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It's fucking hilarious how people don't see this as something wrong. Although the act is wrong as well, the principle, which is infinitely much more important, is where the problem exists. Hard to find people with a moral fiber these days..
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On October 11 2012 02:06 Okawi wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2012 01:58 Insoleet wrote:On October 11 2012 01:46 Calm wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On October 11 2012 01:43 Calm wrote:
Google Translate:
Hi all,
Firstly, let me introduce myself, my name is Ruurk, and I am responsible for developing Eclypsia, this post is one response to the claims of team-aAa site.
I write to you today because I think it is time for me to communicate with you, and lift the veil on practices that you consider questionable from Eclypsia.
It all started in April 2012, each of you will remember, we had the idea ("I" had the idea) to the output of a false Eclypsia April Fool, where he issue was that our young players (less than 2 weeks) had not been paid by Eclypsia. Course given recruitment "fresh" and the date (1 April) we were convinced that 90% of the community would say, ah ah, nice joke, April Fool etc, etc.. Unfortunately for us, many of you have believed our deception, and you felt that this kind of joke was not ethical. We apologize, we just wanted to laugh, we are first and foremost gamers like you and we thought you laugh!
On the other hand, I remind you that all our players were aware of the April Fool and the one that helped launch (Welmu) is always present in Eclypsia, he seems happy to be home and he never had any problems until now.
This case April Fool's is over, we had in our midst a communications officer or head manager, call it what you like, Retox, who had eShara, Blast etc etc.. Load is heavy to get the community he told me about a competition of memes, which would have shown that a self derision. This was the biggest FAIL of Eclypsia, and cost has its place mainly interested. He was fired for other reasons, but mainly for it.
On the case of SC2 players who have left, we gave time (6 months for Korea) that players did not want to meet. Being pressed and I understand, they decided to leave. We agree with that, everyone has paid the wages due and we were all pleased with the partnership. Moreover, in the departures Eclypsia even lost a computer, never returned by the person concerned.
Dota 2 for the team, we just sold Mystress 5000 simultaneous viewers and 10 hours daily stream for a salary of € 5,500. Making only 40 viewers, it turned into a drama and said that they saw our picture we "held by the balls" as she said. We do not give the players and Mystress went to another team, where they caused exactly the same problems, but it is the image of Eclypsia who took for his rank.
During this time, Eclypsia decided to refocus. The business plan was to pay a base salary of streamers, streamer of them for several hours a day, as well as create a thematic TV video games. This plan was a resounding failure, wanting to touch players in addition to their salary money generated on their stream. Unfortunately, Eclypsia did at that time not yet sponsors, we could not compete with the wages offered by our competitors ...
We started with Sarens (eSports manager) and others to review the business plan. Three clear lines had emerged: The Teams, Stream and news portal.
We therefore re-assigned budgets, favoring the appearance and WebTV news portal, while maintaining the appearance team, but no longer than splurge on the transfer market.
The budget allocated mainly to WebTV, things have changed. We released formats such as Dual Fighting (SC2 a show match with € 100 cash prize), the LoL Strategy Cup (showmatch LoL KOTH), flash eSports.
- Dual Fighting
- LoL Strategy Cup
- Flash eSport
Finally, our operations became profitable. Indeed, for € 100 invested in cash prize, we clear about € 150-160 each issue, not enough profitable wages, but we were quite happy, it was the first operations were not at a loss.
And then ...
The team Pomf & Thud, the Iron Squid, arrived with a budget and a project that has created a slew of departures from us, our newsers stars went our streamers, it was carnage.
Millenium, installed on the French market did not even feel the difference, being entrenched at the top of Google for years on queries video game. Our friends aAa meanwhile, have a loyal community.
We then had little choice. Scrape on the cake of others, or create our own. So we went around the web, and we said:
The eSports is a passion for racing video game, but it is also made to follow the games.
So we had the idea, rather than trying to prick the public of our competitors, to fetch external growth, a new audience. A public not yet interested in esport, but may already be video game players.
Like trailers in cinemas or television advertisements, so we thought we wanted to target public:
- Music? Cinema? News sites? too heterogeneous.
- Sites for video games? Competition forces, it seemed impossible ...
We thought our colleagues in the web site owners of mini games or humor site. The public is almost similar, it may stick. The first tests being performed the operation was a success, our TV presenters recover many new likes on facebook and the site carries a whopping 300% extra entries / day compared to an average day. So we found our future audience.
It cost us tens of thousands of dollars per month in advertising budget and does not Eclypsia the most profitable team in the world but just the team that invests the fastest growing external visibility. Is that a crime? I do not think so.
Some on reddit or others did not see the stream that was "hidden". Remember gentlemen eSports enthusiasts that the only reason you have not seen our stream on these pages is that you use Adblock, and you kill the market more than we ...
Without Adblock, the stream is indeed autoplay and automute (ads about they sound), this option is available on Dailymotion, or even Twitch (see the home page).
You say it is a false public?
I do not think this is a false public, I think that this is a new audience, an audience become, how many actually will become our audience? I do not know, 10%, 20%? But it will have it won, and since all this costs us more than it tells us, I do not think that our advertisers will complain.
How did Eclypsia this hocus-pocus?
We bought advertising space as there is 100% of eSports websites and web. Rather than put a banner, we've just put a movie, an idea, a simple idea. We have done with the agreement of our distribution platform, and advertisers.
Advertisers now?
