• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 09:39
CEST 15:39
KST 22:39
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Maestros of the Game: Live Finals Preview (RO4)5TL.net Map Contest #21 - Finalists4Team TLMC #5: Vote to Decide Ladder Maps!0[ASL20] Ro8 Preview Pt1: Mile High15Team TLMC #5 - Finalists & Open Tournaments2
Community News
herO joins T121Artosis vs Ret Showmatch52Classic wins RSL Revival Season 22Weekly Cups (Sept 15-21): herO Goes For Four2SC2 5.0.15 PTR Patch Notes + Sept 22nd update294
StarCraft 2
General
SC2 5.0.15 PTR Patch Notes + Sept 22nd update Maestros of the Game: Live Finals Preview (RO4) Had to smile :) herO joins T1 Storm change is a essentially a strict buff on PTR
Tourneys
Maestros of The Game—$20k event w/ live finals in Paris SC2's Safe House 2 - October 18 & 19 Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Prome's Evo #1 - Solar vs Classic (SC: Evo)
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 492 Get Out More Mutation # 491 Night Drive Mutation # 490 Masters of Midnight Mutation # 489 Bannable Offense
Brood War
General
Artosis vs Ret Showmatch ASL20 General Discussion ASL 20 Soundtrack StarCraft 1 Beta Test (Video) Thoughts on rarely used units
Tourneys
Azhi's Colosseum [ASL20] Ro8 Day 2 [ASL20] Ro8 Day 1 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Current Meta I am doing this better than progamers do. Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile Liquipedia App: Now Covering SC2 and Brood War! Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion LiquidDota to reintegrate into TL.net
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine The Big Programming Thread Trading/Investing Thread
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club! The Happy Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List BarCraft in Tokyo Japan for ASL Season5 Final
Blogs
[AI] Sorry, Chill, My Bad :…
Peanutsc
Try to reverse getting fired …
Garnet
[ASL20] Players bad at pi…
pullarius1
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1596 users

ESL announces Extreme Masters VI (IEM) - Page 17

Forum Index > SC2 General
661 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 15 16 17 18 19 34 Next All
This isn't going to turn into another LoL vs (all other games apparently) thread. You can speak your mind about the selection of games but keep it civil.
elementz
Profile Joined October 2010
United States281 Posts
June 27 2011 22:11 GMT
#321
On June 28 2011 07:05 Falcor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 28 2011 07:04 elementz wrote:
On June 28 2011 06:55 Znoz wrote:
About viewers -
For example what is better:
25k viewers who have 50$ to play game and it's possible that they will buy some products from sponsors and partners?
- or -
100k viewers who play after school and need 2 weeks of suffering in school without food, to buy new mouse or keyboard?

ESports or EFunfair?
Quality of game or Commercial?

And if they wanted to add Dota-style game - why not take DOTA - balanced and all-known instead of you-know-what-casual-imbalanced-sht.

Incorrect, Riot went from a start up to a 400million dollar company within 1 year, I don't know how easy it is for you to make 400million but I ll need 4000years @100k a year. And they didn't make that money because of their good looks.


apparently its pretty easy. Copy someone elses design for a game xactly, make it easier and watch the money roll in

Spoken like someone who never played a MOBA in his life.
this mah s#$%$
mikyaJ
Profile Joined April 2011
1834 Posts
June 27 2011 22:12 GMT
#322
On June 28 2011 07:05 Falcor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 28 2011 07:04 elementz wrote:
On June 28 2011 06:55 Znoz wrote:
About viewers -
For example what is better:
25k viewers who have 50$ to play game and it's possible that they will buy some products from sponsors and partners?
- or -
100k viewers who play after school and need 2 weeks of suffering in school without food, to buy new mouse or keyboard?

ESports or EFunfair?
Quality of game or Commercial?

And if they wanted to add Dota-style game - why not take DOTA - balanced and all-known instead of you-know-what-casual-imbalanced-sht.

Incorrect, Riot went from a start up to a 400million dollar company within 1 year, I don't know how easy it is for you to make 400million but I ll need 4000years @100k a year. And they didn't make that money because of their good looks.


apparently its pretty easy. Copy someone elses design for a game xactly, make it easier and watch the money roll in

That would actually be HoN

And we all know how successful that is right now
MKP||TSL
Shatter
Profile Joined October 2009
United States1401 Posts
June 27 2011 22:13 GMT
#323
If LoL was such an easy game to master, you would see a lot more teams competing at the highest level.Yet, the top 5 or so NA teams are consistently doing well. With LoL's playerbase, if the game was so easy to master, you would see like 100 top teams that could all compete near equal with each other, which isn't the case.
Znoz
Profile Joined January 2011
Latvia127 Posts
June 27 2011 22:16 GMT
#324
On June 28 2011 07:12 mikyaJ wrote:
That would actually be HoN
And we all know how successful that is right now

Yeah, in LoL they removed some features and made game easier.
So it's : Take game - copy - make casual - make f2p- add micro-transactions - add commercials and promote game in tournaments - print-screen 200k viewers- go to forums and post it with big trollface and "u mad?" words.

