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On August 12 2011 11:24 JSy wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 11:22 ptbl wrote:
Wow, how come so much hate against Mr. Chae and Gom TV? People are so fickle these days. Mr. Chae has been so helpful for the Starcraft community and it seems he was just caught in the crossfire. It happened in Korea too >o< http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=253750¤tpage=54#1077Actually, maybe NASL should make a note in the OP like the translator did at PlayXP. Make it clear Mr. Chae was more an intermediary than an actual part of the decision making (although this is just an assumption, too...)
Think people are still confused by Mr. Chae role in this, is he just someone passing on SC2 con's message. if it is just that then there no problem with him, since sc2 con is made up of most of the coaches to the large teams in korea.
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On August 12 2011 08:11 Goobus wrote:
Wow, this is surprising news. It seems a questionable business decision to deny an all expenses paid trip for a shot at the grand finals which pays out a massive first prize. I'm wondering whether this is the beginning of KeSPA 2.0...
Actually I think this has to do more with the teams.
SC2Con is consists of mainly the coaches from each team right?
Seems odd that they're doing this and all agreeing to withdraw.
Honestly NASL is doing its best. It's a new league and doesn't have a lot of $$$$ yet but I think SC2con thinks NASL is withholding money from them when in reality NASL is doing their best.
Also I'm sure once KeSPA is able to enter the SC2 scene, they'll take the offer (rumor has it is. KeSPA is entering SC2 once GOM contract expires. KeSPA will definitely show how it's done >.>).
Sad part is I was looking forward to MarineKing getting a silver in this tournament >.<. Sad to see him gone.
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On August 12 2011 11:24 JSy wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 11:22 ptbl wrote:
Wow, how come so much hate against Mr. Chae and Gom TV? People are so fickle these days. Mr. Chae has been so helpful for the Starcraft community and it seems he was just caught in the crossfire. It happened in Korea too >o< http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=253750¤tpage=54#1077Actually, maybe NASL should make a note in the OP like the translator did at PlayXP. Make it clear Mr. Chae was more an intermediary than an actual part of the decision making (although this is just an assumption, too...)
Mr. Chae is one of the best things to ever happen to SC2. These dumbheads fail to notice that he was only the guy who spoke in behalf of SC2con, for he was somewhat decent at English. He had no say in their decision, AT ALL. These kind of things go directly against everything he and GOM has been trying to achieve for the past year or so, which is uniting the scene under the banner of esports.
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On August 12 2011 11:24 Boomy123 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 11:21 thedz wrote:On August 12 2011 11:21 88FuZiLeiRo wrote:
Bad for NASL, sad for the e-Sports scenario at all...
I still think the Koreans are VERY wrong at this point, 2000$ for each player, in an e-Sports tournament is too much, more than enough for accomodation and the travel itself... On August 12 2011 11:19 Brian333 wrote:
I'm not totally sure about this as I'm usually not the one directly buying or arranging the flights I take between Asia and the US but $1000 is definitely not enough and given the circumstances, $2000 might not be nearly enough either when including hotel fees. Keep in mind that it's a $1000 stipend plus $1000 prize. And the ticket alone will almost certainly be more than $1000. So they'd be essentially be using their own money (earned from over 9 weeks of pool play) to help pay for travel. Basically meaning, if they're lucky they'll break even after 2 months of playing. It's a waste of their time and money to play.
So is then every other tournament.
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On August 12 2011 11:28 eggs wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 11:27 dAPhREAk wrote:On August 12 2011 11:24 Boomy123 wrote:On August 12 2011 11:21 thedz wrote:On August 12 2011 11:21 88FuZiLeiRo wrote:
Bad for NASL, sad for the e-Sports scenario at all...
