship more than IM? Guys, do you remember how LG started supporting IM back in February of 2012? Then immediately afterwards, Mvp won GSL? Then straight after that, Seed won GSL? Then IM won IPL TAC 3? First took second at MLG Summer. YongHwa took second at HSC, then won WCG KR. IM placed second in IPTL... twice. First won IEM, then Mvp won IEM. Mvp placed second in GSL... making it his 6th finals! IM won the preliminary GSTL. HotS came out and IM took 1st-4th at IEM (YoDa, First, YongHwa, Mvp). Mvp won WCS EU. IM just won GSTL again!
On August 09 2013 03:52 Gamegene wrote: why do people constantly berate kespa and treat the organization as a bad thing. besides their strict rules they're a mostly OK organization -_-
Because they only see stuff like the embargo against eSF-teams and silly DQ's and not the fact that they've kept the entire Korean esports industry going for 10+ years.
People weren't exactly praising KeSPA back in BW either, though, and I seem to recall reading that the Korean netizens aren't huge fans of the organisation either. Of course they're doing (and have been for a while) the scene a lot of good, but that doesn't mean people aren't allowed to call them out when they do stupid shit like they often do.
Wow, what a shame for a company as big a LG. Can't they be honorable when there is less money on the line then their CEO is probably getting in a week??
On August 09 2013 02:40 ES.Genie wrote: [quote] No it means an organisation of Korean government that is meant to protect Korean e-sport teams from thing like this, is actually doing its job.
keSPA didn't help on TSL, Slayers, NSHS, oGs
It's funny how theres an organization supposedly created for that very purpose but it ended up spreading lies, bullying teams and now doing one single task of publishing rosters list
KeSPA is trying to get the OGN LOL going.
Since LGIM is one of their big teams there, they kinda want to spread their protectorate.
I thought IM's LoL team was pretty bad.
Well, we know what this means: if IM doesn't get a good sponsor, and this entire thing falls through, they're gonna be cherry-picked by KeSPA once the trade-agreement ends.
I think kespa would rather work with IM than take the players, they need more teams.
Don't you need like a sizeable deposit to participate in PL? Even if KeSPA wants IM in PL, if IM doesn't have the money to make it there, then there's only so much KeSPA can do to pave the road. :/
It's a security deposit, to make sure teams don't drop mid season. It's possible that Kespa can change the rules if they really want more teams in PL.
Do the teams get that deposit back at the end of the season?
On August 09 2013 03:31 esdf wrote: shouldn't it be ESF's responsibility to take care of it's teams?
anyway, go kespa!
eSF has no leverage.
(Maybe IM got annoyed at eSF for foisting Tassadar on them and decided to run to KeSPA instead after that incident, hehhhh. )
You don't run to kespa. You have to have major corporation behind to join kespa which even stx and wjs is struggled now.
I didn't mean "run to KeSPA" as in "join KeSPA." I meant "run to KeSPA" as in "complain to KeSPA, because they're much better at leveraging their position than eSF." The Tassadar comment was obviously a joke.
On August 09 2013 03:52 Gamegene wrote: why do people constantly berate kespa and treat the organization as a bad thing. besides their strict rules they're a mostly OK organization -_-
Because they only see stuff like the embargo against eSF-teams and silly DQ's and not the fact that they've kept the entire Korean esports industry going for 10+ years.
People weren't exactly praising KeSPA back in BW either, though, and I seem to recall reading that the Korean netizens aren't huge fans of the organisation either. Of course they're doing (and have been for a while) the scene a lot of good, but that doesn't mean people aren't allowed to call them out when they do stupid shit like they often do.
The question may be. What is a stupid thing? When they do something, you can call it a stupid thing. But for then it really is? In the long term, their decisions are stupid or good? In the end, their decisions make the games better or worse, make the players earn more or less money?
On August 09 2013 04:03 Entirety wrote: Hopefully with KeSPA pressure, LG will properly compensate IM... or even better, renew their sponsorship for real.
