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On April 05 2012 03:05 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On April 05 2012 03:02 GoSuChicken wrote:On April 05 2012 02:51 Forikorder wrote:On August 17 2011 11:38 TheRageKage12 wrote:Hi Everyone, I had an epiphany the other day. So many people bad manners on ladder after they lose, but nobody good manners. I guess it makes sense, it is easier to yell and blame someone for beating you than it is to accept that they played better. So, in an effort to make the ladder a better place, I've decided to end every game I lose with some good manner for my opponent. Thus far, I have 6 instances of good manner: + Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler +Replays: http://www.mediafire.com/?drqka1kc3volxt1Furthermore, I've found myself much more willing to go back and see how I lost after complementing my opponent on a job well done. That might just be a coincidence (or maybe I'm weird). NOTE: Some players may become confused and frightened at the sight of such a rare occurrence of good manner. If they do begin to lash out, calmly explain to them that you meant your complements and that you most definitely aren't trolling. :D i really dont like people like you jsut because someone is bad mannered doesnt mean there a terrible person that has no feelings and feels there great and the only reason they lsot is cause of some fluke alot of the time people are bad mannered on ladder because there opponent deserves it by all-innning and doing stupid cheese like blocking the ramp with pylons and stuff like that I really dont like people like you. In my opinion cheeses are valid strategies, pylonblocking not maybe but all-ins aren't bad. They are pretty strong and should always be considered. the point of the game is to have fun its no fun being all-inned
Winning is fun. And trying to exploit the mechanics of the game in every possible way in order to win is how the game should be played. If you want to add your own rules to a perfectly fine game try finding guys to play 15min no rush with :p
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Wow after reading this thread and the many opinions I'm a bit disgusted. Is it really THAT hard to type "gg" most of the time? I don't always gg every single time, no one does. I'll get cannoned and be on tilt and just quickly get out of the game and I have a thousand other excuses, but seriously? Its like playing baseball or basket ball and after the game everyone lines up and shakes each other hand or does that "Walking past/hand out/ sorta hi-five". Its a sign of good sportsmanship and respect, even if you got clobbered 100-0. It's some closure. Yes those are team games, what about wrestling? In highschool we always shook hands before and after, no matter who won or not. I didn't stomp my fucking feet and throw a tantrum like a baby, yell in his face and walk off (BM). That seems to be the difference between online gaming and real life. But both are compeitive and fun. I tend to say gg as much as possible, and I feel good when someone says it to me. I've made a ton of friends on battle.net from people i've beaten or beat me just from saying gg or gg wp and maybe sending them a msg or vice versa complimenting their play and striking a conversation. This goes hand in hand with people also crying about battle.net being lonely. Yes, it sorta is but while communicating and not being a whiney asshole I've made tons of friends and always have people messaging me when I get on just something as simple as them telling me about their day and asking how mine is. So, in conclusion, grow up and have some manners. We all go on tilt, but its infectious. But sometimes... good manners can be too. 
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Always gg, and if they do something remarkable, I'll comment on it. Recent example was a Terran (EmpirePinky, he was offracing) who went for 1-1-1 with delayed Cloak and Observer sniping. I got two fast Obs out and then paused for Immortal production. His delayed cloak caught me off guard and he steamrolled me. I told him that it was an unusual and clever play, and gg'd out.
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I was trying to be good manner last night when I was doing random 2s. Mostly I was just PMing my teammates and saying GG or that I liked their build/strat. But, guess what? Literally, every single time (at least 3 occurrences) I tried to do that, they were set to only accepting PMs from people on their friends list. So tired of that option...
Also, does BM skip a generation or something, or what is up with the weird order of BM?
I'm almost positive (but have zero quantitative data) that bronze and masters is chock full of BM, silver and diamond are a little better, and platinum/gold/GM are relatively calm.
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On April 05 2012 03:32 GlintFox wrote:
Wow after reading this thread and the many opinions I'm a bit disgusted. Is it really THAT hard to type "gg" most of the time?
Wow, just wow. If you are disgusted by people not "gg"-ing in some casual leagues I can't imagine how you feel everyday in your real life about important issues.
