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On April 10 2013 23:28 darkness wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2013 23:23 Benjamin99 wrote:On April 10 2013 23:20 darkness wrote:On April 10 2013 23:19 Warpath wrote:On April 10 2013 23:18 darkness wrote:On April 10 2013 23:13 Klipsys wrote:
Sorry to burst the bubble, but it's not Blizzard/Korean's fault that white people are bad at games... Extremely dumb post, and kinda racist too. Actually, "white people" aren't bad at games, it's just that Koreans have established team houses with established practice schedules. This topic has been discussed to death. so white people aren't bad... Koreans are just better. What I said can be said in other words - Koreans are just more hard-working in StarCraft (or gaming). Hard work often pays off.  Yea, sure believe that if you wish. Btw where is you proof to backup those claims? A NA player could practise 24/7 and he still wont be able to touch the Koreans since you only as good as the infrastructure you play in I'm not sure why you mention only an NA player, while EU works too. So, an example of a hard-working guy is NaNiWa. I mean I've not watched him recently, but I refer to the MLG time when he took down MVP, DRG, Nestea... Besides, I said it 'often' pays not 'always'. Some people just don't get it even if they work hard.
And his solid finishes in GSL for the last two seasons. He would be even better if he were training in a Kespa house and refining his practice. Its all about the quality of practice, not the time spent.
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On April 10 2013 23:27 budar wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2013 23:15 dacimvrl wrote:On April 10 2013 23:11 seoul_kiM wrote:On April 10 2013 23:04 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 22:59 zimms wrote:
So the average casual SC2 viewer is a racist?
They don't care about Koreans because they don't know them and see no difference in skill. They also don't really know foreign players, but it's just less frightening to watch somebody with the same skin color.
Seriously? My girlfriend and I don't really care about most the the Korean players over members of EG that are in NA. There are exceptions, like Liquid Hero, MKP and Crank. But the rest, I could give two shits about. And that is why the pros and Blizzard could give two shits about you and your girlfriend. I don't understand why people don't want to see the best Starcraft 2 players in the world, regardless of where they are from, play? Exactly. Not to mention Life vs Flash at the last MLG broke viewer numbers. (even when these casuals don't even care to watch or know these 2 players) I think you're making a wrong conclusion here. I definitely think it's bogus that people don't want to watch "random Koreans" play and that MLG was a clear indication of that. However, I think if you have a tournament of 16 top Koreans with no foreigners in it, you will have much lower numbers than a mixed tournament where the Koreans eventually win out (like at MLG). People who might not judiciously follow the scene will start to care about a "random Korean" who plows through some of their favorite players or shows good games in general. Anyway, if the majority of the viewers were strictly about seeing the best games out there, you'd see GSL completely dominate in terms of viewership, but that simply is not the case. And if they were dominating, you can be sure they would have actually given out real viewer numbers at some point. There were other Korean only tournaments that were super stacked but never broke any viewership records either (Iron Squid comes to mind, but there were others I'm forgetting right now).
I'm sure GSL would get much viewer numbers if schedules were better, even compareable to big MLGs and DHs. I know I have to strain myself to get home after 12 hours of medicine, take a small break, then study, then stay up all night to watch the GSL finals live.
Casuals will NEVER do this, and that's OK.
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This make sme so sad for NA & EU, but NA especially.
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Vatican City State582 Posts
On April 10 2013 23:24 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2013 23:21 dacimvrl wrote:On April 10 2013 23:18 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 23:15 dacimvrl wrote:On April 10 2013 23:11 seoul_kiM wrote:On April 10 2013 23:04 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 22:59 zimms wrote:
So the average casual SC2 viewer is a racist?
They don't care about Koreans because they don't know them and see no difference in skill. They also don't really know foreign players, but it's just less frightening to watch somebody with the same skin color.
