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On January 09 2012 19:25 Tobberoth wrote:
I would like people who seriously think foreigners are closing the gap to ask themselves how that can possibly be when there's pretty much no foreigner who plays even close to as seriously as even the worst korean players in Code A. We have a few players who can seriously put up a fight in Code A, people like Huk, Naniwa, Idra. Neither of them has a serious chance in Code S at the moment, there's just way too many amazing consistent players, and that's the way way top of the mountain of foreigners. I'm willing to bet there's WAY more Code S and A material in korea than in the whole foreign scene, and it's all because of determination.
Korean players take the game seriously and play it as a job. Foreign "professional" players still play it like a game.
couldnt have said it better than this guy
yeah hero won dreamhack but where were the koreans? he beat puma so what puma isnt even in code S or A
puma won nasl seriously theres no top koreans in that tournament
people keep on saying "but hero won dreamhack his top protoss in the world" uh no his not his just exposed more to the foreigners because his on a foreigner team thats why people think his top protoss people are kidding themselves if they believe foreigners can ever close the gap with koreans... the top starcraft players didnt even transfer over yet and when they do GG to foreigners
people got to realize stephano thorzain dimaga sen arent gonna be the foreigner saviors of sc2 it will be the koreans on foreigner teams that will be
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TBH, i think the foreigners were worse because of all the alcohol and the hangover the next day.
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the amount of denial in this thread is laughable. koreans clearly dominate the starcraft 2 scene. they win almost every major tournament in a dominating fashion. im starting to wonder if these people even watch the tournaments lol.. you dont need statistics to show that they kick azz
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Koreans are always, and i mean ALWAYS, going to be better than foreigners due to the way they treat the game/progaming. Teamhouses, countless hours of practice etc and the very way they take their career choice as a "progamer" is far above and beyond the way foreigners treat this "game". Foreigners always will be dominated by Koreans in SC2 unless the same work ethic/way the game is treated by corporate sponsors gets carried over to US/EU and that I doubt will ever happen. Foreigners may close the gap and you always will have anomalies like certain foreigner players who perform well consistently against Koreans, but at the end of the day, the average Korean SC2 progamer will be far far far better than the average US/EU SC2 progamer. And also the top foreigner players will always be far below top Korean players.
And for whoever thinks that the "gap is closing", its not getting any closer for sure. Things aren't getting better for foreigners. Koreans on the other hand have players likw TSL_HyuN and OGS.forGG who were average BW progamers, switch over to SC2 and within a matter of 60 days qualify for code A, while people like Jinro/ToD/etc have been playing this game for almost a year if not more, struggle to make it to code A. The difference in skill level is just too much.
We saw top foreigner players losing to people like Violet and Sound at HSC4 - these are the same korean players who have not made a splash at the Korean sc2 scene, so imagine what would happen if we consistently invite MMA/MVP to foreign events. I highly doubt whether we'd see comments at TL regarding "closing the gap".
If anything, I believe 2012 will be another year of continued Korean domination.
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Simple explanation: Foreigners were celebrating christmas the past weeks, Koreans weren't. Can't read in to these results (ffs Stephano was playing hungover on day 3)
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On January 09 2012 19:53 Groog wrote:
Simple explanation: Foreigners were celebrating christmas the past weeks, Koreans weren't. Can't read in to these results (ffs Stephano was playing hungover on day 3)
what a STUPID comment koreans dont celebrate christmas? thats pretty ignorant i believe and yeah koreans get fatigue of training all day is that there excuse?
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On January 09 2012 19:53 Groog wrote:
Simple explanation: Foreigners were celebrating christmas the past weeks, Koreans weren't. Can't read in to these results (ffs Stephano was playing hungover on day 3)
this is probably the dumbest thing ive ever read
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On January 09 2012 19:59 ZerguufOu wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2012 19:53 Groog wrote:
Simple explanation: Foreigners were celebrating christmas the past weeks, Koreans weren't. Can't read in to these results (ffs Stephano was playing hungover on day 3) this is probably the dumbest thing ive ever read
Why is it dumb? It's no explanation but it could be a factor, for sure.
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So do you guys feel that HSCIV as well as the entirety of 2011 is proof that Korea is the only place a foreigner can hope to improve? I've noticed over the past few months on this forum that many were starting to criticize those that were moving to Korea for having not accomplished anything of note.
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On January 09 2012 20:08 GunPaladin wrote:
So do you guys feel that HSCIV as well as the entirety of 2011 is proof that Korea is the only place a foreigner can hope to improve? I've noticed over the past few months on this forum that many were starting to criticize those that were moving to Korea for having not accomplished anything of note.
if you want to be good you gotta play with good players
players arent gonna just improve by playing players worse then them and thats why people go to korea to get good
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On January 09 2012 20:06 Xiron wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2012 19:59 ZerguufOu wrote:On January 09 2012 19:53 Groog wrote:
Simple explanation: Foreigners were celebrating christmas the past weeks, Koreans weren't. Can't read in to these results (ffs Stephano was playing hungover on day 3) this is probably the dumbest thing ive ever read Why is it dumb? It's no explanation but it could be a factor, for sure.