User was warned for this post

User was temp banned for this post.
isM
Profile Joined September 2010
United States735 Posts
June 27 2011 22:18 GMT
#325
On June 28 2011 07:16 Znoz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 28 2011 07:12 mikyaJ wrote:
That would actually be HoN
And we all know how successful that is right now

Yeah, in LoL they removed some features and made game easier.
So it's : Take game - copy - make casual - make f2p- add micro-transactions - add commercials and promote game in tournaments - print-screen 200k viewers- go to forums and post it with big trollface and "u mad?" words.


You could have print screened 200k viewers at any point the stream was on which is undoubtedly the biggest factor in this whole thing.
Loose lips sink ships
ZergMaestro
Profile Joined January 2011
United States169 Posts
June 27 2011 22:18 GMT
#326
I remember when progaming was more underground type shit. Instead of shit now days getting the lesser games with the bigger view count. Whats next cs 1.6 getting replaced by CSS, or call of duty 8 because it gets more eyeballs? a bigger esport scene isn't going to be the best thing ever. it will appeal to more and more casual fans, and leave the 'core guys yearning for the days of old.
Ma Jae Yoon #1. The ONLY Maestro. Effort.
Daehlie
Profile Joined September 2010
United States43 Posts
June 27 2011 22:18 GMT
#327
On June 28 2011 07:04 elementz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 28 2011 06:55 Znoz wrote:
About viewers -
For example what is better:
25k viewers who have 50$ to play game and it's possible that they will buy some products from sponsors and partners?
- or -
100k viewers who play after school and need 2 weeks of suffering in school without food, to buy new mouse or keyboard?

ESports or EFunfair?
Quality of game or Commercial?

And if they wanted to add Dota-style game - why not take DOTA - balanced and all-known instead of you-know-what-casual-imbalanced-sht.

Incorrect, Riot went from a start up to a 400million dollar company within 1 year, I don't know how easy it is for you to make 400million but I ll need 4000years @100k a year. And they didn't make that money because of their good looks.

The other explanation other than their good looks, Riot Games sold a majority stake in the business to the Chinese Google equivalent for what we can only assume was a dump truck full of cash. If you look on their investor page, they state outright that their are financially backed by Tencent Holdings.

Also, I have not seen any audited financial statements for Riot Games, so I would call into question your assertion of $400M, that is the estimated (financial details of the deal were not officially released) valuation of the company which is a multiple of its true financial performance. Tencent paid a premium to eliminate the two other venture capital firms that had a stake in the startup.

Short answer, to Tencent Holdings, Riot Games looked like it was worth less on paper today than it could be in ten years, and they are willing to gamble on that fact to the tune of $400M. So, in a way, they did choose them for their good looks, but taking the purchase price of a business with the multiple as its "worth" is sophomoric of the first order. By that logic Apple is worth $300B, and LinkedIn is worth $7B.
SK.MC ftw
Kipsate
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Netherlands45349 Posts
June 27 2011 22:18 GMT
#328
On June 28 2011 07:16 Znoz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 28 2011 07:12 mikyaJ wrote:
That would actually be HoN
And we all know how successful that is right now

Yeah, in LoL they removed some features and made game easier.
So it's : Take game - copy - make casual - make f2p- add micro-transactions - add commercials and promote game in tournaments - print-screen 200k viewers- go to forums and post it with big trollface and "u mad?" words.


Did that with Starcraft 2 too, they took BW, - copy - make it easier- SHINY GRAPHICS - make casual - profit!.

See how much that makes sense?
WriterXiao8~~
Falcor
Profile Joined February 2010
Canada894 Posts
June 27 2011 22:19 GMT
#329
On June 28 2011 07:11 elementz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 28 2011 07:05 Falcor wrote:
On June 28 2011 07:04 elementz wrote:
On June 28 2011 06:55 Znoz wrote:
About viewers -
For example what is better:
25k viewers who have 50$ to play game and it's possible that they will buy some products from sponsors and partners?
- or -
100k viewers who play after school and need 2 weeks of suffering in school without food, to buy new mouse or keyboard?

ESports or EFunfair?
Quality of game or Commercial?

And if they wanted to add Dota-style game - why not take DOTA - balanced and all-known instead of you-know-what-casual-imbalanced-sht.