Seriously? My girlfriend and I don't really care about most the the Korean players over members of EG that are in NA. There are exceptions, like Liquid Hero, MKP and Crank. But the rest, I could give two shits about. And that is why the pros and Blizzard could give two shits about you and your girlfriend. I don't understand why people don't want to see the best Starcraft 2 players in the world, regardless of where they are from, play? Exactly. Not to mention Life vs Flash at the last MLG broke viewer numbers. (even when these casuals don't even care to watch or know these 2 players) But there is the thing, there is no reason we can't have both. There is no reason why there can't be a local NA event and Flash vs Life. That is why people are complaining. Every time there looks like there is going to be an NA event for NA players who live in NA, the Koreans come over in mass. MGL did very well when there were no Koerans at it too. There is no reason why we can't have both. See, that's where you are wrong though. We DO have both. There has been a bunch of NA tournaments, filled with like 90% NA players, but nobody watches them. You, for instance, aren't even aware these tournaments exist........ so I don't even know what you are talking about.. I am sorry, do any of the EG players or teams I care about play in those? Are they sponsored and produced as a reasonable level. A bunch of amateur events are neat, but not thats not what we are talking about. There is no reason why we can't have a NA GSL that is off line, just like the GSL.
Course. EG Masters, MSI masters, MLG exhibition matches, IPL showdowns last year, Day9's King of Beta tournaments..etc., and they are all very watchable. you ever watched any of them? Granted, there aren't many koreans, if at all, but there are europeans.
Besides, that's how it all works, you cannot simply expect peewee leagues to have the same production value, prize pool..etc. as MLB, it just doesn't work that way.
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On April 10 2013 23:29 Sjokola wrote:
I don't understand all the people who say they only want to see Koreans play because they are better. I wonder if these people don't support any local sports teams. Do they only watch Champions league? To me sports is all about supporting your local team/players and the stories and rivalries between the players.
In the Netherlands we have our football (soccer) league team FC Utrecht. It doesn't really matter to them how the season goes as long as they beat Ajax.
Both things are valid. I love my local Universidad de Chile team, but I sure as hell watch Champions League matches every single season.
I love United, but I certainly will watch RM's match on semifinals, even if United got eliminated by them.
I love my country Chile, but there's notthing in the world that will stop me from watching World Cup finals.
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Axiom owner Genna Bain posted on Reddit about the lack of information and overall confusion surrounding the situation, and how it made making a decision difficult. Show nested quote +Just wanting to clear something up about our player's names appearing on this list. I had previously said that our team would remain KR. That was back when it appeared that we would be given the option to change if we wanted after WCS KR Season 1. That option has been rumored to have been removed from the table. Please take into consideration that we had no direct communication from Blizzard about any of this information at any point in time. When asking around, I received similar reports from other team owners.
So without speaking to the team owners or the players, Blizzard implemented it's vision for this new WCS format and players have been given an unreasonably short period of time in order to declare their choice of region with little to no information being provided.... [the rest omitted]
God dammit Blizzard. -_-
On April 10 2013 23:32 dacimvrl wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2013 23:24 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 23:21 dacimvrl wrote:On April 10 2013 23:18 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 23:15 dacimvrl wrote:On April 10 2013 23:11 seoul_kiM wrote:On April 10 2013 23:04 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 22:59 zimms wrote:
So the average casual SC2 viewer is a racist?
They don't care about Koreans because they don't know them and see no difference in skill. They also don't really know foreign players, but it's just less frightening to watch somebody with the same skin color.
Seriously? My girlfriend and I don't really care about most the the Korean players over members of EG that are in NA. There are exceptions, like Liquid Hero, MKP and Crank. But the rest, I could give two shits about. And that is why the pros and Blizzard could give two shits about you and your girlfriend. I don't understand why people don't want to see the best Starcraft 2 players in the world, regardless of where they are from, play? Exactly. Not to mention Life vs Flash at the last MLG broke viewer numbers. (even when these casuals don't even care to watch or know these 2 players) But there is the thing, there is no reason we can't have both. There is no reason why there can't be a local NA event and Flash vs Life. That is why people are complaining. Every time there looks like there is going to be an NA event for NA players who live in NA, the Koreans come over in mass. MGL did very well when there were no Koerans at it too. There is no reason why we can't have both. See, that's where you are wrong though. We DO have both. There has been a bunch of NA tournaments, filled with like 90% NA players, but nobody watches them. You, for instance, aren't even aware these tournaments exist........ so I don't even know what you are talking about.. I am sorry, do any of the EG players or teams I care about play in those? Are they sponsored and produced as a reasonable level. A bunch of amateur events are neat, but not thats not what we are talking about. There is no reason why we can't have a NA GSL that is off line, just like the GSL. Course. EG Masters, MSI masters, MLG exhibition matches, IPL showdowns last year, Day9's King of Beta tournaments..etc., and they are all very watchable. you ever watched any of them?