Seriously, at this moment in time, can you think of any other team in the world that deserves this sponsorship more than IM? Guys, do you remember how LG started supporting IM back in February of 2012? Then immediately afterwards, Mvp won GSL? Then straight after that, Seed won GSL? Then IM won IPL TAC 3? First took second at MLG Summer. YongHwa took second at HSC, then won WCG KR. IM placed second in IPTL... twice. First won IEM, then Mvp won IEM. Mvp placed second in GSL... making it his 6th finals! IM won the preliminary GSTL. HotS came out and IM took 1st-4th at IEM (YoDa, First, YongHwa, Mvp). Mvp won WCS EU. IM just won GSTL again!
How can you argue with results like those?
wow this is like every IM fanboy's argument to anyone insinuating that they are not the greatest team ever lol.
On August 09 2013 04:03 Entirety wrote: Hopefully with KeSPA pressure, LG will properly compensate IM... or even better, renew their sponsorship for real.
Seriously, at this moment in time, can you think of any other team in the world that deserves this sponsorship more than IM? Guys, do you remember how LG started supporting IM back in February of 2012? Then immediately afterwards, Mvp won GSL? Then straight after that, Seed won GSL? Then IM won IPL TAC 3? First took second at MLG Summer. YongHwa took second at HSC, then won WCG KR. IM placed second in IPTL... twice. First won IEM, then Mvp won IEM. Mvp placed second in GSL... making it his 6th finals! IM won the preliminary GSTL. HotS came out and IM took 1st-4th at IEM (YoDa, First, YongHwa, Mvp). Mvp won WCS EU. IM just won GSTL again!
On August 09 2013 04:03 Entirety wrote: Hopefully with KeSPA pressure, LG will properly compensate IM... or even better, renew their sponsorship for real.
Seriously, at this moment in time, can you think of any other team in the world that deserves this sponsorship more than IM? Guys, do you remember how LG started supporting IM back in February of 2012? Then immediately afterwards, Mvp won GSL? Then straight after that, Seed won GSL? Then IM won IPL TAC 3? First took second at MLG Summer. YongHwa took second at HSC, then won WCG KR. IM placed second in IPTL... twice. First won IEM, then Mvp won IEM. Mvp placed second in GSL... making it his 6th finals! IM won the preliminary GSTL. HotS came out and IM took 1st-4th at IEM (YoDa, First, YongHwa, Mvp). Mvp won WCS EU. IM just won GSTL again!
How can you argue with results like those?
not to belittle IM, which is a great team, but the results werent sufficient for LG's purposes. no one else's opinion really matters.
On August 09 2013 04:03 Entirety wrote: Hopefully with KeSPA pressure, LG will properly compensate IM... or even better, renew their sponsorship for real.
Seriously, at this moment in time, can you think of any other team in the world that deserves this sponsorship more than IM? Guys, do you remember how LG started supporting IM back in February of 2012? Then immediately afterwards, Mvp won GSL? Then straight after that, Seed won GSL? Then IM won IPL TAC 3? First took second at MLG Summer. YongHwa took second at HSC, then won WCG KR. IM placed second in IPTL... twice. First won IEM, then Mvp won IEM. Mvp placed second in GSL... making it his 6th finals! IM won the preliminary GSTL. HotS came out and IM took 1st-4th at IEM (YoDa, First, YongHwa, Mvp). Mvp won WCS EU. IM just won GSTL again!
How can you argue with results like those?
not to belittle IM, which is a great team, but the results werent sufficient for LG's purposes. no one else's opinion really matters.
Well, it might be more than just the results. Maybe they wanted more sales and marketing of their brand than they got?
Um....Wow very surprising, I really hope that LG ends up paying IM which I am sure they will, as LG is a really big company, if they don't pay then this could be very bad for ESPORTS ... T_T
On August 09 2013 04:53 GGzerG wrote: Um....Wow very surprising, I really hope that LG ends up paying IM which I am sure they will, as LG is a really big company, if they don't pay then this could be very bad for ESPORTS ... T_T
I think Kespa definitely has the power to make them pay damages, continuing sponsorship afterwards is an entirely different thing, I want to be positive but I doubt they will renew the sponsorship.
