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Godwrath
Spain10126 Posts
On January 18 2013 01:57 BlackPearl wrote: The people dissapointed by EG's CEO should really start emailing the sponsors. That's the only way he'll apologize, or regret his actions is if we take away his allowance. : ) Stop. That. Nonsense. About. Emailing. Sponsors. Please. | ||
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crms
United States11933 Posts
On January 18 2013 02:21 bonifaceviii wrote: EG is not equivalent to esports. It's kind of funny people make this leap, no offense to EG but if EG completely died tomorrow, esports would continue. Of course we don't want that, they are a major team and support a lot of players and tournaments. The best part about all of this is the scale and personal relationship we 'feel' we have with these companies likes EG. Companies try to manipulate the media all the time in real life, or even own media outlets that tailor stories, report half truths and make sure the company always looks good. This (rightfully so) is seen as FUCKING TERRIBLE in real life, but EG (a company) trying to strongarm the press (Slasher) seems to be ok, because it's esports!! Really funny and highly ironic. You can agree or disagree with what Slasher does but I don't want any corporate entity (esports or otherwise) controlling or manipulating the media. It's messy enough TL is the information superhub for SC2 and also one of the most popular teams. Thankfully TL does a great job of staying out of drama pieces and mostly focuses on tournament results etc. | ||
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Zealos
United Kingdom3575 Posts
On January 18 2013 02:21 bonifaceviii wrote: EG is not equivalent to esports. No, but if teams can't support themselves as their views are being leeched by journalist sites, then there won't be a great deal of esports to report on. Obviously this is taking it to the extreme, but the point is still relevant. | ||
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Rezudox
207 Posts
Slasher is actively damaging a business's value it is only logical that business would distance themselves completely from him. If he is intentionally doing things with no regard for the impact it has on what a team is doing they are in an adversarial relationship. What is hard to understand about that? Why are people outraged? | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On January 18 2013 02:30 crms wrote: It's kind of funny people make this leap, no offense to EG but if EG completely died tomorrow, esports would continue. Of course we don't want that, they are a major team and support a lot of players and tournaments. The best part about all of this is the scale and personal relationship we 'feel' we have with these companies likes EG. Companies try to manipulate the media all the time in real life, or even own media outlets that tailor stories, report half truths and make sure the company always looks good. This (rightfully so) is seen as FUCKING TERRIBLE in real life, but EG (a company) trying to strongarm the press (Slasher) seems to be ok, because it's esports!! Really funny and highly ironic. You can agree or disagree with what Slasher does but I don't want any corporate entity (esports or otherwise) controlling or manipulating the media. It's messy enough TL is the information superhub for SC2 and also one of the most popular teams. Thankfully TL does a great job of staying out of drama pieces and mostly focuses on tournament results etc. Slasher works Gamespot, which is owned by CBS Interactive, a branch of CBS Broadcasting Inc. He works the works for one of the largest corporate entities in broadcast media and they oversee and approve any of his stories. Also, Nazgul posted his response, which is pretty close to what EG said, just a lot calmer. Link TL is pretty much on a similar page to EG on this subject, which is that Slasher's leaks hurt their bottom line and it damages their relationship. | ||
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Me jan
Sweden72 Posts
On January 18 2013 02:31 Zealos wrote: No, but if teams can't support themselves as their views are being leeched by journalist sites, then there won't be a great deal of esports to report on. Obviously this is taking it to the extreme, but the point is still relevant. Yes indeed that was taking it to the extreme. And relevant how? Isn't there enough place within eSports for both of them to exist? Well good luck adding any new attention to the scene in that case. | ||
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Jeremyy
Canada182 Posts
User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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crms
United States11933 Posts
On January 18 2013 02:37 Plansix wrote: Slasher works Gamespot, which is owned by CBS Interactive, a branch of CBS Broadcasting Inc. He works the works for one of the largest corporate entities in broadcast media and they oversee and approve any of his stories. Also, Nazgul posted his response, which is pretty close to what EG said, just a lot calmer. Link TL is pretty much on a similar page to EG on this subject, which is that Slasher's leaks hurt their bottom line and it damages their relationship. Right and CBSi has no stake in EG. Perhaps if Slasher tries to right inflamtory pieces on CBS owned product he could have some trouble. Really for what I'm trying to say you can replace EG and Slasher for anyone. The media shouldn't care if reporting the news hurts a corporations profits. We would never think this was OK in the 'real world' and when we see it happening (ALL THE TIME) we lose confidence in our media producers. Does anyone really value CNN/FOX or MSNBC anymore? They've all been bought out a long time ago. Esports isn't a charity, and to be treated as such only hurts our community moving forward. Journalist will report, teams will have to deal with this to survive. Right now it's so small scale that we can have these discussions but setting the precedent early that it would be ok for corporations to manipulate journalists is not something we should champion. | ||
