Where did all of the terrans go? - Page 54

On March 15 2012 07:35 ChaosTerran wrote:


It's extremely difficult to scout certain all-ins.

Say you scan and see 3 gate and a robo but no unit. Now this could either be 3 gate immortal all-in, 3/4 gate warp prism all-in or 1 base collossus all-in. You don't know if you scan revealed every tech building or of the protoss has something proxied. It's easier to scout terran because we don't have a "robotics-bay" like building that we can hide somewhere to disguise our tech.

If I want to beat mass immortal all-ins I need constant marine production and don't want to tech too much, same goes for warp prism all-ins, however against 1 base collossus, I want fast tech and vikings.... it is more based on luck than anything.

And what if you scan and only see 3 gates? Now this could be pretty much anything... 3 gate void ray, immortal, collossus, etc.. 3 gate void ray you want a bunker on the highground, but you dont want to do that against collossus or immotal all-ins. It's really hard to read sometimes, and I personally explained this many times now, scan is NOT a reliable way of scouting unless your assumption is that you always know exactly where your opponent builds all his tech buildings... which is impossible... unless you have maphacks, in which case you don't need to scan anyway.

And what all-ins does terran have that protoss needs to be "really" scared of? The way I see it, I need to make exactly 3 decisions to survive as protoss. 1. is he fast expoing yes/no 2. is he 2 raxing yes/no 3. is he 1/1/1ing. Anything else is pretty much irrelevant. As soon as I know 1 I can definitively rule out 2 or 3, if I know it's 2 I can rule out 1 and 3 and if I know it's 3 I can definitively rule out 1 and 2. However, as a terran, knowing that my opponent is not expoing is only half the deal, even scouting 3 gates and a robo doesn't let me conclude which build I'm facing.

And realistically.. what difference does it make for a protoss if the terran 1 gate expands or 1/1/1s? if you know he's not 2 raxing (say you scout with zealot and stalker and see no add-on on the barracks) then you are pretty much set to go 1 gate expo against either build. The only real distinction you have to make until you have observers is 2rax or expo/111 2 rax, you can hold with 1 gate expo, but it's hard, agaisnt expo or 111 you even want to 1 gate expo. The only "build" that really beats early protoss expos is 3 rax marine scv all-ins, which is very easy to scout (misses several scvs, no gas, no command center on the low ground, granted that doesn't automatically mean its all-in, but it's another indicator once you have scouted a lack of scvs.). There really isn't all that much a protoss player has to worry about in the very earlygame, in fact statistically, early game is when P is stronger than T, it's only midgame that sort of saves terran in TvP as lategame is heavily P favored aswell. (playhem statistics/MLG stats)

edit: And scouting by pressuring the protoss is pretty much a non-option. If you 1 rax expand, you dont have enough units at any point in the early game to pressure the protoss and even if that was the case, without stim marines get outrun by stalkers and can't do anything about forcefields, so if you want to lose your entire army, fine go ahead and "pressure" with a few marines, but what's it really going to achieve, you throw units away and fall behind against everything, be it all-ins or macro game. You can't do that at all.

On March 15 2012 07:39 Fission wrote:


Pretty typical condescending reply from a position of entitlement. Why are you posting in this thread if you are only here to belittle people?

On March 15 2012 08:33 Sein wrote:
Playing terran becomes incredibly frustrating if you like long macro games. Blizzard really seems to like the idea of making terran a race that has to race against the clock every game. What blizzard's been doing with all their patches over the past year is really forcing terran players to rely on all-ins early-mid game, which earns the race even more hate. All three races apparently find vT the easiest matchup, and you can tell that quite a few of the remaining terran players are considering switching to a different race because custom games seem to feature even fewer terrans, as in you play a protoss and later check his profile to see that his main race is terran in many instances