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Totally agree on TvZ being completely retarded right now (unless I'm obviously not a pro but a noob)... I really don't know what Blizz was thinking when patching towards this... Earlygame in TvZ is almost non-existent unless you do some all-in-ish bunker rush, the amount of creep spread in the first 10 mins (when done decent) is just ridiculous! Also Terran has no equivalent T3 army to go for in the lategame.
TvZ was always the perfect and most interesting matches to watch, but recently it's a mere joke  (Taeja being the only T left to qualify for Ro8)!
And referring to Terran having been imba for almost 1 years and a half obviously is just stupid IMO since that doesn't justify another race being imba in the current state of the game... Also the tendency of having dull macro-games in EVERY matchup where nothing happens until the 10+ min mark doesn't comfort me, since variations is what makes StarCraft interesting!
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Hero just rolfstomped Taeja 2:0 with a simple 2-base colo on that "asymmetrically imbalanced map" Cloud Kingdom. So there will be exactly 0 terrans in DHS ro8.
Well, I guess I'll watch GSL code S this evening... feels like the last stand.
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If you listend very carefully, you can hear the terrans singing "The Fields of Athenry"
Blasterion, are you still camping this thred? Maybe the time has come for some of your inspiring speeches. Sth like: The FEW, the Proud, the Terrans...?
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On June 18 2012 22:50 scypio wrote:
Hero just rolfstomped Taeja 2:0 with a simple 2-base colo on that "asymmetrically imbalanced map" Cloud Kingdom. So there will be exactly 0 terrans in DHS ro8.
Well, I guess I'll watch GSL code S this evening... feels like the last stand.
yea but see this is why you aren't a pro. if you think it was a 'simple 2 base colo'
there's much much more depth to a game than that.
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On June 18 2012 23:05 FataLe wrote:Show nested quote +On June 18 2012 22:50 scypio wrote:
Hero just rolfstomped Taeja 2:0 with a simple 2-base colo on that "asymmetrically imbalanced map" Cloud Kingdom. So there will be exactly 0 terrans in DHS ro8.
Well, I guess I'll watch GSL code S this evening... feels like the last stand. yea but see this is why you aren't a pro. if you think it was a 'simple 2 base colo' there's much much more depth to a game than that.
This "you're not a pro" talk is just ridiculous. I don't need to be a pro to watch a football game and I don't need to be a pro to watch starcraft. Also, I may like the games (or not like them) regardless of whether I play them or else.
I've been watching SC2 for a over a year and it's getting worse over the time. DHS seems to be just-another-nail-in-the coffin.
No wonder Blizzard is going to sell a million units of HoTS, that's the only saving grace in sight.
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On June 18 2012 20:30 scypio wrote:Show nested quote +On June 18 2012 20:14 Toadvine wrote:
See, this is the problem with continuing to balance the game around Zerg greed, TvZ was in a great place before the patch, because Terran could actually pressure Zerg and delay their third without being all-in. Now TvZ has turned into PvZ, where it's standard for Zerg to get to 70 drones with no units on the field, and then immediately tech to Hive when he confirms no all-in coming. I'm sorry, but this is just fucking retarded. In PvZ, the early and mid game basically don't exist unless either side all-ins. In a standard game, you go straight to late game, and that's just nonsensical.
And the solution is not to give Terran a lategame unit capable of handling Hive tech, that just makes the game even more boring. Blizzard really need to man up and nerf Spawn Larvae in HotS, so Zerg can actually play more reasonably. Yeah, I agree with the above. And, with the current state of meta there is one more thing that concerns me... SC2 nowadays is so horribly dull to watch. It started some time ago at the master/gm level, when Playhem daily cups become a ZvZ / ZvP fest. Now it's starting to take over major tournaments (look, there are 3 terrans in ro16 DHS, stacked in the same part of bracket!)... and probably GSL will be next. For me TvZ was the best matchup to watch before the make-ghosts-in-tvz-extinct nerf. And it's been going downhill from there, now it has more of TvP feeling then ever. There's one composition to rule them all (and a bit of horribly inefficient cheese) - and this is not a good thing.
PvP is actually my favorite matchup to play on the ladder nowadays. Sure, there's a lot of cheese and arbitrary BO advantages, but at least stuff actually happens, and I don't have to wait 10 in-game minutes before me or my opponent can do something.
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all of the match ups are crap nowadays,
HOTS has some fun units but since pros need balance they will all get nerfed into a specific metagame we're sure
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On June 18 2012 23:17 scypio wrote:Show nested quote +On June 18 2012 23:05 FataLe wrote:On June 18 2012 22:50 scypio wrote:
Hero just rolfstomped Taeja 2:0 with a simple 2-base colo on that "asymmetrically imbalanced map" Cloud Kingdom. So there will be exactly 0 terrans in DHS ro8.