Some say that this will reduce the overall CPM and dry and spread income streams. Know first bought qu'Eclypsia spaces already occupied by advertisers and price. These locations have already been purchased by advertisers will not be available directly on the sites in question, but Eclypsia and provider. The volume of sales thus becomes Eclypsia therefore certainly, but extremely deficient.
On the other hand, I think this volume group can not make eSports more than credible.
An example to better understand:
Like Qatar and PSG, many star players together in the same jersey has boosted attendance at the stadium PSG certainly, jerseys sales, certainly, but also and especially the attendance of all stages "local" which PSG welcome for a game.
In our scale esportive, EG meets Stephano and a galaxy of stars and convinces advertisers as Monster Energy or another. Choosing Eclypsia has simply focused on the "media" rather than the "team". A mere difference of strategic choice.
I think the key message is passed and must finish on a positive note:
Openness is not a skull fracture.
Open our market to more potential audience will only grow our community, we are first and foremost enthusiasts, I myself was a player at the highest levels of many games. I am still active and ShootMania SC2. You think we want to destroy the market? We try instead to open more than ever, on a scale which unfortunately scares you. Believe me, these viewers will be at your door soon, as they discover Eclypsia today, but tomorrow they love our environment, our games, our passion, they seek to see more. Rub your hands rather than wipe your eyes.
I remain available to the entire community, and now wants to live better hours at your side.
Eclypsia has already found a sponsor who will be announced soon, we also thank in advance for their support.
Ruurk So it's an advertising strategy. I don't see anything wrong with it, as long as sponsors are aware that the stream numbers are inflated. Same here. I'm glad they take care about what the community thinks. Good move here, EC ! Is this a good move ? Really ? I don't think so, EC is blaming us of destroying Esport with Adblock. They use intrusive stream, in autoplay without sound, on site where no one is interrested by Esport, and lessmore by Starcraft 2. Everything of that because they aren't able to do interessing things on their stream. You are like an EC-Franch-Fanboy and I don't really like that.
No i'm not lol
I just saying its a good move to communicate about this case with the community ! About what EC does... well they have a business to run, and France is a bit small for them to do so. I understand that its hard for them, and they try new things. Why not.
|
What bugs me is their business decision. Strategically speaking, all the decisions they made were subpart. I am just wondering how experienced their management are, because they seem to be out of touch with the entire scene.
|
I can clearly see the video played openly on all those pages. muted and low qual.
Also, I am quite sure they could not have "fixed it" on all partner platforms in such a short time + Show Spoiler +different deploy procedures, development process, QA, staging stuff - they all take quite some time and not all would be able to just deploy a fix to cover things up in less than a week; also, from working with French development companies they usually are quite procedural nazis, where everything needs ~4 signatures and ~3 reviews before any finger in development and operations is lifted
I do have some experience in web development, and I really thought the OP was a little off (a lot ... I had seen the videos).
Indeed I never run adblock + Show Spoiler +not because I endorse web ads - quite the opposite, I hate them, but in my line of work I'm forced to see the real pages
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On October 11 2012 02:14 Insoleet wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2012 02:06 Okawi wrote:On October 11 2012 01:58 Insoleet wrote:On October 11 2012 01:46 Calm wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On October 11 2012 01:43 Calm wrote:
Google Translate:
Hi all,
Firstly, let me introduce myself, my name is Ruurk, and I am responsible for developing Eclypsia, this post is one response to the claims of team-aAa site.
I write to you today because I think it is time for me to communicate with you, and lift the veil on practices that you consider questionable from Eclypsia.
It all started in April 2012, each of you will remember, we had the idea ("I" had the idea) to the output of a false Eclypsia April Fool, where he issue was that our young players (less than 2 weeks) had not been paid by Eclypsia. Course given recruitment "fresh" and the date (1 April) we were convinced that 90% of the community would say, ah ah, nice joke, April Fool etc, etc.. Unfortunately for us, many of you have believed our deception, and you felt that this kind of joke was not ethical. We apologize, we just wanted to laugh, we are first and foremost gamers like you and we thought you laugh!
On the other hand, I remind you that all our players were aware of the April Fool and the one that helped launch (Welmu) is always present in Eclypsia, he seems happy to be home and he never had any problems until now.
This case April Fool's is over, we had in our midst a communications officer or head manager, call it what you like, Retox, who had eShara, Blast etc etc.. Load is heavy to get the community he told me about a competition of memes, which would have shown that a self derision. This was the biggest FAIL of Eclypsia, and cost has its place mainly interested. He was fired for other reasons, but mainly for it.
On the case of SC2 players who have left, we gave time (6 months for Korea) that players did not want to meet. Being pressed and I understand, they decided to leave. We agree with that, everyone has paid the wages due and we were all pleased with the partnership. Moreover, in the departures Eclypsia even lost a computer, never returned by the person concerned.
Dota 2 for the team, we just sold Mystress 5000 simultaneous viewers and 10 hours daily stream for a salary of € 5,500. Making only 40 viewers, it turned into a drama and said that they saw our picture we "held by the balls" as she said. We do not give the players and Mystress went to another team, where they caused exactly the same problems, but it is the image of Eclypsia who took for his rank.
During this time, Eclypsia decided to refocus. The business plan was to pay a base salary of streamers, streamer of them for several hours a day, as well as create a thematic TV video games. This plan was a resounding failure, wanting to touch players in addition to their salary money generated on their stream. Unfortunately, Eclypsia did at that time not yet sponsors, we could not compete with the wages offered by our competitors ...