Why should I write "gl hf gg"? Because someone in WC2 days decided to use it every game? I just won't do stuff I don't feel doing over such a trivial thing as 1v1 game of SC2 in Plat/Diamond league.
Does my "gg" really affect your feelings and worth of victory at the end of the game? Cmon.
Pro games, different story, of course I believe there should be strong code of conduct in pro level games.
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On April 05 2012 03:38 whiterabbit wrote:Show nested quote +On April 05 2012 03:32 GlintFox wrote:
Wow after reading this thread and the many opinions I'm a bit disgusted. Is it really THAT hard to type "gg" most of the time? Wow, just wow. If you are disgusted by people not "gg"-ing in some casual leagues I can't imagine how you feel everyday in your real life about important issues. Why should I write "gl hf gg"? Because someone in WC2 days decided to use it every game? I just won't do stuff I don't feel doing over such a trivial thing as 1v1 game of SC2 in Plat/Diamond league. Does my "gg" really affect your feelings and worth of victory at the end of the game? Cmon. Pro games, different story, of course I believe there should be strong code of conduct in pro level games.
In my quote I was reffering to me being disgusted that people are that worked up and anti-good mannered. And considering what you posted I'm going to guess you didn't read the entire post. Interesting to say the least. The point was it's respectful and nice. No different than if you were playing a game in real life against someone you've never met. Lets say you and I 1v1 in basketball, and I don't talk to you whatsoever and after the game I don't even look at you and just walk away. Does that really affect you? No, but it would be a sign of SPORTSMANSHIP if i said, "hey, good game bro." And about leagues.. It shouldnt matter to be honest, sportsmanship is sportsmanship. But again, this seems to prove just how difficult it is for some people to type out two letters.
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On April 05 2012 03:47 GlintFox wrote:Show nested quote +On April 05 2012 03:38 whiterabbit wrote:On April 05 2012 03:32 GlintFox wrote:
Wow after reading this thread and the many opinions I'm a bit disgusted. Is it really THAT hard to type "gg" most of the time? Wow, just wow. If you are disgusted by people not "gg"-ing in some casual leagues I can't imagine how you feel everyday in your real life about important issues. Why should I write "gl hf gg"? Because someone in WC2 days decided to use it every game? I just won't do stuff I don't feel doing over such a trivial thing as 1v1 game of SC2 in Plat/Diamond league. Does my "gg" really affect your feelings and worth of victory at the end of the game? Cmon. Pro games, different story, of course I believe there should be strong code of conduct in pro level games. In my quote I was reffering to me being disgusted that people are that worked up and anti-good mannered. And considering what you posted I'm going to guess you didn't read the entire post. Interesting to say the least. The point was it's respectful and nice. No different than if you were playing a game in real life against someone you've never met. Lets say you and I 1v1 in basketball, and I don't talk to you whatsoever and after the game I don't even look at you and just walk away. Does that really affect you? No, but it would be a sign of SPORTSMANSHIP if i said, "hey, good game bro." And about leagues.. It shouldnt matter to be honest, sportsmanship is sportsmanship. But again, this seems to prove just how difficult it is for some people to type out two letters.
I read entire post but quoted first part because it is well connected to the rest of your post while it is primary line I am answering to.
I played a lot of basketball in my life and I was never affected by anyone's reaction or lack of sportsmanship nor I ever had feeling I am entitled to be greeted with "good game bro". And I guess there is difference between you and me.
Also nothing is so black and white. BM player in my eyes is player who spams insults, while player who just leaves game without "GG"-ing me is someone who just doesn't care. For me, being angry or happy doesn't change my viewpoint of using "gg" at the end of the game, in both cases I just leave, chill a bit, go to the next game.
And btw, I already said, I never insulted anyone over SC2 game nor answered to any insults.
Leagues matter, you can't tell me majority of Bronze league players feel SC2 as much as Master league players. There is big difference between casuals, players who work to become pros, semi-pros and pros.
At the end of the day you should just chill the f*** out. :-) As long as your opponents don't use spiteful insults you shouldn't care so much! Peace!
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Unless my opponent is being obnoxious in chat, I've been gg'ing out of every game I lose regardless of the strategy the other opponent utilizes. (see below)
+ Show Spoiler +
I encourage you all to do the same.
