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If this is true, then at least Scarlett has earned some prize money as of late, so she probably won't completely crash. Can't say the same for the other members, though.
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On May 04 2012 05:06 nkr wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 05:03 WolfintheSheep wrote:On May 04 2012 04:52 Mallidon wrote:On May 04 2012 04:43 Jono7272 wrote:On May 04 2012 04:40 nkr wrote:On May 04 2012 04:38 Jono7272 wrote:
So its pretty much a "hit this many viewers on your streams or don't get paid" kind of deal? Not cool. Eclypsia looking more and more like a very seedy organisation. Do you see anything wrong in Eclypsia wanting some ROI for the salary they offered? If they didn't like the deal then all they had to say was "no, thank you" and walk away. Lol, hitting so many viewers is not something anyone can guarantee. Its not a reasonable demand. What happens the weeks the players do not get 5000+ viewers? They don't get paid?If it was just, stream this many hours a week. That's fine. Stupid demands are stupid. If that is part of a contract they sign, then yes? Anyway, people can argue the rights and wrongs from both sides until they are blue in the face, doesn't change anything. Yet more forum drama full of people jumping to conclusions and using ANYTHING to discredit a team/ individual or whatever. There are far too many drama junkies in the 'Esports community'. And there are far too many forumgoers that can't seem to read. Try clicking on any of the articles before you start talking about drama junkies, like this one. Eclypsia refused to honour Quantic's existing contracts. Eclypsia started changing the terms of the agreement after pushing Quantic for contract releases. According to Eclypsia; that's not what happened.
Conflicting sources... typical.
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How to spot a bad/fake/inexperienced organisation that you don't want to affiliate yourself with:
1) Contact page, do they have one? Is there a phone number? An email adress? Not just a contact form.
2) Domain name, is it registered to a real person and not to some anonymous service?
3) Company details, is the team a registered company? Who registered it and how long have they been going?
4) Real names and photos of management, not nick names and empty profile pages.
Getting through these 4 points when being approached by an organisation is a must for players, unless the organisation is known ofc.
Looking at Eclypsia they fail at each one which kinda sums it up.
Edit: added some stuff.
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On May 04 2012 05:06 nkr wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 05:03 WolfintheSheep wrote:On May 04 2012 04:52 Mallidon wrote:On May 04 2012 04:43 Jono7272 wrote:On May 04 2012 04:40 nkr wrote:On May 04 2012 04:38 Jono7272 wrote:
So its pretty much a "hit this many viewers on your streams or don't get paid" kind of deal? Not cool. Eclypsia looking more and more like a very seedy organisation. Do you see anything wrong in Eclypsia wanting some ROI for the salary they offered? If they didn't like the deal then all they had to say was "no, thank you" and walk away. Lol, hitting so many viewers is not something anyone can guarantee. Its not a reasonable demand. What happens the weeks the players do not get 5000+ viewers? They don't get paid?If it was just, stream this many hours a week. That's fine. Stupid demands are stupid. If that is part of a contract they sign, then yes? Anyway, people can argue the rights and wrongs from both sides until they are blue in the face, doesn't change anything. Yet more forum drama full of people jumping to conclusions and using ANYTHING to discredit a team/ individual or whatever. There are far too many drama junkies in the 'Esports community'. And there are far too many forumgoers that can't seem to read. Try clicking on any of the articles before you start talking about drama junkies, like this one. Eclypsia refused to honour Quantic's existing contracts. Eclypsia started changing the terms of the agreement after pushing Quantic for contract releases. According to Eclypsia; that's not what happened.
I don't see where eC says that didn't happen. Can you please show me?
What I read is eC saying everything Mysstress said was true, but in a "nicer" language.
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On May 04 2012 05:06 nkr wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 05:03 WolfintheSheep wrote:On May 04 2012 04:52 Mallidon wrote:On May 04 2012 04:43 Jono7272 wrote:On May 04 2012 04:40 nkr wrote:On May 04 2012 04:38 Jono7272 wrote:
So its pretty much a "hit this many viewers on your streams or don't get paid" kind of deal? Not cool. Eclypsia looking more and more like a very seedy organisation. Do you see anything wrong in Eclypsia wanting some ROI for the salary they offered? If they didn't like the deal then all they had to say was "no, thank you" and walk away. Lol, hitting so many viewers is not something anyone can guarantee. Its not a reasonable demand. What happens the weeks the players do not get 5000+ viewers? They don't get paid?If it was just, stream this many hours a week. That's fine. Stupid demands are stupid. If that is part of a contract they sign, then yes? Anyway, people can argue the rights and wrongs from both sides until they are blue in the face, doesn't change anything. Yet more forum drama full of people jumping to conclusions and using ANYTHING to discredit a team/ individual or whatever. There are far too many drama junkies in the 'Esports community'. And there are far too many forumgoers that can't seem to read. Try clicking on any of the articles before you start talking about drama junkies, like this one. Eclypsia refused to honour Quantic's existing contracts. Eclypsia started changing the terms of the agreement after pushing Quantic for contract releases. According to Eclypsia; that's not what happened.
