|
On February 03 2012 04:32 dAPhREAk wrote:Show nested quote +On February 03 2012 04:11 sermokala wrote:On February 03 2012 04:03 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 04:00 Teejing wrote:
Sounds pretty illegal to me. Any Lawer interested to share his wisom with us? not going to do any specific research so take it with a grain of salt. in California, US, it would be considered a breach of contract (unless there is a term stating they can change their terms at any time for a full refund; i'm not reading the TOC), and arguably its a violation of California's Unfair Competition Law, Cal. Bus. & Prof. Code section 17200 because its an unfair business practice (most likely a bait and switch, but also potentially other violations). may also be a violation of the consumer legal remedies act as well. what is ironic about this whole thing is that my mlg membership page still says i am entitled to HQ through April 2014. so, all i have to do is take a screenshot and mlg is fucking in hot water if they get sued. don't be stupid. first off they're based in NY so all cali law doesn't matter. If you want to look for a legal route start reading this. https://accounts.majorleaguegaming.com/membership_terms_of_serviceFun fact TOS's are every companies best friend. People don't read them and they pretty much protect them in any case. "don't be stupid." unless there is an enforceable choice of law clause in the TOS, which California courts love to refuse to enforce in adhesive contracts (like the TOS in this case), California law applies for persons injured in California. moreover, california and new york law are very similar, so it wouldn't matter in any case.
This boggles the mind. Its not a contract its an agreement. And you do consent to have everything done in a NY court. they do have a term stating that they can change it at any time.
|
As long as u guys get something i can buy to watch sc2 in HD from europe ill be happy. 30-50 dollar a year is fine for me.
|
How about a "no gimmicks, just HD" subscription level. I don't want MLG 'features' I will never use, I just want HD...
|
On February 03 2012 04:04 Boblhead wrote:Show nested quote +On February 03 2012 04:01 Yaki wrote:
MLG completely changing lately, don't know what has gotten into them they are downsizing. loss of sponsers or lack of sponser payout is my guess.
They are doing a "reduction in force" which is common in companies that are being back by other people's money. Obviously they did not do a very good job of meeting whatever numbers/goals they projected and had to regroup.
|
Just got a response (within ~2 minutes) that it will be refunded. Hope there will be a $30ish HD package for us EU users too!
|
On February 03 2012 04:36 sermokala wrote:Show nested quote +On February 03 2012 04:32 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 04:11 sermokala wrote:On February 03 2012 04:03 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 04:00 Teejing wrote:
Sounds pretty illegal to me. Any Lawer interested to share his wisom with us? not going to do any specific research so take it with a grain of salt. in California, US, it would be considered a breach of contract (unless there is a term stating they can change their terms at any time for a full refund; i'm not reading the TOC), and arguably its a violation of California's Unfair Competition Law, Cal. Bus. & Prof. Code section 17200 because its an unfair business practice (most likely a bait and switch, but also potentially other violations). may also be a violation of the consumer legal remedies act as well. what is ironic about this whole thing is that my mlg membership page still says i am entitled to HQ through April 2014. so, all i have to do is take a screenshot and mlg is fucking in hot water if they get sued. don't be stupid. first off they're based in NY so all cali law doesn't matter. If you want to look for a legal route start reading this. https://accounts.majorleaguegaming.com/membership_terms_of_serviceFun fact TOS's are every companies best friend. People don't read them and they pretty much protect them in any case. "don't be stupid." unless there is an enforceable choice of law clause in the TOS, which California courts love to refuse to enforce in adhesive contracts (like the TOS in this case), California law applies for persons injured in California. moreover, california and new york law are very similar, so it wouldn't matter in any case. This boggles the mind. Its not a contract its an agreement. And you do consent to have everything done in a NY court. they do have a term stating that they can change it at any time.
you apparently dont have any relevant legal knowledge, so I will leave it at that.
|
On February 03 2012 04:36 enemy2010 wrote:
So, can anyone explain this to me in simple english, please?
I got this free silver account through that Hot Pocket thing. The system says that my "membership will not be renewed when your current term ends on August 26, 2011".
