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Leave it to the good Ol' MLG Commissioner to keep this crap up boys. If they were so torn about deadlines on the production perhaps they should do more bo1 :3
On June 17 2013 05:26 Plexa wrote:Show nested quote +On June 17 2013 05:24 Vindicare605 wrote:On June 17 2013 05:22 Plexa wrote:On June 17 2013 05:20 Vindicare605 wrote:
Of course it's back guys, this is how they do double elimination.
Would you all rather have traditional double elimination where the person coming from the lower bracket has to win two series to win the finals?
It's double elimination, viewers want double elimination. This is part of what makes double elimination what it is. I don't understand the whining about it at all. Sometimes the 'fairest' option is not the best option for the viewers. Let's be honest here Plexa, the viewers are going to complain about something, no matter how much you try to appease them. Extended Series is actually better for the viewers than the double series format we had at Blizzcon and IPL and people really hated that shit. I didn't hear any complaints when people assumed that extended series wasn't going to be present at this MLG, knowing that it was going to be a double elim bracket. You have to ask yourself whether MLG is a tournament where you want the best player to win, or if you want the viewers to have the best possible viewing experience. To have the best player win I would argue in defense of extended series, but I would argue that extended series is not the best thing for viewers.
The pinnacle of anti-climatic finishes. Indeed.
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1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
On June 17 2013 13:10 ElBlanco wrote:
Not much we can do about it, MLG and Blizzard have successfully killed off any potential competition for MLG in the NA market so now we just have to deal with it.
If they do a MLG Ye Olde Map Tournament with WoL maps in HoTS they will win me over
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There is no reason for having an extended series, because any match should be treated the same as any other match ... and thus "in a vacuum" and without the results from any other match interfering in any way.
On June 17 2013 5:26 Plexa wrote:
To have the best player win I would argue in defense of extended series, but I would argue that extended series is not the best thing for viewers.
That is not true, because IF someone is a better player he would be able to win another bo3 as well, but the extended series might force him to play FIVE games instead of THREE and thus tire him out more than other equally good players in the tournament, which gives the others a clear advantage. That is a clear disadvantage of players who are forced to play more games.
Extended series is terrible for viewers too, because it could screw up the tournament and streaming schedule a lot. There is nothing worse than long breaks in something like a weekend tournament coverage; this weeks DH on day 1 and many $100 tournaments with only enthusiasts casting it clearly show that.
EDIT: corrected wrong quote
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On June 17 2013 13:36 StarStruck wrote:Leave it to the good Ol' MLG Commissioner to keep this crap up boys. If they were so torn about deadlines on the production perhaps they should do more bo1 :3 Show nested quote +On June 17 2013 05:26 Plexa wrote:On June 17 2013 05:24 Vindicare605 wrote:On June 17 2013 05:22 Plexa wrote:On June 17 2013 05:20 Vindicare605 wrote:
Of course it's back guys, this is how they do double elimination.
Would you all rather have traditional double elimination where the person coming from the lower bracket has to win two series to win the finals?
It's double elimination, viewers want double elimination. This is part of what makes double elimination what it is. I don't understand the whining about it at all. Sometimes the 'fairest' option is not the best option for the viewers. Let's be honest here Plexa, the viewers are going to complain about something, no matter how much you try to appease them. Extended Series is actually better for the viewers than the double series format we had at Blizzcon and IPL and people really hated that shit. I didn't hear any complaints when people assumed that extended series wasn't going to be present at this MLG, knowing that it was going to be a double elim bracket. You have to ask yourself whether MLG is a tournament where you want the best player to win, or if you want the viewers to have the best possible viewing experience. To have the best player win I would argue in defense of extended series, but I would argue that extended series is not the best thing for viewers. The pinnacle of anti-climatic finishes. Indeed.
People just like to jump on the bandwagon of "Extended series is bad because it knocked out my favorite player unfairly!!!". I think the vocal majority of people don't care what happens as long as the player their rooting for gets past. Extended series if a fair advantage, I don't know how anyone else can complain otherwise.
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haha, MLG. never change. just stop existing.
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Extended series is the same as points in a league. They stick with you and you're punished for every loss. There is nothing wrong with it.