We started with Sarens (eSports manager) and others to review the business plan. Three clear lines had emerged: The Teams, Stream and news portal.
We therefore re-assigned budgets, favoring the appearance and WebTV news portal, while maintaining the appearance team, but no longer than splurge on the transfer market.
The budget allocated mainly to WebTV, things have changed. We released formats such as Dual Fighting (SC2 a show match with € 100 cash prize), the LoL Strategy Cup (showmatch LoL KOTH), flash eSports.
- Dual Fighting
- LoL Strategy Cup
- Flash eSport
Finally, our operations became profitable. Indeed, for € 100 invested in cash prize, we clear about € 150-160 each issue, not enough profitable wages, but we were quite happy, it was the first operations were not at a loss.
And then ...
The team Pomf & Thud, the Iron Squid, arrived with a budget and a project that has created a slew of departures from us, our newsers stars went our streamers, it was carnage.
Millenium, installed on the French market did not even feel the difference, being entrenched at the top of Google for years on queries video game. Our friends aAa meanwhile, have a loyal community.
We then had little choice. Scrape on the cake of others, or create our own. So we went around the web, and we said:
The eSports is a passion for racing video game, but it is also made to follow the games.
So we had the idea, rather than trying to prick the public of our competitors, to fetch external growth, a new audience. A public not yet interested in esport, but may already be video game players.
Like trailers in cinemas or television advertisements, so we thought we wanted to target public:
- Music? Cinema? News sites? too heterogeneous.
- Sites for video games? Competition forces, it seemed impossible ...
We thought our colleagues in the web site owners of mini games or humor site. The public is almost similar, it may stick. The first tests being performed the operation was a success, our TV presenters recover many new likes on facebook and the site carries a whopping 300% extra entries / day compared to an average day. So we found our future audience.
It cost us tens of thousands of dollars per month in advertising budget and does not Eclypsia the most profitable team in the world but just the team that invests the fastest growing external visibility. Is that a crime? I do not think so.
Some on reddit or others did not see the stream that was "hidden". Remember gentlemen eSports enthusiasts that the only reason you have not seen our stream on these pages is that you use Adblock, and you kill the market more than we ...
Without Adblock, the stream is indeed autoplay and automute (ads about they sound), this option is available on Dailymotion, or even Twitch (see the home page).
You say it is a false public?
I do not think this is a false public, I think that this is a new audience, an audience become, how many actually will become our audience? I do not know, 10%, 20%? But it will have it won, and since all this costs us more than it tells us, I do not think that our advertisers will complain.
How did Eclypsia this hocus-pocus?
We bought advertising space as there is 100% of eSports websites and web. Rather than put a banner, we've just put a movie, an idea, a simple idea. We have done with the agreement of our distribution platform, and advertisers.
Advertisers now?
Some say that this will reduce the overall CPM and dry and spread income streams. Know first bought qu'Eclypsia spaces already occupied by advertisers and price. These locations have already been purchased by advertisers will not be available directly on the sites in question, but Eclypsia and provider. The volume of sales thus becomes Eclypsia therefore certainly, but extremely deficient.
On the other hand, I think this volume group can not make eSports more than credible.
An example to better understand:
Like Qatar and PSG, many star players together in the same jersey has boosted attendance at the stadium PSG certainly, jerseys sales, certainly, but also and especially the attendance of all stages "local" which PSG welcome for a game.
In our scale esportive, EG meets Stephano and a galaxy of stars and convinces advertisers as Monster Energy or another. Choosing Eclypsia has simply focused on the "media" rather than the "team". A mere difference of strategic choice.
I think the key message is passed and must finish on a positive note:
Openness is not a skull fracture.
Open our market to more potential audience will only grow our community, we are first and foremost enthusiasts, I myself was a player at the highest levels of many games. I am still active and ShootMania SC2. You think we want to destroy the market? We try instead to open more than ever, on a scale which unfortunately scares you. Believe me, these viewers will be at your door soon, as they discover Eclypsia today, but tomorrow they love our environment, our games, our passion, they seek to see more. Rub your hands rather than wipe your eyes.
I remain available to the entire community, and now wants to live better hours at your side.
Eclypsia has already found a sponsor who will be announced soon, we also thank in advance for their support.
Ruurk So it's an advertising strategy. I don't see anything wrong with it, as long as sponsors are aware that the stream numbers are inflated. Same here. I'm glad they take care about what the community thinks. Good move here, EC ! Is this a good move ? Really ? I don't think so, EC is blaming us of destroying Esport with Adblock. They use intrusive stream, in autoplay without sound, on site where no one is interrested by Esport, and lessmore by Starcraft 2. Everything of that because they aren't able to do interessing things on their stream. You are like an EC-Franch-Fanboy and I don't really like that. No i'm not lol I just saying its a good move to communicate about this case with the community ! About what EC does... well they have a business to run, and France is a bit small for them to do so. I understand that its hard for them, and they try new things. Why not.
It's only because someone discovered this. And now they are acting like it's a good thing, with a post full of bulls****.
They are late of 10 days, their politic is all but transparent ...
|
So Eclypsia is paying websites to advertise their stream, I don't see the problem. If this is their business strategy then so be it.
