|
(To any Mods: Please read the whole article)
Hey guys,
I'm a mid masters random player who used to play Terran but felt like other races were "stronger" in the sense that they we're easier. In no way am I stating this as a fact, it is simply just my perspective after playing random for almost 3 months now. I urge that you please do not take this as an aggressive proposition, I simply want your opinions on the future of the Terran player base. Don't get me wrong; Zerg and Protoss are VERY difficult in their own ways and many times I have struggled, losing to simple builds such as 2factory mass hellions as zerg and multi pronged drops as Protoss. Of course these things I overcame over time.
According to SC2ranks, over the last year the Terran player base has been diminishing. I'm sure you are all well aware of this and have heard threads about it numerous times.
http://www.sc2ranks.com/stats/league/all/1/all
The general thesis is that Terran is simply "too hard", requiring better unit control, solid mechanics and higher apm than the other two races. To be honest I don't completely agree with this.
What I believe is that Protoss and Zerg both have a favorable aspect which I believe allows for them to be more 'Safe' or 'Prepared' or 'Advantageous'. Lets look at Protoss first.
Without a doubt, I would say that the Protoss army has the best ratio of Power:Mobility in the game. We all know what it is, the Protoss death ball. The Protoss army is almost always ready for battle (unless ghosts or fungal is involved). The army cannot be poked, it can only be engaged directly with good position if one was to come out the victor. The Protoss death ball has the advantage of making many positions on the map viable for an engagement. It is mostly the Terran or Zerg's obligation to find the best positioning available for an engagement which can be extremely difficult and very unrewarding if small mistakes are made. I would say that this is mainly because of the colossus and most certainly smart casting. If a Protoss finds himself in a bad position, with ease, in most situations, the Protoss can retreat to safety (FF can also play a part in this).
Due to the softness of vikings (in comparison to the corrupter), the Terran player can also easily lose his armies backbone if vikings are positioned poorly. Again with colossus having the ability to stand within the army amongst the anti air units, It can also become very difficult to find this positioning.
Hence putting lesser skilled Terrans diamond -> masters and even Grandmasters at a larger disadvantage in core battles. Zergs high mobility allows for safety vs Protoss.
Now Zerg I believe have an unbelievable advantage against Terran which I discovered over the last month or so. Building 5 queens at the start of a game vs Terran is one of the greatest most beneficial strategies you can choose. The focus required to spread creep against the focus required to kill the creep is heavily in favor of the Zerg I believe. With 5 queens you can spread tremendous amounts of creep which gives Zerg the most important thing that they need and a little bonus: Vision and MORE SPEED. As if speed-lings aren't fast enough!  .
Now lets discuss killing creep as a Terran. To me it is as important to defend creep tumors as it is to defend a drop. When a Terran sends a squad of tumor killers, you make it a high priority to destroy that squadron. And when you have 8 tumors next to each other, it's really not hard to defend the tumors at all. To be straight forward with you, Terran's creep tumor denial abilities are extremely poor and easily countered. I believe the most effective way for a Terran to kill creep tumors is banshee raven, but of course like I said, easily counter able. Mutalisks and Infestors. Both units death with this substantially well and also any other creep destroying squadron. I have even found beneficial to make 4-5 Spine crawlers and move them with my creep tumors, it denies squadrons completely.
Finally when Terran is to engage the Zerg army, everyone knows that creep is the deadliest place to be. Units are faster and Zerg is given vision. Terrans only means of AoE are tanks. Tanks are a siege unit. Siege tanks take 2 seconds to assume siege mode. Any small mistakes, and like VS Protoss, the backbone of the Terran army disappears and like most situations for a Terran, you endure extremely cost inefficient battles and are put in a devastating position to come back from.
You may say, "Terran should have leap frogged' his tanks" (For those who don't know this term, it is when you leave some tanks siege'd and move un-sieged tanks forward, proceeding forward). Creep ultimately will slow down any timing push made by the Terran. If The Terran is to Leap frog his tanks forward, more time is given for the Zerg to prepare units, or even get in a great position to engage. Timing pushes ultimately work best when there is not creep. However with creep becoming harder and harder to deny, the Terran's strongest means of attack, the 'Timing push' is now at a disadvantage.