Here it goes and to clarify I'm not singling one person out. This xenophobia in the community has always existed. It goes back to the vanilla days of regular Starcraft and it went both ways. Of course the Koreans weren't always on top back in the late 90s, but once they got their infrastructure up and guys like BoxeR came into the fray. They viewed losing to a foreigner as an embarrassment. Now let me address the foreigner xenophobia. Back then, my team was one of the first teams to use Koreans in our onslaught against division 1 teams. They didn't like it. A lot of people viewed these Korean players as mercenaries when in fact they were good friends. Every time we would win a match and win we did. People would always complain about them being hired guns. Even the other teams. It would be nice if people could get over it, but I find that highly unlikely and it will always be there.
There are plenty of amateur tournaments & events. Many of which carried out by the team's organizations and sponsors. Players do play in them and the viewership range can be anywhere from a few hundred to a few thousand to several thousand to 50-60k if it's a big one off. Then you have things like Iron Squid that can still bring in the masses come finals,
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On April 10 2013 23:24 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2013 23:21 dacimvrl wrote:On April 10 2013 23:18 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 23:15 dacimvrl wrote:On April 10 2013 23:11 seoul_kiM wrote:On April 10 2013 23:04 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 22:59 zimms wrote:
So the average casual SC2 viewer is a racist?
They don't care about Koreans because they don't know them and see no difference in skill. They also don't really know foreign players, but it's just less frightening to watch somebody with the same skin color.
Seriously? My girlfriend and I don't really care about most the the Korean players over members of EG that are in NA. There are exceptions, like Liquid Hero, MKP and Crank. But the rest, I could give two shits about. And that is why the pros and Blizzard could give two shits about you and your girlfriend. I don't understand why people don't want to see the best Starcraft 2 players in the world, regardless of where they are from, play? Exactly. Not to mention Life vs Flash at the last MLG broke viewer numbers. (even when these casuals don't even care to watch or know these 2 players) But there is the thing, there is no reason we can't have both. There is no reason why there can't be a local NA event and Flash vs Life. That is why people are complaining. Every time there looks like there is going to be an NA event for NA players who live in NA, the Koreans come over in mass. MGL did very well when there were no Koerans at it too. There is no reason why we can't have both. See, that's where you are wrong though. We DO have both. There has been a bunch of NA tournaments, filled with like 90% NA players, but nobody watches them. You, for instance, aren't even aware these tournaments exist........ so I don't even know what you are talking about.. I am sorry, do any of the EG players or teams I care about play in those? Are they sponsored and produced as a reasonable level. A bunch of amateur events are neat, but not thats not what we are talking about. There is no reason why we can't have a NA GSL that is off line, just like the GSL.
well last year's WCS NA is the event you are looking for i guess. We do have them and a bunch of new bloods got high placing in that tournament. Even favourites like Idra and Scarlett placed highly. Huk only placed 8th which was an upset.
That's the problem though. There are not enough interesting players even in NA itself to have a 32-man tournament the tournament was really forgettable and deemed 2nd rate I think many people don't really care watching your favourite EG player beating Insur or State
To have an NA GSL , you need more high profile players like Idra, Huk, Scarlett. How did these people get their fame? by beating Koreans or by doing well in Koreans-dominated tournaments. It seems like Koreans are necesarry for the growth of the scene especially in NA because the viewers have very little interest in local players.
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I'm just pissed cause the GSL, who have been around since the beginning are having their talent pool drained because the first WCS wasn't the biggest tournament of the year. And now they're stopping teams from investing in the NA (CLG cancelled their plans for a NA team becasue of this announcement). There are no positives to this.
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EU is for the coolest people apparently. I hope MKP chooses Europe too.
