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On January 11 2013 23:11 Fatekeeper wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2013 23:01 InfCereal wrote:On January 11 2013 22:50 EssenceSC wrote:
Nerf infestor, but leave the immortal all in the way it is, a build that's had a stupidly high win ratio for the best part of a year. Dat logic. Immortal sentry is only as good as it is due to forcefields. Blizzard can't remove forcefields without completely redesigning protoss. With swarm so close to release, I think they're doing well by ignoring it and focusing on appeasing the vocal playerbase by nerfing the infestor. same goes for zerg tho. If Blizzard will nerf the infestors to much, they would need to redesign the entire zerg race since all units are so cost ineffective without the infestor that Z would lose every late game fight. I was never a fan of fungal since it prevents micro... same with forcefield.
I don't think that's true. Infestors let zerg overpower other races because of how cost efficient they are, combined with zerg's production mechanics.
I believe zerg's production mechanics would allow zergs to keep up just fine, although they would always be cost inefficient. The play style would be incredibly different than the standard now, though.
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yeah infestors were really good and deserved a nerf, but you gotta buff something else, almost everything else zerg has sucks...
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remove fungal completely. add baneling catapult.
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On January 12 2013 01:48 InfCereal wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2013 23:11 Fatekeeper wrote:On January 11 2013 23:01 InfCereal wrote:On January 11 2013 22:50 EssenceSC wrote:
Nerf infestor, but leave the immortal all in the way it is, a build that's had a stupidly high win ratio for the best part of a year. Dat logic. Immortal sentry is only as good as it is due to forcefields. Blizzard can't remove forcefields without completely redesigning protoss. With swarm so close to release, I think they're doing well by ignoring it and focusing on appeasing the vocal playerbase by nerfing the infestor. same goes for zerg tho. If Blizzard will nerf the infestors to much, they would need to redesign the entire zerg race since all units are so cost ineffective without the infestor that Z would lose every late game fight. I was never a fan of fungal since it prevents micro... same with forcefield. I don't think that's true. Infestors let zerg overpower other races because of how cost efficient they are, combined with zerg's production mechanics. I believe zerg's production mechanics would allow zergs to keep up just fine, although they would always be cost inefficient. The play style would be incredibly different than the standard now, though.
Cost inefficiency in lategame, split map positions is something that makes you lose.
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On January 12 2013 01:50 virpi wrote:
remove fungal completely. add baneling catapult.
Ahah this would be awesome, I thought swarmhost were baneling catapult when they first show the shadow of the unit.
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On January 11 2013 07:49 Seeker wrote:
Omfg... they're going to neft infestors? I can only imagine what kind atrocity awaits us. Blizzard just created a word that's not even in the English dictionary just for infestors...
Blizzard seems to have embiggened the infestor in the most cromulent fashion
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Lets put Hydra to Tier 1.5 move roach to Tiers 2.
Remove Queens
Hydra and roach pop decrease to 1.
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On January 12 2013 02:12 Orzabal wrote:
Lets put Hydra to Tier 1.5 move roach to Tiers 2.
Remove Queens
Hydra and roach pop decrease to 1.
I rather have them introduce a high ground advantage and scaled economy before they do that.
Most units can be "patched" by introducing new maps. We've only had 3 transitions of new maps in SC2. Blizzard's atrocity maps, GSL maps that are all reskinned day breaks, and KESPA maps that "break" the meta game. I honestly dislike how Blizzard feels the need to dictate the meta game by nerfing units. Let the players come up with new strategies, or better yet introduce maps that discourage the need to turtle on 2/3 bases but the only way you will accomplish this is through a scaled economy that rewards players for expanding.
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On January 11 2013 07:56 Aveng3r wrote:
christmas came early
After hearing this news, so did I 
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On January 12 2013 02:12 Orzabal wrote:
Lets put Hydra to Tier 1.5 move roach to Tiers 2.
Remove Queens
Hydra and roach pop decrease to 1.
Because 1 supply roaches were awesome in beta and totally balanced. Wait....no, not at all. Lets just bring the infestor down a few notches until HotS and not try to reinvent the wheel.
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On January 11 2013 08:01 Sandermatt wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2013 07:50 Laryleprakon wrote:
Try having fungal slow and not root, at least try it :/ This gets suggested over and over again, but there is a reason it is not implemented, and the reason are mutas in ZvZ.
