EPTCode S might be losing entertainment value. - Page 31
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GutBuck3t
6 Posts
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karpo
Sweden1998 Posts
Comparing the system of GSL and MLG is kinda weird as one features a price pool 10 times larger and requires more dedication. GSL is more about the long run, if you get into code A you need to, at least, secure your code A spot for the next season and hopefully get far enough to play in the up and downs. More volatility to me only means less stable league and worse players getting lucky against players that do consistently good in Code S. The only thing i'd like to see is more indepth interviews and maybe even some small "Yellow to code A" stuff but with the different teams. | ||
Slomo
Germany7198 Posts
We say "Too much TvT is boring!", they counter with "TvT is teh MU with highes skill cap" and bring up examples like NaDa vs PuMa @MLG and stuff. Nobody ever said those games werent exciting. But compared to the mass of TvT in the SC2 scene (Code S especially) there are only a few exciting games to watch as non Terrans. And sice 2/3 of people arent Terran it gets boring if you see mostly TvT and once a week another matchup. | ||
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legatus legionis
Netherlands559 Posts
It doesn't really matter and it seems super whiny to me to cry about it now and not after we have actually seen what it's like when it's all Terran. Reason being, everybody will have to almost exclusively practice against terran if almost everyone is Terran. That means TvT, ZvT and PvT will make incredible leaps forward. Also it will be hard for Terran to adjust to Zerg and Protoss's innovations when they have to play Terrans themselves. Meaning in time either the ZvT and PvT will move towards the non terran becoming more dominant. Or the Terran that stays strong versus these races will lose or get knocked out earlier because he can't advance past all the strong Terrans that are practicing way more TvT than him. Maybe I'm wrong, and I am assuming that it sort of works like this with the matchups at the highest level, where these things do matter. I wouldn't know if thats true but it seems logical. With that said you can see why I think it's very whiny. The only way it can coverge to is back to more even ratios. And we gain a ton of development in the process. On top of that you can't change anything this is just the way it goes, this is competition. Learn to love it for all it brings. Edit: Cleaned up the formatting. | ||
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Velr
Switzerland10846 Posts
I don't like tons of TvT all the time. Add into this that i can't watch GSL live and can't find a reason to care for most players there... | ||
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chokke
Norway228 Posts
Of course, it also depends on the playstyle of the terrans. Watching MKP I find boring since it's to gimmicky, while MVP is dominating in his style and makes it a sort of (sexy) dance when playing. But watching TvT, then some TvT only to have the winner face a new TvT all the way to the finals is just plain boring. Next season I probably won't watch most of it other then the few matches I want to see (up/down, IM-matches etc). | ||
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KimJongChill
United States6429 Posts
On September 08 2011 19:12 BadgerBadger8264 wrote: I disagree, terran play in Korea just feels a lot more refined and thought-through than protoss or zerg play, it probably has to do with the population of the race. There's just so much more terran players than protoss or zerg players, so they generally find new strategies and counter strategies and exploits much, much faster. Terran players have been dropping, using multi-pronged attacks and just generally using every single unit in their arsenal for months now, while MC has just found out the warp prism is, in fact, a protoss unit. For the same reason TvT is just, by far, the most refined matchup out of all of them. I don't think it has anything to do with race population, just that Terran as a race has more options and a higher skill ceiling, allowing more player skill to translate into something substantial. | ||
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legatus legionis
Netherlands559 Posts
On September 08 2011 19:47 KimJongChill wrote: I don't think it has anything to do with race population, just that Terran as a race has more options and a higher skill ceiling, allowing more player skill to translate into something substantial. I think this is a flawed belief and misconception. On the surface it does seem Terran has more options and it does allow for a deep amount of options but who is to say that isn't present in the other races. I'm sure it is, for some reason it's just been very unexplored. The HuK game where he micro's the warp prism with the HT's, dropping them storming, micro'ing them away. I don't think I've ever seen anyone do that. Maybe it's super hard to do but isn't that a "super high skill ceilling" then? | ||
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oni_link
Germany165 Posts
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Technique
Netherlands1542 Posts
On September 08 2011 19:52 legatus legionis wrote: I think this is a flawed belief and misconception. On the surface it does seem Terran has more options and it does allow for a deep amount of options but who is to say that isn't present in the other races. I'm sure it is, for some reason it's just been very unexplored. The HuK game where he micro's the warp prism with the HT's, dropping them storming, micro'ing them away. I don't think I've ever seen anyone do that. Maybe it's super hard to do but isn't that a "super high skill ceilling" then? Erm mc did that before... Besides thats just a micro trick... not more ''options'', not to speak of how easy that can get sniped. | ||
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legatus legionis
Netherlands559 Posts