So my membership is basically over, isn't it?
Will I be charged after Feb 7th?
Do I have to cancel my membership anywhere to not to be charged?
I don't want to pay any money. I don't care if I won't be able to watch MLG in HD anymore. I just don't want to pay anything.
So?
You won't be charged anything.
--
As for the legal thing, I bet the TOS would get thrown out in court as abusive (for example, MLG could change the terms to "and we give you NOTHING lol") but it doesn't matter because you should just request your refund and get on with it. There's no issue.
|
They should have just auto-refunded or auto upgraded to gold.
Selling HD access, taking the money and then removing the access is just a scam.
Shame on you MLG.
|
On February 03 2012 04:57 Teejing wrote:
They should have just auto-refunded or auto upgraded to gold.
Selling HD access, taking the money and then removing the access is just a scam.
Shame on you MLG.
SO GET THE REFUND.
|
This is a good move but badly handled.
I also have a silver membership, but only for the beta streams and the HD, I don't even know all the other stuffs that my membership gives me.
|
Offering this refund is all well and good (I got a response within minutes), but to not include it in the original email is either a huge oversight, or a conscious decision made to limit the number of refunds they have to issue, as far from everyone will spot this on TL or Reddit. Maybe I'm just a cynic, but until I see a new email sent out to all Silver members I'm going to believe the latter.
|
On February 03 2012 04:47 HorsemasterK wrote:
How about a "no gimmicks, just HD" subscription level. I don't want MLG 'features' I will never use, I just want HD...
Read the post from MLG Kyle, it clearly states that they will be coming out with this:
For those of you who are interested in video, rest assured, there will be products released specifically to suit your interests. In the meantime, I suggest you opt out of renewals on this product moving forward.
|
On February 03 2012 04:54 dAPhREAk wrote:Show nested quote +On February 03 2012 04:36 sermokala wrote:On February 03 2012 04:32 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 04:11 sermokala wrote:On February 03 2012 04:03 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 04:00 Teejing wrote:
Sounds pretty illegal to me. Any Lawer interested to share his wisom with us? not going to do any specific research so take it with a grain of salt. in California, US, it would be considered a breach of contract (unless there is a term stating they can change their terms at any time for a full refund; i'm not reading the TOC), and arguably its a violation of California's Unfair Competition Law, Cal. Bus. & Prof. Code section 17200 because its an unfair business practice (most likely a bait and switch, but also potentially other violations). may also be a violation of the consumer legal remedies act as well. what is ironic about this whole thing is that my mlg membership page still says i am entitled to HQ through April 2014. so, all i have to do is take a screenshot and mlg is fucking in hot water if they get sued. don't be stupid. first off they're based in NY so all cali law doesn't matter. If you want to look for a legal route start reading this. https://accounts.majorleaguegaming.com/membership_terms_of_serviceFun fact TOS's are every companies best friend. People don't read them and they pretty much protect them in any case. "don't be stupid." unless there is an enforceable choice of law clause in the TOS, which California courts love to refuse to enforce in adhesive contracts (like the TOS in this case), California law applies for persons injured in California. moreover, california and new york law are very similar, so it wouldn't matter in any case. This boggles the mind. Its not a contract its an agreement. And you do consent to have everything done in a NY court. they do have a term stating that they can change it at any time. you apparently dont have any relevant legal knowledge, so I will leave it at that.
Sermokala - I'm not a lawyer, but even I know any binding agreement is a contract. You should probably stop lying - unintentionally or not- to people.