When it comes to drama this community is unbelievable.
|
+ Show Spoiler +On October 11 2012 01:43 Calm wrote:
Google Translate:
Hi all,
Firstly, let me introduce myself, my name is Ruurk, and I am responsible for developing Eclypsia, this post is one response to the claims of team-aAa site.
I write to you today because I think it is time for me to communicate with you, and lift the veil on practices that you consider questionable from Eclypsia.
It all started in April 2012, each of you will remember, we had the idea ("I" had the idea) to the output of a false Eclypsia April Fool, where he issue was that our young players (less than 2 weeks) had not been paid by Eclypsia. Course given recruitment "fresh" and the date (1 April) we were convinced that 90% of the community would say, ah ah, nice joke, April Fool etc, etc.. Unfortunately for us, many of you have believed our deception, and you felt that this kind of joke was not ethical. We apologize, we just wanted to laugh, we are first and foremost gamers like you and we thought you laugh!
On the other hand, I remind you that all our players were aware of the April Fool and the one that helped launch (Welmu) is always present in Eclypsia, he seems happy to be home and he never had any problems until now.
This case April Fool's is over, we had in our midst a communications officer or head manager, call it what you like, Retox, who had eShara, Blast etc etc.. Load is heavy to get the community he told me about a competition of memes, which would have shown that a self derision. This was the biggest FAIL of Eclypsia, and cost has its place mainly interested. He was fired for other reasons, but mainly for it.
On the case of SC2 players who have left, we gave time (6 months for Korea) that players did not want to meet. Being pressed and I understand, they decided to leave. We agree with that, everyone has paid the wages due and we were all pleased with the partnership. Moreover, in the departures Eclypsia even lost a computer, never returned by the person concerned.
Dota 2 for the team, we just sold Mystress 5000 simultaneous viewers and 10 hours daily stream for a salary of € 5,500. Making only 40 viewers, it turned into a drama and said that they saw our picture we "held by the balls" as she said. We do not give the players and Mystress went to another team, where they caused exactly the same problems, but it is the image of Eclypsia who took for his rank.
During this time, Eclypsia decided to refocus. The business plan was to pay a base salary of streamers, streamer of them for several hours a day, as well as create a thematic TV video games. This plan was a resounding failure, wanting to touch players in addition to their salary money generated on their stream. Unfortunately, Eclypsia did at that time not yet sponsors, we could not compete with the wages offered by our competitors ...
We started with Sarens (eSports manager) and others to review the business plan. Three clear lines had emerged: The Teams, Stream and news portal.
We therefore re-assigned budgets, favoring the appearance and WebTV news portal, while maintaining the appearance team, but no longer than splurge on the transfer market.
The budget allocated mainly to WebTV, things have changed. We released formats such as Dual Fighting (SC2 a show match with € 100 cash prize), the LoL Strategy Cup (showmatch LoL KOTH), flash eSports.
- Dual Fighting
- LoL Strategy Cup
- Flash eSport
Finally, our operations became profitable. Indeed, for € 100 invested in cash prize, we clear about € 150-160 each issue, not enough profitable wages, but we were quite happy, it was the first operations were not at a loss.
And then ...
The team Pomf & Thud, the Iron Squid, arrived with a budget and a project that has created a slew of departures from us, our newsers stars went our streamers, it was carnage.
Millenium, installed on the French market did not even feel the difference, being entrenched at the top of Google for years on queries video game. Our friends aAa meanwhile, have a loyal community.
We then had little choice. Scrape on the cake of others, or create our own. So we went around the web, and we said:
The eSports is a passion for racing video game, but it is also made to follow the games.
So we had the idea, rather than trying to prick the public of our competitors, to fetch external growth, a new audience. A public not yet interested in esport, but may already be video game players.
Like trailers in cinemas or television advertisements, so we thought we wanted to target public:
- Music? Cinema? News sites? too heterogeneous.
- Sites for video games? Competition forces, it seemed impossible ...
We thought our colleagues in the web site owners of mini games or humor site. The public is almost similar, it may stick. The first tests being performed the operation was a success, our TV presenters recover many new likes on facebook and the site carries a whopping 300% extra entries / day compared to an average day. So we found our future audience.
It cost us tens of thousands of dollars per month in advertising budget and does not Eclypsia the most profitable team in the world but just the team that invests the fastest growing external visibility. Is that a crime? I do not think so.
Some on reddit or others did not see the stream that was "hidden". Remember gentlemen eSports enthusiasts that the only reason you have not seen our stream on these pages is that you use Adblock, and you kill the market more than we ...
Without Adblock, the stream is indeed autoplay and automute (ads about they sound), this option is available on Dailymotion, or even Twitch (see the home page).
You say it is a false public?
I do not think this is a false public, I think that this is a new audience, an audience become, how many actually will become our audience? I do not know, 10%, 20%? But it will have it won, and since all this costs us more than it tells us, I do not think that our advertisers will complain.
How did Eclypsia this hocus-pocus?
We bought advertising space as there is 100% of eSports websites and web. Rather than put a banner, we've just put a movie, an idea, a simple idea. We have done with the agreement of our distribution platform, and advertisers.
Advertisers now?
Some say that this will reduce the overall CPM and dry and spread income streams. Know first bought qu'Eclypsia spaces already occupied by advertisers and price. These locations have already been purchased by advertisers will not be available directly on the sites in question, but Eclypsia and provider. The volume of sales thus becomes Eclypsia therefore certainly, but extremely deficient.
On the other hand, I think this volume group can not make eSports more than credible.