Well, I guess I'll watch GSL code S this evening... feels like the last stand. yea but see this is why you aren't a pro. if you think it was a 'simple 2 base colo' there's much much more depth to a game than that. This "you're not a pro" talk is just ridiculous. I don't need to be a pro to watch a football game and I don't need to be a pro to watch starcraft. Also, I may like the games (or not like them) regardless of whether I play them or else. I've been watching SC2 for a over a year and it's getting worse over the time. DHS seems to be just-another-nail-in-the coffin. No wonder Blizzard is going to sell a million units of HoTS, that's the only saving grace in sight.
what i'm saying is you can't just pass something like a 2 base colo push as simple. There's much more to it than that. and that's what sets spectators apart from pros. they have depth. you don't. stop whining.
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On June 18 2012 23:37 FataLe wrote:
what i'm saying is you can't just pass something like a 2 base colo push as simple. There's much more to it than that. and that's what sets spectators apart from pros. they have depth. you don't. stop whining.
I'm the one watching the games and I'm the one judging them. I have all the right to whine. I can complain about a movie - I am not a movie director. I can complain about dish at a restaurant - I am not a chef. I can complain about a car I drive - I'm not an automotive engineer.
Can you see the analogy? Seriously, quit this "you're not a pro" talk, it's stupid.
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On June 18 2012 23:37 FataLe wrote:Show nested quote +On June 18 2012 23:17 scypio wrote:On June 18 2012 23:05 FataLe wrote:On June 18 2012 22:50 scypio wrote:
Hero just rolfstomped Taeja 2:0 with a simple 2-base colo on that "asymmetrically imbalanced map" Cloud Kingdom. So there will be exactly 0 terrans in DHS ro8.
Well, I guess I'll watch GSL code S this evening... feels like the last stand. yea but see this is why you aren't a pro. if you think it was a 'simple 2 base colo' there's much much more depth to a game than that. This "you're not a pro" talk is just ridiculous. I don't need to be a pro to watch a football game and I don't need to be a pro to watch starcraft. Also, I may like the games (or not like them) regardless of whether I play them or else. I've been watching SC2 for a over a year and it's getting worse over the time. DHS seems to be just-another-nail-in-the coffin. No wonder Blizzard is going to sell a million units of HoTS, that's the only saving grace in sight. what i'm saying is you can't just pass something like a 2 base colo push as simple. There's much more to it than that. and that's what sets spectators apart from pros. they have depth. you don't. stop whining.
So I expect you are a pro, so you can evaluate the movements of hero. It's wrong to say Hero's play was simple. But it's also wrong to overestimate every little move a (pro) player makes during a game. This insane glorification of banal moves really pisses me off. As if a nexus cancel is somewhat new or insanely creative these days. This stuff has been around forever. yeah it was a well executed 2base timing attack. But that's what you should expect at the very least from a (code s) pro player. This is nothing you should go crazy about.... -_-
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Complete crap. The mere hint of Z or P doing this poorly and you'd see an interview about bunker time nerfs.
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imo the best things that could be done to balance tvz are:
- The queen buff just needs to be removed or change range to 4. (it's pretty obvious that the queen buff was terrible and broke tvz)
- Slightly nerf infestors so they don't counter everything that terran uses - slight fungal nerf vs air so vikings aren't directly countered by infestors, or alternativy reduce fungal growths radius to 1.5 ( The same as every other spellcaster )
- Buff ghosts a little to say 35??? (Halfway between what it was before and what it is now)
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Haha, everyone, especially terrans claimed "dafuq" when they saw that queen buff. Now that terran is losing in both matchups internatinally and getting absolutely raped in Korea, I want to hear what exactly dustin and david thought when they implemented this....
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I think the lategame stage is fine if you micro well TvZ but getting there against good zergs is tough
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Please increase the build time of hive tech and 3/3 upgrades for toss and terran! The late game comes too fast in this game!!!
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4713 Posts
On June 18 2012 23:55 CaptainCrush wrote:
Haha, everyone, especially terrans claimed "dafuq" when they saw that queen buff. Now that terran is losing in both matchups internatinally and getting absolutely raped in Korea, I want to hear what exactly dustin and david thought when they implemented this....
Dustin and David are probably very happy with their patch, because their ultra-hyper super sophisticated statistical method of balancing and observing balance, tells them that the game is more balanced then it ever has been. For some reason the only balance issues that seem to pop up on their radar always involve buffing Toss/Zerg and/or nerfing Terran.
I really wish they would become aware of this and revert this nerf and a couple of other older ones, but I'm losing faith in them to actually properly balance the game.
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Why would you increase them relatively? lol that's stupid
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EPT