I would like me some MMA vs MKP finals in Paris or something ;D
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On April 10 2013 23:32 dacimvrl wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2013 23:24 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 23:21 dacimvrl wrote:On April 10 2013 23:18 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 23:15 dacimvrl wrote:On April 10 2013 23:11 seoul_kiM wrote:On April 10 2013 23:04 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 22:59 zimms wrote:
So the average casual SC2 viewer is a racist?
They don't care about Koreans because they don't know them and see no difference in skill. They also don't really know foreign players, but it's just less frightening to watch somebody with the same skin color.
Seriously? My girlfriend and I don't really care about most the the Korean players over members of EG that are in NA. There are exceptions, like Liquid Hero, MKP and Crank. But the rest, I could give two shits about. And that is why the pros and Blizzard could give two shits about you and your girlfriend. I don't understand why people don't want to see the best Starcraft 2 players in the world, regardless of where they are from, play? Exactly. Not to mention Life vs Flash at the last MLG broke viewer numbers. (even when these casuals don't even care to watch or know these 2 players) But there is the thing, there is no reason we can't have both. There is no reason why there can't be a local NA event and Flash vs Life. That is why people are complaining. Every time there looks like there is going to be an NA event for NA players who live in NA, the Koreans come over in mass. MGL did very well when there were no Koerans at it too. There is no reason why we can't have both. See, that's where you are wrong though. We DO have both. There has been a bunch of NA tournaments, filled with like 90% NA players, but nobody watches them. You, for instance, aren't even aware these tournaments exist........ so I don't even know what you are talking about.. I am sorry, do any of the EG players or teams I care about play in those? Are they sponsored and produced as a reasonable level. A bunch of amateur events are neat, but not thats not what we are talking about. There is no reason why we can't have a NA GSL that is off line, just like the GSL. Course. EG Masters, MSI masters, MLG exhibition matches, IPL showdowns last year, Day9's King of Beta tournaments..etc., and they are all very watchable. you ever watched any of them?
Watched a whole bunch of the EG masters, MLG exhibitions and IPL show matches. Even King of the Beta. But I want more. I want an NA GSL that is offline and does not provide excepts for Korean players who want to qualify online. And I want it sooner, rather than later.
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All of TL and EG. . . part of me is cuz their games will be on at better times, part of me is  cuz I think it means the end of the EGTL Proleague participation
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WCS Europe is going to be won by LiquidSnute. I bet this guy is going to dethrone Stephano and claim no.1 foreigner title by defeating mvp,mc and naniwa on his way to WCS Eu championship!.
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On April 10 2013 23:24 Elairec wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2013 23:23 Kylo55 wrote:On April 10 2013 23:20 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 23:18 dacimvrl wrote:On April 10 2013 23:16 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 23:11 seoul_kiM wrote:On April 10 2013 23:04 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 22:59 zimms wrote:
So the average casual SC2 viewer is a racist?
They don't care about Koreans because they don't know them and see no difference in skill. They also don't really know foreign players, but it's just less frightening to watch somebody with the same skin color.
Seriously? My girlfriend and I don't really care about most the the Korean players over members of EG that are in NA. There are exceptions, like Liquid Hero, MKP and Crank. But the rest, I could give two shits about. And that is why the pros and Blizzard could give two shits about you and your girlfriend. I don't understand why people don't want to see the best Starcraft 2 players in the world, regardless of where they are from, play? I like watching SC2 and good games, but a lot of the time, I don't care who wins. But my girlfriend and I watch the games for players we like, because it is fun. And considering my girlfriend is the audience that all Esports would love to have, people who don't play, but would watch a game being played. Larger numbers is better for them. I think blizzard would rather have paying customers(ppl who bought the game and watch the game often) than ppl who watch the game once in a while. Blizzard wants everyone to watch, along with Twitch and the teams. They all make money off the viewership. My girlfriend already owns a copy of SC2, she just doesn't play online. And there is no reason why we can't have an NA event for NA players. Yes they want everybody, but you cannot make everybody happy, so they are trying to make the biggest group of ppl happy. And the biggest group want koreans, numbers dont lie. What numbers?
Numbers of viewers of WCS NA 2012 for example.