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On June 17 2013 14:12 Rabiator wrote:There is no reason for having an extended series, because any match should be treated the same as any other match ... and thus "in a vacuum" and without the results from any other match interfering in any way. Show nested quote +On June 17 2013 13:36 StarStruck wrote:
To have the best player win I would argue in defense of extended series, but I would argue that extended series is not the best thing for viewers. That is not true, because IF someone is a better player he would be able to win another bo3 as well, but the extended series might force him to play FIVE games instead of THREE and thus tire him out more than other equally good players in the tournament, which gives the others a clear advantage. That is a clear disadvantage of players who are forced to play more games. Extended series is terrible for viewers too, because it could screw up the tournament and streaming schedule a lot. There is nothing worse than long breaks in something like a weekend tournament coverage; this weeks DH on day 1 and many $100 tournaments with only enthusiasts casting it clearly show that.
You meant to quote Plexa man not me lol.
On June 17 2013 15:11 MonkSEA wrote:Show nested quote +On June 17 2013 13:36 StarStruck wrote:Leave it to the good Ol' MLG Commissioner to keep this crap up boys. If they were so torn about deadlines on the production perhaps they should do more bo1 :3 On June 17 2013 05:26 Plexa wrote:On June 17 2013 05:24 Vindicare605 wrote:On June 17 2013 05:22 Plexa wrote:On June 17 2013 05:20 Vindicare605 wrote:
Of course it's back guys, this is how they do double elimination.
Would you all rather have traditional double elimination where the person coming from the lower bracket has to win two series to win the finals?
It's double elimination, viewers want double elimination. This is part of what makes double elimination what it is. I don't understand the whining about it at all. Sometimes the 'fairest' option is not the best option for the viewers. Let's be honest here Plexa, the viewers are going to complain about something, no matter how much you try to appease them. Extended Series is actually better for the viewers than the double series format we had at Blizzcon and IPL and people really hated that shit. I didn't hear any complaints when people assumed that extended series wasn't going to be present at this MLG, knowing that it was going to be a double elim bracket. You have to ask yourself whether MLG is a tournament where you want the best player to win, or if you want the viewers to have the best possible viewing experience. To have the best player win I would argue in defense of extended series, but I would argue that extended series is not the best thing for viewers. The pinnacle of anti-climatic finishes. Indeed. People just like to jump on the bandwagon of "Extended series is bad because it knocked out my favorite player unfairly!!!". I think the vocal majority of people don't care what happens as long as the player their rooting for gets past. Extended series if a fair advantage, I don't know how anyone else can complain otherwise.
The vocal majority do care. Ask all the players. Ask the people in attendance. Not just these forums or reddit. Everyone I know hates the idea. I don't care for excuses and you know what. There have been countless debates on this and I don't see any reason to go over them again. ~_~ I'll just say this. More suspense is a good thing and with this rule it's very rare that you'll find any of it.
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hahaha, MLG xD You just couldn't live without it, could you?
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1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
On June 17 2013 15:20 Kluey wrote:
Extended series is the same as points in a league. They stick with you and you're punished for every loss. There is nothing wrong with it.
Hardly comparable as this is a playoff tournament, not a league.
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On June 17 2013 15:20 Kluey wrote:
Extended series is the same as points in a league. They stick with you and you're punished for every loss. There is nothing wrong with it.
Eh no, that would be like if the regular season results in the nhl transferred over to the playoffs. The seeding is an advantage in itself, you don't need any extended shit. And in MLG's format you have an advantage of only having to win one bo3 if you face off against someone from the losers bracket, regardless if you have met that player before or not. The extended series just makes sure the second serie is basically over before it starts in a lot of cases.
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On June 17 2013 15:24 StarStruck wrote:Show nested quote +On June 17 2013 14:12 Rabiator wrote:There is no reason for having an extended series, because any match should be treated the same as any other match ... and thus "in a vacuum" and without the results from any other match interfering in any way. On June 17 2013 13:36 StarStruck wrote:
To have the best player win I would argue in defense of extended series, but I would argue that extended series is not the best thing for viewers. That is not true, because IF someone is a better player he would be able to win another bo3 as well, but the extended series might force him to play FIVE games instead of THREE and thus tire him out more than other equally good players in the tournament, which gives the others a clear advantage. That is a clear disadvantage of players who are forced to play more games. Extended series is terrible for viewers too, because it could screw up the tournament and streaming schedule a lot. There is nothing worse than long breaks in something like a weekend tournament coverage; this weeks DH on day 1 and many $100 tournaments with only enthusiasts casting it clearly show that. You meant to quote Plexa man not me lol.