It sounds more like IM was desperately clinging to the hope that LG will renew their sponsorship after the deadline, not LG led them on into thinking that they will renew their sponsorship in bad faith. In either case, LG won't be hurt by this while IM may have a significant problem.
I really hope Legacy of the Void will revive everything, but as of now the future is pretty dark and gloomy.
On August 09 2013 04:03 Entirety wrote: Hopefully with KeSPA pressure, LG will properly compensate IM... or even better, renew their sponsorship for real.
Seriously, at this moment in time, can you think of any other team in the world that deserves this sponsorship more than IM? Guys, do you remember how LG started supporting IM back in February of 2012? Then immediately afterwards, Mvp won GSL? Then straight after that, Seed won GSL? Then IM won IPL TAC 3? First took second at MLG Summer. YongHwa took second at HSC, then won WCG KR. IM placed second in IPTL... twice. First won IEM, then Mvp won IEM. Mvp placed second in GSL... making it his 6th finals! IM won the preliminary GSTL. HotS came out and IM took 1st-4th at IEM (YoDa, First, YongHwa, Mvp). Mvp won WCS EU. IM just won GSTL again!
How can you argue with results like those?
while I admit those are good results, I rofl'd once I saw you're a fan of IM
Fuuuccckkk. But if any entity can try and force a solution, it's KESPA. Glad IM swallowed their pride and went outside of the eSF to try and get a solution that helped their players.
On August 09 2013 04:03 Entirety wrote: Hopefully with KeSPA pressure, LG will properly compensate IM... or even better, renew their sponsorship for real.
Seriously, at this moment in time, can you think of any other team in the world that deserves this sponsorship more than IM? Guys, do you remember how LG started supporting IM back in February of 2012? Then immediately afterwards, Mvp won GSL? Then straight after that, Seed won GSL? Then IM won IPL TAC 3? First took second at MLG Summer. YongHwa took second at HSC, then won WCG KR. IM placed second in IPTL... twice. First won IEM, then Mvp won IEM. Mvp placed second in GSL... making it his 6th finals! IM won the preliminary GSTL. HotS came out and IM took 1st-4th at IEM (YoDa, First, YongHwa, Mvp). Mvp won WCS EU. IM just won GSTL again!
How can you argue with results like those?
not to belittle IM, which is a great team, but the results werent sufficient for LG's purposes. no one else's opinion really matters.
Well, it might be more than just the results. Maybe they wanted more sales and marketing of their brand than they got?
They did so much marketing, they even got a tournament to change its name to LG-IEM! lol
Wow this has not been a great few days for the Starcraft 2 scene... MLG presumably cutting SC2, LG flaked on IM since October '12... Alicia and CranK didn't make Ro8... The list just goes on and on. Forgot to mention the fact that MVP has no foreign sponsor.
On August 09 2013 04:03 Entirety wrote: Hopefully with KeSPA pressure, LG will properly compensate IM... or even better, renew their sponsorship for real.
Seriously, at this moment in time, can you think of any other team in the world that deserves this sponsorship more than IM? Guys, do you remember how LG started supporting IM back in February of 2012? Then immediately afterwards, Mvp won GSL? Then straight after that, Seed won GSL? Then IM won IPL TAC 3? First took second at MLG Summer. YongHwa took second at HSC, then won WCG KR. IM placed second in IPTL... twice. First won IEM, then Mvp won IEM. Mvp placed second in GSL... making it his 6th finals! IM won the preliminary GSTL. HotS came out and IM took 1st-4th at IEM (YoDa, First, YongHwa, Mvp). Mvp won WCS EU. IM just won GSTL again!
How can you argue with results like those?
while I admit those are good results, I rofl'd once I saw you're a fan of IM
So being a fan of the team instantly invalidates his arguments? Because he is a fan those results never happened? This has to be one the silliest things i read for a while.
Pretty nice to see Kespa stepping in on behalf of LGIM though. Its nice to see the big boys of esports take a stand for a {lone} team, and it strengthens the scene as a whole.
Dude, guys I feel like this issue is simple but more to what the OP posted.
