On October 29 2011 00:01 GTLAllDayEveryDay wrote: I cant wait for the BW pros to switch over so they can get man handled. It doesnt take too much talent to be the top player at a game that only a handful of players play. SC2 increased the player count many times over. It's funny to see all these BW fanboys speaking hypothetical about their heroes dominating the SC2, but you damn well know in their hearts they're hoping they don't switch because then if players like FlaSh, Jaedong, Bisu switch and become good, but don't reach the mind boggling heights of their BW glory, it just proves that they're not RTS gods, just exceptional BW players that were able to excel in a mechanically difficult game -- remember this is a strategy game, it shouldn't take 400 APM to execute a strategy. Also BW became a very niche thing over the years, like curling.
wow. can u write even more bullshit??
what the! if you have 400 APM and you are still on PAR with a guy with 100 APM, then the game is screwed. It will be like any ordinary crap RTS games in which practising more has no effect.
Go play Spam Click v3 then. 400 APM were needed because the game was stupidly user unfriendly. It is not anymore, allowing more people without nerdy skills and time to express their strategical abilities. In a strategy game, that is what is important.
When watching pro-games and seeing them hit 200-300APM and STILL not doing everything that's needed in SC2, then that goes to show you are still wrong. APM is needed.
APM means, I can click fast. I does not mean I can click where it matters all the time. Click fast can be achieve by any monkey, clicking where is matters have to though. Their is still ways to improve in this domain. Look at EAPM. Their removed the spam, they fall to 60-100, maybe 200 in fights. So the standard 400 APM in BW, means 60 useful actions in reality. Hugh? What?
with every post, you show how little you know.
the top bw pros make meaningful clicks, they can multi task like monsters with multi pronged battles on the map while macroing and managing their bases.
I really hope ZerO can win an OSL D:. I suppose if he switches, he can just win a lot of GSLs, but it won't be the same... It does look like some crazy stuff is gonna rock the SC2 world soon, I wonder how this will affect all the current SC2 progamers; Let's see if they will be able to keep up once the BW players catch up to current skill level!
Doesn't GomTV still have sole rights to SC2 broadcasting in Korea? Or am I just wrong about that? I wonder if/when the SC2 Korean scene will explode and more major tournaments start popping up.
It'll be interesting to see if the GSL and Kespa can come to some sort of agreement....I like the current GSL, it'd be cool to see it coexist with a true Proleague.
Prolly less time for foreign tournaments after this, hopefully MLG can still draw top koreans over to play
I really hope Kespa and GRETECH can be partners and that top koreans will continue to go to foreign event (Nestea vs Jaedong.... Flash vs MMA.... at MLG, I can dream). I don't want a Kespa monopole where players are strictly tied with the Kespa organisation. Anyway, it had to come one day, I didn't know it could be that soon. If this happen, BW teams are gonna dominate so hard, I give them 2 months before absolutely crushing the scene
On October 28 2011 18:43 cursor wrote: It's time to find out how much we really suck. Bisu?
If they start playing seriously, everyone is so fucked. MVP. IdrA. Nestea. HuK. Deep. Shit.
I'd love to see some of them playing.
that list is highly problematic, idra is just riding a wave Zerg being quite strong at the moment especially in macro games (which is idra's bread and butter) with infestor broodlord and huk is probably the luckiest tournament player in the world, everything breaks for him so well and he wins, when it doesn't he out in round of 32 GSL and if zenio didn't mess up in their game he is in up and down possible back in code A. nestea mvp and a lot of other korean players are leagues ahead of these two and while i agree that huk and idra and pretty all foreign players will fade away as SC2 becomes more popular in korea, the players who have been the best in their respective races throughout the last year will continue to be so even after the BW players have caught up in skill
On October 29 2011 00:01 GTLAllDayEveryDay wrote: I cant wait for the BW pros to switch over so they can get man handled. It doesnt take too much talent to be the top player at a game that only a handful of players play. SC2 increased the player count many times over. It's funny to see all these BW fanboys speaking hypothetical about their heroes dominating the SC2, but you damn well know in their hearts they're hoping they don't switch because then if players like FlaSh, Jaedong, Bisu switch and become good, but don't reach the mind boggling heights of their BW glory, it just proves that they're not RTS gods, just exceptional BW players that were able to excel in a mechanically difficult game -- remember this is a strategy game, it shouldn't take 400 APM to execute a strategy. Also BW became a very niche thing over the years, like curling.
wow. can u write even more bullshit??
what the! if you have 400 APM and you are still on PAR with a guy with 100 APM, then the game is screwed. It will be like any ordinary crap RTS games in which practising more has no effect.
