On May 13 2013 00:57 mango_destroyer wrote: This is cool for those who prefer the backspace method.
I still prefer the korean style of hotkeying individual hatches though (+ screen locations). Sure it might be a second slower when cycling injects, but you have control to create units or set rally at specific individual hatches quickly. I guess it comes down to what people find is more beneficial through the game, but seeing some of the top pro zergs who can do very well without backspace method, leads me to believe it isn`t worth giving up the other benefits of using another method.
no top level player uses base cam because it is an inefficient crutch.
base cam is only used by lower-level players because it's easier to have 1 key to move from base to base rather than 3 to 4, which is what screen hotkeys give you.
if lower-level players who use base cam are not serious about improving much, then it's fine for them to stay on the base cam method. but if they want to get better, they have to give up base cam at some point.
base cam is a bad habit-- much like you might pick up in a golf/baseball swing if you were taught the wrong way. as in taught the wrong mechanics (self-taught or not). base cam is a jerk in your swing, that gives the illusion of speed. while it looks and feels 'fast,' the chaos of base cam equates to spinning one's wheels in place.
Take a zerg on 4 base with 2 macro hatches--
with base cam, cycling through each hatch makes it so you are GUARANTEED to waste two strokes by cycling through hatcheries that can already be seen if each base was camera-key bound. And if you tab through your hatches and land in the wrong spot, it also takes you a second to realize you haven't made the 'correct' jump, and then you need to correct it.
the power of screen hotkeys for injects is that it is STANDARDIZED. Every time i hit f1, it brings me to my main; every time i hit f2 it brings me to my nat and so forth.
there are several methods to move the camera in sc2, and they are ranked by order of efficiency here: 1. screen hotkey (1 click/keystroke for 1 unique screen) 2. unit/individual building hotkey (2 keystrokes for 1 unique screen) 3. clicking minimap (the correct way to place the camera on a space that you don't have a hotkeyed unit/screen) 4. edge scrolling + base cam (edge scrolling is ranked low because it is slower than clicking the minimap for the same end; base cam is ranked low because it's x amount of clicks/keystrokes for multiple unique screens)
if you use the base cam to inject, that bad habit will bleed into the rest of your play. if you want to quickly jump to a base in order to react to a drop, you might cycle through your bases until you get to the right one instead of clicking on the minimap. so, you may end up using the most inefficient way to move the camera to a specific location as a habit, and explicitly restrict yourself from using method 2 (since if you are using base cam, I assume you don't have individual hatcheries hotkeyed by default)
i could go on and on about how the base cam is even worse than i've depicted above, but there is no point. if you want to improve, + Show Spoiler +
I'm surprised so many people prefer methods using backspace still. I find it only works well if you've got a queen at every single hatch. Otherwise extra hatches and missing queens all mess with you. You've got to account for that and know when to skip clicks in your rotation or else you've got your queens running around doing bad things, which just defeats the point for me.
On May 13 2013 00:57 mango_destroyer wrote: This is cool for those who prefer the backspace method.
I still prefer the korean style of hotkeying individual hatches though (+ screen locations). Sure it might be a second slower when cycling injects, but you have control to create units or set rally at specific individual hatches quickly. I guess it comes down to what people find is more beneficial through the game, but seeing some of the top pro zergs who can do very well without backspace method, leads me to believe it isn`t worth giving up the other benefits of using another method.
no top level player uses base cam because it is an inefficient crutch.
base cam is only used by lower-level players because it's easier to have 1 key to move from base to base rather than 3 to 4, which is what screen hotkeys give you.
if lower-level players who use base cam are not serious about improving much, then it's fine for them to stay on the base cam method. but if they want to get better, they have to give up base cam at some point.
base cam is a bad habit-- much like you might pick up in a golf/baseball swing if you were taught the wrong way. as in taught the wrong mechanics (self-taught or not). base cam is a jerk in your swing, that gives the illusion of speed. while it looks and feels 'fast,' the chaos of base cam equates to spinning one's wheels in place.