An example to better understand:
Like Qatar and PSG, many star players together in the same jersey has boosted attendance at the stadium PSG certainly, jerseys sales, certainly, but also and especially the attendance of all stages "local" which PSG welcome for a game.
In our scale esportive, EG meets Stephano and a galaxy of stars and convinces advertisers as Monster Energy or another. Choosing Eclypsia has simply focused on the "media" rather than the "team". A mere difference of strategic choice.
I think the key message is passed and must finish on a positive note:
Openness is not a skull fracture.
Open our market to more potential audience will only grow our community, we are first and foremost enthusiasts, I myself was a player at the highest levels of many games. I am still active and ShootMania SC2. You think we want to destroy the market? We try instead to open more than ever, on a scale which unfortunately scares you. Believe me, these viewers will be at your door soon, as they discover Eclypsia today, but tomorrow they love our environment, our games, our passion, they seek to see more. Rub your hands rather than wipe your eyes.
I remain available to the entire community, and now wants to live better hours at your side.
Eclypsia has already found a sponsor who will be announced soon, we also thank in advance for their support.
Ruurk
I believe that as long as they have told Dailymotion, and any other sponsors/advertisers that they have, about this plan and how it will affect the numbers on their stream, there is nothing wrong with this. After this explanation, this practice does not seem bad(assuming everyone was notified) and is something that Eclypsia is taking a big risk with.
I wish them luck with this, and hope they are able to improve their image in the community!
|
On October 11 2012 02:25 Laurens wrote:
So Eclypsia is paying websites to advertise their stream, I don't see the problem. If this is their business strategy then so be it.
When it comes to drama this community is unbelievable.
it's fraud, plain and simple
|
Eclypsia is still a thing?
One scandal after another, this team seems to have done nothing but harm eSports since its conception. Why anyone takes it as anything but a scam is beyond me.
|
On October 11 2012 02:26 JohnHarr wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On October 11 2012 01:43 Calm wrote:
Google Translate:
Hi all,
Firstly, let me introduce myself, my name is Ruurk, and I am responsible for developing Eclypsia, this post is one response to the claims of team-aAa site.
I write to you today because I think it is time for me to communicate with you, and lift the veil on practices that you consider questionable from Eclypsia.
It all started in April 2012, each of you will remember, we had the idea ("I" had the idea) to the output of a false Eclypsia April Fool, where he issue was that our young players (less than 2 weeks) had not been paid by Eclypsia. Course given recruitment "fresh" and the date (1 April) we were convinced that 90% of the community would say, ah ah, nice joke, April Fool etc, etc.. Unfortunately for us, many of you have believed our deception, and you felt that this kind of joke was not ethical. We apologize, we just wanted to laugh, we are first and foremost gamers like you and we thought you laugh!
On the other hand, I remind you that all our players were aware of the April Fool and the one that helped launch (Welmu) is always present in Eclypsia, he seems happy to be home and he never had any problems until now.
This case April Fool's is over, we had in our midst a communications officer or head manager, call it what you like, Retox, who had eShara, Blast etc etc.. Load is heavy to get the community he told me about a competition of memes, which would have shown that a self derision. This was the biggest FAIL of Eclypsia, and cost has its place mainly interested. He was fired for other reasons, but mainly for it.
On the case of SC2 players who have left, we gave time (6 months for Korea) that players did not want to meet. Being pressed and I understand, they decided to leave. We agree with that, everyone has paid the wages due and we were all pleased with the partnership. Moreover, in the departures Eclypsia even lost a computer, never returned by the person concerned.
Dota 2 for the team, we just sold Mystress 5000 simultaneous viewers and 10 hours daily stream for a salary of € 5,500. Making only 40 viewers, it turned into a drama and said that they saw our picture we "held by the balls" as she said. We do not give the players and Mystress went to another team, where they caused exactly the same problems, but it is the image of Eclypsia who took for his rank.
During this time, Eclypsia decided to refocus. The business plan was to pay a base salary of streamers, streamer of them for several hours a day, as well as create a thematic TV video games. This plan was a resounding failure, wanting to touch players in addition to their salary money generated on their stream. Unfortunately, Eclypsia did at that time not yet sponsors, we could not compete with the wages offered by our competitors ...
We started with Sarens (eSports manager) and others to review the business plan. Three clear lines had emerged: The Teams, Stream and news portal.
We therefore re-assigned budgets, favoring the appearance and WebTV news portal, while maintaining the appearance team, but no longer than splurge on the transfer market.
The budget allocated mainly to WebTV, things have changed. We released formats such as Dual Fighting (SC2 a show match with € 100 cash prize), the LoL Strategy Cup (showmatch LoL KOTH), flash eSports.
- Dual Fighting
- LoL Strategy Cup
- Flash eSport
Finally, our operations became profitable. Indeed, for € 100 invested in cash prize, we clear about € 150-160 each issue, not enough profitable wages, but we were quite happy, it was the first operations were not at a loss.
And then ...
The team Pomf & Thud, the Iron Squid, arrived with a budget and a project that has created a slew of departures from us, our newsers stars went our streamers, it was carnage.
Millenium, installed on the French market did not even feel the difference, being entrenched at the top of Google for years on queries video game. Our friends aAa meanwhile, have a loyal community.
We then had little choice. Scrape on the cake of others, or create our own. So we went around the web, and we said:
The eSports is a passion for racing video game, but it is also made to follow the games.
