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Of course Starcraft 1 did not retail as a perfect game and its expansion Brood War and its years of patching helped make it become a dominant e-sport.
I feel like your statement of will they make an "improvement" of making the game easier for casual players does not help the game, the game is already easier for casual players than brood war, requiring much less mechanics and to make the game easier would only hurt the competitive scene. I partially believe the reason why Brood War became so huge is because how hard it was to play and how much time you needed to put in to become a great player, I am not saying Starcraft 2 does not require you to put in time to became a great player but I feel like the skills needed to play at a pro scene are not as high as brood war. If this game was easier for casual gamers I would not like playing it, I love a game that requires sheer skill and talent over a game where you move a stick and hope you hit a few people before you die. Thats why Brood war players are so highly regarded they are so skilled at the game and they've put so much time into it. If you want to play casually fine, why would you dumb down the game so its easier to play at a higher level.
Starcraft has been growing rapidly, if you look at the viewers just at the event they have multiplied like rabbits. Even take a look at the viewers on the streams for the events they are always increasing. Big tournaments and small tournaments would not put up such a big prize pool if they did not have the money from their sponsors. As for new features to help the game in tournament environments all we really need is LAN......LAN blizzard.....LAN, you know that thing we had over 13 years ago, that didn't make tournaments have so many difficulties, LAN.
Foreign gamers are creating team houses and there are many that practice their hearts out. You can even read on team liquid that Reign just started a team house. If you're so worried about esports, watch a stream, a tournament, or even buy a premium pass that extras 10 cents or couple bucks helps push esports to the next level and shows your interest and that in return gets sponsor interest.
Starcraft 2 is only growing so I do not know how you can rate GSL B+ compared to MLG, GSL at least gives some money back to the players for their hard work. It also instills something to look forward to during the week, as their is always new play going on and favorite players playing all of the time. MLG is an event that is everyone once in a while, GSL is a consistent event. Casual gamers and viewers will prefer watching starcraft 2 over brood war, they'll see the old graphics and not want to stare at it. Right now Starcraft 2 is just eye candy and has yet to have a need for solid mechanics instilled into it. Starcraft 2 only has room to grow, brood war will become less and less popular slowly over time as the casual and die hard gamers will start to swing towards 2 as it improves (hopefully) over time.
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I honestly think that they need to support the team play aspect of things (not 3v3s or 4v4s but the 1v1 KOTH style) rather than oversaturate 1v1s which is what we're seeing. If IGN's league was teams instead of 1v1s, it would have been perfect. Right now, it's getting up there but there needs to be a big league besides the EG thing. A lot of the other games in the E-Sports industry all have some sort of involvement with the entire team.
For casual play, an unranked ladder would be alright since most people that go into the custom games lobby just look for Starjeweled or something and it wouldn't be scary. There are other things that I wish I could list like making the game a bit more micro intensive but that's Blizzard's department
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On June 20 2011 13:54 GenoPewPew wrote:
I honestly think that they need to support the team play aspect of things (not 3v3s or 4v4s but the 1v1 KOTH style) rather than oversaturate 1v1s which is what we're seeing. If IGN's league was teams instead of 1v1s, it would have been perfect. Right now, it's getting up there but there needs to be a big league besides the EG thing. A lot of the other games in the E-Sports industry all have some sort of involvement with the entire team.
For casual play, an unranked ladder would be alright since most people that go into the custom games lobby just look for Starjeweled or something and it wouldn't be scary. There are other things that I wish I could list like making the game a bit more micro intensive but that's Blizzard's department
That's why the GSTL is so much fun to watch, its was the same in BW PL is sometimes attracts more viewers than OLS/MSL. I especially like the winner league format.
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I'd say it's not a bubble, we have a very strong foundation with a lot of different sponsors for every event, not only one big ass sponsor who does everything. What we need to really "go big" is more non-computer related sponsors.
We got a solid viewer base on streams, we don't really need television, steady results and winners are starting to appear (which is important). We have upsets, which is as important. The story lines and hate matches are there, most of them involving idra and some other dude, but still.
E-sport will grow, but it will grow slow, which is good. If it grows slow, it shows it got a dedicated fanbase, and not just som fluke.
Atleast that's what I think.
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If it is a bubble, i hope it is one of them sponge bob bubbles. You know, the ones that you can make animals out of and send messages that activate upon popping? Ya, dat bubbles.
And if i ever find the person that pops the SC2 bubble, imma wreck them.
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On June 20 2011 14:07 godemperor wrote:Show nested quote +On June 20 2011 13:54 GenoPewPew wrote:
I honestly think that they need to support the team play aspect of things (not 3v3s or 4v4s but the 1v1 KOTH style) rather than oversaturate 1v1s which is what we're seeing. If IGN's league was teams instead of 1v1s, it would have been perfect. Right now, it's getting up there but there needs to be a big league besides the EG thing. A lot of the other games in the E-Sports industry all have some sort of involvement with the entire team.
For casual play, an unranked ladder would be alright since most people that go into the custom games lobby just look for Starjeweled or something and it wouldn't be scary. There are other things that I wish I could list like making the game a bit more micro intensive but that's Blizzard's department
That's why the GSTL is so much fun to watch, its was the same in BW PL is sometimes attracts more viewers than OLS/MSL. I especially like the winner league format.
Yeah, I think it's exciting and as a spectator it's fun to watch and its how we learn of up and coming players in the scene
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Fantastic post. While I definitely hope eSports is finally becoming a viable and respectable career in the west, I can't help but worry. Blizzard seem to have their own agenda with Starcraft 2 that isn't in the interests of eSports while claiming the contrary (LAN is critical and they know it).