My Speculation is that Kespa and IM is pressuring LG to sponsor IM full on Kespa style so they can integrate IM into Proleague. Every Kespa team is sponsored by somone big named (team 8 counts!) and with the departure of EG-TL they need a team that has a sponsorship big enough for kespa style.
LG probably was happy with sponsoring IM while it was at esF but Kespa demands a lot more from sponsors. That's probably why LG is pulling out and IM-Kespa is going all in.
On August 09 2013 15:57 titan55 wrote: Dude, guys I feel like this issue is simple but more to what the OP posted.
My Speculation is that Kespa and IM is pressuring LG to sponsor IM full on Kespa style so they can integrate IM into Proleague. Every Kespa team is sponsored by somone big named (team 8 counts!) and with the departure of EG-TL they need a team that has a sponsorship big enough for kespa style.
LG probably was happy with sponsoring IM while it was at esF but Kespa demands a lot more from sponsors. That's probably why LG is pulling out and IM-Kespa is going all in.
I think that's a ton of very empty speculation.
EGTL pulling out makes it so that we're missing a team, but it looks like you didn't quite read the OP or understand the situation. LG hasn't paid IM any money when their contract didn't work well in December 2012. EGTL didn't pull out until recently. Granted they didn't show the best results, but there was never really a huge incentive for LGIM to join the SPL anyway since they don't seem to be a team that worries too much about team results.
All these people threatening to no longer buy LG products is doing more harm than good. Future sponsors would never want to support something that will get them so much negative press while being shaken down for money that wasn't even contracted.
On August 09 2013 20:54 Darkstar_X wrote: All these people threatening to no longer buy LG products is doing more harm than good. Future sponsors would never want to support something that will get them so much negative press while being shaken down for money that wasn't even contracted.
As much as this sucks for IM, it's essentially their own fault. If you don't have a contract with the sponsor, then you don't have a sponsor. If they turned down other offers in favor of an unconfirmed sponsor they have no one else to blame but themselves. It's also LG's fault for not telling IM to stop honoring a non-existent contract.
On August 09 2013 20:54 Darkstar_X wrote: All these people threatening to no longer buy LG products is doing more harm than good. Future sponsors would never want to support something that will get them so much negative press while being shaken down for money that wasn't even contracted.
This seems very true for e-sports, not much buying power from young people, but pitchforks are very strong from them.
How in the world did IM allow this to get drag out for so long? The day that your contract ends is the day you stop representing LG. Out of common sense, aren't you suppose to get re-sponsorship confirmation from sponsors ahead of time, that way you have time to look for other sponsors if they decline. In this case IM is asking for drama when it could have been easily avoided.
On August 09 2013 20:54 Darkstar_X wrote: All these people threatening to no longer buy LG products is doing more harm than good. Future sponsors would never want to support something that will get them so much negative press while being shaken down for money that wasn't even contracted.
This seems very true for e-sports, not much buying power from young people, but pitchforks are very strong from them.
On August 10 2013 02:54 Like a Boss wrote: How in the world did IM allow this to get drag out for so long? The day that your contract ends is the day you stop representing LG. Out of common sense, aren't you suppose to get re-sponsorship confirmation from sponsors ahead of time, that way you have time to look for other sponsors if they decline. In this case IM is asking for drama when it could have been easily avoided.
Given how long it took T8 to find a sponsor, I doubt that IM could find one so easily too. I can't say just how hard they tried to "easily avoid" it, but I'm just guessing it wasn't that easy. And if IM straight up stops representing LG the moment the contract ends, it would be like rudely shutting the door on a possible opportunity for a re-extension. Not something you want to do in a negotiation phase with no backup plan. They were probably "hoping for the best", and it just didn't turn out right.
Not everyday we get to grab our pitchforks to lynch a potential esports sponsor.
I'm seriously beginning to wonder why this sort of head-scratching stuff seems to be more common amongst eSF teams than KeSPa teams. Even though Team 8 has been looking for a sponsor for a while, I never heard of them struggling like this. Is team management just better under KeSPa?