I have seen countless footage of Korean Terrans losing to zerg because they push their luck by walking a few extra cm on creep. The Terran may even scout arrowhead (Lead with a marine far beyond the pack) and siege when he see's the Zerg army, but you must truly understand the speed of Zerg units on creep. Tanks might get 2 shots off on lings depending on how far out you siege your tanks.
EDIT: I might as well add that Protoss players do not need to deal with creep the same way Terran players do due to the colossus' mobility.
Now I'm not saying Terran is underpowered on a Korean professional level, however on a lower level I would argue they are. Every race has their strengths and their weaknesses of course (perhaps the 5queen is a little too strong), however I am saying, that at a until a certain level of skill, Playing Terran is ultimately and uphill battle especially with the current map designs such as Entombed valley which is heavily Protoss favoured due to the ability to take a 3rd which is very easy to defend. This would explain why there are such low numbers of foreign pro Terrans, and would also explain the diminishing number of Terrans on ladder.
So my conclusion is to be that Terran will most likely remain the lowest played race due to mechanical issues. Unless perhaps there is to be innovative map design that allows for Terran to have easier access to advantageous positioning vs Protoss. I think the Zerg aspect is Fixable so we could see a change there. If tanks were made more viable vs Protoss then it would be a game changer. Of course I forgot to mention that when I say TvP i'm talking Bio which is the standard play.
This would also explain why Terrans all in so much on ladder I imagine XD
So there you have it. These are the conclusions I've drawn from playing all three races and I think I make some valid points. Please discuss and do not argue aggressively. This thread is in no way to cause trouble and I hope you can all sympathize for Terrans but keep crushing, would you not rather lose to a Terran with skill rather than a Terran who only knows all in?
Edit: I'm sure you have all seen the graphs of the Korean players losses to Foreigners. Terran has the highest amount of deaths to foreign Protoss and Zerg. Foreign Terrans however very rarely defeat a Korean Terran. I will try find a link
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=385876 ~ there you go, please scroll down.
|
Yes, Terran will be the least played race at lower levels due to mechanical difficulty. Same exact thing happened in BW. However, they were the most dominant at the professional level. It's just the way the world works when you have asymmetrical race design. Issues only arise when the skill demand/reward ratio is too skewed to reward easy play (like Infestor play) or if a race just doesn't have the means to counter a strategy with a reasonably expected level of mechanical skill.
|
I like how you wrote an essay complaining about how underpowered terran is and can still say, "I'm not saying terran is underpowered."
|
On January 19 2013 01:13 Powerfoe wrote:
I like how you wrote an essay complaining about how underpowered terran is and can still say, "I'm not saying terran is underpowered."
Well I suppose you're right. I'm saying that at a Korean Pro level, most races are relatively balanced, however at lower levels I would say there is an imbalance. Thanks for pointing that out.
|
I don't think everyone picks their race on balance. I picked Terran at the start, then switched to Zerg when they were considered the harder race and Terran considered OP. I only did it because I liked Zerg play style. I didn't really care that I dropped a league or two at the time.
|
On January 19 2013 01:13 Powerfoe wrote:
I like how you wrote an essay complaining about how underpowered terran is and can still say, "I'm not saying terran is underpowered."
His essay doesn't say they are underpowered. Saying something is inherently harder to use for lower level people and saying something is underpowered is quite different.
You can have the most powerful calculator in the world at your fingertips, but if it is impossibly complicated, most people would rather use a simpler calculator. This doesn't mean that the calculator is underpowered, just that the initial learning curve is such that it harder for new users to learn it. Top KR terrans can make terran very strong, however, the point is that for the average-joe on ladder, many terran players are getting easily discouraged and leaving.
|
On January 19 2013 01:17 haffy wrote:
I don't think everyone picks their race on balance. I picked Terran at the start, then switched to Zerg when they were considered the harder race and Terran considered OP. I only did it because I liked Zerg play style. I didn't really care that I dropped a league or two at the time.