|
On February 03 2012 05:05 TheUnderking wrote:Show nested quote +On February 03 2012 04:54 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 04:36 sermokala wrote:On February 03 2012 04:32 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 04:11 sermokala wrote:On February 03 2012 04:03 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 04:00 Teejing wrote:
Sounds pretty illegal to me. Any Lawer interested to share his wisom with us? not going to do any specific research so take it with a grain of salt. in California, US, it would be considered a breach of contract (unless there is a term stating they can change their terms at any time for a full refund; i'm not reading the TOC), and arguably its a violation of California's Unfair Competition Law, Cal. Bus. & Prof. Code section 17200 because its an unfair business practice (most likely a bait and switch, but also potentially other violations). may also be a violation of the consumer legal remedies act as well. what is ironic about this whole thing is that my mlg membership page still says i am entitled to HQ through April 2014. so, all i have to do is take a screenshot and mlg is fucking in hot water if they get sued. don't be stupid. first off they're based in NY so all cali law doesn't matter. If you want to look for a legal route start reading this. https://accounts.majorleaguegaming.com/membership_terms_of_serviceFun fact TOS's are every companies best friend. People don't read them and they pretty much protect them in any case. "don't be stupid." unless there is an enforceable choice of law clause in the TOS, which California courts love to refuse to enforce in adhesive contracts (like the TOS in this case), California law applies for persons injured in California. moreover, california and new york law are very similar, so it wouldn't matter in any case. This boggles the mind. Its not a contract its an agreement. And you do consent to have everything done in a NY court. they do have a term stating that they can change it at any time. you apparently dont have any relevant legal knowledge, so I will leave it at that. Sermokala - I'm not a lawyer, but even I know any binding agreement is a contract. You should probably stop lying - unintentionally or not- to people.
Where's that one borderline brilliant lawyer guy?
Either way, I'm sure MLG has a clause in their TOS that let them do this. I'm not sure that it matters though, given that MLG is offering full refunds.
|
There's no question, to me, that MLG's screwed this up in no particularly small way. However, I do believe that their track record has proven that they are operating in good faith with the community. That means that, while we can and should express our collective displeasure with the way they did this, and ask for the things we'd like to see, talk and threats of the legality of it are just wasteful and damaging.
I'd hope that they would send out an email explaining options more thoroughly, hope that they wouldn't auto-enroll anyone, and ensure that it never happens this way again. However, I do have the hope and expectation that they will do things properly.
On February 03 2012 04:47 HorsemasterK wrote:
How about a "no gimmicks, just HD" subscription level. I don't want MLG 'features' I will never use, I just want HD...
Sounds good to me too.
|
On February 03 2012 05:24 TheToast wrote:Show nested quote +On February 03 2012 05:05 TheUnderking wrote:On February 03 2012 04:54 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 04:36 sermokala wrote:On February 03 2012 04:32 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 04:11 sermokala wrote:On February 03 2012 04:03 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 04:00 Teejing wrote:
Sounds pretty illegal to me. Any Lawer interested to share his wisom with us? not going to do any specific research so take it with a grain of salt. in California, US, it would be considered a breach of contract (unless there is a term stating they can change their terms at any time for a full refund; i'm not reading the TOC), and arguably its a violation of California's Unfair Competition Law, Cal. Bus. & Prof. Code section 17200 because its an unfair business practice (most likely a bait and switch, but also potentially other violations). may also be a violation of the consumer legal remedies act as well. what is ironic about this whole thing is that my mlg membership page still says i am entitled to HQ through April 2014. so, all i have to do is take a screenshot and mlg is fucking in hot water if they get sued. don't be stupid. first off they're based in NY so all cali law doesn't matter. If you want to look for a legal route start reading this. https://accounts.majorleaguegaming.com/membership_terms_of_serviceFun fact TOS's are every companies best friend. People don't read them and they pretty much protect them in any case. "don't be stupid." unless there is an enforceable choice of law clause in the TOS, which California courts love to refuse to enforce in adhesive contracts (like the TOS in this case), California law applies for persons injured in California. moreover, california and new york law are very similar, so it wouldn't matter in any case. This boggles the mind. Its not a contract its an agreement. And you do consent to have everything done in a NY court. they do have a term stating that they can change it at any time. you apparently dont have any relevant legal knowledge, so I will leave it at that. Sermokala - I'm not a lawyer, but even I know any binding agreement is a contract. You should probably stop lying - unintentionally or not- to people. Where's that one borderline brilliant lawyer guy? Either way, I'm sure MLG has a clause in their TOS that let them do this. I'm not sure that it matters though, given that MLG is offering full refunds.
again, even if there was a clause in the TOS that allows them to change the terms that does not make what they have done legal. it just means they aren't breaching the contract. there are numerous state and federal laws that prevent things like this regardless of the contract terms. the laws are designed to protect consumers from large corporations and their fifty-page, 8 point font terms and conditions.
|
On February 03 2012 04:57 Soleron wrote:Show nested quote +On February 03 2012 04:36 enemy2010 wrote:
So, can anyone explain this to me in simple english, please?