Taking Eclypsia's statement at face value is even worse, because it basically says that after a single week the DOTA2 players couldn't stream for 10 hours/day and/or didn't reach 5k viewers. After one week. So they dropped them.
And this is probably before they even got equipment to do streaming.
So yeah, Eclypsia's statement is basically pure BS.
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On May 04 2012 05:03 WolfintheSheep wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 04:52 Mallidon wrote:On May 04 2012 04:43 Jono7272 wrote:On May 04 2012 04:40 nkr wrote:On May 04 2012 04:38 Jono7272 wrote:
So its pretty much a "hit this many viewers on your streams or don't get paid" kind of deal? Not cool. Eclypsia looking more and more like a very seedy organisation. Do you see anything wrong in Eclypsia wanting some ROI for the salary they offered? If they didn't like the deal then all they had to say was "no, thank you" and walk away. Lol, hitting so many viewers is not something anyone can guarantee. Its not a reasonable demand. What happens the weeks the players do not get 5000+ viewers? They don't get paid?If it was just, stream this many hours a week. That's fine. Stupid demands are stupid. If that is part of a contract they sign, then yes? Anyway, people can argue the rights and wrongs from both sides until they are blue in the face, doesn't change anything. Yet more forum drama full of people jumping to conclusions and using ANYTHING to discredit a team/ individual or whatever. There are far too many drama junkies in the 'Esports community'. And there are far too many forumgoers that can't seem to read. Try clicking on any of the articles before you start talking about drama junkies, like this one. Eclypsia refused to honour Quantic's existing contracts. Eclypsia started changing the terms of the agreement after pushing Quantic for contract releases.
And there are many people who make sweeping generalisations about if someone has read up on a subject before posting or not. I've read the article and see nothing from either side that proves beyond doubt that there was something sinister or unjust going on from either side.
I also don't know why absolutely EVERYTHING has to be dragged up on forums for the pitchfork crowd EVERY TIME something someone doesn't like happens.
On May 04 2012 05:03 Berailfor wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 04:52 Mallidon wrote:On May 04 2012 04:43 Jono7272 wrote:On May 04 2012 04:40 nkr wrote:On May 04 2012 04:38 Jono7272 wrote:
So its pretty much a "hit this many viewers on your streams or don't get paid" kind of deal? Not cool. Eclypsia looking more and more like a very seedy organisation. Do you see anything wrong in Eclypsia wanting some ROI for the salary they offered? If they didn't like the deal then all they had to say was "no, thank you" and walk away. Lol, hitting so many viewers is not something anyone can guarantee. Its not a reasonable demand. What happens the weeks the players do not get 5000+ viewers? They don't get paid?If it was just, stream this many hours a week. That's fine. Stupid demands are stupid. If that is part of a contract they sign, then yes? Anyway, people can argue the rights and wrongs from both sides until they are blue in the face, doesn't change anything. Yet more forum drama full of people jumping to conclusions and using ANYTHING to discredit a team/ individual or whatever. There are far too many drama junkies in the 'Esports community'. Edit On May 04 2012 04:50 TigerKarl wrote:
Anyone who supports Eclypsia is willingly risking the integrity of E-Sports.
I knew from March 30th on, that this "organization" must be withdrawn from E-Sports, even after they revealed their April fools "joke" to be a hoax on April 1st, i kept pointing a finger on them for risking the face of professional E-Sports for selfish PR-reasons. I heard many people say that they liked this "organizations" april fools, but i really hope that now everyone realizes that these amateur clowns have to be stopped.
Only sad thing here is that they managed to lure in some good players, first and foremost Scarlett. I hope she can get out of there. And stop being butthurt for falling for an April fools joke. Your absolutely right. If it was a contract they signed about the 5000 viewers then so be it. The guy was stupid for signing a contract that he didn't get paid when he didn't generate 5000 viewers (which is 100% TOTALLY unreasonable). But that isn't what happened. That was not in the contract. If it was then Eclypsia wouldn't have claimed this as a "verbal agreement" and the other guy wouldn't be claiming that this was never specified. I'm not 100% saying Eclyspia DIDN'T specify this. But your 100% saying they DID. Which is just as bad. And giving a team with a real bad track record the benefit of the doubt. Like I stated in my previous post. I think that Eclypsia is LYING. Why you ask? Because would you ever agree to "you won't get paid unless you generate 5K viewers?" of course not.. Because if your at all intelligent then you'd know that going to be impossible for someone who isn't well known. So if the guy who joined is AT ALL intelligent he wouldn't have agreed to that. I think Eclyspia is not only lying, but taking advantage of the fact that they can recruit players who are semi-desperate for a team.
