Should "Deal Making" be illegal? - Page 8

On September 02 2011 08:14 cyprin wrote:



would you not agree that what tt1 did was match fixing?
he threw at least one of the games by going one base carrier

On September 02 2011 08:17 sixfour wrote:


it's not that the prize pools aren't big enough, they are, but they're just not arranged sensibly. current gsl has the semi finalists winning $4.5k, the runner up winning $18.5k, and the winner taking $46k. which is insanely top heavy. if they just made it so that the winner took $30k, runner up $20k, and the semi finalists $10k, nobody would need to deal.

ffs, i've dealt in the final of a £50 winner takes all pool comp. it is reducing variance in an ultra high variance environment. you'd be crazy not to.

On September 02 2011 08:23 babylon wrote:

There are so many factors that can affect someone's performance in the finals against a teammate. Maybe he was unmotivated because of the deal, maybe he didn't get a good night's sleep, maybe he was on tilt, maybe he was fatigued, maybe he needed to go to the fucking restroom, maybe it was all of these -- there is simply no way to prove he "threw" the match because of the deal.

On September 02 2011 08:22 Mig wrote:
As people have said the analogy comparing it to poker is definitely not correct. In a poker tournament the players themselves 99% of the time provide 100% of the prize pool. In general it should be their right to make a deal if they wish. In SC2 or any other spectator game where sponsors provide the prize pool then the players should not have control over the payouts.

I don't think the players chopping are terrible people the amount of variance and risk is a lot to deal with and can be incredibly stressful. But that being said I would never chop in their places. Even when I was a poor poker player just coming up I never chopped and I doubt I will ever chop a meaningful tourney. The reason many people play games for a living is because of how enjoyable the competition is. Playing big money high pressure matches is the most fun part of the job. So fuck making deals and ruining that.

On September 02 2011 08:22 Mig wrote:
As people have said the analogy comparing it to poker is definitely not correct. In a poker tournament the players themselves 99% of the time provide 100% of the prize pool. In general it should be their right to make a deal if they wish. In SC2 or any other spectator game where sponsors provide the prize pool then the players should not have control over the payouts.

On September 02 2011 08:23 piknic wrote:
I am sorry, but If i knew the two players were splitting their pot before a match I wouldn't look at it quite the same. The practice may be necessary because players need to eat food, but I don't want to hear about it. Ideally it should not happen, in a perfect world it wouldn't. Poker is completely different because players buyin, they owe nothing to the competition/audience when the prize money is 100% generated by their buyin.

On September 02 2011 08:22 Mig wrote:
Even when I was a poor poker player just coming up I never chopped and I doubt I will ever chop a meaningful tourney.

On September 02 2011 08:22 Mig wrote:
As people have said the analogy comparing it to poker is definitely not correct. In a poker tournament the players themselves 99% of the time provide 100% of the prize pool. In general it should be their right to make a deal if they wish. In SC2 or any other spectator game where sponsors provide the prize pool then the players should not have control over the payouts.

I don't think the players chopping are terrible people the amount of variance and risk is a lot to deal with and can be incredibly stressful. But that being said I would never chop in their places. Even when I was a poor poker player just coming up I never chopped and I doubt I will ever chop a meaningful tourney. The reason many people play games for a living is because of how enjoyable the competition is. Playing big money high pressure matches is the most fun part of the job. So fuck making deals and ruining that.

On September 02 2011 08:29 sixfour wrote:


you will change your mind when you get to such a stage and it is a life-altering amount of money. first thing i did when in my first (and only so far lol me) major tourney final was arrange with everyone to rework the prizepool and flatten it. everyone agreed this within about two minutes, and none of us had ever met before prior to that day. it was simple because we all knew it made sense, and the prizepool was already much flatter than every SC2 tourney i've ever seen. until you are in such a situation you can't make blanket statements like that.

On September 02 2011 08:28 jeparie wrote:


I'm not sure why you think there's an actual difference.

Poker players use their own money to buy in to the tournament, and sc2 pros depend on tournament winnings for part of their salary.

In either case, if they lose that money they have lost whatever their expected value was from playing in that tournament.

I think the main issue here is that people don't understand how variance works, or it's effects on things like tournaments. For a profession like sc2 where large scale tournaments are few and far between, things like prize splitting are a necessity.

On September 02 2011 08:29 sixfour wrote:


you will change your mind when you get to such a stage and it is a life-altering amount of money. first thing i did when in my first (and only so far lol me) major tourney final was arrange with everyone to rework the prizepool and flatten it. everyone agreed this within about two minutes, and none of us had ever met before prior to that day. it was simple because we all knew it made sense, and the prizepool was already much flatter than every SC2 tourney i've ever seen. until you are in such a situation you can't make blanket statements like that.

edit - mentioned this thread on poker forum where we talk about sc2, someone immediately said "i honestly don't know how they wouldn't chop gsl, it makes no sense not to"