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Good read. It's a very interesting topic. I hope SC2's popularity is not a bubble, but at this point I guess only time will tell.
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On June 20 2011 14:16 branflakes14 wrote:
Fantastic post. While I definitely hope eSports is finally becoming a viable and respectable career in the west, I can't help but worry. Blizzard seem to have their own agenda with Starcraft 2 that isn't in the interests of eSports while claiming the contrary (LAN is critical and they know it).
LAN is not critical. But what is critical is a little bit of favoritism for and trust of their partners. They need to release a heavily stripped down version of BNET to allow for LAN equivalent play for the major tournaments, to ensure stability. They could just ship it as a packaged rack-mount box(like google does for their business search offerings), with heavy NDA restrictions, and everything would be good.
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On June 20 2011 13:54 GenoPewPew wrote:
I honestly think that they need to support the team play aspect of things (not 3v3s or 4v4s but the 1v1 KOTH style) rather than oversaturate 1v1s which is what we're seeing. If IGN's league was teams instead of 1v1s, it would have been perfect. Right now, it's getting up there but there needs to be a big league besides the EG thing. A lot of the other games in the E-Sports industry all have some sort of involvement with the entire team.
For casual play, an unranked ladder would be alright since most people that go into the custom games lobby just look for Starjeweled or something and it wouldn't be scary. There are other things that I wish I could list like making the game a bit more micro intensive but that's Blizzard's department
It's still going to be played out in 1v1 matches.
How the heck is a ladder service going to have teams?(!)
Again that's the community's responsibility.
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Wow. Read. Awesome. Yeah, I gotta say you're right about that bubble of the player pool. Its the one that I can really speak on the behalf of. I have a couple friends who has hit the 'wall' in the learning curve and they rarely play. Or just stick to customs. The game on a serious note doesn't go well with casual players over the long term.
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Wow really well done, I really hope it's a wave it just grabs everyone you know and evokes such a great emotional response I know I will be playing SC until the bitter end.
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Good read. I definetely think that the two expansions would help to retain casual players interest for an extended period of time, but its too early to tell whether the whole thing is just a huge bubble waiting to burst or not.
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I don't think sc2 is a bubble, but I don't think it is a wave either. It seems to me that it will certainly grow, and that the exchange of worldwide talent alongside gaming venues on the international scale will only benefit the growth of the game. However, the sheer learning curve of the game is very discouraging to new players, although I don't quite know how much fluency with the game impacts spectatorship. With all of these factors in mind, the game appears to be heading towards continual growth, though I predict the growth itself will be moderate, or at least experience a boom during the infancy of the game which will be attenuated as the game progresses in years.
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As others, i have also been thinking this big boom in interest for pro sc2 would decline eventually. the expansions will help keep player interest. more corporation btw diff leagues also help as foreigner vs korean provide the best storyline, entertainment, and skill level for me at least so long as the skill gap doesn't become to great. hopefully fxo does well in the gstl and the 3 code A invites as well.
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I think it is irrelevant to assign grades to tournaments based on financial efficiency while (somewhat) ignoring the most important factor: SPONSORS.
This game will have sponsors as long as it is "the" e-sports, and lets be honest, it has no contenders as of now or in visible future. I mean watching DHS2011, at one point I saw 90k+ people on Day9 stream, and possibly 110-120k+ in all streams which is almost double the number of TSL games, which shows that viewership base is growing steadily. Huge companies like TELIA have commercials directed specifically at gamers while sponsoring these tournaments, as well as brands such as Coca-Cola, Alienware, etc. sponsoring indirectly.
In short, this may be a bubble, but as long as no games can contest for its place in the spotlight, it will not burst.
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Nice work sir
hope blizzard wont let us down
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"best way to predict future is to invent it" - Alan Kay
and just btw your Rating is not convincing in anyway - image s&p would kinda rate like this 8)
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There is an acceptance amongst most people in most sports that winning and losing in a team game is an enjoyable experience. There are millions that play football every week, casually or otherwise, but the ones really interested in it are doing so in small, lower league tournies. Their victories are smaller, but they are still victories.
Starcraft 2 will be considered a success when tournaments for silver and gold league players are significantly MORE common than those for grandmaster league players. Everyone wants to get to GM to show off, but most people simply do not have the dedication to pump enough time to make it worth their while. However, if silver and gold leagers had their own BLIZZARD SUPPORTED tournaments (which is key, btw), SC2 will continue to expand.
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On June 20 2011 09:44 deadjawa wrote:
This “grind” has victimized most of my friends who initially bought the game with high hopes Same for my friends. The problem is, that with a smaller pool of such casual players, it is more likely to get matched against someone who plays more serious, making winning more difficult and driving away even more casual players.
On June 20 2011 13:41 RacerX wrote:
I feel like your statement of will they make an "improvement" of making the game easier for casual players does not help the game, the game is already easier for casual players than brood war, requiring much less mechanics and to make the game easier would only hurt the competitive scene. I would say, that is not the point. Even if SC2 would be mechanically easier, it still would drive many casual gamers away because they get crushed too often. If you are new to RTS, you should be prepared to lose umpteen games with very few random wins inbetween. Beginners get the impression that all other players are like zombies on crack, only trying to kill the opponent as fast as possible and with the most abusive units possible. It is too fast-paced and too hard to understand even for bronze level.
The solution is not to slow down or dumb down Starcraft, but to integreate a playing field for all true casual gamers where they can battle each other. The Blizzard ladder promotes cheeses and all-ins and fast rushes and harass were your workers are attacked and so on. This is too much for many potential players.
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EPT