I too wanted to switch to Zerg a while after I began playing however I was determined that I could become masters because I thought I was genuinely good at computer games and wanted to make it to masters whether Terran was OP at the time or UP.
|
I have said this for long time, and I say this again. Terran is the hardest race by far, both mechanically and strategically.
Terran has been nerfed to the ground so many times that I have lost track, and blizzards unability to make mech work in TvP despite many attemps and opportunities tells me that nothing is going to change. I would say that terran as it is now, is in wrong game because other two races are just so much more mobile and flexible that terran has hard time to compete with them in any aspect of the game.
|
How is Terran more mechanical difficult at lower Leagues when Terran is the only race of them all that has similar mechanics to other RTS games. If you have ever played another RTS game, Terran will be the easiest to pick up and learn since they have the classic RTS mechanics with pumping out units from Barracks. Protoss and Zerg works completely different.
Just dont agree that Terran is difficult to learn.
|
On January 19 2013 01:18 Traceback wrote:Show nested quote +On January 19 2013 01:13 Powerfoe wrote:
I like how you wrote an essay complaining about how underpowered terran is and can still say, "I'm not saying terran is underpowered." His essay doesn't say they are underpowered. Saying something is inherently harder to use for lower level people and saying something is underpowered is quite different. You can have the most powerful calculator in the world at your fingertips, but if it is impossibly complicated, most people would rather use a simpler calculator. This doesn't mean that the calculator is underpowered, just that the initial learning curve is such that it harder for new users to learn it. Top KR terrans can make terran very strong, however, the point is that for the average-joe on ladder, many terran players are getting easily discouraged and leaving.
Yeah its pretty late here and I just spat those words out... Definitely could have explained some things better.
|
No imbalance at all. Heart of the SWARM has too sell. It's just business. No hard feelings, ok?
|
On January 19 2013 01:20 Avean wrote:
How is Terran more mechanical difficult at lower Leagues when Terran is the only race of them all that has similar mechanics to other RTS games. If you have ever played another RTS game, Terran will be the easiest to pick up and learn since they have the classic RTS mechanics with pumping out units from Barracks. Protoss and Zerg works completely different.
Just dont agree that Terran is difficult to learn. \
Well I learned Protoss and Zerg, and although at first I was terrible, the mechanics of the races can easily be learned even by just reading a few articles.,, "Don't miss your spit"... Protoss isn't really that far off from Terran macro wise
|
I disagree and I feel like you bring valid points without bringing their complement. For example when you talked about protoss you talked about its superior strengh but actually protoss army is so weak without colossus So for the protoss to survive the first 9 mins he needs to use forcefields to their greatest extend(this also require choosing army position to be easier to forcefield in panic mode) Now to zerg first most of your points in zvt is about creep which is actually not THAT hard to deal with and remember spreading the creep after the first 10 mins of the game requires some attention from the zerg so obviously terran needs some work to clear it. Clearing creep is an issue and i agree with that but that doesnt mean easier or harder it is an advantage for zergs who spend some of their apm on creep like for example terrans advantage in having planetary fortress which allows them to force the zerg army to be all their to destroy it.
Note: There will always be a least represented race even if the game is perfectly balanced for me the main reason terran is under represented is that in general people try to play with different races in any game other than humans(not a fact just an observation)
|
I just lost all my games today against low masters and high diamonds, and i'm pretty depressed. I really feel like i play as well/better as my opponents but still get CRUSHED. Like, CRUSHED, in most of the games. I don't know, I'd love blizzard to do something about other races macro compared to terran's. We don't have something to increase our units production, only our income. Our production is the longest to come in to play because of addons. And our units aren't great enough to justify such handicaps imo.