Take a zerg on 4 base with 2 macro hatches--
with base cam, cycling through each hatch makes it so you are GUARANTEED to waste two strokes by cycling through hatcheries that can already be seen if each base was camera-key bound. And if you tab through your hatches and land in the wrong spot, it also takes you a second to realize you haven't made the 'correct' jump, and then you need to correct it.
the power of screen hotkeys for injects is that it is STANDARDIZED. Every time i hit f1, it brings me to my main; every time i hit f2 it brings me to my nat and so forth.
there are several methods to move the camera in sc2, and they are ranked by order of efficiency here: 1. screen hotkey (1 click/keystroke for 1 unique screen) 2. unit/individual building hotkey (2 keystrokes for 1 unique screen) 3. clicking minimap (the correct way to place the camera on a space that you don't have a hotkeyed unit/screen) 4. edge scrolling + base cam (edge scrolling is ranked low because it is slower than clicking the minimap for the same end; base cam is ranked low because it's x amount of clicks/keystrokes for multiple unique screens)
if you use the base cam to inject, that bad habit will bleed into the rest of your play. if you want to quickly jump to a base in order to react to a drop, you might cycle through your bases until you get to the right one instead of clicking on the minimap. so, you may end up using the most inefficient way to move the camera to a specific location as a habit, and explicitly restrict yourself from using method 2 (since if you are using base cam, I assume you don't have individual hatcheries hotkeyed by default)
i could go on and on about how the base cam is even worse than i've depicted above, but there is no point. if you want to improve, + Show Spoiler +
STOP USING BASE CAM
Many korean pros use backspace. For example I am watching Hyun stream right now and he does it. So do many others.
On May 13 2013 00:57 mango_destroyer wrote: This is cool for those who prefer the backspace method.
I still prefer the korean style of hotkeying individual hatches though (+ screen locations). Sure it might be a second slower when cycling injects, but you have control to create units or set rally at specific individual hatches quickly. I guess it comes down to what people find is more beneficial through the game, but seeing some of the top pro zergs who can do very well without backspace method, leads me to believe it isn`t worth giving up the other benefits of using another method.
no top level player uses base cam because it is an inefficient crutch.
base cam is only used by lower-level players because it's easier to have 1 key to move from base to base rather than 3 to 4, which is what screen hotkeys give you.
if lower-level players who use base cam are not serious about improving much, then it's fine for them to stay on the base cam method. but if they want to get better, they have to give up base cam at some point.
base cam is a bad habit-- much like you might pick up in a golf/baseball swing if you were taught the wrong way. as in taught the wrong mechanics (self-taught or not). base cam is a jerk in your swing, that gives the illusion of speed. while it looks and feels 'fast,' the chaos of base cam equates to spinning one's wheels in place.
Take a zerg on 4 base with 2 macro hatches--
with base cam, cycling through each hatch makes it so you are GUARANTEED to waste two strokes by cycling through hatcheries that can already be seen if each base was camera-key bound. And if you tab through your hatches and land in the wrong spot, it also takes you a second to realize you haven't made the 'correct' jump, and then you need to correct it.
the power of screen hotkeys for injects is that it is STANDARDIZED. Every time i hit f1, it brings me to my main; every time i hit f2 it brings me to my nat and so forth.
there are several methods to move the camera in sc2, and they are ranked by order of efficiency here: 1. screen hotkey (1 click/keystroke for 1 unique screen) 2. unit/individual building hotkey (2 keystrokes for 1 unique screen) 3. clicking minimap (the correct way to place the camera on a space that you don't have a hotkeyed unit/screen) 4. edge scrolling + base cam (edge scrolling is ranked low because it is slower than clicking the minimap for the same end; base cam is ranked low because it's x amount of clicks/keystrokes for multiple unique screens)
if you use the base cam to inject, that bad habit will bleed into the rest of your play. if you want to quickly jump to a base in order to react to a drop, you might cycle through your bases until you get to the right one instead of clicking on the minimap. so, you may end up using the most inefficient way to move the camera to a specific location as a habit, and explicitly restrict yourself from using method 2 (since if you are using base cam, I assume you don't have individual hatcheries hotkeyed by default)
i could go on and on about how the base cam is even worse than i've depicted above, but there is no point. if you want to improve, + Show Spoiler +
STOP USING BASE CAM
Many korean pros use backspace. For example I am watching Hyun stream right now and he does it. So do many others.
do you know that for a fact? looks like screen hot keys to me
edit: 100% screen hotkey. and who is 'many others?'
Afaik most pros use screen hotkeys, which is far more efficient and versatile than base camera.