You think.
Exactly my point. Neither you nor I know what terms were agreed to. All we have is the word of one party against the word of another.
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On May 04 2012 05:13 dignitasNewmaN wrote:
How to spot a bad/fake/inexperienced organisation that you don't want to affiliate yourself with:
1) Contact page, do they have one? Is there a phone number? An email adress? Not just a contact form.
2) Domain name, is it registered to a real person and not to some anonymous service?
3) Company details, is the team a registered company? Who registered it and how long have they been going?
Getting through these 3 points when being approached by an organisation is a must for players, unless the organisation is known ofc.
I'm honestly astounded at the fact that they managed to even attract such investment (if they did of course) with such a poor approach the professionalism and even just legitimacy? It doesn't make sense at all
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it's not that they are hurting esports. they just suck at it. that and running a respectable storefront which is the name of the game right now. they probably won't get hurt in court for any of this but the situation just makes them look really unprofessional. if they were a protoss player, idra would call them gimmicky.
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On May 04 2012 05:13 windzor wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 05:06 nkr wrote:On May 04 2012 05:03 WolfintheSheep wrote:On May 04 2012 04:52 Mallidon wrote:On May 04 2012 04:43 Jono7272 wrote:On May 04 2012 04:40 nkr wrote:On May 04 2012 04:38 Jono7272 wrote:
So its pretty much a "hit this many viewers on your streams or don't get paid" kind of deal? Not cool. Eclypsia looking more and more like a very seedy organisation. Do you see anything wrong in Eclypsia wanting some ROI for the salary they offered? If they didn't like the deal then all they had to say was "no, thank you" and walk away. Lol, hitting so many viewers is not something anyone can guarantee. Its not a reasonable demand. What happens the weeks the players do not get 5000+ viewers? They don't get paid?If it was just, stream this many hours a week. That's fine. Stupid demands are stupid. If that is part of a contract they sign, then yes? Anyway, people can argue the rights and wrongs from both sides until they are blue in the face, doesn't change anything. Yet more forum drama full of people jumping to conclusions and using ANYTHING to discredit a team/ individual or whatever. There are far too many drama junkies in the 'Esports community'. And there are far too many forumgoers that can't seem to read. Try clicking on any of the articles before you start talking about drama junkies, like this one. Eclypsia refused to honour Quantic's existing contracts. Eclypsia started changing the terms of the agreement after pushing Quantic for contract releases. According to Eclypsia; that's not what happened. I don't see where eC says that didn't happen. Can you please show me? What I read is eC saying everything Mysstress said was true, but in a "nicer" language.
"Eclypsia conditions to recruiting a team included capacities to stream and generate a specified audience.
A verbal agreement was found with Mystress ‘ Danish team to be transferred to Eclypsia on the base of the understanding and the acceptation of these conditions."
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On May 04 2012 05:00 DeepElemBlues wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 04:50 TigerKarl wrote:
Anyone who supports Eclypsia is willingly risking the integrity of E-Sports.
I knew from March 30th on, that this "organization" must be withdrawn from E-Sports, even after they revealed their April fools "joke" to be a hoax on April 1st, i kept pointing a finger on them for risking the face of professional E-Sports for selfish PR-reasons. I heard many people say that they liked this "organizations" april fools, but i really hope that now everyone realizes that these amateur clowns have to be stopped.
Only sad thing here is that they managed to lure in some good players, first and foremost Scarlett. I hope she can get out of there. don't support them then, you don't have to actively go after them. being a part of the e-sports community shouldn't mean you get a free tote bag with a pitchfork in it and that pitchfork has to be pulled out every time you don't like something i thought people complaining about the grab the pitchforks mentality were being a little overdramatic when it was brought up during the destiny drama but now i'm not so sure.
And Katu and Orb.
A large proportion of this community sickens me.
Don't people have better things to do?
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The meme thead on eclypsia forums has to be the funniest bit of reading i have seen in a while, literally 2 serious suggestions which could be accepted. Is there any part of their organization which isn't a complete disaster?
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On May 04 2012 05:22 Mantraz wrote:
The meme thead on eclypsia forums has to be the funniest bit of reading i have seen in a while, literally 2 serious suggestions which could be accepted. Is there any part of their organization which isn't a complete disaster?