Koreans don't celebrate Christmas, they don't have social life, what's next? They don't poop too?
How far can self-denial go? This thread answers that question: further than I could possibly imagine.
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Koreans are way better than foreigners. period
The best foreigners weren't there thats true but so wasn't the best of the best koreans
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Switzerland2892 Posts
On January 09 2012 19:53 Groog wrote:
Simple explanation: Foreigners were celebrating christmas the past weeks, Koreans weren't. Can't read in to these results (ffs Stephano was playing hungover on day 3)
Most of the Koreans took vacations from approximately December 20 to January though
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On January 09 2012 20:12 nokz88 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2012 20:06 Xiron wrote:On January 09 2012 19:59 ZerguufOu wrote:On January 09 2012 19:53 Groog wrote:
Simple explanation: Foreigners were celebrating christmas the past weeks, Koreans weren't. Can't read in to these results (ffs Stephano was playing hungover on day 3) this is probably the dumbest thing ive ever read Why is it dumb? It's no explanation but it could be a factor, for sure. Koreans don't celebrate Christmas, they don't have social life, what's next? They don't poop too? How far can self-denial go? This thread answers that question: further than I could possibly imagine.
Koreans are mainly not christian? They don't hold it as their main holiday, so that it doesn't have as big of meaning to them, which in order doesn't make them celebrate it as much. How dumb must one be to ignore his own self denial and critisize others for theirs. And, how ignorant one must be to think that everyone is christian anyway.
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On January 09 2012 20:36 Xiron wrote:
Koreans are mainly not christian? They don't hold it as their main holiday, so that it doesn't have a big a meaning to them, which in order doesn't make them celebrate it as much. How dumb must one be to ignore his own self denial and critisize others for theirs. And, how ignorant one must be to think that everyone is christian anyway.
Roughly 30% of koreans are christian according to recent statistics.. there are probably more christians in korea than many secular european countries.
Which doesn't even matter because its the stupidest excuse I have ever seen.
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On January 09 2012 20:40 zefreak wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2012 20:36 Xiron wrote:
Koreans are mainly not christian? They don't hold it as their main holiday, so that it doesn't have a big a meaning to them, which in order doesn't make them celebrate it as much. How dumb must one be to ignore his own self denial and critisize others for theirs. And, how ignorant one must be to think that everyone is christian anyway. Roughly 30% of koreans are christian according to recent statistics.. there are probably more christians in korea than many secular european countries. Which doesn't even matter because its the stupidest excuse I have ever seen.
Yeah if I remember correctly, 70% is still more than 30%, which is exactly what I said. Also I said that it might be a factor, not that it's the reason why koreans are better.
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On January 09 2012 20:06 Xiron wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2012 19:59 ZerguufOu wrote:On January 09 2012 19:53 Groog wrote:
Simple explanation: Foreigners were celebrating christmas the past weeks, Koreans weren't. Can't read in to these results (ffs Stephano was playing hungover on day 3) this is probably the dumbest thing ive ever read Why is it dumb? It's no explanation but it could be a factor, for sure.
Im pretty sure Koreans celebrate New year like we westeners celebrate christmas.
Theres a holiday periode at the end of December in Korea so they must be celebrating something.
There are more Christians in South Korea (the Republic of Korea) than in other asian countries such as China and Japan, so Christmas is celebrated more widely. (Christians make up about 25-30% of the population.) However, the other 70% of people in South Korea are Buddhist (about 25%) or don't have a religion.
Unlike Japan, Christmas is an official holiday - so people do have the day of work and school! But they go back on the 26th (Boxing Day). There's a longer official winter break in the New Year.
Churches are decorated with lights and many have a bright red neon cross on top (all the year!) so that goes very well with the Christmas lights! Most churches will have a service on Christmas day. Going to Church for Christmas is becoming more popular, even among non Christians.
Department stores put on big displays of decorations. There's also an amazing display of lights in the capital city, Seoul. The lights are all over the city centre including the bridges over the Han River.
Wiki says:
Korean New Year, commonly known as Seollal (Hangul: 설날; RR: Seollal; MR: Sŏllal), is the first day of the lunar calendar. It is the most important of the traditional Korean holidays. It consists of a period of celebrations, starting on New Year's Day. Koreans also celebrate solar New Year's Day on January 1 each year, following the Gregorian Calendar. The Korean New Year holiday lasts three days, and is considered a more important holiday than the solar New Year's Day.
--Edit--
i will make the bold statement that even if HSC4 would have happend in 3 months from now the results would be the same...
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It doesn't come to a surprise that the Koreans are doing better, because they practice hours on end in team houses while most foreigners have jobs or are in school.
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I suggest we start replacing the term foreigners with 'the guys that don't practice' and Koreans with 'the guys who are actually serious about being a pro-gamer'.
It is sad in a way that we root for the lazy guys when there are guys out there who are actually willing to sacrifice many other things in order to be good at SC2.
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EPT