On August 10 2013 17:50 chaos021 wrote: Not everyday we get to grab our pitchforks to lynch a potential esports sponsor.
I'm seriously beginning to wonder why this sort of head-scratching stuff seems to be more common amongst eSF teams than KeSPa teams. Even though Team 8 has been looking for a sponsor for a while, I never heard of them struggling like this. Is team management just better under KeSPa?
You have to remember that KeSPa is a government body while eSF isn't. So I believe that being in a government body with much more strict regulations, it will be harder for this kind of stuff to happen. I just hope that KeSPA and eSF can join force later on. I know its hard, but it is better for the SCII scene for them to combine.
On August 10 2013 02:54 Like a Boss wrote: How in the world did IM allow this to get drag out for so long? The day that your contract ends is the day you stop representing LG. Out of common sense, aren't you suppose to get re-sponsorship confirmation from sponsors ahead of time, that way you have time to look for other sponsors if they decline. In this case IM is asking for drama when it could have been easily avoided.
Given how long it took T8 to find a sponsor, I doubt that IM could find one so easily too. I can't say just how hard they tried to "easily avoid" it, but I'm just guessing it wasn't that easy. And if IM straight up stops representing LG the moment the contract ends, it would be like rudely shutting the door on a possible opportunity for a re-extension. Not something you want to do in a negotiation phase with no backup plan. They were probably "hoping for the best", and it just didn't turn out right.
On August 10 2013 22:27 Estancia wrote: You have to remember that KeSPa is a government body while eSF isn't. So I believe that being in a government body with much more strict regulations, it will be harder for this kind of stuff to happen. I just hope that KeSPA and eSF can join force later on. I know its hard, but it is better for the SCII scene for them to combine.
I thought KeSPa was run by very large corporations that are ubiquitous in Korean society? I'm sure such corporations would have major ties to government, but I didn't think it was run by government.
1st wtf moment: LG doesn't pay up 2nd wtf moment: IM still represents LG's logo despite no payment 3rd and biggest wtf moment: KeSPA defends an ESF team
On August 10 2013 22:27 Estancia wrote: You have to remember that KeSPa is a government body while eSF isn't. So I believe that being in a government body with much more strict regulations, it will be harder for this kind of stuff to happen. I just hope that KeSPA and eSF can join force later on. I know its hard, but it is better for the SCII scene for them to combine.
I thought KeSPa was run by very large corporations that are ubiquitous in Korean society? I'm sure such corporations would have major ties to government, but I didn't think it was run by government.
He may be referring to how kespa is a GOVERNING body, whereas esf does not have any governing powers over its teams and players.
On August 09 2013 22:25 DeCoder wrote: As much as this sucks for IM, it's essentially their own fault. If you don't have a contract with the sponsor, then you don't have a sponsor. If they turned down other offers in favor of an unconfirmed sponsor they have no one else to blame but themselves. It's also LG's fault for not telling IM to stop honoring a non-existent contract.
I don't think a lot of people have a lot of business experience here, so I'd like to fill them in a bit.
Essentially when a contract ends, or is getting close to ending, you may negotiate and agree to terms verbally over the phone in a conversation, possibly even in email. At that point one or both parties may not rush into signing a contract as they have other and better things to do. This happens all the time. You don't want to destroy a relationship with a sponsor/customer/client by pressuring them to sign something that has already been agreed upon. It may not sound like a big deal here, but business moves fast, you get the agreement and move on. You find a time to sign later. Again it happens all the time and you sometimes end up taking peoples word, and generally this works out fine. You want to show good faith by taking the word of a sponsor/customer/client.
So this might not be IM's fault. If LG agreed verbally to a contract, that is binding, or at least it would be in the United States. It sounds like some details were not quite ironed out though.
From the sounds of it, I'm sure IM and LG had something worked out and then LG decided to renege.
People are quick to jump onto twitter or email sponsors when a player says what they perceive to be the wrong thing, I hope everybody also goes in to bat for IM and lets LG know what they think about this.