So we had the idea, rather than trying to prick the public of our competitors, to fetch external growth, a new audience. A public not yet interested in esport, but may already be video game players.
Like trailers in cinemas or television advertisements, so we thought we wanted to target public:
- Music? Cinema? News sites? too heterogeneous.
- Sites for video games? Competition forces, it seemed impossible ...
We thought our colleagues in the web site owners of mini games or humor site. The public is almost similar, it may stick. The first tests being performed the operation was a success, our TV presenters recover many new likes on facebook and the site carries a whopping 300% extra entries / day compared to an average day. So we found our future audience.
It cost us tens of thousands of dollars per month in advertising budget and does not Eclypsia the most profitable team in the world but just the team that invests the fastest growing external visibility. Is that a crime? I do not think so.
Some on reddit or others did not see the stream that was "hidden". Remember gentlemen eSports enthusiasts that the only reason you have not seen our stream on these pages is that you use Adblock, and you kill the market more than we ...
Without Adblock, the stream is indeed autoplay and automute (ads about they sound), this option is available on Dailymotion, or even Twitch (see the home page).
You say it is a false public?
I do not think this is a false public, I think that this is a new audience, an audience become, how many actually will become our audience? I do not know, 10%, 20%? But it will have it won, and since all this costs us more than it tells us, I do not think that our advertisers will complain.
How did Eclypsia this hocus-pocus?
We bought advertising space as there is 100% of eSports websites and web. Rather than put a banner, we've just put a movie, an idea, a simple idea. We have done with the agreement of our distribution platform, and advertisers.
Advertisers now?
Some say that this will reduce the overall CPM and dry and spread income streams. Know first bought qu'Eclypsia spaces already occupied by advertisers and price. These locations have already been purchased by advertisers will not be available directly on the sites in question, but Eclypsia and provider. The volume of sales thus becomes Eclypsia therefore certainly, but extremely deficient.
On the other hand, I think this volume group can not make eSports more than credible.
An example to better understand:
Like Qatar and PSG, many star players together in the same jersey has boosted attendance at the stadium PSG certainly, jerseys sales, certainly, but also and especially the attendance of all stages "local" which PSG welcome for a game.
In our scale esportive, EG meets Stephano and a galaxy of stars and convinces advertisers as Monster Energy or another. Choosing Eclypsia has simply focused on the "media" rather than the "team". A mere difference of strategic choice.
I think the key message is passed and must finish on a positive note:
Openness is not a skull fracture.
Open our market to more potential audience will only grow our community, we are first and foremost enthusiasts, I myself was a player at the highest levels of many games. I am still active and ShootMania SC2. You think we want to destroy the market? We try instead to open more than ever, on a scale which unfortunately scares you. Believe me, these viewers will be at your door soon, as they discover Eclypsia today, but tomorrow they love our environment, our games, our passion, they seek to see more. Rub your hands rather than wipe your eyes.
I remain available to the entire community, and now wants to live better hours at your side.
Eclypsia has already found a sponsor who will be announced soon, we also thank in advance for their support.
Ruurk I believe that as long as they have told Dailymotion, and any other sponsors/advertisers that they have, about this plan and how it will affect the numbers on their stream, there is nothing wrong with this. After this explanation, this practice does not seem bad(assuming everyone was notified) and is something that Eclypsia is taking a big risk with. I wish them luck with this, and hope they are able to improve their image in the community!
Making a muted stream run behind a website without the person visiting the site being aware is not wrong?
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On October 11 2012 02:34 Zanno wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2012 02:25 Laurens wrote:
So Eclypsia is paying websites to advertise their stream, I don't see the problem. If this is their business strategy then so be it.
When it comes to drama this community is unbelievable. it's fraud, plain and simple
What? Where is the deception? It's already been pointed out that the stream is not hidden, only if you use adblock.
Who are they deceiving? Their sponsors? Do you honestly think they didn't inform them about this idea? Or that the sponsors wouldn't notice when the number of views exploded exponentianally and asked what's up?
Again, it's just a form of advertising, it's amazing how people are twisting and turning just to hate on Eclypsia.
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On October 11 2012 02:39 Laurens wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2012 02:34 Zanno wrote:On October 11 2012 02:25 Laurens wrote:
So Eclypsia is paying websites to advertise their stream, I don't see the problem. If this is their business strategy then so be it.
When it comes to drama this community is unbelievable. it's fraud, plain and simple What? Where is the deception? It's already been pointed out that the stream is not hidden, only if you use adblock. Who are they deceiving? Their sponsors? Do you honestly think they didn't inform them about this idea? Or that the sponsors wouldn't notice when the number of views exploded exponentianally and asked what's up? Again, it's just a form of advertising, it's amazing how people are twisting and turning just to hate on Eclypsia.
It'd be the equivalent of walking into a store and see clerks throwing stuff in your cart. You can tell them to stop (obviously) and they would, but I would never go to that store ever again.
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As long as EC sponsor know what they are paying for, and for who they are advertising I don't see a problem with this.
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On October 11 2012 02:43 wcr.4fun wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2012 02:39 Laurens wrote:On October 11 2012 02:34 Zanno wrote:On October 11 2012 02:25 Laurens wrote:
So Eclypsia is paying websites to advertise their stream, I don't see the problem. If this is their business strategy then so be it.
