EPTCode S might be losing entertainment value. - Page 33
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BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES51100 Posts
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bittman
Australia8759 Posts
This season had nothing...well nerd-chills worthy regarding production. Sure, there were those awkward Code S intros they canned (which were hilarious), but there was a lack of epic trailers, hype videos, additional content, etc. I loved when they spent some time in the previous season (or before that?) to highlight MarineKing and oGsTheWind. Some people have said it before, but as foreign viewers we're struggling to find the connection with the players. When our GSL experience is limited to listening to english casters and then watching the games, we're only getting what any halfway decent tournament can offer. GSL is meant to offer us a portal into the Korean competitive scene. The personality of a scene is a part of it. As it is, this season felt like watching replays casted in english with the occasional half translated interview. Been trying to work out why I haven't enjoyed this season as much as the previous few, and thought it was just me getting bored of sc2. However I've never so intently watched MLG and IPL has been looking good. GSL needs to step up its production game, I think that's it's current issue. GSL can't do anything about the races. And though I do have an issue with the format, it's not bad, just not how I'd like it. | ||
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Cathasaigh
United States285 Posts
On September 08 2011 21:23 Fubi wrote: I don't know why people are saying TvT is boring. ZvZ and PvP is like rush-fest / 1 mistake you lose. Imagine the GSL terran situation is all switched to Zergs or Protoss, I think people would complain about all the ZvZ's and PvP's way more than they complain about TvT now. TvP is pretty bad as well atm with all the 1-1-1s The other MUs TvZ and PvZ is decent, and you can argue they're better than TvT all you want, but imo TvT is still one of the top 3 most interesting MU TvT is boring because we've all seen it so many times. It doesn't matter if TvT is the best match-up ever, if you show it over and over eventually people will get tired of seeing it and at the moment that is definitely the case with TvT. When we first started seeing so many TvTs I was actually kinda happy because I enjoy it more than most match-ups but at this point I usually don't even pay attention when they come up. It really doesn't have much to do with the match-up itself as much as it does the repititiveness of seeing the same match-up so many times. There would be quite a bit of complaining if we had to see any match-up this much. | ||
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Liudo
United Kingdom344 Posts
-Inconvenient screening times for live viewing in the EU -Extremely poor quality picture (again, I don't want to pay for better qaulity) -There is some drama in the GSL but I would prefer more of it.. basically I am sure story-lines would emerge if I could be more immersed in it, but that would require fixes to the above... -After reading some other posts it seems the GSL could use more content focused on showing the personalities of the players, rivalries between the players, that kind of thing Essentially it comes down to the fact I don't want to pay for it. There is enough starcraft2 around without the need to pay for it, even if it is the GSL. | ||
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CreationSoul
Romania231 Posts
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BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES51100 Posts
I think Gom need to open up their tournament format a bit,Code A is a lot more flexible and has varying race representation. | ||
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ronpaul012
United States769 Posts
Where I struggle with the GSL is that even after paying for months and months and watching, their just some korean dude to me. Sure I like nestea's style, but I don't get to watch him on a podcast. I can't come home from work and watch his stream. I don't get the chance to email him a question to be read on air, or pm him on teamliquid just telling him how much I enjoy watching him. Like I said above, I dont think there's anything the GSL can do about it, its just different cultures and different communities and how they work, and it's all up to your personal preference. | ||
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GGPope
Australia367 Posts
Their format isn't perfect, and their terran saturation is greater than desirable, but I'll still watch it to see the korean metagame and learn from the best (and laugh at TheBest). | ||
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Zechs
United Kingdom321 Posts
On September 08 2011 22:36 bittman wrote: Oh, I finally worked out my major gripe with this season. Production value. This season had nothing...well nerd-chills worthy regarding production. Sure, there were those awkward Code S intros they canned (which were hilarious), but there was a lack of epic trailers, hype videos, additional content, etc. I loved when they spent some time in the previous season (or before that?) to highlight MarineKing and oGsTheWind. Some people have said it before, but as foreign viewers we're struggling to find the connection with the players. When our GSL experience is limited to listening to english casters and then watching the games, we're only getting what any halfway decent tournament can offer. GSL is meant to offer us a portal into the Korean competitive scene. The personality of a scene is a part of it. As it is, this season felt like watching replays casted in english with the occasional half translated interview. Been trying to work out why I haven't enjoyed this season as much as the previous few, and thought it was just me getting bored of sc2. However I've never so intently watched MLG and IPL has been looking good. GSL needs to step up its production game, I think that's it's current issue. GSL can't do anything about the races. And though I do have an issue with the format, it's not bad, just not how I'd like it. Well, maybe for you, but i think at least some people - myself included - couldn't care less about the hype videos. I generally go do something else between matches, whatever is going on. Still, at least it's better than irrirating adverts and motionless crowd shots, a la MLG. | ||