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While I do think not gg'ing is rude, for many of the reasons already mentioned, it's still about a million times less rude than actually insulting your opponent directly.
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On April 05 2012 03:26 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On April 05 2012 03:25 duct_TAPE wrote:On April 05 2012 03:05 Forikorder wrote:On April 05 2012 03:02 GoSuChicken wrote:On April 05 2012 02:51 Forikorder wrote:On August 17 2011 11:38 TheRageKage12 wrote:Hi Everyone, I had an epiphany the other day. So many people bad manners on ladder after they lose, but nobody good manners. I guess it makes sense, it is easier to yell and blame someone for beating you than it is to accept that they played better. So, in an effort to make the ladder a better place, I've decided to end every game I lose with some good manner for my opponent. Thus far, I have 6 instances of good manner: + Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler +Replays: http://www.mediafire.com/?drqka1kc3volxt1Furthermore, I've found myself much more willing to go back and see how I lost after complementing my opponent on a job well done. That might just be a coincidence (or maybe I'm weird). NOTE: Some players may become confused and frightened at the sight of such a rare occurrence of good manner. If they do begin to lash out, calmly explain to them that you meant your complements and that you most definitely aren't trolling. :D i really dont like people like you jsut because someone is bad mannered doesnt mean there a terrible person that has no feelings and feels there great and the only reason they lsot is cause of some fluke alot of the time people are bad mannered on ladder because there opponent deserves it by all-innning and doing stupid cheese like blocking the ramp with pylons and stuff like that I really dont like people like you. In my opinion cheeses are valid strategies, pylonblocking not maybe but all-ins aren't bad. They are pretty strong and should always be considered. the point of the game is to have fun its no fun being all-inned If there were no punishing builds it would be a macro game every time, meaning no need to invest in early defense. Zerg for example would be able to take 5 bases against a ffe protoss and drone up to 95 and get broods by the 14 min mark. I agree that all-ins are not the most exciting thing but it keeps players from being overly greedy. theres nothing stopping you from just doing some safe pressure like hellion expand or 2 base 4 gate or void ray agression or something that doesnt mean you ahve to leave if they defendShow nested quote +executing the all-in, however, can be quite fun.
so we seem to have a contradiction here, for one person to have fun it means his opponent can't? i dont believe that someone who palys the game can only ahve fun by doing all-ins, but if they purposely choose a strat in order to remove my fun then i will let them know how i feel about, if someone is rude then im going to be rude back
If you start doing light pressure builds against a general consensus of 'no all-ins allowed' gameplay, you're essentially going all-in cause the other player will have a very economic build and if your light pressure dosn't do enough damage you're going to end up way behind in economy. By going for light pressure you have a way to be dealt with by the other person even by a very economic opening.
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On April 05 2012 04:28 duct_TAPE wrote:Show nested quote +On April 05 2012 03:26 Forikorder wrote:On April 05 2012 03:25 duct_TAPE wrote:On April 05 2012 03:05 Forikorder wrote:On April 05 2012 03:02 GoSuChicken wrote:On April 05 2012 02:51 Forikorder wrote:On August 17 2011 11:38 TheRageKage12 wrote:Hi Everyone, I had an epiphany the other day. So many people bad manners on ladder after they lose, but nobody good manners. I guess it makes sense, it is easier to yell and blame someone for beating you than it is to accept that they played better. So, in an effort to make the ladder a better place, I've decided to end every game I lose with some good manner for my opponent. Thus far, I have 6 instances of good manner: + Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler +Replays: http://www.mediafire.com/?drqka1kc3volxt1Furthermore, I've found myself much more willing to go back and see how I lost after complementing my opponent on a job well done. That might just be a coincidence (or maybe I'm weird). NOTE: Some players may become confused and frightened at the sight of such a rare occurrence of good manner. If they do begin to lash out, calmly explain to them that you meant your complements and that you most definitely aren't trolling. :D i really dont like people like you jsut because someone is bad mannered doesnt mean there a terrible person that has no feelings and feels there great and the only reason they lsot is cause of some fluke alot of the time people are bad mannered on ladder because there opponent deserves it by all-innning and doing stupid cheese like blocking the ramp with pylons and stuff like that I really dont like people like you. In my opinion cheeses are valid strategies, pylonblocking not maybe but all-ins aren't bad. They are pretty strong and should always be considered. the point of the game is to have fun its no fun being all-inned If there were no punishing builds it would be a macro game every time, meaning no need to invest in early defense. Zerg for example would be able to take 5 bases against a ffe protoss and drone up to 95 and get broods by the 14 min mark. I agree that all-ins are not the most exciting thing but it keeps players from being overly greedy. theres nothing stopping you from just doing some safe pressure like hellion expand or 2 base 4 gate or void ray agression or something that doesnt mean you ahve to leave if they defendexecuting the all-in, however, can be quite fun.