On August 10 2013 22:27 Estancia wrote: You have to remember that KeSPa is a government body while eSF isn't. So I believe that being in a government body with much more strict regulations, it will be harder for this kind of stuff to happen. I just hope that KeSPA and eSF can join force later on. I know its hard, but it is better for the SCII scene for them to combine.
I thought KeSPa was run by very large corporations that are ubiquitous in Korean society? I'm sure such corporations would have major ties to government, but I didn't think it was run by government.
He may be referring to how kespa is a GOVERNING body, whereas esf does not have any governing powers over its teams and players.
no hes rêferring to KeSPA actually being run by the Ministry of Culture in Korea. Its belongs to the government
On August 09 2013 22:25 DeCoder wrote: As much as this sucks for IM, it's essentially their own fault. If you don't have a contract with the sponsor, then you don't have a sponsor. If they turned down other offers in favor of an unconfirmed sponsor they have no one else to blame but themselves. It's also LG's fault for not telling IM to stop honoring a non-existent contract.
I don't think a lot of people have a lot of business experience here, so I'd like to fill them in a bit.
Essentially when a contract ends, or is getting close to ending, you may negotiate and agree to terms verbally over the phone in a conversation, possibly even in email. At that point one or both parties may not rush into signing a contract as they have other and better things to do. This happens all the time. You don't want to destroy a relationship with a sponsor/customer/client by pressuring them to sign something that has already been agreed upon. It may not sound like a big deal here, but business moves fast, you get the agreement and move on. You find a time to sign later. Again it happens all the time and you sometimes end up taking peoples word, and generally this works out fine. You want to show good faith by taking the word of a sponsor/customer/client.
So this might not be IM's fault. If LG agreed verbally to a contract, that is binding, or at least it would be in the United States. It sounds like some details were not quite ironed out though.
From the sounds of it, I'm sure IM and LG had something worked out and then LG decided to renege.
I don't think a lot of people have a lot of business experience here, so I'd like to fill them in a bit. . . . . . . .
this is what business is actually built on, its the people in it who lack the experience, but hell u play sc2 well right, therefore you know more about everything than anyone else.. Do you really think when i was transporting i sent it out before the contract was faxed over, signed, seal numbered and registered.Not once. we verified the money was in the account or we didnt send it. You are right, you dont want to seem pushy when these people were your main source of income but things cant be done without the money first and that business should know that as well. You arent being arsy or pushy, this is what it is to be a successful business. Money first and verified before you do anything as 99.99% of any other avenue will result in failure. Kespa need to be more assertive as being as passive as their are and using hope doesnt pay bills and generate any more income. the idea in business is any money you do make you put back into it. Im not really understanding the infrastructure of epsorts at the minute and im beginning to think i can create a 5 man team, pay them a decent wage(all house, food and bills taken care of of course), set up a gaming room in my house with very very modest sleeping arrangements(as in there will be 2 rooms they can bunk down in with living rooms . . of course my family would have to move out!!!) but i feel i could do that for less than £2000-£3000(max) a month?
Im really really not sure whats costing so much after you have a sponsor? (dont forget ive bare minimumed it)
Either I'm is desperate and playing victim or. LG is a douchebag. Both are real possibilities. Since I've seen how dirty lg can be in business. I still remember when I'm instigated the boycott of the kespa osl because kespa refused to compete in the GSL. I'M can be ruthless but maybe coach kang is right and LG was being a dick.
On August 12 2013 19:15 chatuka wrote: Either I'm is desperate and playing victim or. LG is a douchebag. Both are real possibilities. Since I've seen how dirty lg can be in business. I still remember when I'm instigated the boycott of the kespa osl because kespa refused to compete in the GSL. I'M can be ruthless but maybe coach kang is right and LG was being a dick.
Or you know, the third choice, that everything isn't always black and white
On August 09 2013 04:03 Entirety wrote: Hopefully with KeSPA pressure, LG will properly compensate IM... or even better, renew their sponsorship for real.