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On April 10 2013 23:01 Benjamin99 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2013 23:01 Cattlecruiser wrote:NA looks like there are bit too many Korean B teamers in it. However, this isn't the death of the NA scene like many seem to think. The number of Koreans is a direct result of using GSL Code A & S for WCS Korea. If Korean players outside of Code A &S had the chance to qualify for the current season it would be a different story. Whatever the reason, this isn't what Blizzard imagined when they made the structure. On April 10 2013 22:20 Benjamin99 wrote:On April 10 2013 22:15 syllogism wrote:On April 10 2013 22:07 Champloo wrote:
This is so stupid, why didn't they just make it based on nationality like the last WCS?
At least Europe will have mainly European players in it, but NA is not even worth watching for me now, and I would definitely be pissed if I was a NA pro player. That's funny, because I was thinking that NA WCS wouldn't be worth watching with the region lock in place. In addition, NA pro players have no right to be pissed given that all Blizzard is doing is adding a few leagues with big prize pools; it is objectively an improvement from their pespective. Only for code S Koreans the structure may be worse than the current one. Well I'm sure the NA players is happy that you syllogism and you elitist attitude is going to watch. ps I´´ll take 1 casual fan over 10 of you any day of the week because casual fans grows the scene while you just spawn elitist crap and complain about how bad the casters are. Hahaha. Wow. "elitist" lol. Lmao. I'm not a Republican or conservative in any sense, but your so called "anti-elitist" thing is the most laughable thing I've ever read. Should I step on my shoes and give them to you? Maybe you should have my cars and my house you can live in that too. I'm sorry I can appreciate higher level of play, and don't think watching players marginally better than me is entertaining. Yea because that attitude really grew the western BW scene right? I'm wondering how many casual fans and women actually saw BW and no lolita dolls doesn't count
Starcraft is never going to be a "sport" like Football, Baseball, Soccer, or Hockey.
Blizzard/any tournament is never going to be the NFL, MLB, NBA, or NHL.
Sorry I don't speak geek, but wtf is a lolita doll?
NA scene is stronger than in BW. Mainly due to western teams buying eSF players instead of KeSPA hoarding all the talent.
Young talent will come out from NA/EU but it will never be the quality or the quantity of Koreans.
It is like other countries trying to catch up to the US in American Football or Basketball.
I guess elitist attitude and refining the game for bigger, stronger, and faster players to thrive in "ruined" those games too. LMFAO.
![[image loading]](http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lr66auQjDJ1qit63to1_500.jpg)
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On April 10 2013 23:33 dtz wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2013 23:24 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 23:21 dacimvrl wrote:On April 10 2013 23:18 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 23:15 dacimvrl wrote:On April 10 2013 23:11 seoul_kiM wrote:On April 10 2013 23:04 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 22:59 zimms wrote:
So the average casual SC2 viewer is a racist?
They don't care about Koreans because they don't know them and see no difference in skill. They also don't really know foreign players, but it's just less frightening to watch somebody with the same skin color.
Seriously? My girlfriend and I don't really care about most the the Korean players over members of EG that are in NA. There are exceptions, like Liquid Hero, MKP and Crank. But the rest, I could give two shits about. And that is why the pros and Blizzard could give two shits about you and your girlfriend. I don't understand why people don't want to see the best Starcraft 2 players in the world, regardless of where they are from, play? Exactly. Not to mention Life vs Flash at the last MLG broke viewer numbers. (even when these casuals don't even care to watch or know these 2 players) But there is the thing, there is no reason we can't have both. There is no reason why there can't be a local NA event and Flash vs Life. That is why people are complaining. Every time there looks like there is going to be an NA event for NA players who live in NA, the Koreans come over in mass. MGL did very well when there were no Koerans at it too. There is no reason why we can't have both. See, that's where you are wrong though. We DO have both. There has been a bunch of NA tournaments, filled with like 90% NA players, but nobody watches them. You, for instance, aren't even aware these tournaments exist........ so I don't even know what you are talking about.. I am sorry, do any of the EG players or teams I care about play in those? Are they sponsored and produced as a reasonable level. A bunch of amateur events are neat, but not thats not what we are talking about. There is no reason why we can't have a NA GSL that is off line, just like the GSL. well last year's WCS NA is the event you are looking for i guess. We do have them and a bunch of new bloods got high placing in that tournament. Even favourites like Idra and Scarlett placed highly. Huk only placed 8th which was an upset. That's the problem though. There are not enough interesting players even in NA itself to have a 32-man tournament the tournament was really forgettable and deemed 2nd rate I think many people don't really care watching your favourite EG player beating Insur or State To have an NA GSL , you need more high profile players like Idra, Huk, Scarlett. How did these people get their fame? by beating Koreans or by doing well in Koreans-dominated tournaments. It seems like Koreans are necesarry for the growth of the scene especially in NA because the viewers have very little interest in local players.