I apologize ... and yes, that quote is from Plexa. I get annoyed when people dont quote correctly and now its time to be annoyed by myself. *damn*
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On June 17 2013 15:11 MonkSEA wrote:Show nested quote +On June 17 2013 13:36 StarStruck wrote:Leave it to the good Ol' MLG Commissioner to keep this crap up boys. If they were so torn about deadlines on the production perhaps they should do more bo1 :3 On June 17 2013 05:26 Plexa wrote:On June 17 2013 05:24 Vindicare605 wrote:On June 17 2013 05:22 Plexa wrote:On June 17 2013 05:20 Vindicare605 wrote:
Of course it's back guys, this is how they do double elimination.
Would you all rather have traditional double elimination where the person coming from the lower bracket has to win two series to win the finals?
It's double elimination, viewers want double elimination. This is part of what makes double elimination what it is. I don't understand the whining about it at all. Sometimes the 'fairest' option is not the best option for the viewers. Let's be honest here Plexa, the viewers are going to complain about something, no matter how much you try to appease them. Extended Series is actually better for the viewers than the double series format we had at Blizzcon and IPL and people really hated that shit. I didn't hear any complaints when people assumed that extended series wasn't going to be present at this MLG, knowing that it was going to be a double elim bracket. You have to ask yourself whether MLG is a tournament where you want the best player to win, or if you want the viewers to have the best possible viewing experience. To have the best player win I would argue in defense of extended series, but I would argue that extended series is not the best thing for viewers. The pinnacle of anti-climatic finishes. Indeed. People just like to jump on the bandwagon of "Extended series is bad because it knocked out my favorite player unfairly!!!". I think the vocal majority of people don't care what happens as long as the player their rooting for gets past. Extended series if a fair advantage, I don't know how anyone else can complain otherwise.
Explain to me why the extended series is FAIR.
Player A plays against player B and one of them goes down to the losers bracket. The loser has "paid his price" by losing one of his two lives. Why should he be penalized later on if they meet again, because both of them are losers?
Its like a criminal who has served his sentence in prison and who commits another crime later on ... he only gets tried for the new crime instead of all his crimes, because he paid the penalty already.
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United Kingdom14103 Posts
Double bracket is kind of good if that's how it works.
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I dont understand why everybody is/are crying? Its more fair for the players, if you beat him before - you have the advantage in the next match, its normal, stop crying. You just came here to complain about everything, which is stupid thing to do .
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From a viewer standpoint they appear equal to me (extended and non-extended series), but I feel like I'm different than the majority on most viewership issues like this one.
From a competitive standpoint, however, the divide seems to be whether or not someone thinks it's fair for the player who comes through the loser's bracket to have to win an extended series or not. I personally think that it's a fair reward for the player who hasn't lost to have that back-up series once the double elimination part is over and they lose 2-1 or 2-0. To me, the penalty for the other player who has already lost, was going through the Loser's bracket, and just because one player gets penalized and the other is rewarded doesn't mean, to me, that the one player is being punished twice. That's my position on it, and I completely understand how someone could feel otherwise.
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Noooooooo not this again, now were gonna argue for month over this...........
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Americans just don't want to have a nice sc2 scene. I totally accept that.
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On June 17 2013 16:01 Rabiator wrote:Show nested quote +On June 17 2013 15:11 MonkSEA wrote:On June 17 2013 13:36 StarStruck wrote:Leave it to the good Ol' MLG Commissioner to keep this crap up boys. If they were so torn about deadlines on the production perhaps they should do more bo1 :3 On June 17 2013 05:26 Plexa wrote:On June 17 2013 05:24 Vindicare605 wrote:On June 17 2013 05:22 Plexa wrote:On June 17 2013 05:20 Vindicare605 wrote:
Of course it's back guys, this is how they do double elimination.
Would you all rather have traditional double elimination where the person coming from the lower bracket has to win two series to win the finals?