I got this free silver account through that Hot Pocket thing. The system says that my "membership will not be renewed when your current term ends on August 26, 2011".
So my membership is basically over, isn't it?
Will I be charged after Feb 7th?
Do I have to cancel my membership anywhere to not to be charged?
I don't want to pay any money. I don't care if I won't be able to watch MLG in HD anymore. I just don't want to pay anything.
So? You won't be charged anything.
Thank you 
|
I hope they wont change the gold membership. I got it sitll running till ocotober 2012.
|
On February 03 2012 05:28 dAPhREAk wrote:Show nested quote +On February 03 2012 05:24 TheToast wrote:On February 03 2012 05:05 TheUnderking wrote:On February 03 2012 04:54 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 04:36 sermokala wrote:On February 03 2012 04:32 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 04:11 sermokala wrote:On February 03 2012 04:03 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 04:00 Teejing wrote:
Sounds pretty illegal to me. Any Lawer interested to share his wisom with us? not going to do any specific research so take it with a grain of salt. in California, US, it would be considered a breach of contract (unless there is a term stating they can change their terms at any time for a full refund; i'm not reading the TOC), and arguably its a violation of California's Unfair Competition Law, Cal. Bus. & Prof. Code section 17200 because its an unfair business practice (most likely a bait and switch, but also potentially other violations). may also be a violation of the consumer legal remedies act as well. what is ironic about this whole thing is that my mlg membership page still says i am entitled to HQ through April 2014. so, all i have to do is take a screenshot and mlg is fucking in hot water if they get sued. don't be stupid. first off they're based in NY so all cali law doesn't matter. If you want to look for a legal route start reading this. https://accounts.majorleaguegaming.com/membership_terms_of_serviceFun fact TOS's are every companies best friend. People don't read them and they pretty much protect them in any case. "don't be stupid." unless there is an enforceable choice of law clause in the TOS, which California courts love to refuse to enforce in adhesive contracts (like the TOS in this case), California law applies for persons injured in California. moreover, california and new york law are very similar, so it wouldn't matter in any case. This boggles the mind. Its not a contract its an agreement. And you do consent to have everything done in a NY court. they do have a term stating that they can change it at any time. you apparently dont have any relevant legal knowledge, so I will leave it at that. Sermokala - I'm not a lawyer, but even I know any binding agreement is a contract. You should probably stop lying - unintentionally or not- to people. Where's that one borderline brilliant lawyer guy? Either way, I'm sure MLG has a clause in their TOS that let them do this. I'm not sure that it matters though, given that MLG is offering full refunds. again, even if there was a clause in the TOS that allows them to change the terms that does not make what they have done legal. it just means they aren't breaching the contract. there are numerous state and federal laws that prevent things like this regardless of the contract terms. the laws are designed to protect consumers from large corporations and their fifty-page, 8 point font terms and conditions.
Yes and no. If the TOS clearly state that the company can make changes to the service at any time there's really nothing the consumer can do. What about the proposed Quickster/Netflix thing? No one was claiming that would have been illegal. Companies change their services and rates all the time. While there are consumer protection laws, as far as I know none of them cover this type of thing. I would be interested to see if you can find any that do.
