EPTMonetizing Starcraft / LordJerith rant. Thoughts? - Page 22
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xSixGeneralHan
United States528 Posts
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Duravi
United States1205 Posts
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MannerMan
371 Posts
If the average viewer were 30 or 35 then maybe PPV would make the most sense. | ||
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SupLilSon
Malaysia4123 Posts
User was warned for this post | ||
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gnatinator
Canada169 Posts
On February 10 2012 06:02 Carnagath wrote: There are ways to go about monetizing something, some of them more clever than others. What's certain is that pure hatred towards a whole community is far from a healthy start. E-sports are an experimental market, there are no set rules, if you have no personal investment and passion for it all you will manage to do is fuck up everything you touch. After reading through these quotes I have to say I do not have any respect for LordJerith and his position as head of vVv Gaming. His attitude has no place in the Starcraft community. | ||
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LordJerith
United States92 Posts
On February 10 2012 06:09 SupLilSon wrote: Wow, I actually just listened to the guys rant... he sounds like a total moron. Saying stuff like, "most people watching streams are kids who don't make money, and are probably sucking someone's dick". How exactly does he expect to gain fan support? Not to mention he talks about how he makes bank without actually working at all and cusses every other word while claiming to be "highly educated". No wonder VVV is going nowhere with this guys spearheading that organization. I never said anything like that. Come on now. Please quote accurately, that is simply just not true. As far as it being a rant, it's purpose is to stir the pot. Even if you disagree with how its delivered, I think it's best to stick to the topic of the message itself. | ||
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SACtheXchng
168 Posts
On February 10 2012 03:53 Chill wrote: This stupid comment is the crux of the problem. "Spend your money to give me free content or don't bother." Ridiculous. It's ESPORTS, not C(harity)SPORTS Chill, that's the second time you're using the term "Charity", and it's the second time I'm feeling offended by it. It's insulting to the community of content consumers of which I am a part. So here we go again: Yes, I (and many others) consume free SC2 content. No, we're not asking for charity in this thread. Au contraire. This thread exists because content producers are asking the community (i.e. us) for charity. They are asking us to pay $X for content that's worth $Y (where Y<X), ore else "ZOMG ESPORTS will die". We are the ones who get fingers pointed at us, that if we don't DONATE (yes, that's what it is) we are spoiled brats, and if ESPORTS dies, then it's our fault. BULLSHIT!!! If ESPORTS dies, it's the fault of incompetent companies who tried jumping on a bandwaggon, seeing big bucks. If ESPORTS dies, it's the fault of these companies not earning these big bucks and hence asking for donations from the fans now. If ESPORTS dies, it's the fault of "Pro" gamers who throw games out of (in)convenience. I could probably name a few more if I could be bothered, but one thing I am absolutely sure about: If ESPORTS dies, it's NOT the fault of consumers who are unwilling to pay to watch people play a video game. If leagues want to charge fees PPV style, I'm the last one to tell them not to. I know however that the day the last freely viewable tournament will begin charging, will be the last day of me consuming SC2 content. | ||
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crms
United States11933 Posts
On February 10 2012 05:44 Boblhead wrote: this is soo true, I don't know anyone who actually orders UFC through ppv, all my friends usually just head to the bar I'm not sure which numbers you're referring too because they report different numbers. They report live attendance (how many people in the stadium), live gate (how much they sold in tickets), BUY RATE (how many purchased the PPV, includes bar purchases) and viewership (how many people they speculate watch based on a lot of factors). The last item viewership could be inflated if they overestimate (I'm sure they do) but the buy rate (how many purchased) isn't inflated. Also if you go to a bar to watch a UFC PPV, while you, yourself may be saving money, the bars can spend upwards $5,000 PER event. They don't pay the same rate as a private consumer. I'm sure some bars order it without proper licensing but it's illegal. Anyway, I hope we get away from UFC (mma model) vs eSports soon, they aren't even close. Perhaps you can compare eSports now to MMA from 1999-2002 era. | ||
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SupLilSon
Malaysia4123 Posts
On February 10 2012 06:14 LordJerith wrote: I never said anything like that. Come on now. Are you serious? I almost quoted you word for word. Good thing your podcast is online so I can find the exact minute and second where you said that. 52:30 and onwards. Come on now. | ||
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LordJerith
United States92 Posts
On February 10 2012 06:06 Arcanne wrote: this guy ranting is hilarious Thanks! It's supposed to be entertaining. | ||
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Scribble
2077 Posts
On February 10 2012 06:02 Carnagath wrote: There are ways to go about monetizing something, some of them more clever than others. What's certain is that pure hatred towards a whole community is far from a healthy start. E-sports are an experimental market, there are no set rules, if you have no personal investment and passion for it all you will manage to do is fuck up everything you touch. I agree that there are better ways to monetize. I'm still not seeing the whole "hatred for an entire community," thing in the quote you posted. That's a pretty kind way to describe the types of people who hang out whining in stream chats. | ||
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LordJerith
United States92 Posts