It's double elimination, viewers want double elimination. This is part of what makes double elimination what it is. I don't understand the whining about it at all. Sometimes the 'fairest' option is not the best option for the viewers. Let's be honest here Plexa, the viewers are going to complain about something, no matter how much you try to appease them. Extended Series is actually better for the viewers than the double series format we had at Blizzcon and IPL and people really hated that shit. I didn't hear any complaints when people assumed that extended series wasn't going to be present at this MLG, knowing that it was going to be a double elim bracket. You have to ask yourself whether MLG is a tournament where you want the best player to win, or if you want the viewers to have the best possible viewing experience. To have the best player win I would argue in defense of extended series, but I would argue that extended series is not the best thing for viewers. The pinnacle of anti-climatic finishes. Indeed. People just like to jump on the bandwagon of "Extended series is bad because it knocked out my favorite player unfairly!!!". I think the vocal majority of people don't care what happens as long as the player their rooting for gets past. Extended series if a fair advantage, I don't know how anyone else can complain otherwise. Explain to me why the extended series is FAIR. Player A plays against player B and one of them goes down to the losers bracket. The loser has "paid his price" by losing one of his two lives. Why should he be penalized later on if they meet again, because both of them are losers? Its like a criminal who has served his sentence in prison and who commits another crime later on ... he only gets tried for the new crime instead of all his crimes, because he paid the penalty already.
No. Extended series allow you to make a difference between 2-1 and 2-0 in a Bo3.
As long as it doesn't affect the finals, I'm okay with it.
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On June 17 2013 17:31 Nyvis wrote:Show nested quote +On June 17 2013 16:01 Rabiator wrote:On June 17 2013 15:11 MonkSEA wrote:On June 17 2013 13:36 StarStruck wrote:Leave it to the good Ol' MLG Commissioner to keep this crap up boys. If they were so torn about deadlines on the production perhaps they should do more bo1 :3 On June 17 2013 05:26 Plexa wrote:On June 17 2013 05:24 Vindicare605 wrote:On June 17 2013 05:22 Plexa wrote:On June 17 2013 05:20 Vindicare605 wrote:
Of course it's back guys, this is how they do double elimination.
Would you all rather have traditional double elimination where the person coming from the lower bracket has to win two series to win the finals?
It's double elimination, viewers want double elimination. This is part of what makes double elimination what it is. I don't understand the whining about it at all. Sometimes the 'fairest' option is not the best option for the viewers. Let's be honest here Plexa, the viewers are going to complain about something, no matter how much you try to appease them. Extended Series is actually better for the viewers than the double series format we had at Blizzcon and IPL and people really hated that shit. I didn't hear any complaints when people assumed that extended series wasn't going to be present at this MLG, knowing that it was going to be a double elim bracket. You have to ask yourself whether MLG is a tournament where you want the best player to win, or if you want the viewers to have the best possible viewing experience. To have the best player win I would argue in defense of extended series, but I would argue that extended series is not the best thing for viewers. The pinnacle of anti-climatic finishes. Indeed. People just like to jump on the bandwagon of "Extended series is bad because it knocked out my favorite player unfairly!!!". I think the vocal majority of people don't care what happens as long as the player their rooting for gets past. Extended series if a fair advantage, I don't know how anyone else can complain otherwise. Explain to me why the extended series is FAIR. Player A plays against player B and one of them goes down to the losers bracket. The loser has "paid his price" by losing one of his two lives. Why should he be penalized later on if they meet again, because both of them are losers? Its like a criminal who has served his sentence in prison and who commits another crime later on ... he only gets tried for the new crime instead of all his crimes, because he paid the penalty already. No. Extended series allow you to make a difference between 2-1 and 2-0 in a Bo3. As long as it doesn't affect the finals, I'm okay with it.
So a criminal in your world will be sentenced for all his crimes from the past ... no matter if he already served time in prison?
The way MLG works with the group stage and the bracket stage you have more than just "a match" to to consider, because the ones who are pushed down from group stage earlier will have to play more games ... a lot more. Adding an extended series is yet another penalty on top of this. It is in no way fair.
Imagine what would happen if the GSL had extended series. There are several group stages where people go on in the tournament after losing to another. Isnt the GSL (WCS) totally "unfair" since they have no extended series? Why are people not protesting that?
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On June 17 2013 16:39 D4V3Z02 wrote:
Americans just don't want to have a nice sc2 scene. I totally accept that.
It's funny they decided to take it away after all massive shits about it, then suddenly out of nowhere decided to add it again.
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EPT