Go play Spam Click v3 then. 400 APM were needed because the game was stupidly user unfriendly. It is not anymore, allowing more people without nerdy skills and time to express their strategical abilities. In a strategy game, that is what is important.
When watching pro-games and seeing them hit 200-300APM and STILL not doing everything that's needed in SC2, then that goes to show you are still wrong. APM is needed.
APM means, I can click fast. I does not mean I can click where it matters all the time. Click fast can be achieve by any monkey, clicking where is matters have to though. Their is still ways to improve in this domain. Look at EAPM. Their removed the spam, they fall to 60-100, maybe 200 in fights. So the standard 400 APM in BW, means 60 useful actions in reality. Hugh? What?
with every post, you show how little you know.
the top bw pros make meaningful clicks, they can multi task like monsters with multi pronged battles on the map while macroing and managing their bases.
I've been a bw player/fan since vanilla and i've never gotten a chance to see a full game of fpview of a progamer. This was super sick. Very inspirational. Every click was precise and he seemed to be in complete control of the game. Thank you for sharing.
I hope the BW scene doesn't bother switching over until HOTS comes out at the very least. Seems like it will be released in the next 6months, so it'd be pointless to join just as WOL meets its end.
Either way, I feel sorry for the BW fans if all these rumors are true. Sucks to have your hobby/entertainment phased out =/
On October 29 2011 00:01 GTLAllDayEveryDay wrote: I cant wait for the BW pros to switch over so they can get man handled. It doesnt take too much talent to be the top player at a game that only a handful of players play. SC2 increased the player count many times over. It's funny to see all these BW fanboys speaking hypothetical about their heroes dominating the SC2, but you damn well know in their hearts they're hoping they don't switch because then if players like FlaSh, Jaedong, Bisu switch and become good, but don't reach the mind boggling heights of their BW glory, it just proves that they're not RTS gods, just exceptional BW players that were able to excel in a mechanically difficult game -- remember this is a strategy game, it shouldn't take 400 APM to execute a strategy. Also BW became a very niche thing over the years, like curling.
wow. can u write even more bullshit??
what the! if you have 400 APM and you are still on PAR with a guy with 100 APM, then the game is screwed. It will be like any ordinary crap RTS games in which practising more has no effect.
Go play Spam Click v3 then. 400 APM were needed because the game was stupidly user unfriendly. It is not anymore, allowing more people without nerdy skills and time to express their strategical abilities. In a strategy game, that is what is important.
When watching pro-games and seeing them hit 200-300APM and STILL not doing everything that's needed in SC2, then that goes to show you are still wrong. APM is needed.
APM means, I can click fast. I does not mean I can click where it matters all the time. Click fast can be achieve by any monkey, clicking where is matters have to though. Their is still ways to improve in this domain. Look at EAPM. Their removed the spam, they fall to 60-100, maybe 200 in fights. So the standard 400 APM in BW, means 60 useful actions in reality. Hugh? What?
with every post, you show how little you know.
the top bw pros make meaningful clicks, they can multi task like monsters with multi pronged battles on the map while macroing and managing their bases.
SC2 Players: Consider that there are people who still love the BW community and feel like their game and community are preemptively being killed. Everybody who played BW and SC2 at a high level know that, in their current form, BW is a more difficult and more balanced game. It's an exciting time for SC2, but be respectful to the BW community.
Most of the community now at TL has never really been entrenched into BW, but barely understand that the fundamental differences between BW/SC2 progamers, and thusly are excited to see 'their game' being played a level never seen before. Hopefully, atleast.
But many do not really understand the game of BW itself, as is painfully obvious from some posts in this thread, and so you cannot really begin to make the comparison about which is the 'better game'. And all you end up doing is upsetting those and inciting more flamewars on the matter by trying to act like you do.
The individuals here with many, many years of BW under their belts are distinctly qualified to compare the two games from both a players and spectators perspective. It is not a matter of fanboyism or anything like that - there's no point really. We do truly believe that BW is the better spectators's experience - by understanding its more challenging to play at such high levels, by it being more balanced, and being more entertaining overall.