I still think the Koreans are VERY wrong at this point, 2000$ for each player, in an e-Sports tournament is too much, more than enough for accomodation and the travel itself... On August 12 2011 11:19 Brian333 wrote:
I'm not totally sure about this as I'm usually not the one directly buying or arranging the flights I take between Asia and the US but $1000 is definitely not enough and given the circumstances, $2000 might not be nearly enough either when including hotel fees. Keep in mind that it's a $1000 stipend plus $1000 prize. And the ticket alone will almost certainly be more than $1000. So they'd be essentially be using their own money (earned from over 9 weeks of pool play) to help pay for travel. Basically meaning, if they're lucky they'll break even after 2 months of playing. It's a waste of their time and money to play. yes, that is true. but it is the same for everyone. why should one group receive different treatment? sen is in taiwan; white ra in ukraine. why should they have to bear more risk? They have different teams with different sponsors, and no commitments to the GSL schedule.
i see. so, it is NASL's job to sponsor some players and teams over others because they cant get sponsorships and they want to play in other leagues. yeah, that seems fair.
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On August 12 2011 11:27 eggs wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 11:25 Omegastorm wrote:
Don't worry, you can be successful without the Koreans as well. You will be able to get them nxt season with ( 4-5 invites ) North American E-sports pride, don't give up and work hard! You have my full support! ( i will try to watch ) Optimism is nice but I'm not sure sure about that. There's a reason there was a Korean playing during almost every scheduled stream time at MLG. Top players draw viewers.
But NASL fans will watch it no matter what to show support!
I admit that losing the Koreans are bad for NASL but this season will not be as bad as ppl think because the international sc2 scene can be as good if they try hard.
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On August 12 2011 11:24 Boomy123 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 11:21 thedz wrote:On August 12 2011 11:21 88FuZiLeiRo wrote:
Bad for NASL, sad for the e-Sports scenario at all...
I still think the Koreans are VERY wrong at this point, 2000$ for each player, in an e-Sports tournament is too much, more than enough for accomodation and the travel itself... On August 12 2011 11:19 Brian333 wrote:
I'm not totally sure about this as I'm usually not the one directly buying or arranging the flights I take between Asia and the US but $1000 is definitely not enough and given the circumstances, $2000 might not be nearly enough either when including hotel fees. Keep in mind that it's a $1000 stipend plus $1000 prize. And the ticket alone will almost certainly be more than $1000. So they'd be essentially be using their own money (earned from over 9 weeks of pool play) to help pay for travel. Basically meaning, if they're lucky they'll break even after 2 months of playing. It's a waste of their time and money to play.
And what's wrong with that? Over there only 33 (32 Code S players + 1 Code A winner) of them will ever stand a chance of winning money in the GSL, and it takes place over one entire month. Taking part in the GSTL is a 2-3 month commitment on its own and they don't gain anything at all should they fail to make it to the playoffs. Participating in the NASL is another viable source of income on its own - they don't even need to step out of the comfort of their homes.
IMO I think that the SC2con isn't doing their players justice. But of course they might come up with a statement of their own.
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On August 12 2011 11:24 Boomy123 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 11:21 thedz wrote:On August 12 2011 11:21 88FuZiLeiRo wrote:
Bad for NASL, sad for the e-Sports scenario at all...
I still think the Koreans are VERY wrong at this point, 2000$ for each player, in an e-Sports tournament is too much, more than enough for accomodation and the travel itself... On August 12 2011 11:19 Brian333 wrote:
I'm not totally sure about this as I'm usually not the one directly buying or arranging the flights I take between Asia and the US but $1000 is definitely not enough and given the circumstances, $2000 might not be nearly enough either when including hotel fees. Keep in mind that it's a $1000 stipend plus $1000 prize. And the ticket alone will almost certainly be more than $1000. So they'd be essentially be using their own money (earned from over 9 weeks of pool play) to help pay for travel. Basically meaning, if they're lucky they'll break even after 2 months of playing. It's a waste of their time and money to play.
How is this any different than players who don't win money at other tournaments? Look at EG at MLG Anaheim. They didn't have one player win any money. Yet they still paid how much money to go to MLG. Look at TL. Huk is the only player who won money ($500). That didn't cover his cost to fly over, but you don't hear TL bitching about it. Not to mention every other player of theirs that didn't make any money.