Seriously, at this moment in time, can you think of any other team in the world that deserves this sponsorship more than IM? Guys, do you remember how LG started supporting IM back in February of 2012? Then immediately afterwards, Mvp won GSL? Then straight after that, Seed won GSL? Then IM won IPL TAC 3? First took second at MLG Summer. YongHwa took second at HSC, then won WCG KR. IM placed second in IPTL... twice. First won IEM, then Mvp won IEM. Mvp placed second in GSL... making it his 6th finals! IM won the preliminary GSTL. HotS came out and IM took 1st-4th at IEM (YoDa, First, YongHwa, Mvp). Mvp won WCS EU. IM just won GSTL again!
How can you argue with results like those?
Entirety said it all, can't believe any sponsor would wanna drop a team with those achievements. Us fans need to do our part and support IM and continue to make our voice heard, I hope someone significant from LG will hear the fans' voices and do someting about it. It'll be a real shame to see IM lose LG, their shirts even look better with the LG logo. Come on LG, do the right thing or else it's lifetime LG goods boycott for me. I'm sure I'm not the only fan who'd do this.
Am I the only one that understood that LG just stopped paying after their contract run out? Whats wrong with this? Its IM´s fault in the end, just signed contracts or nothing. Its not the exchange where money is made by believing.
On August 13 2013 06:20 tadL wrote: Am I the only one that understood that LG just stopped paying after their contract run out? Whats wrong with this? Its IM´s fault in the end, just signed contracts or nothing. Its not the exchange where money is made by believing.
verbal agreements are legally binding in many countries. you dont actually have to sign the contract for it to be "signed"
I don't know.. I see this more of a fault by IM for using LG tag when they weren't being sponsored for it. LG have no obligation to pay up if there is no contract in place for that period.
kespa is always quick to play the victim and twist words. everything they have done thus far has been shady from allowing match fixing to happen under their nose to using a copyrighted game to make money without paying royalties.
On August 24 2013 00:45 schaf wrote: Some news: LG is still named as a sponsor for IM at WCS S2 finals, First still has the LG patches on his sweater. curious!
I'm not sure if that really means anything Making new uniforms takes time and money.
On August 24 2013 00:45 schaf wrote: Some news: LG is still named as a sponsor for IM at WCS S2 finals, First still has the LG patches on his sweater. curious!
I'm not sure if that really means anything Making new uniforms takes time and money.
Taking off patches takes like 5 minutes a patch if you do it carefully, especially if they were sewn on and not ironed or something.
On August 24 2013 00:45 schaf wrote: Some news: LG is still named as a sponsor for IM at WCS S2 finals, First still has the LG patches on his sweater. curious!
I'm not sure if that really means anything Making new uniforms takes time and money.
Taking off patches takes like 5 minutes a patch if you do it carefully, especially if they were sewn on and not ironed or something.
the shirts have a huge LG logo on the front of them don't they? pretty sure It's not able to be removed.
On August 24 2013 21:40 FFW_Rude wrote: Just noticed that FIRST is presented with IM only and not IM-LG. So it's officias ?
I wouldn't read much into it. For example, on of their LoL teams played a match just a few minutes ago and they had switched their tags back to LG-IM today, despite having IM as their tag just a couple of days ago. I have no idea what's going on.
Wow, shame on you LG. If you did not want to renew your sponsorship of IM, you should've made that clear from the off. Now, you've benefited from their work, and they've received absolutely nothing. I won't be touching any LG products any time soon, that's for sure, at least until they pay what IM is due.
I hope some other better tech company picks up IM, they are consistently placing so high in various tournaments. I am sure they provide one of the best ROI out of most teams. Something like google would be seriously awesome. IM only team to have a player in season semi finals now.
On August 24 2013 23:35 sparklyresidue wrote: The fickle nature of sponsorship means a lot of people with LG or Steelseries gear suddenly regret their purchases..right?
It is better to make a shit storm on their social media sites than regret to buy their products ( if they are not bad).
On August 24 2013 21:40 FFW_Rude wrote: Just noticed that FIRST is presented with IM only and not IM-LG. So it's officias ?
I wouldn't read much into it. For example, on of their LoL teams played a match just a few minutes ago and they had switched their tags back to LG-IM today, despite having IM as their tag just a couple of days ago. I have no idea what's going on.