And I watched that and wanted to watch more of it, but it was on during MLG. That is the problem with WCS last year for NA, was that it was paired with MLG. I want an event all by itself for players who qualify off line, just like GSL. Korean players who want to play can get an visa and rent an apartment, just like an NA player who wants to play in GSL.
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On April 10 2013 23:26 Acrofales wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2013 23:09 CoR wrote:On April 10 2013 23:08 Acrofales wrote:On April 10 2013 22:47 Benjamin99 wrote:On April 10 2013 22:44 dacimvrl wrote:On April 10 2013 22:42 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 22:40 dacimvrl wrote:On April 10 2013 22:34 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 22:31 mordk wrote:On April 10 2013 22:13 Benjamin99 wrote:
[quote]
And that's not true at all. The reason NA WSC got less viewers was because MLG was at the same time. It was unfair for the NA WCS.
Look at WCS EU one of the highest watched tournaments in 2012 and properly one of the best and most exciting
[quote]
Not true Mordk . Again look at WSC EU One tournament hardly means anything. For every case I can remember except WCS EU finals, tournaments heavily benefited in terms of viewer counts with the presence of KR players. No one is saying a few Korean players wouldn't be fine. Polt and Violet would be totally ok. But the top 16 shouldn't be Korean for an NA league, where the rules for NA players trying for the Korean league require them to be in Korea. Viewers or not, it is BS for the any player in NA who has been putting in any serious effort. The koreans are comming here for easy money because they are allowed qualify and play online. If they were required to play off line, in a studio, we should very few, if any. I welcome this. I honestly would rather watch top 16 filled w/ decent koreans like on the list. If I really wanted to watch some NA/EU master/gm noobs play, I would just watch my own replays... Yeah, well half my friends and girlfriend disagree. They couldn't give two shits about Korean players except MKP and Liquid Hero. That is like 10 viewer that will not be interested in this WCS if it is all Koreans. awesome, a whopping total of 10 viewers!! like Acrofales said, who would rather watch minigun vs catz when you can watch herO vs aLive. Please take you trolling elsewhere may I suggest Reddit On April 10 2013 22:46 Tobblish wrote:On April 10 2013 22:42 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 22:40 dacimvrl wrote:On April 10 2013 22:34 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 22:31 mordk wrote:On April 10 2013 22:13 Benjamin99 wrote:
[quote]
And that's not true at all. The reason NA WSC got less viewers was because MLG was at the same time. It was unfair for the NA WCS.