so we seem to have a contradiction here, for one person to have fun it means his opponent can't? i dont believe that someone who palys the game can only ahve fun by doing all-ins, but if they purposely choose a strat in order to remove my fun then i will let them know how i feel about, if someone is rude then im going to be rude back If you start doing light pressure builds against a general consensus of 'no all-ins allowed' gameplay, you're essentially going all-in cause the other player will have a very economic build and if your light pressure dosn't do enough damage you're going to end up way behind in economy. By going for light pressure you have a way to be dealt with by the other person even by a very economic opening.
thats the dumbest thing ive ever heard
Hellion expand doesnt require ou to cut workers at all, it doesnt hurt you in any way and doesnt at all prevent you from building up your econ
it also prevents your opponent from taking a fast third and can kill alot of drones if there palying to greedy, same deal with 2 base 4 gate or light stargate agression or +1 zealots
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I've already commented on my part on the OP but I wanted to include this, as I didn't have my book with me on the subway and I had time to kill. I found this very interesting:
Out of all of the people who posted in this thread with a response relating to the fact that they do not gg, or do not gg if they don't think it's a good game/didn't deserve it, etc.
+ Show Spoiler +
Food for thought ><. GG guys, else you'll get permabanned ^^
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On April 05 2012 05:20 Badfatpanda wrote:I've already commented on my part on the OP but I wanted to include this, as I didn't have my book with me on the subway and I had time to kill. I found this very interesting: Out of all of the people who posted in this thread with a response relating to the fact that they do not gg, or do not gg if they don't think it's a good game/didn't deserve it, etc. + Show Spoiler +Food for thought ><. GG guys, else you'll get permabanned ^^
coreelation =/= causation just because some people who got perm banned jsut so happened to be the people who do not GG doesnt mean anything
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I dont GG, and dont whine, or talk thrash either. I dont think it's necessary to say GG, because 99% om the times, when i lose, i made a crucial mistake somewhere, so the game wasnt that good for me, but i think talking thrash doesn't solve anything, so im not BMing either..
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On April 05 2012 05:15 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On April 05 2012 04:28 duct_TAPE wrote:On April 05 2012 03:26 Forikorder wrote:On April 05 2012 03:25 duct_TAPE wrote:On April 05 2012 03:05 Forikorder wrote:On April 05 2012 03:02 GoSuChicken wrote:On April 05 2012 02:51 Forikorder wrote:On August 17 2011 11:38 TheRageKage12 wrote:Hi Everyone, I had an epiphany the other day. So many people bad manners on ladder after they lose, but nobody good manners. I guess it makes sense, it is easier to yell and blame someone for beating you than it is to accept that they played better. So, in an effort to make the ladder a better place, I've decided to end every game I lose with some good manner for my opponent. Thus far, I have 6 instances of good manner: + Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler +Replays: http://www.mediafire.com/?drqka1kc3volxt1Furthermore, I've found myself much more willing to go back and see how I lost after complementing my opponent on a job well done. That might just be a coincidence (or maybe I'm weird). NOTE: Some players may become confused and frightened at the sight of such a rare occurrence of good manner. If they do begin to lash out, calmly explain to them that you meant your complements and that you most definitely aren't trolling. :D i really dont like people like you jsut because someone is bad mannered doesnt mean there a terrible person that has no feelings and feels there great and the only reason they lsot is cause of some fluke alot of the time people are bad mannered on ladder because there opponent deserves it by all-innning and doing stupid cheese like blocking the ramp with pylons and stuff like that I really dont like people like you. In my opinion cheeses are valid strategies, pylonblocking not maybe but all-ins aren't bad. They are pretty strong and should always be considered. the point of the game is to have fun its no fun being all-inned If there were no punishing builds it would be a macro game every time, meaning no need to invest in early defense. Zerg for example would be able to take 5 bases against a ffe protoss and drone up to 95 and get broods by the 14 min mark. I agree that all-ins are not the most exciting thing but it keeps players from being overly greedy. theres nothing stopping you from just doing some safe pressure like hellion expand or 2 base 4 gate or void ray agression or something that doesnt mean you ahve to leave if they defendexecuting the all-in, however, can be quite fun.