I actually remember reading somewhere than one of the first few things Kespa rookies are taught is how to use screen hotkeys as efficiently as possible.
Many korean pros use backspace. For example I am watching Hyun stream right now and he does it. So do many others.
I have yet to see ONE korean zerg pro use that method...
to lower players base cam looks like screen hotkey so when they use base cam hotkey to 'look' like they are as fast, they think that it's true. it's a vicious cycle of poor mechanics and queen inject threads.
Many korean pros use backspace. For example I am watching Hyun stream right now and he does it. So do many others.
I have yet to see ONE korean zerg pro use that method...
to lower players base cam looks like screen hotkey so when they use base cam hotkey to 'look' like they are as fast, they think that it's true. it's a vicious cycle of poor mechanics and queen inject threads. 1st world probs, sure, but BASE CAM SUCKSSSS
On May 12 2013 22:08 Naemesis wrote: I think it's safe to say we've all heard about the new "choose ability" hotkey and how rebinding it to your keyboard can help speed up certain game mechanics.
No, it is not safe to say. Personally I have no idea what you are talking about. If you want to make a topic only for advanced players, then maybe make that visible in the title or something. Otherwise please choose your words a little bit more carefully in the future to make sure that you don't come across as arrogant. Not meant as an offense or anything, since I am sure you didn't mean it that way. Just as a friendly advice for the future.
Many korean pros use backspace. For example I am watching Hyun stream right now and he does it. So do many others.
I have yet to see ONE korean zerg pro use that method...
to lower players base cam looks like screen hotkey so when they use base cam hotkey to 'look' like they are as fast, they think that it's true. it's a vicious cycle of poor mechanics and queen inject threads. 1st world probs, sure, but BASE CAM SUCKSSSS
On May 12 2013 22:08 Naemesis wrote: I think it's safe to say we've all heard about the new "choose ability" hotkey and how rebinding it to your keyboard can help speed up certain game mechanics.
No, it is not safe to say. Personally I have no idea what you are talking about. If you want to make a topic only for advanced players, then maybe make that visible in the title or something. Otherwise please choose your words a little bit more carefully in the future to make sure that you don't come across as arrogant. Not meant as an offense or anything, since I am sure you didn't mean it that way. Just as a friendly advice for the future.
Here's a short video about the "use ability" hotkey
I cant make the Control + W work for the Queen spawn larva injection. When i push add alternative, and press control and press W just the simple W shows up as added alternate. How do you assign Control + X to any unites? I can only make it work under global hotkeys. Not under unit specific hotkeys.
I don't use backspace, but just because you waste some key strokes from using it, doesn't mean it could not be used at the pro level. Pros waste key strokes like crazy, like attacking with their army while spamming other keys unnecessarily.
The MAIN disadvantage I think is dealing with harass, transferring workers etc. Although you could use backspace for injects and use the camera position keys when you need to.
Unfortunately this method still bears with it all the terrible disadvantages of the backspace method. If you want to have crisp clean and perfect injects regardless of situation, camera hotkey injects with unbound queens are still the way to go, IMO. Has the additional advantage of complete flexibility (cannot be understated).
Also, honestly, the speed between this and regular town hall inject shouldn't really be any different. Because you are alternating your clicks between your keyboard hand (space) and your mouse hand (ability activate/left click), the synchronized speed between your hands is going to be incredibly fast (one action between each, simultaneous actions). This method has it all on 3 keys, which is three actions appropriated to one hand. You still have to select all queens - still have to center your mouse.
Functionally, I cannot help but see them as the same.
I really really like this, because you can spam the 3 buttons in any order without side effects. One can easily inject 10 bases in less than 2 seconds by mashing the three buttons. Not using any Control modifier makes it even easier (perhaps use the F1-F4 keys). Of course, it still has the downside that it crumbles immediately when any of your bases does not have a queen next to it and you start sending your queens all over the place...
They should either take this away or give protoss back the ability to crono stuff in the selected items window.
Early in WOL you could select your nexus, press C, then hit the key for a control group, and click on anything in the selected items window at the bottom of the screen. It was nice to be able to crono gates, robo, upgrades like this. Protoss also has to move it's screen to produce every unit. In this way you could crono any building you had a control group for without moving your screen, they removed this. In light of zerg being able to spam larva injects on every base simply by using hotkeys, they should give this back to protoss.
EPT
