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On September 07 2012 13:35 DRob wrote:Show nested quote +The only thing I find interesting is why foreigner had a big increase in win rate @ 2012 Q2. Everything else is to be expected That is a very good question. Looking at the Q2 events which everyone can do on the article, there isn't a particular event that stood out. Non-Koreans just did better at most all of the Q2 events. Like a 34% match win rate in MLG Spring Championship vs. a 22% match win rate at MLG Summer Championship. GSL also went pretty well for non-Koreans v. Koreans with a 5-5 record from this period. As a percentage of the total there is a lot more non-Korean Zergs so Q2 could also be impacted by strong Zergs across the board (Korean or not) after the Queen patch. And that effect has declined as Zergs have come back down to a more balanced performance range. That is just a theory.
Try adding error bars, that single quarter doesn't necessarily mean anything more than chance.
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On September 07 2012 10:03 Al Bundy wrote:
In conclusion: Koreans own white dudes. Will they keep owing white dudes in the future? Some people say that HotS then LotV will help balancing the winrates (something to do with resetting the metagame) but, I'm not holding my breath tbh.
Al Bundy owns all human beings.
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Conclusion from the graph:
Korean own foreigners.
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On September 07 2012 10:17 Hazuc wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2012 10:14 CosmicSpiral wrote:On September 07 2012 10:06 Hazuc wrote:
They should compare the top 32 koreans with the top 32 foreigners instead. There are many bad foreigners in foreign events while the bad koreans do not participate in those tournaments. No one knows who the top 32 Koreans are. What I'm trying to say is that most koreans playing in foreign tournaments are Code S level which is not really fair for comparisons.
The graphs are not meant to show the percentage, rather the trend. The trend is definitely legit.
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On September 07 2012 10:14 CosmicSpiral wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2012 10:06 Hazuc wrote:
They should compare the top 32 koreans with the top 32 foreigners instead. There are many bad foreigners in foreign events while the bad koreans do not participate in those tournaments. No one knows who the top 32 Koreans are.
Code S is a damn good representation of the top 32 Koreans. Code S is so competitive at this point that really only the absolute best at any given time make it there with very few exceptions.
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Man, and all that hype about foreigners being competitive from when the game first came out...
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We all knew Koreans were favored vs foreigners. Now we know how much!
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It's the quantity of quality. For every top-tier foreigner (late 2010/early 2011 Jinro, mid 2011 to early 2012 Huk, Stephano, etc), there are probably more than 50 Koreans at a similar level.
SC2 is volatile as hell, which is why even the best players cannot win every tournament. But when you see it as Korea vs the World, the deck is always in favor of Korea because they have more top level players. Guys like Stephano can hold with perhaps even the best of the Koreans, but not all the time.
Let's use Stephano and MLG as an example: Say Stephano has a 10% chance of winning MLG. That's great, but there are few foreigners who can perform at his level, and fewer who can do so consistently (if any, and hell, even Stephano isn't totally consistent either. There are times when he flops).
But there are likely 10 or so Koreans nowadays at MLGs that have a similar chance of winning as Stephano. Even if one of them is eliminated, another Korean takes up the banner and races for the finals, and should he fall, yet another Korean can go for the gold, and so on.
TL;DR We have Code S level foreigners and players that can compete with the best. It's just that in terms of good players, Korea has us beat big-time in quantity.
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For the first 12 months, foreigners had a chance. But then their general laziness and sloth got in the way and outside of a few genuinely talented people the rest stagnated while Koreans produced more and more talent.
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In these days and ages it would be good to separate americans from europeans imo.
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On September 07 2012 15:46 Sub40APM wrote:
For the first 12 months, foreigners had a chance. But then their general laziness and sloth got in the way and outside of a few genuinely talented people the rest stagnated while Koreans produced more and more talent.
Yep, just as everyone predicted would happen :D
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On September 07 2012 10:06 Hazuc wrote:
They should compare the top 32 koreans with the top 32 foreigners instead. There are many bad foreigners in foreign events while the bad koreans do not participate in those tournaments.
exactly what i was thinking, if they count mlg qualifier bracket they will have lots of matches vs master- mid gm US server Free wins before they even get to the best foreigneer players. While its only those koreans that actually think its worth investing time and money that come to fight the foreigneers.
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On September 07 2012 16:05 zerino wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2012 10:06 Hazuc wrote:
They should compare the top 32 koreans with the top 32 foreigners instead. There are many bad foreigners in foreign events while the bad koreans do not participate in those tournaments. exactly what i was thinking, if they count mlg qualifier bracket they will have lots of matches vs master- mid gm US server Free wins before they even get to the best foreigneer players. While its only those koreans that actually think its worth investing time and money that come to fight the foreigneers.
You haven't really read the op, except to look at the shiny pictures, have you?
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On September 07 2012 09:59 Fionn wrote:
So you're telling me that Koreans, those folk from Asia, are better than everyone else?
Shit. Just. Got. Serious.
:D
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To all the people saying that only good Koreans fly abroad and play in foreign tournaments . . . . look at any big foreign tournament with heavy Korean participation and you can find tons and tons and tons of Koreans that would never dream of touching Code S. And yet they are more than capable enough of stomping through foreigners in online qualifiers.
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Very interesting that the gap continues to increase between foreigner and Korean skill.
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On September 07 2012 15:46 Sub40APM wrote:
For the first 12 months, foreigners had a chance. But then their general laziness and sloth got in the way and outside of a few genuinely talented people the rest stagnated while Koreans produced more and more talent.
Or, one could say the foreigners only stood a chance because the game was not figured out yet for the most part ... The same will be expected of hots, the koreans/foreigners might perform similar at the start, but 5 or so months after its release expect the gap to start widening alot. And with kespa in the scene now, Its only now going to get really fierce.
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Fenrax
United States5018 Posts
Wow, fuck these haters. Seriously. AMAZING work bro. Thanks for that. Very very insightful.
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Cool!
I love data, number crunching and graphs  . We all knew that Korea still holds the leading edge of SC2, but numbers are always good to observe for a closer look.
Thanks for collecting and presenting it all!
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EPT