so we seem to have a contradiction here, for one person to have fun it means his opponent can't? i dont believe that someone who palys the game can only ahve fun by doing all-ins, but if they purposely choose a strat in order to remove my fun then i will let them know how i feel about, if someone is rude then im going to be rude back If you start doing light pressure builds against a general consensus of 'no all-ins allowed' gameplay, you're essentially going all-in cause the other player will have a very economic build and if your light pressure dosn't do enough damage you're going to end up way behind in economy. By going for light pressure you have a way to be dealt with by the other person even by a very economic opening. thats the dumbest thing ive ever heard Hellion expand doesnt require ou to cut workers at all, it doesnt hurt you in any way and doesnt at all prevent you from building up your econ it also prevents your opponent from taking a fast third and can kill alot of drones if there palying to greedy, same deal with 2 base 4 gate or light stargate agression or +1 zealots
You're not thinking straight, you have to think in terms of your own rules.
What prevents a zerg from taking 3 hatches before your 4 hellions, getting 3 roaches and then drone to 80? If no more than 4 hellions is your 'pressure' then you can take 3 hatches with no competetion. It's not like a normal game opening but it dosn't have to be if the zerg knows that you're ONLY doing light pressure.
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Nice initiative man, I always gg out with the occasional ggwp, after trying to compliment people further in the manner you show, most people thought that i was being sarcastic, resulting in long conversations explaining that i do mean what i've said xD.
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On April 05 2012 05:25 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On April 05 2012 05:20 Badfatpanda wrote:I've already commented on my part on the OP but I wanted to include this, as I didn't have my book with me on the subway and I had time to kill. I found this very interesting: Out of all of the people who posted in this thread with a response relating to the fact that they do not gg, or do not gg if they don't think it's a good game/didn't deserve it, etc. + Show Spoiler +Food for thought ><. GG guys, else you'll get permabanned ^^ coreelation =/= causation just because some people who got perm banned jsut so happened to be the people who do not GG doesnt mean anything
Fuck, there needs to be some sarcasm spoiler, I figured ^^ was enough T_T. Thought wrong.
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I only GG in ladder when I am impressed by my opponents play in some way. This means, this opponent plays a specific style I can relate to in some way. It might be some insane macro, some counter to my build or very good micro. It does not include wins by extremely cheesy plays or standard all-in plays and annoying plays which are obviously just for getting ladder points instead of improving yourself (which should be the very motivation for playing ladder). This is the way how I and many others will do it. Just accept it please. There is no need for an useless 'GG'-inflation where nobody really means it when he types these letter at the end of a match. Of course I am only speaking about my own ladder games and not about official matches by progamers in big tournaments or leagues.
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Its like all the pro gg people wear it as a badge of superiority. People who think everyone should say gg come across as pompous and the people who don't come across as whiny. Who gives a fuck what people say. The people who msg you "gg" after a game are just as bad as the people who bm you. If the guy wanted to say it he would, like I said it comes across as pompous.
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On April 05 2012 03:26 Forikorder wrote:
i dont believe that someone who palys the game can only ahve fun by doing all-ins, but if they purposely choose a strat in order to remove my fun then i will let them know how i feel about, if someone is rude then im going to be rude back
I don't believe that someone who plays the game can only have fun by doing economic oriented games, all ins are fun strats to be executed, if you get annoyed by them, its your own mentality that does that, don't blame others
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