When it comes to drama this community is unbelievable. it's fraud, plain and simple What? Where is the deception? It's already been pointed out that the stream is not hidden, only if you use adblock. Who are they deceiving? Their sponsors? Do you honestly think they didn't inform them about this idea? Or that the sponsors wouldn't notice when the number of views exploded exponentianally and asked what's up? Again, it's just a form of advertising, it's amazing how people are twisting and turning just to hate on Eclypsia. It'd be the equivalent of walking into a store and see clerks throwing stuff in your cart. You can tell them to stop (obviously) and they would, but I would never go to that store ever again. Okay, you made your choice. Let me make mine. Now, why the witchhunt?
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On October 11 2012 02:39 Laurens wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2012 02:34 Zanno wrote:On October 11 2012 02:25 Laurens wrote:
So Eclypsia is paying websites to advertise their stream, I don't see the problem. If this is their business strategy then so be it.
When it comes to drama this community is unbelievable. it's fraud, plain and simple What? Where is the deception? It's already been pointed out that the stream is not hidden, only if you use adblock. Who are they deceiving? Their sponsors? Do you honestly think they didn't inform them about this idea? Or that the sponsors wouldn't notice when the number of views exploded exponentianally and asked what's up? Again, it's just a form of advertising, it's amazing how people are twisting and turning just to hate on Eclypsia.
I also pointed that out, I think you should just give up tring to reason.
I am dissapoint
Reading stuff that's black on white does not make it truth. If ppl do not bother to check the facts for themselves when it's really easy as in the current case, why expect ppl to accept the Earth is older than 6k years. It's this kind of jumping the band wagon and accepting blindly what others are saying that also creates all the drama in esports.
I guess it's also a factor of audience age, because I expect education levels to be acceptable in TL (as in around highschool and with an open mind).
Again ... I am dissapoint
And also still waiting for more evidence for the OP case and point because I am still leaning toward EC's argument on this.
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On October 11 2012 02:39 NeonFox wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2012 02:26 JohnHarr wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On October 11 2012 01:43 Calm wrote:
Google Translate:
Hi all,
Firstly, let me introduce myself, my name is Ruurk, and I am responsible for developing Eclypsia, this post is one response to the claims of team-aAa site.
I write to you today because I think it is time for me to communicate with you, and lift the veil on practices that you consider questionable from Eclypsia.
It all started in April 2012, each of you will remember, we had the idea ("I" had the idea) to the output of a false Eclypsia April Fool, where he issue was that our young players (less than 2 weeks) had not been paid by Eclypsia. Course given recruitment "fresh" and the date (1 April) we were convinced that 90% of the community would say, ah ah, nice joke, April Fool etc, etc.. Unfortunately for us, many of you have believed our deception, and you felt that this kind of joke was not ethical. We apologize, we just wanted to laugh, we are first and foremost gamers like you and we thought you laugh!
On the other hand, I remind you that all our players were aware of the April Fool and the one that helped launch (Welmu) is always present in Eclypsia, he seems happy to be home and he never had any problems until now.
This case April Fool's is over, we had in our midst a communications officer or head manager, call it what you like, Retox, who had eShara, Blast etc etc.. Load is heavy to get the community he told me about a competition of memes, which would have shown that a self derision. This was the biggest FAIL of Eclypsia, and cost has its place mainly interested. He was fired for other reasons, but mainly for it.
On the case of SC2 players who have left, we gave time (6 months for Korea) that players did not want to meet. Being pressed and I understand, they decided to leave. We agree with that, everyone has paid the wages due and we were all pleased with the partnership. Moreover, in the departures Eclypsia even lost a computer, never returned by the person concerned.
Dota 2 for the team, we just sold Mystress 5000 simultaneous viewers and 10 hours daily stream for a salary of € 5,500. Making only 40 viewers, it turned into a drama and said that they saw our picture we "held by the balls" as she said. We do not give the players and Mystress went to another team, where they caused exactly the same problems, but it is the image of Eclypsia who took for his rank.
During this time, Eclypsia decided to refocus. The business plan was to pay a base salary of streamers, streamer of them for several hours a day, as well as create a thematic TV video games. This plan was a resounding failure, wanting to touch players in addition to their salary money generated on their stream. Unfortunately, Eclypsia did at that time not yet sponsors, we could not compete with the wages offered by our competitors ...
We started with Sarens (eSports manager) and others to review the business plan. Three clear lines had emerged: The Teams, Stream and news portal.
We therefore re-assigned budgets, favoring the appearance and WebTV news portal, while maintaining the appearance team, but no longer than splurge on the transfer market.
The budget allocated mainly to WebTV, things have changed. We released formats such as Dual Fighting (SC2 a show match with € 100 cash prize), the LoL Strategy Cup (showmatch LoL KOTH), flash eSports.
- Dual Fighting
- LoL Strategy Cup
- Flash eSport
Finally, our operations became profitable. Indeed, for € 100 invested in cash prize, we clear about € 150-160 each issue, not enough profitable wages, but we were quite happy, it was the first operations were not at a loss.
And then ...
The team Pomf & Thud, the Iron Squid, arrived with a budget and a project that has created a slew of departures from us, our newsers stars went our streamers, it was carnage.
Millenium, installed on the French market did not even feel the difference, being entrenched at the top of Google for years on queries video game. Our friends aAa meanwhile, have a loyal community.
We then had little choice. Scrape on the cake of others, or create our own. So we went around the web, and we said:
The eSports is a passion for racing video game, but it is also made to follow the games.