On September 08 2011 19:55 Technique wrote: Erm mc did that before... Besides thats just a micro trick... not more ''options'', not to speak of how easy that can get sniped. I'm not saying it hasn't been done before but that I haven't seen it before. And it does seem very unexplored. I don't understand why a strategy revolving around a micro tactic like that isn't on the same level as a strategy revolving around a different micro tactic, like making a banshee. My point would be that there's an unknown amount left to be explored making it impossible to make absolute conclusions like that. It being easy to snipe is a non argument because that is only valid when the other person has the means to do so (making potentially useless vikings), and when the player in control allows it ("skill and adding personality to a play"). Even then, it's still an option. To expand on this, lets say you do zealot archon with this to do storms. They need to get vikings to stop it right? But you aren't making colossi so they are useless, you can just drop the templar and use it regularly and move the warp prism to do a warp in harass. This is way too theorycrafty so I wouldn't look into it seriously, but neither do I when you say it's easy to snipe it and that that alone makes it an option that cannot offer any value. Edit: Sentence wasn't clear. | ||
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GutBuck3t
6 Posts
You are right it is easy I guess Koreans are just 2 shy to ask politely. And you don't ever ever ever ever need vikings to stop WP, marines take them easily enough. Pro players aren't dumb, they have reasons why don't they use WP that often, especially against terran. User was banned for this post. | ||
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BadgerBadger8264
Netherlands409 Posts
Yeah dropping a templar against korean players is so easy.. Hey MVP I'm gonna make a WP and go with it in your base, so I will have less units but will you be so kind and not attack me for like first 10 minutes of the game? Then please don't make any marines or any AA and please wait until my storm upgrade finishes then I may kill couple of your SCVs but please don't make mules after that. You are right it is easy I guess Koreans are just 2 shy to ask politely. And you don't ever ever ever ever need vikings to stop WP, marines take them easily enough. Pro players aren't dumb, they have reasons why don't they use WP that often, especially against terran. You're right, drops are terrible against terran, because of their insane mobility, instant reinforcements everywhere and great static defense they're just flat out useless, this is why we never see drops in TvT. Professional players are called professional because they only do easy things and never try to revolutionize the game or come up with new strategies. Doing stuff like that is for bronze leaguers. | ||
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Lorch
Germany3690 Posts
That and the fact that even terrans don't enjoy seeing the same matchup all the time. | ||
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eloist
United States1017 Posts
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Purpose2
England187 Posts
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KimJongChill
United States6429 Posts
On September 08 2011 19:52 legatus legionis wrote: I think this is a flawed belief and misconception. On the surface it does seem Terran has more options and it does allow for a deep amount of options but who is to say that isn't present in the other races. I'm sure it is, for some reason it's just been very unexplored. The HuK game where he micro's the warp prism with the HT's, dropping them storming, micro'ing them away. I don't think I've ever seen anyone do that. Maybe it's super hard to do but isn't that a "super high skill ceilling" then? Yeah sure, the possibilities exist, but are probably even higher placed skill-wise. The whole medivac dynamic is just an amazing way to reward good multitasking, whereas analogues for z/p require more of an investment in both attention and resources. I don't think z/p currently have the depth of terran; this is reflected in the dearth of zerg units, as well as the vast array of upgrades, abilities, and unique characteristics of terrans. With all of their buildings and siege tanks and static defense, terran can control space so much better than the other races, and create positional advantages. Z/P are unexplored, as is Terran, but I think it still stands that Terran have the more accessible, appealing, and relatively rewarding options | ||
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Euronyme
Sweden3804 Posts
On September 08 2011 06:06 Vorrenus wrote: Hm, I wonder why GSL is getting boring prob because when its live its 240p and when its not i can't watch it at all.  Or maybe it's because you didn't pay the fee to watch their channel -.-' Don't complain about quality when you're being a cheap fuck who won't pay for almost unlimited top notch starcraft that costs as much as a sandwich. My personal interest flattened a little bit with the failure of the protoss players. Mirror matchups are all very boring imo (unless there are arbitrary excitement factors, such as rivalry and whatnot. Yellow vs Boxer ftw), and especially TvT which we've seen alot of lately. | ||
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Jenia6109
Russian Federation1613 Posts
1) Protoss suck more and more every season 2) Most series are TvT. Though it's interesting MU but it becomes boring when u must watch it so much 3) It hasn't youtube chanel (like nevake) and i must watch chineese commentaries which are just bad 4) Zerg suck too 5) Players dont seem enough hardcore. They seem more like celebrities than like sportsmen 6) Balance is bad after all T>all 7) There is no dominating players yet 8) Game is too young 9) Two semifinals Bo5 in one day is bad... 10) Bo7 is bad... | ||
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Sbrubbles
Brazil5776 Posts
I seldom watch it since I prefer the foreign tournaments. Still, I had no clue GSL was on the decline! | ||
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