Look at WCS EU one of the highest watched tournaments in 2012 and properly one of the best and most exciting
[quote]
Not true Mordk . Again look at WSC EU One tournament hardly means anything. For every case I can remember except WCS EU finals, tournaments heavily benefited in terms of viewer counts with the presence of KR players. No one is saying a few Korean players wouldn't be fine. Polt and Violet would be totally ok. But the top 16 shouldn't be Korean for an NA league, where the rules for NA players trying for the Korean league require them to be in Korea. Viewers or not, it is BS for the any player in NA who has been putting in any serious effort. The koreans are comming here for easy money because they are allowed qualify and play online. If they were required to play off line, in a studio, we should very few, if any. I welcome this. I honestly would rather watch top 16 filled w/ decent koreans like on the list. If I really wanted to watch some NA/EU master/gm noobs play, I would just watch my own replays... Yeah, well half my friends and girlfriend disagree. They couldn't give two shits about Korean players except MKP and Liquid Hero. That is like 10 viewer that will not be interested in this WCS if it is all Koreans. I wonder why those 10 people don't like to watch Koreans instead of Americans. Racists people I bet. Yes 90% fans of Starcraft are all racist you got us. On April 10 2013 22:47 plasemeious wrote:On April 10 2013 22:33 EleanorRIgby wrote:
wtf with this region mean nothing, it is not WCS NA. They should just region lock it or the NA scene will shrink rather then grow. People are already tired of watching korean vs korean everything and want some country/continent only tournaments. I never understood this. I always preferred to see the better players playing as opposed to worse foreigners playing Ask a Malaga fan why he don't support Barcelona in football when they clearly got the best players. Welcome to the world of sports Are there Malaga fans outside of Malaga? Except for the economic fugitives from Spain's impoverished south, I doubt it. Yet Barcelona is one of the most popular football clubs in the world. If Malaga plays against Levante, only Spaniards care (and ony a few of them). If Barcelona plays against Man U. half of the football-loving world tunes in (from Brazil to Japan). I wonder which market Blizzard is more interested in? Now of course you can say that Barcelona and Man U. only have that extraordinary selection of talent BECAUSE of teams like Malaga (or more likely Flamengos or Boca Juniors), but then we enter into another realm of discussion: how should eSports be promoted and encouraged to grow. Blizzard clearly thinks that putting the Barcelonas and Man U.'s in the spotlight will encourage more tournaments to give the Levantes of this world a chance, because sponsors are attracted, etc. etc. (trickle-down effect). People here seem to think that the grass-roots approach is better. I don't know, but I am sure that Blizzard has some clever market analysts working on it and they came up with this model, so lets try trusting them, hey? In the meantime, we get to watch great games instead of a failure where the only exciting question is whether Idra bombs out in the first or second round. AND STILL, as malaga fan you dont care anyone as much as malaga and so is it with pros, you have "your" players you love and like them more, if spanish league says "no more league just showmatches between topteams and then more championleague games etc" its good for alot guys alot love top games but your pissed as fuck ... ps: as bvb fan i love malaga quotes xD And that's where the opinions differ. You seem to think it is Blizzard's job to create national leagues. Blizzard sees it as their job to create the Champions League. They tried the national league approach last year and it clearly didn't work as well as they had hoped. In the Spanish league there are enough fans of the local teams to sustain them at a professional level. Unfortunately for eSports, there are not (yet) enough fans of the Miniguns, Vibes and Insurs of this world to sustain them at a professional level. So now Blizzard has decided to promote eSports in a different way. Whether it will work, we don't know yet. But I am quite confident that with players like Hero, aLive and Nestea in the American WCS, it will have more vieweres than the WCS NA event last year (which was a complete failure).
What more could they want ? WCS EU was like the most watched tournament last year. How the hell can you do better then that ?
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On April 10 2013 23:35 Kylo55 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2013 23:24 Elairec wrote:On April 10 2013 23:23 Kylo55 wrote:On April 10 2013 23:20 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 23:18 dacimvrl wrote:On April 10 2013 23:16 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 23:11 seoul_kiM wrote:On April 10 2013 23:04 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 22:59 zimms wrote:
So the average casual SC2 viewer is a racist?
They don't care about Koreans because they don't know them and see no difference in skill. They also don't really know foreign players, but it's just less frightening to watch somebody with the same skin color.
Seriously? My girlfriend and I don't really care about most the the Korean players over members of EG that are in NA. There are exceptions, like Liquid Hero, MKP and Crank. But the rest, I could give two shits about. And that is why the pros and Blizzard could give two shits about you and your girlfriend. I don't understand why people don't want to see the best Starcraft 2 players in the world, regardless of where they are from, play? I like watching SC2 and good games, but a lot of the time, I don't care who wins. But my girlfriend and I watch the games for players we like, because it is fun. And considering my girlfriend is the audience that all Esports would love to have, people who don't play, but would watch a game being played. Larger numbers is better for them. I think blizzard would rather have paying customers(ppl who bought the game and watch the game often) than ppl who watch the game once in a while. Blizzard wants everyone to watch, along with Twitch and the teams. They all make money off the viewership. My girlfriend already owns a copy of SC2, she just doesn't play online. And there is no reason why we can't have an NA event for NA players. Yes they want everybody, but you cannot make everybody happy, so they are trying to make the biggest group of ppl happy. And the biggest group want koreans, numbers dont lie. What numbers? Numbers of viewers of WCS NA 2012 for example.