I really feel like switching races or just quitting, because terran is by far the funniest race to play for me, but losing all the time hopelessly isn't fun.
|
Well terran is much harder to play ata lower level. I am a life long terran player. When i first started Bronze 1v1 and D in BW, I was stuck in bronze FOREVER! Honestly now that i am mechanically sound i went right to masters. Terran is tough to play, it requires micro and better decision making than other races. Our units aren't as strong as protoss and not as fast as zerg. So we are forced to turtle. That isn't afun play style but it is what it is. So i can completely see why it is not played by as many people.
|
On January 19 2013 01:20 Avean wrote:
How is Terran more mechanical difficult at lower Leagues when Terran is the only race of them all that has similar mechanics to other RTS games. If you have ever played another RTS game, Terran will be the easiest to pick up and learn since they have the classic RTS mechanics with pumping out units from Barracks. Protoss and Zerg works completely different.
Just dont agree that Terran is difficult to learn.
Maybe in the beginning, but learning the mechanics for Zerg and Protoss isn't that huge of a problem in my opinion. As a masters random player I think once you got the basic mechanics of Zerg and Protoss, the overall terran gameplay is much more unforgiving and difficult.
However the worst thing they could do is making terran easier, they should make aspects of the other races harder instead, for example infestor usage. Add more high risk high reward micro for the Zerg or Protoss army instead of (more or less) a-move would be really cool. I am not saying this is the case for all army compositions, but a lot of them don't require as much micro as a Terran going marine tank, splitting the marines, focus firing and kiting at the same time.
|
This belongs in "The Designated Balance Discussion"- thread. Just because you're venting in large paragraphs, that doesn't make it any less whining. Players of every race thinks their race is the hardest and/or weakest. You're a terran player, therefor you'd like to think that your race has it worst, because it's a part of the human defense mechanism to blame anything but yourself.
|
On January 19 2013 01:26 omars252 wrote:
I disagree and I feel like you bring valid points without bringing their complement. For example when you talked about protoss you talked about its superior strengh but actually protoss army is so weak without colossus So for the protoss to survive the first 9 mins he needs to use forcefields to their greatest extend(this also require choosing army position to be easier to forcefield in panic mode) Now to zerg first most of your points in zvt is about creep which is actually not THAT hard to deal with and remember spreading the creep after the first 10 mins of the game requires some attention from the zerg so obviously terran needs some work to clear it. Clearing creep is an issue and i agree with that but that doesnt mean easier or harder it is an advantage for zergs who spend some of their apm on creep like for example terrans advantage in having planetary fortress which allows them to force the zerg army to be all their to destroy it.
Note: There will always be a least represented race even if the game is perfectly balanced for me the main reason terran is under represented is that in general people try to play with different races in any game other than humans(not a fact just an observation)
Hey man you're totally right> Protoss is extremely weak without colossus I will agree with you there, however I am strictly talking small aspects of the game where Terran can lose very core battles with the inclusion of the colossus. Early game is a whole different story, hence the favorable Terran all ins.
|
On January 19 2013 01:33 ErAsc2 wrote:
This belongs in "The Designated Balance Discussion"- thread. Just because you're venting in large paragraphs, that doesn't make it any less whining. Players of every race thinks their race is the hardest and/or weakest. You're a terran player, therefor you'd like to think that your race has it worst, because it's a part of the human defense mechanism to blame anything but yourself.
Hey man i'm trying my best to speak from a rational point of view. I gave up on Terran and switched to random. It is far more enjoyable and I support random now. In no way am I attempting to be biased.
|
On January 19 2013 01:28 Nimix wrote:
I just lost all my games today against low masters and high diamonds, and i'm pretty depressed. I really feel like i play as well/better as my opponents but still get CRUSHED. Like, CRUSHED, in most of the games. I don't know, I'd love blizzard to do something about other races macro compared to terran's. We don't have something to increase our units production, only our income. Our production is the longest to come in to play because of addons. And our units aren't great enough to justify such handicaps imo.
I really feel like switching races or just quitting, because terran is by far the funniest race to play for me, but losing all the time hopelessly isn't fun.
I suppose this is it. After playing several games with terran i suppose most people are fed up from dying to storms/colossi/fungal. For low level players it is pretty easy to get caught and in sc2 you can be punished pretty brutally by the amount of AoE in this game.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