Incorrect, Riot went from a start up to a 400million dollar company within 1 year, I don't know how easy it is for you to make 400million but I ll need 4000years @100k a year. And they didn't make that money because of their good looks.


apparently its pretty easy. Copy someone elses design for a game xactly, make it easier and watch the money roll in

Spoken like someone who never played a MOBA in his life.


i actually played tides of blood and then switched to dota then when LoL beta came out i played that until release....so yeah ur right
Znoz
Profile Joined January 2011
Latvia127 Posts
June 27 2011 22:20 GMT
#330
On June 28 2011 07:13 Shatter wrote:
If LoL was such an easy game to master, you would see a lot more teams competing at the highest level.Yet, the top 5 or so NA teams are consistently doing well. With LoL's playerbase, if the game was so easy to master, you would see like 100 top teams that could all compete near equal with each other, which isn't the case.

Because 90% of LoLers need 5-7 years to become independent from school and parents, and then they will compete in "top".

User was warned for this post
Sae
Profile Joined November 2010
United Kingdom74 Posts
June 27 2011 22:20 GMT
#331
On June 28 2011 06:59 velocityqt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 28 2011 06:43 rareh wrote:
On June 28 2011 05:19 ComusLoM wrote:
Last I heard QL was completely dead, with the same players winning every single event. Basically LoL is huge and has the potential to be a competitive title with some tweaks such as ingame pauses etc. I don't understand the hate. I miss the old quake, back when it was good.

Can't wait for live on three.


Last i heard SC2 had no skill compared to BW.

Its like this BW and QL are games that take skill,therefore the usual people win(FLash in BW, rapha in QL).

You cannot cheese until the final like rain or others and beat players that are better then you.



its overall good game and decent replacemnt for old bw and pretty much everybody accepted it (this who didnt still play bw),


what kind of a sentence is this wtf
Shatter
Profile Joined October 2009
United States1401 Posts
June 27 2011 22:21 GMT
#332
On June 28 2011 07:20 Znoz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 28 2011 07:13 Shatter wrote:
If LoL was such an easy game to master, you would see a lot more teams competing at the highest level.Yet, the top 5 or so NA teams are consistently doing well. With LoL's playerbase, if the game was so easy to master, you would see like 100 top teams that could all compete near equal with each other, which isn't the case.

Because 90% of LoLers need 5-7 years to become independent from school and parents, and then they will compete in "top".
Haha, you are hilarious.
Udyr
Profile Joined May 2011
Austria16 Posts
June 27 2011 22:21 GMT
#333
Quake is a good game, but whoever watched League of Legends at Dreamhack might have noticed that the viewer count is even higher than the Starcraft one... Watching this game is amazing, I would give LoL a chance for that EMS... : )
Roffles *
Profile Blog Joined April 2007
Pitcairn19291 Posts
June 27 2011 22:23 GMT
#334
On June 28 2011 07:20 Znoz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 28 2011 07:13 Shatter wrote:
If LoL was such an easy game to master, you would see a lot more teams competing at the highest level.Yet, the top 5 or so NA teams are consistently doing well. With LoL's playerbase, if the game was so easy to master, you would see like 100 top teams that could all compete near equal with each other, which isn't the case.

Because 90% of LoLers need 5-7 years to become independent from school and parents, and then they will compete in "top".

Shut the fuck up.
God Bless
ComusLoM
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Norway3547 Posts
June 27 2011 22:23 GMT
#335
On June 28 2011 06:30 Roffles wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 28 2011 06:10 danl9rm wrote:
On June 27 2011 23:20 GTR wrote:
what a travesty that quake live was shafted for league of legends.

i guess riot are pouring the money in for the game to be a major ESPORTS title.


As someone who has played both, LoL is a joke of a game compared to QuakeLive.
The game caters to noobs in every way conceivable.

I was about to hit "post," but I will instead elaborate.

From Dota -> League of Legends:
Problem: meanie-head denies all my creeps leaving me way behind Fix: No more denying creeps! You can now sit there like the noob you are and get full exp!
Problem: I have to use the mini-map. Fix: You are now panned so far out you can see everything w/o it!
Problem: I sometimes run out of mana. Fix: Spells now take next to no mana with insane mana regneration!
Problem: Sometimes when I'm playing someone better than me, they combo me to death. Fix: It is now impossible to combo someone down from full health. Spells will do insignificant damage and they will have to cast a dozen of them on you to kill you. At 40% health, please retreat to base for healing.
Problem: It seems no matter who I pick, my opponent can still beat me. Fix: Some characters are now drastically overpowered compared to others so you'll always have a chance against someone actually wanting to pick a different character!
Problem: When I get low on health, people sometimes kill me. Fix: Now, when you get low on health, just leisurely walk back under the tower (with extended range!) and it will totally obliterate anyone who dare follow you! Now you can lane and shoot at creeps all day long!