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Am0n3r
United States254 Posts
On January 18 2013 02:36 Rezudox wrote: If Slasher is going to do coverage which detracts from the value of a team's activities the team is well within their rights to actively avoid allowing Slasher from having sensitive information. I would do the same. Slasher is actively damaging a business's value it is only logical that business would distance themselves completely from him. If he is intentionally doing things with no regard for the impact it has on what a team is doing they are in an adversarial relationship. What is hard to understand about that? Why are people outraged? I have no clue... I have been in shock since yesterday, and just can't understand why people are grabbing the pitchforks... | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On January 18 2013 02:50 crms wrote: Right and CBSi has no stake in EG. Perhaps if Slasher tries to right inflamtory pieces on CBS owned product he could have some trouble. Really for what I'm trying to say you can replace EG and Slasher for anyone. The media shouldn't care if reporting the news hurts a corporations profits. We would never think this was OK in the 'real world' and when we see it happening (ALL THE TIME) we lose confidence in our media producers. Does anyone really value CNN/FOX or MSNBC anymore? They've all been bought out a long time ago. Esports isn't a charity, and to be treated as such only hurts our community moving forward. Journalist will report, teams will have to deal with this to survive. Right now it's so small scale that we can have these discussions but setting the precedent early that it would be ok for corporations to manipulate journalists is not something we should champion. I never said that they should care. Also, the whole "Esports isn't a charity" argument sucks and is stupid. No one is asking for a hand out. People are discussion the professional relationships between teams and the press, and that some of the recent actions of the press have undercut the teams ability to make money. If this was CBSi, I wouldn't care. But none of the Esports teams are that large and all of them are work hard for all the exposure they can get. The teams are pointing out that CBSi makes money off of Slashers reporting. Who needs the money more, CBSi, one of the largest broadcast networks or the the Esports teams. Slasher is doing it job, sure, but the teams are doing theirs by sticking up for themselves. If Slasher knows he is costing the team money, he needs to be prepared to take the heat from that. Naz'Gul said it best with this quote right here: On January 17 2013 19:33 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: Slasher on the one hand wants to use Liquid for information supply, as well as work with us officially on interviews and other content. Yet, on the other hand he will look for leaks outside of my organization that will impact me negatively upon releasing the information. I view this as poor relationship management. I don't think it works like that anywhere, neither here nor in other sports. As a professional, I agree with him. You can't screw someone over the one day and the next ask them for an interview. Its a bad practice and will either get you denied an interview or worse. | ||
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Zealos
United Kingdom3575 Posts
On January 18 2013 02:37 Me jan wrote: Yes indeed that was taking it to the extreme. And relevant how? Isn't there enough place within eSports for both of them to exist? Well good luck adding any new attention to the scene in that case. Yes, there is plenty of room. But there isn't if Slasher runs stories that ruin the stories for teams. Two options: 1. Team makes announcement, Slasher gets exclusive content to produce. 2. Slasher leaks announcement in a shitty article, and the team who have already been producing content about it get fucked. EDIT: Not to mention he can still post the story once the player has already been made public, and all this "new attention" will still see it. | ||
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bonifaceviii
Canada2890 Posts
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TheSir
1830 Posts
On January 18 2013 03:08 Plansix wrote: I never said that they should care. Also, the whole "Esports isn't a charity" argument sucks and is stupid. No one is asking for a hand out. People are discussion the professional relationships between teams and the press, and that some of the recent actions of the press have undercut the teams ability to make money. If this was CBSi, I wouldn't care. But none of the Esports teams are that large and all of them are work hard for all the exposure they can get. The teams are pointing out that CBSi makes money off of Slashers reporting. Who needs the money more, CBSi, one of the largest broadcast networks or the the Esports teams. Slasher is doing it job, sure, but the teams are doing theirs by sticking up for themselves. If Slasher knows he is costing the team money, he needs to be prepared to take the heat from that. Naz'Gul said it best with this quote right here: As a professional, I agree with him. You can't screw someone over the one day and the next ask them for an interview. Its a bad practice and will either get you denied an interview or worse. welcome to the real world, thats what journalist do and you can deny a journalist from doing interviews but when he's that important (like Slasher is) it will only hurt yourself. There's a very tin line you have to walk when working with journalists cause you both hand your hands in the same cookie jar with different agenda's but you also need each other. this hole drama discussion is just mind blowing stupid | ||