The thought that players who showed us extremely challenging and ballsy reaver control over the years are now going to fool around with fuck-all boring colossus? No more muta micro? Immortal dragoons? Arbiters, manlots, playguuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu, CARRIERS?!
So please. Watch the entirety of one BW tournament (Jin Air is a good place to start), and don't try to tell me that BW was dying in any way, or is inferior in any way.
Wow, if this is true, I'm super excited. And all this BW/SC2 infighting is pointless imo. Either way, we'll find out how these S-Class bw players will do when they make the transition to SC2 (which is inevitable). I'm sure they'll do really well, but I don't know if they'll completely dominate, at least right away.
Don't get me wrong, I don't care either way. I just want to see the best players play. If these new BW players are truly that great, then all hail our new korean overlords!
Programers switching over cool and all but I'm only really concerned about KeSPA in SC2. No doubt that once they get in there will be many changes. One post I saw pointed out that they might try to schedule important games during things like the MLG/GSL exchange and as a result no Koreans want to come over. I just really hope not to see the same ultranationalistic KeSPA again, GOMTV resembles what KeSPA should be more like so here's hoping that GOM supervises and controls what KeSPA does...
On October 29 2011 01:36 SiguR wrote: How exactly is kespa going to work in SC2?
My predictions:
1- Courage tournament or something like that will be used for giving progamer licenses to people 2- Proleague teams will take over and current SC2 teams will be trash 3- GOM can be trash. KeSPA is notorious for holding grudges, I don't think they will allow GOM to do shit in Korea if they take over the SC2 scene, but with MBCGame shutting down, they might allow GOM to do broadcasts too. After all, they actually have a good setup for SC2 broadcasting (their obs is much worse than OGN one though). 4- Korean SC2 community, which was at first notorious for hating on KeSPA, bashing every single mistake that KeSPA did and then started saying that they wished KeSPA took up the SC2 scene too so that SC2 could actually be popular in Korea, will love KeSPA from the bottom of their heart.
But if KeSPA takes over the SC2 scene too and does not give up on BW and does at least the #1 of my prediction, we might observe a mass migration to BW as well (too many SC2 players, too little money for each player, too few BW players, relatively more money for each player, BW being a much more enjoyable* and better developed game: mass migration).
* "Much more enjoyable" part was completely my personal taste
On October 29 2011 00:01 GTLAllDayEveryDay wrote: I cant wait for the BW pros to switch over so they can get man handled. It doesnt take too much talent to be the top player at a game that only a handful of players play. SC2 increased the player count many times over. It's funny to see all these BW fanboys speaking hypothetical about their heroes dominating the SC2, but you damn well know in their hearts they're hoping they don't switch because then if players like FlaSh, Jaedong, Bisu switch and become good, but don't reach the mind boggling heights of their BW glory, it just proves that they're not RTS gods, just exceptional BW players that were able to excel in a mechanically difficult game -- remember this is a strategy game, it shouldn't take 400 APM to execute a strategy. Also BW became a very niche thing over the years, like curling.
wow. can u write even more bullshit??
what the! if you have 400 APM and you are still on PAR with a guy with 100 APM, then the game is screwed. It will be like any ordinary crap RTS games in which practising more has no effect.
Go play Spam Click v3 then. 400 APM were needed because the game was stupidly user unfriendly. It is not anymore, allowing more people without nerdy skills and time to express their strategical abilities. In a strategy game, that is what is important.
When watching pro-games and seeing them hit 200-300APM and STILL not doing everything that's needed in SC2, then that goes to show you are still wrong. APM is needed.
APM means, I can click fast. I does not mean I can click where it matters all the time. Click fast can be achieve by any monkey, clicking where is matters have to though. Their is still ways to improve in this domain. Look at EAPM. Their removed the spam, they fall to 60-100, maybe 200 in fights. So the standard 400 APM in BW, means 60 useful actions in reality. Hugh? What?
with every post, you show how little you know.
the top bw pros make meaningful clicks, they can multi task like monsters with multi pronged battles on the map while macroing and managing their bases.
I've been a bw player/fan since vanilla and i've never gotten a chance to see a full game of fpview of a progamer. This was super sick. Very inspirational. Every click was precise and he seemed to be in complete control of the game. Thank you for sharing.
How could you manage to not to find or bump into any fpvod until now?
Back in the day I remember watching this in 2002 or 2003, downloaded from pgtour or sth can't remember now:
EPT