Yes, I hate that game. And if I had played it more recently, I'm sure I could point out 100 more things that they purposely put into that game, that dota had right, just to make it for noobs.
UGH.

Sorry Quakelive

Just no. No. Don't talk if you don't know shit.

The only joke is you.

Haha that was what I was going to post. People don't seem to understand that LoL has high level competition, if there was no skill then there would be no stand out players. But there are players that are way better than the average or even the really good players, if it was so easy then everyone would be able to compete with the best. People said the same thing about SC2, and while there isn't that huge of a gap between the pro and the high masters/grand master players who don't play it competitively it's still very noticeable in competition.
"The White Woman Speaks in Tongues That Are All Lies" - Incontrol; Member #37 of the Chill Fanclub
T0fuuu
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Australia2275 Posts
June 27 2011 22:24 GMT
#336
Quite saddened that QL isnt in IEM anymore but I guess it is LOLs turn to give it a try. Maybe in a few years when the moba scene has moved on there will still be enough people playing QL that it will go back into the circuit.

Also theres no need to bash on lol. Its a game without replay and spectator functions. Its like picking on an esports kid that is still in its diapers.
cold-
Profile Joined October 2010
Canada209 Posts
June 27 2011 22:24 GMT
#337
Lol and Hon are both disgraceful to Dota.
everything they attempted to change and make better - they failed.
Enderbantoo
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States465 Posts
June 27 2011 22:25 GMT
#338
On June 28 2011 07:09 Jomz wrote:
Much prefer QL to LoL, but it's fine, I can still watch LoL. Really wanted to see Rapha and Cooller play! T.T

Ah well. That prize purse is pretty huge which is awesome. Good Luck to all whoa re attending ;o


Rapha bamf, Cooller is awesome
At the biggest upset of all of bw, Shanghai SPL finals 2011
Fishriot
Profile Joined May 2010
United States621 Posts
June 27 2011 22:26 GMT
#339
I've recently been playing a lot of LoL (more than sc2 tbh...). And after seeing their season 1 finals, I'm totally stoked for it to be growing in the esports community!
question
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Czech Republic509 Posts
June 27 2011 22:27 GMT
#340
well QL and starcraft are 100% best esports to spectate
GGverySooN
Prev 1 15 16 17 18 19 34 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 5h 21m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
UpATreeSC 34
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 45157
GuemChi 5276
Rain 4211
JYJ1575
Flash 958
Hyuk 847
Shuttle 576
Killer 473
Light 440
Barracks 353
[ Show more ]
Zeus 265
EffOrt 246
Soulkey 155
ggaemo 140
Last 131
hero 118
Dewaltoss 89
Hyun 89
soO 63
sas.Sziky 33
Sacsri 26
Free 24
scan(afreeca) 20
Yoon 19
Shine 11
HiyA 10
Noble 8
Hm[arnc] 4
Dota 2
boxi981689
XcaliburYe1135
Counter-Strike
fl0m1692
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu257
Khaldor192
Other Games
gofns30869
tarik_tv19790
singsing2793
B2W.Neo1204
crisheroes405
XaKoH 162
Sick111
ArmadaUGS103
NeuroSwarm58
MindelVK21
Organizations
Other Games
BasetradeTV91
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Adnapsc2 25
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 2577
League of Legends
• Nemesis3354
Other Games
• WagamamaTV334
• Shiphtur114
Upcoming Events
BSL Team Wars
5h 21m
Team Bonyth vs Team Sziky
BSL
7h 51m
Artosis vs Sziky
Afreeca Starleague
20h 21m
Soma vs BeSt
Wardi Open
21h 21m
OSC
1d 10h
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 20h
Afreeca Starleague
1d 20h
Bisu vs Larva
LiuLi Cup
2 days
OSC
3 days
The PondCast
3 days
[ Show More ]
Wardi Open
4 days
[BSL 2025] Weekly
6 days
[BSL 2025] Weekly
6 days
Safe House 2
6 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-09-25
Maestros of the Game
HCC Europe

Ongoing

BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Points
ASL Season 20
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
EC S1
ESL Pro League S22
FERJEE Rush 2025
Birch Cup 2025
DraculaN #2
LanDaLan #3
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1

Upcoming

IPSL Winter 2025-26
SC4ALL: Brood War
BSL 21 Team A
BSL Season 21
RSL Revival: Season 3
Stellar Fest
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
WardiTV TLMC #15
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
Frag Blocktober 2025
Urban Riga Open #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.