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dtz
5834 Posts
On September 08 2011 22:36 bittman wrote: Oh, I finally worked out my major gripe with this season. Production value. This season had nothing...well nerd-chills worthy regarding production. Sure, there were those awkward Code S intros they canned (which were hilarious), but there was a lack of epic trailers, hype videos, additional content, etc. I loved when they spent some time in the previous season (or before that?) to highlight MarineKing and oGsTheWind. Some people have said it before, but as foreign viewers we're struggling to find the connection with the players. When our GSL experience is limited to listening to english casters and then watching the games, we're only getting what any halfway decent tournament can offer. GSL is meant to offer us a portal into the Korean competitive scene. The personality of a scene is a part of it. As it is, this season felt like watching replays casted in english with the occasional half translated interview. Been trying to work out why I haven't enjoyed this season as much as the previous few, and thought it was just me getting bored of sc2. However I've never so intently watched MLG and IPL has been looking good. GSL needs to step up its production game, I think that's it's current issue. GSL can't do anything about the races. And though I do have an issue with the format, it's not bad, just not how I'd like it. Eh? they are having Project A at the moment. That's way bigger than mini documentary about MKP or TheWind. | ||
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BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES51100 Posts
On September 08 2011 22:42 ronpaul012 wrote: To be perfectly honest, I don't think it's anything that the GSL could do, or at least it would be very hard. One of the main reasons I like MLG more than GSL is that for most of the players, I can relate to them and their personality. For around 90% of the pool players I know where there from, how they've been doing lately, watched their streams, and so on. Even with the koreans who come over, its easier to identify them based off x win and y lose. What team their on and style. Where I struggle with the GSL is that even after paying for months and months and watching, their just some korean dude to me. Sure I like nestea's style, but I don't get to watch him on a podcast. I can't come home from work and watch his stream. I don't get the chance to email him a question to be read on air, or pm him on teamliquid just telling him how much I enjoy watching him. Like I said above, I dont think there's anything the GSL can do about it, its just different cultures and different communities and how they work, and it's all up to your personal preference. yeah its a verrrry personal problem in your case,but still SC2 pros are doing more for us that BW pros have ever done really. | ||
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Tetryon
Canada8 Posts
On September 08 2011 22:30 ViTaLiTy17 wrote: GSL is great  sure they're are alot of tvt's but Terran seems to be the trend at the moment. Sorry that protoss and zerg players aren't able to step their game up. And try qualifying for Code A. It is sooooo hard. Best way to get into Code S in my opinion. I dont want no open bracket crap seeing randoms in Code S. Keep it up GOM. You guys are great When Zerg can make Lings/Roach and win 90% of their matchups (marine/tank takes skill) and toss can just go Zealot/Collosus and win 90% of their matchups you can come back and talk about stepping up their game. Terran play hasn't changed at all since Brood War and you come here with the gall to say it's the Zerg and Toss that are in the wrong. Christ you're a troll. | ||
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Swad1000
United States366 Posts
I would rather lose to the same Kr terran 50 times in a row then drop to diamond and lose 50 more times then see Mc get knocked out of GSL. | ||
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Tetryon
Canada8 Posts
On September 08 2011 22:52 Swad1000 wrote: GSL is going to be hard to watch this season from a protoss perspective. If Hero/Sage/Puzzle and Mc are unable to make it past the first rounds theres no reason to watch other then Tastosis and foreigner hope. Yea I'm really hoping that Puzzle and MC can hold their own. I'm not a huge fan of Huk, and don't think Naniwa is going to do that great despite how great his play has become since moving to Korea. Here's hoping. | ||
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flodeskum
Iceland1267 Posts
On September 08 2011 21:23 Fubi wrote: I don't know why people are saying TvT is boring. ZvZ and PvP is like rush-fest / 1 mistake you lose. Imagine the GSL terran situation is all switched to Zergs or Protoss, I think people would complain about all the ZvZ's and PvP's way more than they complain about TvT now. TvP is pretty bad as well atm with all the 1-1-1s The other MUs TvZ and PvZ is decent, and you can argue they're better than TvT all you want, but imo TvT is still one of the top 3 most interesting MU Nobody is saying they like the other mirrors more than TvT. People just don't like watching TvT all the time. Or even just terran all the time. This GSL featured a terran player in 91% of the total matches played. 91 fucking per cent. And next season will have more terrans and more TvT. | ||
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Striding Strider
United Kingdom787 Posts
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Durp
Canada3117 Posts