The money behind it. Though it's a shady business, it's certainly a very wealthy one.
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The point is, if Mystress have only a verbal account of things and nothing on paper from Eclypsia which Eclypsia refuses to live up to... there is nothing to dwell on here. Eclypsia decided not to work with those guys and thats that.
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On May 04 2012 05:21 scarrow wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 05:00 DeepElemBlues wrote:On May 04 2012 04:50 TigerKarl wrote:
Anyone who supports Eclypsia is willingly risking the integrity of E-Sports.
I knew from March 30th on, that this "organization" must be withdrawn from E-Sports, even after they revealed their April fools "joke" to be a hoax on April 1st, i kept pointing a finger on them for risking the face of professional E-Sports for selfish PR-reasons. I heard many people say that they liked this "organizations" april fools, but i really hope that now everyone realizes that these amateur clowns have to be stopped.
Only sad thing here is that they managed to lure in some good players, first and foremost Scarlett. I hope she can get out of there. don't support them then, you don't have to actively go after them. being a part of the e-sports community shouldn't mean you get a free tote bag with a pitchfork in it and that pitchfork has to be pulled out every time you don't like something i thought people complaining about the grab the pitchforks mentality were being a little overdramatic when it was brought up during the destiny drama but now i'm not so sure. And Katu and Orb. A large proportion of this community sickens me. Don't people have better things to do?
You should ask the same of the people you listed.
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On May 04 2012 05:21 scarrow wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 05:00 DeepElemBlues wrote:On May 04 2012 04:50 TigerKarl wrote:
Anyone who supports Eclypsia is willingly risking the integrity of E-Sports.
I knew from March 30th on, that this "organization" must be withdrawn from E-Sports, even after they revealed their April fools "joke" to be a hoax on April 1st, i kept pointing a finger on them for risking the face of professional E-Sports for selfish PR-reasons. I heard many people say that they liked this "organizations" april fools, but i really hope that now everyone realizes that these amateur clowns have to be stopped.
Only sad thing here is that they managed to lure in some good players, first and foremost Scarlett. I hope she can get out of there. don't support them then, you don't have to actively go after them. being a part of the e-sports community shouldn't mean you get a free tote bag with a pitchfork in it and that pitchfork has to be pulled out every time you don't like something i thought people complaining about the grab the pitchforks mentality were being a little overdramatic when it was brought up during the destiny drama but now i'm not so sure. And Katu and Orb. A large proportion of this community sickens me. Don't people have better things to do?
Getting pissy over words is idiotic, but this is something the community should actually be a part of.
We're talking about potentially screwing with teams contracts and players livelihoods through ignorance and/or negligence. Eclypsia made an offer to a team, the team accepted it, Eclypsia contacted Quantic to arrange a release of the current contract, and then started to add more terms on to the agreement.
So now the DOTA2 team is in some weird limbo state, where they are signed to a team that thought they were about to leave.
Even if the community can't get Eclypsia to shape up, players need to know that the team they're getting offers from is extremely unprofessional.
On May 04 2012 05:24 iDope wrote:
The point is, if Mystress have only a verbal account of things and nothing on paper from Eclypsia which Eclypsia refuses to live up to... there is nothing to dwell on here. Eclypsia decided not to work with those guys and thats that.
Except Eclypsia was already trying to get Quantic to drop the team. The only saving grace here is that Quantic didn't release the contracts yet.
I'm pretty sure that since it reached that point, Eclypsia could be brought up for estoppel. Of course...no one actually has the money to go to court.
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On May 04 2012 05:23 Otolia wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 05:22 Mantraz wrote:
The meme thead on eclypsia forums has to be the funniest bit of reading i have seen in a while, literally 2 serious suggestions which could be accepted. Is there any part of their organization which isn't a complete disaster? The money behind it. Though it's a shady business, it's certainly a very wealthy one.
How do we know tho, I could make a professional website and contact players with an unreleastic contract aswell.
As I've said before, Eclypsia doesn't have ANY sponsors, I would really like to know from some of the Eclypsia players if they actually received their promised salaries.
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Too much misinformation floating around. Given gaming history, odds suggest that the business acumen of the team/manager is lacking, and they were unable to meet what they agreed they would uphold. Eclypsia wanted to walk away and says as much in their statement, even specifying that people need to take the conditions seriously.
Unless something more concrete comes out, there's not much one can do.
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This is so ironic after the whole April fools thing
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Dumb April Fools joke, meme contest about their own players and now talks of this. Can't say I'm too surprised, this team is a mess.
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EPT