So we had the idea, rather than trying to prick the public of our competitors, to fetch external growth, a new audience. A public not yet interested in esport, but may already be video game players.
Like trailers in cinemas or television advertisements, so we thought we wanted to target public:
- Music? Cinema? News sites? too heterogeneous.
- Sites for video games? Competition forces, it seemed impossible ...
We thought our colleagues in the web site owners of mini games or humor site. The public is almost similar, it may stick. The first tests being performed the operation was a success, our TV presenters recover many new likes on facebook and the site carries a whopping 300% extra entries / day compared to an average day. So we found our future audience.
It cost us tens of thousands of dollars per month in advertising budget and does not Eclypsia the most profitable team in the world but just the team that invests the fastest growing external visibility. Is that a crime? I do not think so.
Some on reddit or others did not see the stream that was "hidden". Remember gentlemen eSports enthusiasts that the only reason you have not seen our stream on these pages is that you use Adblock, and you kill the market more than we ...
Without Adblock, the stream is indeed autoplay and automute (ads about they sound), this option is available on Dailymotion, or even Twitch (see the home page).
You say it is a false public?
I do not think this is a false public, I think that this is a new audience, an audience become, how many actually will become our audience? I do not know, 10%, 20%? But it will have it won, and since all this costs us more than it tells us, I do not think that our advertisers will complain.
How did Eclypsia this hocus-pocus?
We bought advertising space as there is 100% of eSports websites and web. Rather than put a banner, we've just put a movie, an idea, a simple idea. We have done with the agreement of our distribution platform, and advertisers.
Advertisers now?
Some say that this will reduce the overall CPM and dry and spread income streams. Know first bought qu'Eclypsia spaces already occupied by advertisers and price. These locations have already been purchased by advertisers will not be available directly on the sites in question, but Eclypsia and provider. The volume of sales thus becomes Eclypsia therefore certainly, but extremely deficient.
On the other hand, I think this volume group can not make eSports more than credible.
An example to better understand:
Like Qatar and PSG, many star players together in the same jersey has boosted attendance at the stadium PSG certainly, jerseys sales, certainly, but also and especially the attendance of all stages "local" which PSG welcome for a game.
In our scale esportive, EG meets Stephano and a galaxy of stars and convinces advertisers as Monster Energy or another. Choosing Eclypsia has simply focused on the "media" rather than the "team". A mere difference of strategic choice.
I think the key message is passed and must finish on a positive note:
Openness is not a skull fracture.
Open our market to more potential audience will only grow our community, we are first and foremost enthusiasts, I myself was a player at the highest levels of many games. I am still active and ShootMania SC2. You think we want to destroy the market? We try instead to open more than ever, on a scale which unfortunately scares you. Believe me, these viewers will be at your door soon, as they discover Eclypsia today, but tomorrow they love our environment, our games, our passion, they seek to see more. Rub your hands rather than wipe your eyes.
I remain available to the entire community, and now wants to live better hours at your side.
Eclypsia has already found a sponsor who will be announced soon, we also thank in advance for their support.
Ruurk I believe that as long as they have told Dailymotion, and any other sponsors/advertisers that they have, about this plan and how it will affect the numbers on their stream, there is nothing wrong with this. After this explanation, this practice does not seem bad(assuming everyone was notified) and is something that Eclypsia is taking a big risk with. I wish them luck with this, and hope they are able to improve their image in the community! Making a muted stream run behind a website without the person visiting the site being aware is not wrong?
As long as everyone involved has been alerted and they have worked out a deal to account for the "ghost" viewers that are inevitable and everyone involved agreed to the conditions assigned to the new situation... No, I don't think it is wrong.
(Although if they are still getting the same rates per viewer as they would without the "ghost" viewers, or if they do not meet any other conditions that were put forward with this change in viewers[This is assuming that there was a promise/contract about the added viewers], then it is wrong)
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Papua New Guinea1058 Posts
Eclypsia is legit, guys, just like Blight.
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On October 11 2012 01:06 smileface wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2012 00:51 ShamW0W wrote:
I'm so confused as to why this is a 'bad thing'. They're paying to advertise their stream, what did they do wrong there? If you go to a site, and the Eclypsia stream pops up, it was the site that coded how the stream appears and not Eclypsia.
This is pretty standard internet advertising. I won't say that I'm a fan of pop-ups but I understand their value and have no problem with a team advertising their stream in this way. Teams market themselves to sponsors by showing how much interest the gaming community has in them. One of the ways to prove your popularity is to show stream numbers. "Look! dear sponsor X, there are 10k people on our stream!!!! If YOU would sponsor us, 10k people will see your logo ingame!!! how great is that???" and now... have 9.9k of those people be randoms that dont notice your stream and just let it run in the background... you tell me what is wrong with that
If the sponsor just takes that figure for face value then that's the fault of the sponsor. By advertising their stream how are they doing anything that can be perceived as 'wrong'? I can understand that some people claim that it's "unfair" but even that's a stretch.
In general business are successful because they either have a superior product or they're great at getting the message out about their product and generating buzz. (see: Shamwow  ) A good way to generate buzz is to spend money on advertising which is effective even if you have an inferior product. (not claiming the EC stream is inferior, just stating an observation of business in general)
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What a terrible reason to make a drama thread. This is stupid. Everyone who posts in this thread is stupid. Oh crap...now I'm stupid.
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EPT