I kind of forgot to edit my post because 10minutes later i saw he had the LG tag on his shirt... sorry.
On August 26 2013 19:46 painkilla wrote: Why aren't IM disbanding though with no sponsorship ? Where do they get the money? Do the players have salaries at all?
They have nearly as many sponsors as EG, LG just were giving them the most money. They wont disband for something like this.
On August 26 2013 19:46 painkilla wrote: Why aren't IM disbanding though with no sponsorship ? Where do they get the money? Do the players have salaries at all?
Aside from LG they are sponsored by: Coca-Cola, Nvidia, Kingston HyperX, Steelseries just to name a few. I'm sure they'll figure out something.
On August 26 2013 19:46 painkilla wrote: Why aren't IM disbanding though with no sponsorship ? Where do they get the money? Do the players have salaries at all?
As others have said, they have a lot of other good sponsors. They won't disband.
From what I've gathered in interviews and Khaldor's video from the IM house, most of the players don't earn a salary.
On August 26 2013 19:46 painkilla wrote: Why aren't IM disbanding though with no sponsorship ? Where do they get the money? Do the players have salaries at all?
As others have said, they have a lot of other good sponsors. They won't disband.
From what I've gathered in interviews and Khaldor's video from the IM house, most of the players don't earn a salary.
On August 26 2013 19:46 painkilla wrote: Why aren't IM disbanding though with no sponsorship ? Where do they get the money? Do the players have salaries at all?
As others have said, they have a lot of other good sponsors. They won't disband.
From what I've gathered in interviews and Khaldor's video from the IM house, most of the players don't earn a salary.
No salary? must get alot from dem sponsors
The funds are going towards paying the transports for players, the house etc. But also paying off the debt they incurred during the first years of sc2. Hirai personally payed for stuff and is still in debt, afaik.
On August 29 2013 08:25 rshawer wrote: of course, Mvp, Nestea, and quite some other well known IM players are getting a salary, but not everyone, or even a majority
While LG was giving them money, sure I doubt they continued to have salaries after LG pulled out
On August 29 2013 07:48 jiberish wrote: Well it isn't too bad. Free accommodation, free food etc.
Slaves get similar benefits
Not a fair comparison. Slaves don't choose to be in their position.
It's completely fair. I said 'similar' and only referred to the benefits. I'm not saying they're like slaves in all aspects, just that the benefits listed are also the ones slaves are entitled to.
On August 29 2013 07:48 jiberish wrote: Well it isn't too bad. Free accommodation, free food etc.
Slaves get similar benefits
You mean Kespa B teamers
kespa b teamers/practice partners had to pay for board and do all the chores and shit lol
really they had to pay for board? interesting
Yes/No, Not all B teamers had too, but most certainly the smaller teams had a deal similar to that(or free board but pay for your own food+do chores). I know SKT b teamers up until they got let go got free room/food.
On August 29 2013 07:48 jiberish wrote: Well it isn't too bad. Free accommodation, free food etc.
Slaves get similar benefits
You mean Kespa B teamers
kespa b teamers/practice partners had to pay for board and do all the chores and shit lol
really they had to pay for board? interesting
Yes/No, Not all B teamers had too, but most certainly the smaller teams had a deal similar to that(or free board but pay for your own food+do chores). I know SKT b teamers up until they got let go got free room/food.
You guys must be thinking of the [Name] amateur BW team house. It was more like a BW camp that parents send their kids to to see if they have potential of becoming pro, hence the money payment.
On August 26 2013 19:46 painkilla wrote: Why aren't IM disbanding though with no sponsorship ? Where do they get the money? Do the players have salaries at all?
Aside from LG they are sponsored by: Coca-Cola, Nvidia, Kingston HyperX, Steelseries just to name a few. I'm sure they'll figure out something.
Those sponsors don't really mean much if they aren't giving monetary support and I seriously doubt Kingston, Steelseries, and Nvidia would give much money to a dying market in a dead region when SC2 is more viable in EU.
EPT![[image loading]](http://img.ruliweb.daum.net/data/news13/08m/24/pc/ruliweb_kespa.jpg)
