Bronze level players - Page 22

On March 14 2012 22:36 Monkeyballs25 wrote:
http://drop.sc/130077
http://drop.sc/23286

Two replays there, both are executing a 1-1-1 build.
One has 24 SCVs, 14 marines, 3 tanks, 2 banshees and 1 hellion at 9:00.
One has 23 SCVs,14 marines, 2 tanks, 2 vikings and 1 raven at 9:00.

One was a sample replay pulled from this guide on stopping the 1-1-1.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=250379
One was my encounter with a bronze leaguer in EU season 6.

Which is which, and why?

On March 14 2012 16:02 Lysenko wrote:
Huh? A high school student who starts learning about calculus is getting better at math. I don't get your point. (In my example, it's not like the bronze league players are learning that some units can't hit air and then deliberately making those units vs. air anyway, so it is a meaningful improvement, even if a small one.)

Oh yeah, who?? Everyone I have ever met in real life who has touched the game bought it in the first couple months. I have not met one person, not one single person, who started in the last year. (I do know a couple who took breaks and came back, so to some extent those folks may be coming in near the bottom.)

My sense is that bottom bronze is probably about the same. The active players in bronze who stand a good chance of promotion are certainly playing as well as silver players around the time of release. Meanwhile, silver, gold, platinum have kind of compressed in the middle -- I find that random fluctuation in my win rate has me oscillating between silver, gold, and platinum opponents, which tells me that high silver through low plat are a pretty narrow skill difference as measured by win likelihood (because of the rock/scissors/paper effect of complementary skills that came up earlier on this page.) That entire range are pretty much where low plat were after the introduction of master league, at least based on the macro you would see looking at old replays.

Meanwhile, I have no personal basis to guess, but I wouldn't be surprised if diamond and up had stretched out like you suggest.

On March 15 2012 01:18 HyperionDreamer wrote:
So your win rate is fluctuating your league placement, that's how the ladder system works. I can tell you from doing occasional coaching that silver and plat are absolutely light years apart in terms of game understanding.

On March 15 2012 01:18 HyperionDreamer wrote:
You said that bronze players have learned that banshees don't hit air units. That's learning about existence. There's a huge difference between that and actually learning to properly do a 2port banshee allin.

I don't really see the need to respond to the Gheed stuff, since he's already personally responded and basically confirmed my points exactly.

Anyone who buys starcraft 2 is defined as "coming in" to the system. I'd look up the overall sales of starcraft 2, because I'm sure that it's sold more than a few thousand copies per month.

On March 14 2012 23:19 lazyitachi wrote:



and yet sc2gear says zimson is gold.. sounds like a cool story.
So your measure of skill is executing an all-in build that cuts scv production?
I wonder why you even comment.

On March 15 2012 04:49 Neo.NEt wrote:

On that note, I pretty much guarantee that I could get anyone over 12 years old out of bronze EASILY if they actually wanted to be.

On March 15 2012 02:53 Monkeyballs25 wrote:


Its a measure of smoothly executing a build order to the point where its barely distinguishable from a presumably much higher level player. Just because it cuts SCVs doesn't really change the difficulty of it one way or another. I can't think of a better way to benchmark someone's basic macro ability.

He was in bronze when I played him, can't say how or why. Since I'm not in bronze myself, its only the up and comers I'm likely to see. Besides, I'd thought you'd be happy to find evidence of someone using solid build order execution to get out of bronze

On March 15 2012 10:06 lazyitachi wrote:


It only takes 60 real life apm sitting in base literally staring at his army to get out of bronze into gold.

Thus if this is all it takes then I don't expect permabronze to be any good at all.
Which shows that if such a simple execution is all it takes then they are doing something wrong to still be in bronze.

On March 15 2012 04:49 Neo.NEt wrote:
Honestly I stopped reading after you starting talking about "accepting the fact that you are a bronze level player". Personally I hate being bad at anything and I'll work as hard as necessary to be good at anything, no matter what it is.

On that note, I pretty much guarantee that I could get anyone over 12 years old out of bronze EASILY if they actually wanted to be.