On September 08 2011 22:46 Tetryon wrote: When Zerg can make Lings/Roach and win 90% of their matchups (marine/tank takes skill) and toss can just go Zealot/Collosus and win 90% of their matchups you can come back and talk about stepping up their game. Terran play hasn't changed at all since Brood War and you come here with the gall to say it's the Zerg and Toss that are in the wrong. Christ you're a troll. Spoken like a true gold leaguer. NOBODY (edit; maybe NesTea is)is winning 90% of their matchups. Obviously you have a hard time with Roach/ling or zealot/colossus. Not everyone does. The problem inherent is that there just aren't the same number of high level players across the board for the Zerg and Protoss. This is undeniable. When you look through a list of the top players, in Korea or internationally, The Zerg have NesTea, Losira, DRG... ? That's it? (imo IdrA has fallen way off to be considered close to their level anymore). The Protoss have MC. *tumbleweed* .... and he's in Code-A. HuK? Nah, I can't buy into him. He's playing well lately, sometimes, but his games never look dominating enough to show that he's truly a step ahead of his opponents. The Terran have MVP, Bomber, Ryung, MMA, MKP, Puma, Optimus, I will stop the list here because my point is proven. Terrans are winning more because they have an overall higher skill. A higher number of Code-S quality terrans as opposed to their other race counterparts leads to a higher Terran saturation. If you check the Code-A qualifiers, the Terrans there actually did relatively poorly. That is because after this "best in the world" grouping of players (which, sadly imo, occupy nearly half of the GSL) you have a whole wave of high level protoss and zergs, that are all great players in their own regards, but just not at the same level of the rest of Code-S. The post you quoted is worded terribly, but actually accurate. Zerg and Protoss players have not stepped their game up to match the level of the Korean Terrans. Whether that's a map, practice, balance, or game design issue is for someone else to debate. I have no interest getting into the circular semantics argument that becomes. | ||
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Lazorstrats
Netherlands43 Posts
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Dayrlan
United States248 Posts
Here's an assorted list of reasons why I've become less interested: 1) GSL normally starts streaming at 5am in my time zone. Sure, I could keep up with waking up to watch it live for a few months, but I can't make a long-term habit out of it. And even though I've purchased access to the VODs, I rarely watch them. Why? Same reason that LAN tournaments are more exciting than online tournaments -- without a sense that the action is "happening right now," there's just not as much of a draw. 2) The GSL schedule is oversaturated/too frequent. As soon as one champion is crowned, we launch straight back into a new season in such a short amount of time. There's no time to appreciate any of the accomplishments made. By comparison, MLG Raleigh felt mildly lackluster compared to MLG Anaheim (for me, at least). Some of that might have been the hurricane and the diminished crowd, but surely a portion of it is that the two events were spaced too closely together. 3) Inevitable Korean dominance. Yeah, I'll say it. It's not fun watching the Koreans win every. single. time. If my friends and I kept getting stomped by some older guys at the basketball court, eventually we'd find another place to play on our own. Even MLG was more exciting when it felt like there was some mystery to who would actually pull out the big win. Now the winner of each MLG is relegated to a choice from the set of whichever-Koreans-showed-up-this-time, the occasional foreign hero (HuK, Naniwa, etc.), and a prayer of a hope that IdrA can last an entire event without early GG'ing. How does this relate to GSL? Well, it was a lot of fun when Jinro and IdrA were competing successfully. That era ended, and my attention for GSL began to wane quickly. It's probably the same reason I never got into professional Brood War -- I don't think everyone is psychologically built to be able to just pick up a favorite player from a different culture, thousands of miles away, and follow them religiously. 4. No Tastosis in Code A = "Who cares about Code A?" Pretty straightforward. With all of the caster juggling that happened in Code A, and the low-quality show that resulted (for at least a number of seasons), I got tired of Code A. I'm sure it's better now, but since I already have my "Starcraft viewing rhythm" down now (with all of the great events in the international scene), I would need a reason to go back. 5. GSL feels unstable. I'm not entirely sure I can clearly articulate this one. Basically, it feels hard to pick a favorite player and stick with them, given their tournament format. One season, my player could make it to the Ro4 Code S, and I'll be super excited. A few seasons later, in the total course of 3-4 matches played, my player is struggling to re-qualify for Code A. Oh. Even count the number of "big name" Korean mega-gosus who have fallen to Code A after a series of Code S success. Mix that with #2 (The GSL schedule is oversaturated/too frequent), and you've got a great recipe for turning off fans. --- Meh. :/ I realize it's still the best-of-the-best -- the pinnacle of Starcraft 2 skill. I want to want to watch it. But... | ||
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Deleted User 101379
4849 Posts
Yes, the players are probably 10 times better than almost all foreigners, but they play TOO perfect to be entertaining and they all play only to win, not to entertain. This is why i like tournaments like the shoutcraft invitational a lot more. Yeah, the players are worse but the games are a lot more fun to watch. The players show that they care about their fans and want to provide entertainment. In short: Want to watch the best players: Watch GSL. Want to have fun while watching SC2: Watch foreign tournaments. | ||
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