You are never guaranteed to walk away from a tournament with winnings. Thats why teams use things like ROI to justify sending their players to these tournaments. Teams realize that by going to these events they gain fans, exposure, notariety, and so on.
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On August 12 2011 11:30 dAPhREAk wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 11:28 eggs wrote:On August 12 2011 11:27 dAPhREAk wrote:On August 12 2011 11:24 Boomy123 wrote:On August 12 2011 11:21 thedz wrote:On August 12 2011 11:21 88FuZiLeiRo wrote:
Bad for NASL, sad for the e-Sports scenario at all...
I still think the Koreans are VERY wrong at this point, 2000$ for each player, in an e-Sports tournament is too much, more than enough for accomodation and the travel itself... On August 12 2011 11:19 Brian333 wrote:
I'm not totally sure about this as I'm usually not the one directly buying or arranging the flights I take between Asia and the US but $1000 is definitely not enough and given the circumstances, $2000 might not be nearly enough either when including hotel fees. Keep in mind that it's a $1000 stipend plus $1000 prize. And the ticket alone will almost certainly be more than $1000. So they'd be essentially be using their own money (earned from over 9 weeks of pool play) to help pay for travel. Basically meaning, if they're lucky they'll break even after 2 months of playing. It's a waste of their time and money to play. yes, that is true. but it is the same for everyone. why should one group receive different treatment? sen is in taiwan; white ra in ukraine. why should they have to bear more risk? They have different teams with different sponsors, and no commitments to the GSL schedule. i see. so, it is NASL's job to sponsor some players and teams over others because they cant get sponsorships and they want to play in other leagues. yeah, that seems fair.
Not sure how you jumped to that conclusion. Explain?
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Finally, another event not swarmed with koreans. Let our foriegn community have its own tournements.
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On August 12 2011 11:24 Boomy123 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 11:21 thedz wrote:On August 12 2011 11:21 88FuZiLeiRo wrote:
Bad for NASL, sad for the e-Sports scenario at all...
I still think the Koreans are VERY wrong at this point, 2000$ for each player, in an e-Sports tournament is too much, more than enough for accomodation and the travel itself... On August 12 2011 11:19 Brian333 wrote:
I'm not totally sure about this as I'm usually not the one directly buying or arranging the flights I take between Asia and the US but $1000 is definitely not enough and given the circumstances, $2000 might not be nearly enough either when including hotel fees. Keep in mind that it's a $1000 stipend plus $1000 prize. And the ticket alone will almost certainly be more than $1000. So they'd be essentially be using their own money (earned from over 9 weeks of pool play) to help pay for travel. Basically meaning, if they're lucky they'll break even after 2 months of playing. It's a waste of their time and money to play.
I believe you just defined a competition sir.
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I don't know if this has been said, but decisions like this betray the lack of money on the Korean teams, which makes it more and more likely we see Korean players leave for foreigner teams. That's where the money is, that's where players can go to get more exposure, more tournaments, and more prize money. I'd be very surprised if we don't see more and more blurring of the line between "foreign" and "Korean" teams in the future.
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On August 12 2011 11:32 eggs wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 11:30 dAPhREAk wrote:On August 12 2011 11:28 eggs wrote:On August 12 2011 11:27 dAPhREAk wrote:On August 12 2011 11:24 Boomy123 wrote:On August 12 2011 11:21 thedz wrote:On August 12 2011 11:21 88FuZiLeiRo wrote:
Bad for NASL, sad for the e-Sports scenario at all...