On February 10 2012 06:05 Novalisk wrote: Never liked LordJerith. He acts like a tip-top businessman but has nothing to show for it. Nothing to show for it? I wouldn't call vVv gaming and all we do "nothing." Too many people work very hard to deliver on all what we do. Never liking me. . . well. . . that is perfectly fine :-) | ||
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karpo
Sweden1998 Posts
On February 10 2012 06:14 SACtheXchng wrote: Chill, that's the second time you're using the term "Charity", and it's the second time I'm feeling offended by it. It's insulting to the community of content consumers of which I am a part. So here we go again: Yes, I (and many others) consume free SC2 content. No, we're not asking for charity in this thread. Au contraire. This thread exists because content producers are asking the community (i.e. us) for charity. They are asking us to pay $X for content that's worth $Y (where Y<X), ore else "ZOMG ESPORTS will die". We are the ones who get fingers pointed at us, that if we don't DONATE (yes, that's what it is) we are spoiled brats, and if ESPORTS dies, then it's our fault. BULLSHIT!!! If ESPORTS dies, it's the fault of incompetent companies who tried jumping on a bandwaggon, seeing big bucks. If ESPORTS dies, it's the fault of these companies not earning these big bucks and hence asking for donations from the fans now. If ESPORTS dies, it's the fault of "Pro" gamers who throw games out of (in)convenience. I could probably name a few more if I could be bothered, but one thing I am absolutely sure about: If ESPORTS dies, it's NOT the fault of consumers who are unwilling to pay to watch people play a video game. If leagues want to charge fees PPV style, I'm the last one to tell them not to. I know however that the day the last freely viewable tournament will begin charging, will be the last day of me consuming SC2 content. I'm sorry but wtf? You say that someone creating content and wants to charge people for it are the ones to blame? Wanting to get paid for your work is asking for charity? What do you do? You watch stuff for free and add nothing to the "esport" you watch beside maybe some commercial revenue. Where in the world do you get similar content for free, legally? The entitlement is just astounding, especially when you imply that esports dying would not be due to people being cheap. | ||
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LordJerith
United States92 Posts
On February 10 2012 06:18 SupLilSon wrote: Are you serious? I almost quoted you word for word. Good thing your podcast is online so I can find the exact minute and second where you said that. 52:30 and onwards. Come on now. I NEVER said they were "sucking dick." Yea, you "almost" quoted me alright, lol. | ||
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SugarBear
United States842 Posts
On February 10 2012 05:42 gnatinator wrote: PPV is likely not the right business model for esports. Trying to fit a square peg into a round hole just reaks of corporate laziness. The numbers for UFC are massively inflated due to its broadcast in gyms, bars, etc. These numbers do not directly translate into $20-$30 each. Wouldn't that make the number DEFLATED since there would be more people watching in a gym/bar/etc. than if each sale was a single individual? | ||
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m4inbrain
1505 Posts
On February 10 2012 06:18 SupLilSon wrote: Are you serious? I almost quoted you word for word. Good thing your podcast is online so I can find the exact minute and second where you said that. 52:30 and onwards. Come on now. Im pretty sure that hes saying "sucking of someones' tip" or something like that. Doesnt sound like "dick" to me. But then again, just hearing this blabbering for like 2 minutes to check what he said, gave me a headache. To be honest? I dont know who he tried to impress, but dicking around and fishing for compliments doesnt really help. edit: on a more serious note.. Im actually baffled that someone whos swearing and cursing all over the place in a public cast calls himself "highly educated". I actually think its pretty stupid, and your whole "performance" there pretty infantile. If you want to look serious, be serious. Have a point and explain it. What you did is just "polemics", the kind of talk you do if youre close to clinical death in a bar with 3 friends. | ||
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gnatinator
Canada169 Posts
On February 10 2012 06:22 SugarBear wrote: Wouldn't that make the number DEFLATED since there would be more people watching in a gym/bar/etc. than if each sale was a single individual? You're kidding yourself if you think UFC PR is counting viewers in that fashion. | ||
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karpo
Sweden1998 Posts
On February 10 2012 06:22 SugarBear wrote: Wouldn't that make the number DEFLATED since there would be more people watching in a gym/bar/etc. than if each sale was a single individual? I'm pretty sure bars need to pay more to show the content OR the UFC has some kind of average viewer/bar thing that inflates numbers. | ||
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Trentelshark
Canada385 Posts
That said is he right? Probably, any business model is based off making money at the end of the day. Is it absolutely viable today like UFC? Probably not. Recall UFC's popularity has picked up more since the free series (Ultimate Fighter), and broadcasting of free fight nights here and there. eSports is no different, but eventually will have to transition to a PPV format period as costs increase, etc. | ||
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DoomsVille
Canada4885 Posts
At the moment all of them are just trying to deliver as much content as possible. They are fighting for broadcasting slots, viewers, sponsors, and the time of players. It just isn't sustainable. Some of them will die under the current system. And of course, since one of them doesn't charge, none of them can. How can any justify forcing payment if the others don't? It just doesn't make sense. Ad revenue and sponsors will only take you so far. But you don't create anything sustainable until the viewers are paying for something. With TV you pay for cable, with UFC you pay to watch the fights, with movies you pay for tickets... there is some overarching monetization system. That doesn't exist in SC2. Unfortunately it can't exist until the major players start co-operating with each other. | ||
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