So make it root air units and slow ground units. Surely such a feat of programming is in the realm of possibility.
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I think fixing Infested Terrans and Neural Parasite takes priority over fungal. Zergs don't make 20 infestors to take cast 40 fungals, they make them to spam ITs. 20 Infestors can produce 160 free marines which is just stupid. Either increase the energy cost for IT to 30, or make ITs not benefit from upgrades, or reduce the range they can be thrown.
I also want Neural Parasite nerfed for the sole reason of NP on the Mothership. Make psionic units immunte to NP.
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On January 12 2013 03:22 eugalp wrote:
I think fixing Infested Terrans and Neural Parasite takes priority over fungal. Zergs don't make 20 infestors to take cast 40 fungals, they make them to spam ITs. 20 Infestors can produce 160 free marines which is just stupid. Either increase the energy required to throw an IT to 30, or make ITs not benefit from upgrades, or reduce the range they can be thrown.
this is something i've brought up a few times (even in this thread) and have never seen mentioned. by principle, it can be presumed nothing in sc2 is allowed to cost 30 anything, be it energy, gas or minerals. only allowed resource costs come in increments of 25. this is consistent enough both in both brood war and sc2 as to say it's an imposed limitation in balance design. only exception as far as i know is that point defense drones eat ten energy per shot intercepted, but that is not in the realm of player control as a usable skill, being something that's passively consumed.
it sounds stupid when you think about it. it is stupid. in essence, it is possible to consider modifying infested terrans' energy cost by increments of, uhh, 100% at a time.
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On January 12 2013 00:54 LingBlingBling wrote:
Don't see why they should even bother with WOL balance. Hots release is less then 3 months away.
Seems silly.
Many tournaments are going on before HotS so
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Yeah we have heard before that they are going to nerf Infestors, but I highly doubt the nerfing will be enough... also its so close to HotS...
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On January 12 2013 02:27 Acid~ wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2013 08:01 Sandermatt wrote:On January 11 2013 07:50 Laryleprakon wrote:
Try having fungal slow and not root, at least try it :/ This gets suggested over and over again, but there is a reason it is not implemented, and the reason are mutas in ZvZ. So make it root air units and slow ground units. Surely such a feat of programming is in the realm of possibility.
I've seen many other people already say this, but fungal rooting is perfectly fine. What isn't fine, is fungal rooting on a unit that is massable. Blizzard is fixing the "massable" part of infesotrs. You remove the upgrades on IT, then in the late game if I already have 6-8 infestors for fungal, I'm not going to build another 20 for 100 worthless IT. Right now, I do want 100 IT because they are an amazingly strong unit. With the proposed nerf (which is an excellent idea from blizzard, I am convinced it works after playing around in the beta), infestors will no longer be massed. Now if you whiff a fungal, it's a huge deal.
However, all this fixes is massing infestors in the lategame. I think all that will happen is people will go back to infestor/BL, which will still be almost an auto-win, but at least now there is a small chance for miss control again. This patch will have no noticable effect on balance I think, but watching infestor/BL is slightly less painful than watching mass infestor (although, it still is very painful).
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Make infestor slow units, so next fungal slow units even more. For example 1 fungal slow units by 30% and next fungal slow by 30% the slowed units. The slowing percentage could be higher ofcaurse
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On January 12 2013 01:50 virpi wrote:
remove fungal completely. add baneling catapult.
that actually sounds awesome lol, as long as it did friendly fire i think it would be great and really fun, lots of possibilities..nah nm its blizzard
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- metagame is fine
- random buffs no one asked for
- metagame is ruined
- they start nerfing left and right, chaos everywhere, everyone is complaining
Blizzard. Not even once.
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On January 12 2013 03:43 Irre wrote:Show nested quote +On January 12 2013 01:50 virpi wrote:
remove fungal completely. add baneling catapult. that actually sounds awesome lol, as long as it did friendly fire i think it would be great and really fun, lots of possibilities..nah nm its blizzard
Lol there is actually a baneling launcher unit on sc2mapster, I used it to create a modified infestor in one of my ums maps that is basically a reaver that looks like an infestor, but shoots banelings instead of those reaver bombs. It is a ton of fun to play with!
One solution might be to get rid of fungal growth and replace it with spawn broodlings. Then the infestor becomes more of an anti-mech specialist..
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EPT