Again though, MLG is offering a full refund so I don't see any cause for outrage. The only thing I would fault MLG for here is the fact that the don't have the HD access only membership available yet that MLG Erik was talking about. Probably would have been much more convinient for members to just switch their membership to that product instead of having to re-buy it whenever they come out with that. So a bit clumbsy on their part but overall not a huge deal. Put away the pitchforks everyone 
|
On February 03 2012 05:42 TheToast wrote:Show nested quote +On February 03 2012 05:28 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 05:24 TheToast wrote:On February 03 2012 05:05 TheUnderking wrote:On February 03 2012 04:54 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 04:36 sermokala wrote:On February 03 2012 04:32 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 04:11 sermokala wrote:On February 03 2012 04:03 dAPhREAk wrote:On February 03 2012 04:00 Teejing wrote:
Sounds pretty illegal to me. Any Lawer interested to share his wisom with us? not going to do any specific research so take it with a grain of salt. in California, US, it would be considered a breach of contract (unless there is a term stating they can change their terms at any time for a full refund; i'm not reading the TOC), and arguably its a violation of California's Unfair Competition Law, Cal. Bus. & Prof. Code section 17200 because its an unfair business practice (most likely a bait and switch, but also potentially other violations). may also be a violation of the consumer legal remedies act as well. what is ironic about this whole thing is that my mlg membership page still says i am entitled to HQ through April 2014. so, all i have to do is take a screenshot and mlg is fucking in hot water if they get sued. don't be stupid. first off they're based in NY so all cali law doesn't matter. If you want to look for a legal route start reading this. https://accounts.majorleaguegaming.com/membership_terms_of_serviceFun fact TOS's are every companies best friend. People don't read them and they pretty much protect them in any case. "don't be stupid." unless there is an enforceable choice of law clause in the TOS, which California courts love to refuse to enforce in adhesive contracts (like the TOS in this case), California law applies for persons injured in California. moreover, california and new york law are very similar, so it wouldn't matter in any case. This boggles the mind. Its not a contract its an agreement. And you do consent to have everything done in a NY court. they do have a term stating that they can change it at any time. you apparently dont have any relevant legal knowledge, so I will leave it at that. Sermokala - I'm not a lawyer, but even I know any binding agreement is a contract. You should probably stop lying - unintentionally or not- to people. Where's that one borderline brilliant lawyer guy? Either way, I'm sure MLG has a clause in their TOS that let them do this. I'm not sure that it matters though, given that MLG is offering full refunds. again, even if there was a clause in the TOS that allows them to change the terms that does not make what they have done legal. it just means they aren't breaching the contract. there are numerous state and federal laws that prevent things like this regardless of the contract terms. the laws are designed to protect consumers from large corporations and their fifty-page, 8 point font terms and conditions. Yes and no. If the TOS clearly state that the company can make changes to the service at any time there's really nothing the consumer can do. What about the proposed Quickster/Netflix thing? No one was claiming that would have been illegal. Companies change their services and rates all the time. While there are consumer protection laws, as far as I know none of them cover this type of thing. I would be interested to see if you can find any that do. Again though, MLG is offering a full refund so I don't see any cause for outrage. The only thing I would fault MLG for here is the fact that the don't have the HD access only membership available yet that MLG Erik was talking about. Probably would have been much more convinient for members to just switch their membership to that product instead of having to re-buy it whenever they come out with that. So a bit clumbsy on their part but overall not a huge deal. Put away the pitchforks everyone
California's Unfair Competition Law, Business and Professions Code section 17200 prevents unfair business practices such as bait and switches. MLG made representations as to a product, they took our money and then they took the product away, but continued to offer their "gold" plan.
California's Consumer Legal Remedies Act (I am litigating a class-action under this law as we speak) prevents companies from making fraudulent representations. MLG made representations as to their product, they took our money and then the product turned out not to be what they offered.
These are only two examples based on cases I have actually litigated in California courts. We may not have any rights under contract law to sue MLG because of the TOS (I haven't read, so I won't express an opinion), but that does not preclude suit under the various consumer laws. Especially in California where consumers are treated like babies who are unable to read contracts.
That being said. I got my refund. Still pissed at MLG at how they handled this (and that they had auto-renew in the first place), but MLG's product is still solid so I will buy a gold pass. And, no, I won't be taking legal action, because its not worth the time or money, but there are a lot of starving class-action lawyers in California looking for a quick buck.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