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Me jan
Sweden72 Posts
If they are intrested in eSports growing they would be happy that the media can bring new casual players to the scene. And work so both the media and teams can coexist. The responsability of holding information lies at the teams table, and the responsability of reporting to the viewers lies at the journalist. If a team is gonna make an announcement and put money in to it, they should protect that information. That is their business and no one elses. If they are not able to protect the information, well they are undermining their own business. I wish they would accept responsability of that and don't blam journalists. Or make a new term on what a journalist is in the eSports scene, what was discussed was jounali-sh, wich is no makeing the scene any more legitimate. | ||
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Zealos
United Kingdom3575 Posts
On January 18 2013 03:21 Me jan wrote: The responsability of holding information lies at the teams table, and the responsability of reporting to the viewers lies at the journalist. If a team is gonna make an announcement and put money in to it, they should protect that information. That is their business and no one elses. If they are not able to protect the information, well they are undermining their own business. I wish they would accept responsability of that and don't blam journalists. Or make a new term on what a journalist is in the eSports scene, what was discussed was jounali-sh, wich is no makeing the scene any more legitimate. Cross posted from Nazguls blog: On January 18 2013 02:24 Bumblebee wrote: No, it is not the team's fault that it leaks. It's something we're not in control over. There are too many people that needs to be involved in player transfers and stuff alike for the team to have control over the situation -- nor do they really control the people who knows. Things such as the team the player comes from, the other bidding teams and tournaments who need to be informed ahead of time in order to secure spots/book/pay for things. An example is that I had personally informed EG, IPL and IEM about Snute prior to the announcement since if I want Snute to play in SC2L or IPTL, I need to do that. Snute also came from another team and there were other bidders who also knew of our situation. There's just too many people who you don't have power over or control of. It's not as simple as just "protecting" it. | ||
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Me jan
Sweden72 Posts
On January 18 2013 03:23 Zealos wrote: Cross posted from Nazguls blog: It's not as simple as just "protecting" it. I would say it is. It's their intrests, therefore all teams should want to watch after information for each other and for all the teams sake. If they are leaking, it's them who have a problem. If they can't controll the information they will need to have another set-up on how things are arranged. | ||
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Mr Showtime
United States1353 Posts
On January 18 2013 02:24 Godwrath wrote: Stop. That. Nonsense. About. Emailing. Sponsors. Please. Seriously. Ffs, I don't think people understand how inappropriate that course of action really is. Especially in this circumstance. | ||
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IdrA
United States11541 Posts
On January 18 2013 03:32 Me jan wrote: I would say it is. It's their intrests, therefore all teams should want to watch after information for each other and for all the teams sake. If they are leaking, it's them who have a problem. If they can't controll the information they will need to have another set-up on how things are arranged. read what he said. that's tl's player manager. its a practical impossibility. as we';ve been saying all along. | ||
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Me jan
Sweden72 Posts
On January 18 2013 03:39 IdrA wrote: read what he said. that's tl's player manager. its a practical impossibility. as we';ve been saying all along. It needs to be solved tho, somehow. | ||
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Imbu
United States903 Posts
On January 18 2013 03:48 Me jan wrote: + Show Spoiler + On January 18 2013 03:39 IdrA wrote: read what he said. that's tl's player manager. its a practical impossibility. as we';ve been saying all along. It needs to be solved tho, somehow. And how will that happen? As long as we have multiple organizations each hosting their own tournaments, there are simply too many variables to prevent everything from happening. Right now, ever league must be notified of this update so that these players can start participating immediately. Similarly, various other organizations will know who the free agents are, and which teams would be bidding on them. The reason that the Korean scene was so successful in keeping a hold of leaks back in BW was because how central everything was. All trades and acquiescions happened through KeSPA, and as such, there were less variables to control. Until the creation of an international body that controls the leagues, this will not be possible. And if the past is any example, this is something that is quite a bit off in the distance. | ||
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