I still think the Koreans are VERY wrong at this point, 2000$ for each player, in an e-Sports tournament is too much, more than enough for accomodation and the travel itself... On August 12 2011 11:19 Brian333 wrote:
I'm not totally sure about this as I'm usually not the one directly buying or arranging the flights I take between Asia and the US but $1000 is definitely not enough and given the circumstances, $2000 might not be nearly enough either when including hotel fees. Keep in mind that it's a $1000 stipend plus $1000 prize. And the ticket alone will almost certainly be more than $1000. So they'd be essentially be using their own money (earned from over 9 weeks of pool play) to help pay for travel. Basically meaning, if they're lucky they'll break even after 2 months of playing. It's a waste of their time and money to play. yes, that is true. but it is the same for everyone. why should one group receive different treatment? sen is in taiwan; white ra in ukraine. why should they have to bear more risk? They have different teams with different sponsors, and no commitments to the GSL schedule. i see. so, it is NASL's job to sponsor some players and teams over others because they cant get sponsorships and they want to play in other leagues. yeah, that seems fair. Now sure how you jumped to that conclusion. Explain?
you are saying that NASL should pay for their travel costs because they dont have sponsorships, right? that means NASL is sponsoring them, right?
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Also for those who want a refund - If you have the spare money (that is you don't immediately need the refund), you should still keep the ticket.
NASL is another good tournament and its helping eSports (really). More major tournaments = better for eSports.
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dont see why players with sponsorships cant play
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This is all cause of Puma -_- They don't want their players poached anymore lol
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On August 12 2011 11:33 dAPhREAk wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 11:32 eggs wrote:On August 12 2011 11:30 dAPhREAk wrote:On August 12 2011 11:28 eggs wrote:On August 12 2011 11:27 dAPhREAk wrote:On August 12 2011 11:24 Boomy123 wrote:On August 12 2011 11:21 thedz wrote:On August 12 2011 11:21 88FuZiLeiRo wrote:
Bad for NASL, sad for the e-Sports scenario at all...
I still think the Koreans are VERY wrong at this point, 2000$ for each player, in an e-Sports tournament is too much, more than enough for accomodation and the travel itself... On August 12 2011 11:19 Brian333 wrote:
I'm not totally sure about this as I'm usually not the one directly buying or arranging the flights I take between Asia and the US but $1000 is definitely not enough and given the circumstances, $2000 might not be nearly enough either when including hotel fees. Keep in mind that it's a $1000 stipend plus $1000 prize. And the ticket alone will almost certainly be more than $1000. So they'd be essentially be using their own money (earned from over 9 weeks of pool play) to help pay for travel. Basically meaning, if they're lucky they'll break even after 2 months of playing. It's a waste of their time and money to play. yes, that is true. but it is the same for everyone. why should one group receive different treatment? sen is in taiwan; white ra in ukraine. why should they have to bear more risk? They have different teams with different sponsors, and no commitments to the GSL schedule. i see. so, it is NASL's job to sponsor some players and teams over others because they cant get sponsorships and they want to play in other leagues. yeah, that seems fair. Not sure how you jumped to that conclusion. Explain? you are saying that NASL should pay for their travel costs because they dont have sponsorships, right? that means NASL is sponsoring them, right?
I don't think you know what sponsorship means. The Koreans weren't asking for NASL to sponsor the Korean teams.
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On August 12 2011 11:15 The KY wrote:
Sounds like they were being arrogant dicks who thought that their participation is so important that they can demand what they liked...don't mean to be too harsh but given the terms offered it is plain unreasonable.
Don't see why. Better teams get better treatment in every sport, to a much greater extent than anywhere in sc2, including their proposal. Instead of getting a share of the broadcasting revenue, they asked for better treatment otherwise. Given the amount of viewers they bring (and hence the money they generate for NASL), that simply will not be there without them (see for example the EXPLOSIVE growth of MLG viewership numbers since they started inviting Koreans), it's not a completely unreasonable negotiating position.
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On August 12 2011 11:33 Xx26Vanek26xX wrote:
still many good players from Slayers MVP IM and Zenex they could get to replace them
Except MVP IM Zenex are part of sc2con?
Slayers Boxer withdrew for similar reasons, so no one else from slayers will be participating.
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EPT