Cherry picking tournaments doesn't work to prove a point
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On April 10 2013 23:35 Kylo55 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2013 23:24 Elairec wrote:On April 10 2013 23:23 Kylo55 wrote:On April 10 2013 23:20 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 23:18 dacimvrl wrote:On April 10 2013 23:16 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 23:11 seoul_kiM wrote:On April 10 2013 23:04 Plansix wrote:On April 10 2013 22:59 zimms wrote:
So the average casual SC2 viewer is a racist?
They don't care about Koreans because they don't know them and see no difference in skill. They also don't really know foreign players, but it's just less frightening to watch somebody with the same skin color.
Seriously? My girlfriend and I don't really care about most the the Korean players over members of EG that are in NA. There are exceptions, like Liquid Hero, MKP and Crank. But the rest, I could give two shits about. And that is why the pros and Blizzard could give two shits about you and your girlfriend. I don't understand why people don't want to see the best Starcraft 2 players in the world, regardless of where they are from, play? I like watching SC2 and good games, but a lot of the time, I don't care who wins. But my girlfriend and I watch the games for players we like, because it is fun. And considering my girlfriend is the audience that all Esports would love to have, people who don't play, but would watch a game being played. Larger numbers is better for them. I think blizzard would rather have paying customers(ppl who bought the game and watch the game often) than ppl who watch the game once in a while. Blizzard wants everyone to watch, along with Twitch and the teams. They all make money off the viewership. My girlfriend already owns a copy of SC2, she just doesn't play online. And there is no reason why we can't have an NA event for NA players. Yes they want everybody, but you cannot make everybody happy, so they are trying to make the biggest group of ppl happy. And the biggest group want koreans, numbers dont lie. What numbers? Numbers of viewers of WCS NA 2012 for example.
The event that ran alongside an MLG and got no air time. Lets talk about WCS EU 2012, as it was a full blown event.
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On April 10 2013 23:35 Cattlecruiser wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2013 23:01 Benjamin99 wrote:On April 10 2013 23:01 Cattlecruiser wrote:NA looks like there are bit too many Korean B teamers in it. However, this isn't the death of the NA scene like many seem to think. The number of Koreans is a direct result of using GSL Code A & S for WCS Korea. If Korean players outside of Code A &S had the chance to qualify for the current season it would be a different story. Whatever the reason, this isn't what Blizzard imagined when they made the structure. On April 10 2013 22:20 Benjamin99 wrote:On April 10 2013 22:15 syllogism wrote:On April 10 2013 22:07 Champloo wrote:
This is so stupid, why didn't they just make it based on nationality like the last WCS?
At least Europe will have mainly European players in it, but NA is not even worth watching for me now, and I would definitely be pissed if I was a NA pro player. That's funny, because I was thinking that NA WCS wouldn't be worth watching with the region lock in place. In addition, NA pro players have no right to be pissed given that all Blizzard is doing is adding a few leagues with big prize pools; it is objectively an improvement from their pespective. Only for code S Koreans the structure may be worse than the current one. Well I'm sure the NA players is happy that you syllogism and you elitist attitude is going to watch. ps I´´ll take 1 casual fan over 10 of you any day of the week because casual fans grows the scene while you just spawn elitist crap and complain about how bad the casters are. Hahaha. Wow. "elitist" lol. Lmao. I'm not a Republican or conservative in any sense, but your so called "anti-elitist" thing is the most laughable thing I've ever read. Should I step on my shoes and give them to you? Maybe you should have my cars and my house you can live in that too. I'm sorry I can appreciate higher level of play, and don't think watching players marginally better than me is entertaining. Yea because that attitude really grew the western BW scene right? I'm wondering how many casual fans and women actually saw BW and no lolita dolls doesn't count [...] Sorry I don't speak geek, but wtf is a lolita doll?
You're not a geek, yet you're on TL?
Interesting.
+ Show Spoiler +Nah, you're a nerd like everyone else dude :D
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EPT
